wch new chip

[bywqdq]

ch32h417

[bywqdq]

[brucehoult]

So, what is the target application? And what price point?

[bywqdq]

特色就是risc-v 双核cpu，usb3.0可用配合FPGA完成数据采集上传。价格还不知道。肯定不便宜。

[ledtester]

特色就是risc-v 双核cpu，usb3.0可用配合FPGA完成数据采集上传。价格还不知道。肯定不便宜。

Via Google translate:

The feature is the RISC-V dual-core CPU, USB3.0 can be used with FPGA to complete data collection and upload. The price is not yet known. It's certainly not cheap.

[SiliconWizard]

Pretty cool stuff if it's for real.

[woofy]

I wonder how the 512k flash and 896k RAM is organised.
If its directly executable flash - great, but if its SPI flash and needs to be loaded into RAM as I suspect the 307 is, then potentially there is only 384k of RAM.
I do like the 100MBit Ethernet PHY.

[SiliconWizard]

I wonder how the 512k flash and 896k RAM is organised.
If its directly executable flash - great, but if its SPI flash and needs to be loaded into RAM as I suspect the 307 is, then potentially there is only 384k of RAM.

Most likely not, as this isn't how WCH market their MCUs.

The CH32V30x do load Flash content into internal RAM on startup, but it's extra RAM inside the chip that is not advertised as usable as data RAM.
The CH32V307 for instance has a lot more internal RAM than the advertised 64 KB, and some of it can be used as data RAM depending on config bits. It has a total of 320 KB of RAM, so that's 256 KB copied from Flash and 64 KB available as "RAM". You can configure it to get up to 128 KB of usable "RAM" if you restrict the usable "code" Flash to 192 KB.

So if anything, I'm pretty sure they use the same marketing terms for all their MCUs, and the marketed 896 KB are fully available to the user. If it copies Flash to RAM, it most certainly has 512 KB of extra internal RAM.

[Sacodepatatas]

You can configure it to get up to 128 KB of usable "RAM" if you restrict the usable "code" Flash to 192 KB.

You don't need to restrict the usable code Flash to 192 KB if you are aware that the code located inside the 192-480KB segment is going to be accessed 10x slower because is retrieved from the serial flash (512KB) rather than the RAM mirrored flash.


https://github.com/ch32-rs/wlink/blob/main/README.md

https://cpldcpu.com/2024/05/01/decapsulating-the-ch32v203-reveals-a-separate-flash-die/

[bywqdq]

100MBit Ethernet PHY.  ch32v317

[Psi]

I wonder if the CAN bus is CAN-FD or not.  They would probably have said FD if it was, just says 2.0B

[GromBeestje]

One thing I notice here is the core. It says RISC-V5F, so that is a QingKeV5 core. Is there anything known what this new core can do?

[brucehoult]

One thing I notice here is the core. It says RISC-V5F, so that is a QingKeV5 core. Is there anything known what this new core can do?

Yeah, nothing yet at https://www.wch-ic.com/search?t=all&k=qingkev

[Psi]

One thing I notice here is the core. It says RISC-V5F, so that is a QingKeV5 core. Is there anything known what this new core can do?

Seems likely it can unlock itself and dump its firmware if any person with some secret key asks it to.

Not that most other mcu's don't have some possible hack to dump firmware, but in this case its probably intentional.

[ali_asadzadeh]

I think they should fix or add these issues to the chips,
1- The ability to execute code from external SPI flash
2- The ability to add external RAM (some parts have it)
3- Add a RGB LCD controller to the MCU
4-Make all the SPI cores capable of Acting as I2S

[ftg]

Seems like this ch32h417 potentially replaces ch569.
But it does not seem to mention the HSPI (high-speed parallel interface) that ch569 has for FPGA interfacing.
Unless the idea is to use the SerDes for it. Or they have a new interface with a new acronym for that.
The USB-PD is also interesting for making devices with just a single USB-C connector for everything.

[SiliconWizard]

Seems like this ch32h417 potentially replaces ch569.
But it does not seem to mention the HSPI (high-speed parallel interface) that ch569 has for FPGA interfacing.
Unless the idea is to use the SerDes for it. Or they have a new interface with a new acronym for that.
The USB-PD is also interesting for making devices with just a single USB-C connector for everything.

Yes, it looks like they took most of the CH569 features and integrated them in a new, more powerful MCU, along with other features such as USB-PD.

They have this distinction between the CH32xxxxx line and CHxxx. As I understand it, the CHxxx products, while some are MCUs, are more marketed as "interface chips", while the CH32xxxxx series are marketed as MCUs.
So not sure it will replace the CH569, but more address a different market. It's probably going to be more expensive too.

[brucehoult]

They have this distinction between the CH32xxxxx line and CHxxx. As I understand it, the CHxxx products, while some are MCUs, are more marketed as "interface chips", while the CH32xxxxx series are marketed as MCUs.
So not sure it will replace the CH569, but more address a different market. It's probably going to be more expensive too.

I'm not sure what the exact difference is. Interface?  Special purpose vs general-purpose? Maybe something custom they made because one customer wanted a million of them, and they put them on sale for everyone too? I suspect the CH570D, for example, is probably the latter. Same price as CH32V003 but 8x more RAM and flash and 2x MHz, USB and 2.4 GHz radio. But dropping some important features (for general purpose) such as ADC.

[SiliconWizard]

They have this distinction between the CH32xxxxx line and CHxxx. As I understand it, the CHxxx products, while some are MCUs, are more marketed as "interface chips", while the CH32xxxxx series are marketed as MCUs.
So not sure it will replace the CH569, but more address a different market. It's probably going to be more expensive too.

I'm not sure what the exact difference is. Interface?  Special purpose vs general-purpose? Maybe something custom they made because one customer wanted a million of them, and they put them on sale for everyone too? I suspect the CH570D, for example, is probably the latter. Same price as CH32V003 but 8x more RAM and flash and 2x MHz, USB and 2.4 GHz radio. But dropping some important features (for general purpose) such as ADC.

You can have a look at their offering:
https://wch-ic.com/products/categories/46.html?pid=1

All CHxxx products are, from what I can see, indeed some kind of "interface" chips, providing a specific set of interfaces. Some have a CPU core inside, some don't.
While the products listed as "MCUs" have a different naming scheme and yes, are marketed as "general-purpose" MCUs.

For sure some of them cross boundaries.

[bywqdq]

UHSIF may be a useful alternative to HSPI. Not sure.

[bywqdq]

https://www.wch.cn/downloads/PRODUCT_GUIDE_PDF.html

[ftg]

UHSIF may be a useful alternative to HSPI. Not sure.

Could be. DDG only finds Advantest T6391 when searching for "UHSIF", so it could be a new tem by WCH.
Translating the text from that product guide points towards the acronym being "Universal High-Speed InterFace".

Outside of that I cannot really find any details about the capabilities of the UHSIF.

[peter-h]

Nice to see loads of RAM - the most precious resource in most systems.

No chance of getting even most of the peripherals coming out unless you go for the biggest package. Even on the QFP100 32F417 I lost perhaps 1/3 of the peripherals. The tradeoffs will be interesting e.g. I could not get four UARTs and three SPIs. Had to sacrifice SPI1 which happens to be the fastest.

A big political risk, too, nowadays.

[__george__]

One thing I notice here is the core. It says RISC-V5F, so that is a QingKeV5 core. Is there anything known what this new core can do?

Seems likely it can unlock itself and dump its firmware if any person with some secret key asks it to.

Not that most other mcu's don't have some possible hack to dump firmware, but in this case its probably intentional.

Ψ, do you have any links for this? It will be an interesting read.

[peter-h]

Still waiting for the mystery links

If a chip mfg put in a back door, who for? The CCP? That would make sense, but all these chips are vulnerable to methods like VCC pulsing.