Best scope for 5-6k

[tautech]

Long sighted here so get the +2 specs out for any serious scope work and never bother engaging the large font as what's on the display matters more providing the scope is set correctly.....love autosense probes and active probes that are detected by the scope and automatically configured.
SCP5030A and SDP6150A are the current favorites.....

[Martin72]

Yes, I wouldn't want to be without the active input anymore, because it's just so convenient.
But it's also proprietary—you can only use it with compatible products from the same manufacturer, which makes the whole setup a bit limited, and those compatible products aren't exactly cheap.

[Martin72]

Right now the SDS3034X HD looks like the winner to me. $4790 for 350 MHz, 12 bit ADC, 400Mpts and 16 digital channels seems hard to beat. Is there anything about this scope that should make me reconsider? Or another to look at?

In this price range, the options for decent oscilloscopes are very limited; basically, there are only four brands that have anything to offer, and one of them has models that are somewhat outdated (R&S RTB2K), while Rigol is completely out of the running.
That’s why the SDS3000X HD is definitely a logical choice.
It already offers many of the features found in the larger models, but at a reasonable price.
And it has tons of features to offer—I took a few screenshots of the menus...

[Martin72]

Rest of the pics...

[resonant_frequency]

I got a demo unit of the SDS3000XHD and I am quite disappointed. The features are great, but there are just too many bugs.

I've only had it a week and I've already run into:
- scope hard froze when left overnight generating measurements and a histogram, had to hold down the power button until it shut off.
- continuous roll is glitchy and sometimes once the data gets to the left side of the screen, the screen will clear and start over instead of continuously moving data over
- measurements sometimes say *** when added, but if I change the measurement channel back and forth then the data shows up
- pressing on universal button to switch between cursor 1, 2 and both was glitching out had to switch to y cursors then back to x
- math says invalid source (ch1 (A) * ch3 (v)) sometimes says invalid source until a new waveform is captured

I want to get this scope, but I can't justify spending 4k+ on a scope riddled with bugs
 

[tautech]

Please state the firmware version installed.....it is quite possible fixes are on the way.
Current is  V1.0.4.2

[resonant_frequency]

I am on version V1.0.4.2.

[2N3055]

I got a demo unit of the SDS3000XHD and I am quite disappointed. The features are great, but there are just too many bugs.

I've only had it a week and I've already run into:
- scope hard froze when left overnight generating measurements and a histogram, had to hold down the power button until it shut off.
- continuous roll is glitchy and sometimes once the data gets to the left side of the screen, the screen will clear and start over instead of continuously moving data over
- measurements sometimes say *** when added, but if I change the measurement channel back and forth then the data shows up
- pressing on universal button to switch between cursor 1, 2 and both was glitching out had to switch to y cursors then back to x
- math says invalid source (ch1 (A) * ch3 (v)) sometimes says invalid source until a new waveform is captured

I want to get this scope, but I can't justify spending 4k+ on a scope riddled with bugs

Riddled with bugs? Are we being dramatic a bit ?
Many times, when we start using new, complicated device that is different than what we are used to, darn devices have many bugs that magically go away once we learn a bit more.

1. If the scope froze that is not good. We would need to know more what exactly you did to get there. I personally did not have a freeze ever on that scope, and had it since January 2024. So that is something not normally happening. And I assure you that I entered such a complicated stuff in those Math formulas that you never will. On all 4 math channels.
2. Continuous roll is not glitching. It is triggering. Set scope to Auto mode while in Roll to get "classic" Roll mode. Not a bug.
3. Sometimes I do some thing that somehow do something that somebody sometimes don't like. You would need to actually explain what you exactly did and what exactly happened.  More detail please.
4. Why do you think uni button when pressed is switching between the cursors and not defaulting value for the selected item? Again, what exactly are you doing? Is behavior buggy or different from what you expect?
5. Math says invalid source when source is invalid for the calculation. How is that a bug? It tells you that it cannot calculate from empty data. Once you get valid data it calculates. It again seems to me as more of expectation mismatch. Can you explain better, please?

Best,

[tautech]

I got a demo unit of the SDS3000XHD and I am quite disappointed. The features are great, but there are just too many bugs.

I've only had it a week and I've already run into:
- scope hard froze when left overnight generating measurements and a histogram, had to hold down the power button until it shut off.
- continuous roll is glitchy and sometimes once the data gets to the left side of the screen, the screen will clear and start over instead of continuously moving data over
- measurements sometimes say *** when added, but if I change the measurement channel back and forth then the data shows up
- pressing on universal button to switch between cursor 1, 2 and both was glitching out had to switch to y cursors then back to x
- math says invalid source (ch1 (A) * ch3 (v)) sometimes says invalid source until a new waveform is captured

I want to get this scope, but I can't justify spending 4k+ on a scope riddled with bugs

Riddled with bugs? Are we being dramatic a bit ?
Many times, when we start using new, complicated device that is different than what we are used to, darn devices have many bugs that magically go away once we learn a bit more.

1. If the scope froze that is not good. We would need to know more what exactly you did to get there. I personally did not have a freeze ever on that scope, and had it since January 2024. So that is something not normally happening. And I assure you that I entered such a complicated stuff in those Math formulas that you never will. On all 4 math channels.
2. Continuous roll is not glitching. It is triggering. Set scope to Auto mode while in Roll to get "classic" Roll mode. Not a bug.
3. Sometimes I do some thing that somehow do something that somebody sometimes don't like. You would need to actually explain what you exactly did and what exactly happened.  More detail please.
4. Why do you think uni button when pressed is switching between the cursors and not defaulting value for the selected item? Again, what exactly are you doing? Is behavior buggy or different from what you expect?
5. Math says invalid source when source is invalid for the calculation. How is that a bug? It tells you that it cannot calculate from empty data. Once you get valid data it calculates. It again seems to me as more of expectation mismatch. Can you explain better, please?

Best,

100%

When we moved from X-E models to ****X HD models there were many differences in the UI we had to get to grips with but luckily 2kX Plus and 5kX were already using the same UI and menus and now most later Siglent DSO's use a common UI for operation to be so very similar across all recent models.
While the 800X HD feature set is very different to 7000A they are still very similar to operate for all basic scope use.

I've always maintained that to get a feel for how Siglent DSO's work the $356 SDS802X HD is the entry drug to how the 8 GHz SDS7804AP works, albeit with much higher sampling and memory depth the 7k models provide.

[resonant_frequency]

Maybe I'm being dramatic, but if a car I was test driving stalled I wouldn't buy it. I would love if these are all user error but that doesn't seem to be the case. I've never had our old Tek scopes freeze of me in my hundreds of hours of using them.  I am usually using a scope to measure one off events so stability and the ability to analyze them after they are captured is important to me.

1. I had this happen again today. I left the scope on overnight, captured a number of wave forms and hit save 1-2 times and the scope hard froze. I have save programmed to save a PNG. I did not have a flash drive in, but plugged one it about 10 seconds after pressing save (before I realized it had froze).

1.1 I say 1-2 times because I find it somewhat difficult to tell if I've pressed the soft buttons enough to trigger them.

2. +1 for this. Hitting auto did get the roll to operate how I was expecting. I do not understand the normal trigger roll mode. If anyone has documentation on how this works that would be appreciated.

3. My expectation is that I can capture a waveform on CH 1 and CH 2, then add the measurements afterwards. For example RMS on CH1, frequency on CH2. It is annoying that the measurements sometimes seemingly require recapturing the save waveform.

4. I believe that when the cursors are selected the universal button is supposed to operate in the following way: X1 is selected knob moves x1, then press button x2 is selected knob moves x2, press button x1 and x2 both move together, press button again and it goes back to x1. I don't remember exactly what I observed the first time button it was not that. It was something like: press universal knob x2 moves to x1 and turning knob does nothing, press knob and now you can move x2, press knob again and now x1 and x2 move together. This exact description may be wrong, but it was not the correct behavior that I described above.

5. I don't use the math feature that often on our Tek scopes so I didn't realize they also have the same behavior. My expectation was that I could capture CH 1 and CH3 and then add a math channel that multiples CH1 X CH3 and have it immediately display CH1 x CH3. Both the tek and siglent scopes require recapturing the waveform. Why is this? They both already have the waveforms captured?

 

[KungFuJosh]

Just speculating here, but... Have you stored a lot on the internal storage drive? Maybe it's freezing because it's low on space?

In any case, Scopes respond differently to certain flash drives. There's a whole thread about it for Siglent stuff. Make sure whatever you're using is happy with the scope before you use it on anything important.

[2N3055]

Maybe I'm being dramatic, but if a car I was test driving stalled I wouldn't buy it. I would love if these are all user error but that doesn't seem to be the case. I've never had our old Tek scopes freeze of me in my hundreds of hours of using them.  I am usually using a scope to measure one off events so stability and the ability to analyze them after they are captured is important to me.

1. I had this happen again today. I left the scope on overnight, captured a number of wave forms and hit save 1-2 times and the scope hard froze. I have save programmed to save a PNG. I did not have a flash drive in, but plugged one it about 10 seconds after pressing save (before I realized it had froze).

1.1 I say 1-2 times because I find it somewhat difficult to tell if I've pressed the soft buttons enough to trigger them.

2. +1 for this. Hitting auto did get the roll to operate how I was expecting. I do not understand the normal trigger roll mode. If anyone has documentation on how this works that would be appreciated.

3. My expectation is that I can capture a waveform on CH 1 and CH 2, then add the measurements afterwards. For example RMS on CH1, frequency on CH2. It is annoying that the measurements sometimes seemingly require recapturing the save waveform.

4. I believe that when the cursors are selected the universal button is supposed to operate in the following way: X1 is selected knob moves x1, then press button x2 is selected knob moves x2, press button x1 and x2 both move together, press button again and it goes back to x1. I don't remember exactly what I observed the first time button it was not that. It was something like: press universal knob x2 moves to x1 and turning knob does nothing, press knob and now you can move x2, press knob again and now x1 and x2 move together. This exact description may be wrong, but it was not the correct behavior that I described above.

5. I don't use the math feature that often on our Tek scopes so I didn't realize they also have the same behavior. My expectation was that I could capture CH 1 and CH3 and then add a math channel that multiples CH1 X CH3 and have it immediately display CH1 x CH3. Both the tek and siglent scopes require recapturing the waveform. Why is this? They both already have the waveforms captured?

Thank you for the response.

1. So freezing is somehow connected with USB and saving.. OK, I will try to play with it. If I find something I will report.
I pretty much never use USB for save (so even if there is some problem there I would not stumble upon it) because scope has SMB Server/client, where I mapped my PC disk, and save everything directly to PC at all times. Pretty much only time I use USB is FW updates (and that can be done over network too)
2.  Glad that ROLL is ok now for your use.
3. I apologize for teasing a bit. Yes I know, sometimes we are actually doing something and paying attention to what we are working on, and not exactly noticing details of operating instrument... But as Reacher say "..in investigation details matter..", once we notice something is "behaving" (or at least we think it is) than we need to go back and methodically investigate. Otherwise it is just a "something that sometimes maybe does something" and we have nothing to report to manufacturer. Sometimes it is a bug, but sometimes it is just implemented in a way that does not feel natural, and maybe there is better way, that gets revealed when users give feedback what they like and what they don't.
4.  I did try again. I do use these scopes all the time, but I verified just to be sure I am not wrong. I captured two signals on CH1 and CH2 with Single. I enabled math and set for CH1xCH2 and it has shown math waveform from previously captured, stopped waveforms.
It did not require recapturing a waveform after adding Math channel.
So it does that. Same as the measurements. That works too. I added measurements on already captured and they all calculated fine.
Now, I am not disputing your finding, but I presume there are other parameters that are in the play here.

As for exact cursor behavior, I would need to sit down and look into that in more detail. Maybe later, no time now.

Best,

[2N3055]

While quickly playing with the scope for previous post, I remembered few things I meant to share for some time but it slipped my mind.

Firstly, in recent FW revisions, 3000xHD got some interesting and very useful improvements.

A hysteresis adjustment was added to protocol decodes.
You can decode from Math and memory channels. That means you can use two single ended probes and subtract them and get diff signal. Or that you can save signal and recall it later with decoding.
New Bit rate measurements were added.

One neat trick with Clock/Data signals is to multiply the two with math channel to get AND function, so you can see timing overlap.

There is more, these are just some observations of top of my head.

[resonant_frequency]

I had a chance yesterday to take some screenshots of the measurement issue I was describing.

I captured an event on CH2 and CH 4.


Then I added a measurement to ch 4. I would expect the measurement value to display because I have already captured CH 4 waveform. That is not the case it - it displays ***:


I had to recapture the event to get the measurement to show up:


Why is this happening? This is not how my Tek scope works. It certainly seems like a bug to me.

[nctnico]

It is not really a bug. It is a design choice to update measurements based on existing data or not. Whether that workflow works for you is a personal choice.

[resonant_frequency]

Are you sure? 2N3055 said that his siglent scope will show the measurement immediately.

Why would anyone not want the measurement to show up immediately? If I add a measurement it's because I want the value of the measurement.

[nctnico]

Are you sure? 2N3055 said that his siglent scope will show the measurement immediately.

2N3055 is writing about math channels, not measurements. Protocol decoding is also something that may only be updated until/after a new acquisition. It really depends on make & model.

[resonant_frequency]

It did not require recapturing a waveform after adding Math channel.
So it does that. Same as the measurements. That works too. I added measurements on already captured and they all calculated fine.

This sounds like he's talking about measurements as well to me.

[adam4521]

I think your scope may be in Normal trigger mode,'Ready', not 'Stopped'? Does it make a difference?

[bson]

Then R&S or Keysight it is. Price will be what it will be.

Yeah. Inflexible rules carry a cost; I'm sure they've considered this vs the security risks.  Even a small risk becomes significant when you have 100k employees...

[resonant_frequency]

I think your scope may be in Normal trigger mode,'Ready', not 'Stopped'? Does it make a difference?

Thank you! This made all the difference. I am still pretty sure the behavior is a bug, but it is at least deterministic and has a relatively straight forward workaround.

I had some time to experiment with the behavior and it appears that in Normal trigger mode if their is a measurement or math on that channel when it is captured it will correctly display a new measurement or math that is added after it is captured. If there is no measurement or math on that channel when the waveform is captured then it will display *** for new measurements and Invalid source for the math channel. Pressing stop will then immediately get it to update. I highly doubt this is the intended behavior but at least you can get the measurements to show up if you hit stop.

Here is some photo evidence:

Measurement issue:

Before waveform capture, C2 has measurement added:


After capture C2 show measurement


Added measurement to C2 and C1. C2 measurement immediately displays data, C1 does not.



Press stop, C1 now correctly shows measurement



Math issue:

Before waveform capture, C1 and C2 has measurement added:



After capture C1 and C2 show measurement



Add math F1=C1+C2 and math F2=C3+C4. F1 displays correctly, F2 says invalid source



Press stop and now F2 displays correctly.






Are there any other bugs / odd behavior that requires workarounds that I should be aware of for this scope?

[resonant_frequency]

Just speculating here, but... Have you stored a lot on the internal storage drive? Maybe it's freezing because it's low on space?

In any case, Scopes respond differently to certain flash drives. There's a whole thread about it for Siglent stuff. Make sure whatever you're using is happy with the scope before you use it on anything important.

I don't think that's the issue because the flash drive and the internal storage have stored many more photos from the scope since then.

[resonant_frequency]

Simple question this time: is there a way to have the measurement gated on the zoom? Is there a way two have more than 5 measurements at the same time across multiple channels? It seems like I can only add 5 in the Advanced measure mode.

[BillyO]

I think your scope may be in Normal trigger mode,'Ready', not 'Stopped'? Does it make a difference?

Thank you! This made all the difference. I am still pretty sure the behavior is a bug, but it is at least deterministic and has a relatively straight forward workaround.

I had some time to experiment with the behavior and it appears that in Normal trigger mode if their is a measurement or math on that channel when it is captured it will correctly display a new measurement or math that is added after it is captured. If there is no measurement or math on that channel when the waveform is captured then it will display *** for new measurements and Invalid source for the math channel. Pressing stop will then immediately get it to update. I highly doubt this is the intended behavior but at least you can get the measurements to show up if you hit stop.

Here is some photo evidence:

Measurement issue:

Before waveform capture, C2 has measurement added:
(Attachment Link)

After capture C2 show measurement
(Attachment Link)

Added measurement to C2 and C1. C2 measurement immediately displays data, C1 does not.
(Attachment Link)


Press stop, C1 now correctly shows measurement
(Attachment Link)


Math issue:

Before waveform capture, C1 and C2 has measurement added:
(Attachment Link)


After capture C1 and C2 show measurement
(Attachment Link)


Add math F1=C1+C2 and math F2=C3+C4. F1 displays correctly, F2 says invalid source
(Attachment Link)


Press stop and now F2 displays correctly.
(Attachment Link)





Are there any other bugs / odd behavior that requires workarounds that I should be aware of for this scope?

So essentially, if you don't have measurements defined for a channel it is not going acquire data for that channel.  If you add measurements to a new channel it will not acquire data for that channel until a trigger event such as a new trigger condition or pressing 'STOP'.

The math 'issue' is exactly the same.  Data has not yet been acquired.

In 'Normal' mode, the scope is waiting for a trigger event.  It's not going to update anything until it gets one.  To me, this is perfectly normal and expected behavior.

I only have Siglent scopes, so cannot try this party trick on something different.  Maybe someone else can, but to me this is a big nothing.

[KungFuJosh]

I am still pretty sure the behavior is a bug, but it is at least deterministic and has a relatively straight forward workaround.

It's better to learn how a device works than to assume the workflow is a bug because you're not used to it yet.