East tester ET432 vs Der EE DE-5000 Comparison

[NoMoreMagicSmoke]

I recently decided to add a LCR meter to my measurement tools. In my searching these two meters looked to be competitors, with the East Tester having slightly better specifications. I could not find any good comparisons between them, so I did what anyone with a case of TEA syndrome would do, and purchased both . After using them, I believe that there is a definite winner between the two, and I figured I would share my experience to help the next person who might be trying to decide between the two.

Note, there are reviews out already especially of the DE-5000, and this is not intended to be an in-depth review. More a high-level comparison of the two different meters, that will hopefully help someone else make a decision between the two.

User interface
Using the two meters is a significantly different experience. The ET432 has a color screen and can use dedicated arrow keys to be able to select parameters and make changes whereas the DE-5000 only has dedicated keys. The biggest difference I noted though was that the ET432 allows for quickly cycling through the secondary parameters while the meter is in auto mode. This was a nice timesaver if measuring different types of components. The screen on the ET432 was nice and clear and easily readable. The screen on the DE-5000 on the other hand seemed to have poor contrast, and the backlight was mediocre at best. One other thing that I liked about the ET432 was the adjustable power off timeout. It could be adjusted through the setup menu, and could even be turned off.

Winner - ET432 for the color screen and the quicker navigation of the different features.

Features
Both meters have similar features, with both supporting 100Hz to 100Khz measurement. They both can measure inductance, capacitance, and resistance, and they both support DC resistance measurements. The East tester also adds the ability to apply a DC bias, selectable level and has a dedicated electrolytic capacitor mode. This electrolytic capacitor mode automatically applies a DC bias, to ensure that the sine wave does not go negative while measuring the capacitor.

Winner - ET 432, for the selectable level and DC bias.

Included accessories
Both meters can be ordered with different accessories for different prices, but there is a significant difference in the accessories. An interesting difference in the basic accessories though is that the ET432 included a shorting bar, whereas I could not find an option to recieve the shorting bar with a DE-5000.

The ET432 can be ordered with true 4 wire Kelvin clips, whereas the DE-5000 clips are 4 wire to the clips, but then soldered together to standard alligator clips. This is easy to remedy, but will require purchasing separate Kelvin clips, and soldering the new clips in place of the alligator clips.

The ET432 can be ordered with tweezers, but they are pretty cheap. They appear to be bare wire run to a bent tab, soldered together then covered with heat shrink. They appear to get the job done but are not nearly as nice as the molded plastic handled with a real PCB board that the DE-5000 tweezers come with.

Winner - Tie. The ET432 has nicer clips, but the DE-5000 has nicer tweezers.

Build Quality
Both meters feel substantial, and solid when holding. The ET432 has a silicone sleeve that will protect it from drops, whereas the DE-5000 does not have any type of protection. The sleeve is substantially thick but the fit is a bit loose, the tilting bale is floppy, and the meter has slots that the sleeve fits into, making the sleeve almost required for use. In fact, while performing my tests, the tilting bale was so floppy, that it came out of the sleeve causing the meter to fall over. The DE was more stable but feels very light and rocks when standing. I never had it fall over, but it did have a tendency to slide on my workbench if I was not careful pressing buttons. The buttons took a very light press to actuate, so in practice I was able to adapt to the light presses needed.

I opened up both and internally they were neatly layed out, with no bodges. Both meters had what appeared to be leftover flux residue on the input jacks, but the rest of each PCB was clean. The DE-5000 solder joints all look nice, whereas the ET432 input clips had incomplete solder joints. Other than the input solder joints on the ET432, the rest of the soldering looks good.

I included a photo of the inside of the ET432 for anyone interested.

Winner - DE-5000 due to the incomplete solder joints inside the ET432, and the fact that the tilting bale came loose during my functional testing.

Implementation
The DE-5000 is well known to be an integrated chip solution, and when I researched the ET432 there was speculation that it was a similar implementation. The PCB said a very different story though. When I opened up the ET432 it was full of electronic switches and muxes. The ET432 appears that it is a more conventional implementation with discrete components compared to the integrated chipset of the DE-5000. One substantial difference is that the DE-5000 contains 6 range resistors covering 100Ohm to 1MOhm range, and the ET432 only contains 5 range resistors covering 100Ohm to 100KOhm. I suspect this missing range resistor proved to make a demonstrable difference in the measurement performance.

Winner - Subjective, but the extra range resistor does give the DE-5000 ad advantage when measuring high resistance devices.

Measurements
This is where the two meters started to substantially differ. The ET432 is a 40k count meter whereas the DE-5000 is only a 20K count meter. This better precision combined with the better specifications should make the ET432 a far more capable meter than the DE-5000. In practice this did not prove to be the case. To test out the two meters, I measured some capacitors and resistors.

Here is a quick overview of the results. All measurements taken using 4 wire Kelvin clips, except for the measurements taken with a Fluke 189.

As an ESR reference, I used a signal generator and my Fluke 189 to determine ESR following the instructions at http://www.kerrywong.com/2015/11/23/esr-measurement-using-multimeter-and-function-generator/.

47 uf polymer capacitor
Meter   Capacitance (120Hz)   D(120Hz)   ESR(100KHz)
DE       49.45uF                      0.026        28mOhm
ET        49.88uF                     0.0296       42.30mOhm
Fluke    52.4uF                       -------        28mOhm

After taking these measurements, I was surprised that the ET432 was so far off measuring the ESR. To rule out fixturing, I re-tested by putting the resistor directly in the measurement slots of each meter. The readings on the DE did not substantially change, but the ET432 ESR dropped to a more expected 24.89mOhm.  I then tried using the bananna jacks with the included alligator clips, and the ET432 then read 23.9mOhm for ESR. As it turns out, instead of testing the meter, I proved what we all already knew. Fixturing matter a LOT when performing measurements!  AND I also proved that the included Kelvin clips look nice but are actually crap. 

20K 0.1% film resistor
Meter   DCR                 100Hz              1KHz               100Khz
DE       20.01KOhm      20.00kOhm       20.00KOhm     19.98KOhm
ET        19.991KOhm    20.004KOhm    20.005KOhm    19.659KOhm
Fluke    20.007KOhm     ------               -------              -------

These results also do not bode well for the ET432. The DE-5000 is accurate well within its specifications at all frequencies, but the ET432 is 1.75% out (Spec is 0.8%) measuring the resistor at 100KHz

10M 0.5% carbon resistor
Meter   DCR                 100Hz            1KHz              100Khz
DE       10.080MOhm    9.996MOhm    9.998MOhm    OL
ET        9.901MOhm     9.905MOhm     6.311MOhm   14.075KOhm
Fluke    10.008MOhm    ------              -------            -------

This tells a similar story to the 20K resistor. The DE-5000 exceeded its specifications in all ranges except for the 100KHz range. To be fair to the meter, the manual also indicates that there is no specification for the 20MOhm range at 100KHz, so this is documented behavior. The ET432 on the other hand, while within its specifications at DCR and 100HZ was measuring almost half the resistance at 1Khz, and orders of magnitude too low in the 100KHz range.

The fact that the ET is so far off on the 10M resistor is interesting to me. The DE has a 1MOhm range resistor, but the ET432 only has a 100KOhm range resistor as its highest value. I wonder if the ET meter would have done better if it has a 1MOhm range resistor.

After the reasonable testing, I figured I would have some fun and I attempted to measure the input impedance of my Brymen 789. 

BM789 input (6V DC range)
Meter   Capacitance (100Hz) Resistance (100Hz) Resistance (DCR)
DE        68pF                       10.97MOhm            11.119MOhm
ET        64pF                        9.099mOhm           10.94MOhm
Fluke    200nF                       -----------              11.120MOhm

Since the Brymen specified the input capacitance as 75pF, I would say both LCR meters did an acceptable job measuring the input. The ET measured resistance low again, but within its specifications and the DE measured the resistance well within its specifications. The Fluke did not accurately measure the input capacitance, which shows why a proper LCR meter is needed if measuring complex impedance.

In addition to the readings above, the DE-5000 readings were always consistently repeatable after performing the compensation routine. The ET432 on the other hand did not seem to have as consistent readings and would change every time the compensation routine was run. The DE-5000 readings were also extremely stable once the final reading was reached, whereas the ET432 readings had a tendency to vary 10's of counts constantly.

Winner - DE-5000 due to the inaccuracy of the ET432 at 100KHz, and the questionable repeatability.

Conclusion
I really liked the ET432 meter. It has a great display and quick intuitive user interface and was great to use. I may have gotten a bad meter, but based on my testing unfortunately it's measurement capabilities at 100KHz don't live up to the specification sheet. Additionally, the Kelvin clips included with the ET432 look nice but seem to perform worse that the included two wire alligator clips. I have reached out to the seller of the ET432, and will update with their response. The DE-5000 on the other hand does not have quite as nice of a display, and the user interface is not as nice to use, but the measurements were all spot on with the expected values.

Based on this quick test, the DE-5000 is a much more reliable and accurate meter than the ET432. The ET432 has great potential, but the measurements outside of its published specifications, makes it impossible to recommend.

[mawyatt]

Nice work, and why we have the DE-5000, it just works and gives the correct results!!

Agree the TL-21 Alligator clips supplied with the DE-5000 don't seem like they would perform as well as the popular Kelvin clips with the separate BNCs, but they do and are actually better performers!! We had made up a set of typical Kelvin clips for the DE-5000 with a modified TL-21, but after some evaluations the Alligator clips proved more reliable, repeatable, and easier to use (shorter cables certainly helps with a handheld).

We then took the modded TL-21 with the Kelvin clips and removed the clips, then attached a set of 4 BNC connectors/cables that can mate with the standard Bench LCR meter fixtures. This proved to be very useful indeed, and now we can utilize all the precision LCR meter fixtures available, including SMD fixtures, with the DE-5000. Here's link discussing such, see page 3.

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/de-5000-lcr-tl-21-mod/msg4754858/#msg4754858

We've done a considerable amount of testing with the DE-5000 compared to the lab grade bench Hioki IM3536 and Tonghui TH2830 LCR meters, and the DE-5000 has earned a spot up front on our test bench, and is the "Go To" resource for quick, reliable L & C measurements.

Best,

[NoMoreMagicSmoke]

Nice work, and why we have the DE-5000, it just works and gives the correct results!!

Agree the TL-21 Alligator clips supplied with the DE-5000 don't seem like they would perform as well as the popular Kelvin clips with the separate BNCs, but they do and are actually better performers!! We had made up a set of typical Kelvin clips for the DE-5000 with a modified TL-21, but after some evaluations the Alligator clips proved more reliable, repeatable, and easier to use (shorter cables certainly helps with a handheld).

We then took the modded TL-21 with the Kelvin clips and removed the clips, then attached a set of 4 BNC connectors/cables that can mate with the standard Bench LCR meter fixtures. This proved to be very useful indeed, and now we can utilize all the precision LCR meter fixtures available, including SMD fixtures, with the DE-5000. Here's link discussing such, see page 3.

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/de-5000-lcr-tl-21-mod/msg4754858/#msg4754858

We've done a considerable amount of testing with the DE-5000 compared to the lab grade bench Hioki IM3536 and Tonghui TH2830 LCR meters, and the DE-5000 has earned a spot up front on our test bench, and is the "Go To" resource for quick, reliable L & C measurements.

Best,

Thanks!

Based on my research, I knew that the DE-5000 was a good meter. I was tempted to just order it, and ignore the East Tester, but my curiosity got the better of me. Hopefully this post will be able to help the next person that is trying to decide between the two. I am honestly really bummed though because I really do like the ET432 user interface and screen so much better than the DE-5000. It has a lot of potential!

I can't honestly say how well the alligator clips work on the DE-5000 because I immediately replaced them with the Kelvin clips mostly so I could have longer leads.  The Kelvin clips I installed on the DE-5000 so far seem to work great and give identical measurements as inserting the components directly into the meter. If I was doing lab work, I would probably add the BNC connections the same as you did. This is my home toy though, so I doubt it will ever be used with a precision fixture.

Hearing stories about comparing the DE-5000 to lab grade bench meters is impressive. It definitely says a lot about just how good that integrated chipset is!

[coromonadalix]

do you have open close calibration on the ET lcr ??

Geehy  mcu  WTF  ??  brand is this  loll

The internals protections on the ET lcr seems better  ??  haven't seen munch in the DE5000

I would have loved a fight betwen them and the hantek 1832 1833

[mawyatt]

Based on my research, I knew that the DE-5000 was a good meter. I was tempted to just order it, and ignore the East Tester, but my curiosity got the better of me. Hopefully this post will be able to help the next person that is trying to decide between the two. I am honestly really bummed though because I really do like the ET432 user interface and screen so much better than the DE-5000. It has a lot of potential!

 

Note below |
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[NoMoreMagicSmoke]

do you have open close calibration on the ET lcr ??

Geehy  mcu  WTF  ??  brand is this  loll

The internals protections on the ET lcr seems better  ??  haven't seen munch in the DE5000

I would have loved a fight betwen them and the hantek 1832 1833

Yes. The ET has the same open and close calibration as the DE

It does appear that they put some input protection, but it does not appear to be more than a PTC and some diodes.

Since the Hantek has the same chipset as the DE, I suspect it would be very similar. I know there are other threads reviewing the Hantek.

[coromonadalix]

you meant  like the ET

[NoMoreMagicSmoke]

you meant  like the ET

Whoops. I was thinking of the Mastech meter. Yes, that Hantek certainly looks very similar to the ET.

Ok now, I do actually share your curiosity if the Hantek will have the same 100Khz issues the ET had.

[mawyatt]

I can't honestly say how well the alligator clips work on the DE-5000 because I immediately replaced them with the Kelvin clips mostly so I could have longer leads.  The Kelvin clips I installed on the DE-5000 so far seem to work great and give identical measurements as inserting the components directly into the meter. If I was doing lab work, I would probably add the BNC connections the same as you did. This is my home toy though, so I doubt it will ever be used with a precision fixture.

Hearing stories about comparing the DE-5000 to lab grade bench meters is impressive. It definitely says a lot about just how good that integrated chipset is!

Actually the "Precision Fixture" doesn't cost much, both of the SMD fixture types we have were "roll the dice" cheap from AliExpress, under $100. We did rework the insides some for better repeatability, and on one we 3D printed a "V Groove" fixture that holds the smaller SMD DUT's better. Even for a hobby home use (we are retired but still do some EE consulting), this added BNC cable adapter & SMD fixture really expands the DE-5000 measurement capability and repeatability which is already quite good!!

Edit: With the DE-5000 & SMD fixture you can do an Open Cal with the Fixture Plunger pried open to the expected SMD length DUT, this gives an accurate result of the DE-5000, BNC Cable and Fixture Capacitance. For the Short Cal we use 0 ohm SMD devices in 0603, 0805, 1206 and so on sizes, this gives a good representation for the total loop resistance in the DE-5000, BNC Cables and SMD Fixture.

Best,

[Martin72]

For the price the DE5000 is unbeatable, the ET4410 is "better" but cost much more (appx 300).
Little bit surprising that the ET432 performs worse vs DE5000.
Reading it´s manual, the part with the accuracy, makes you mad...Diagrams, formulars, tables, correction factors...
But it would be interesting to find out why it´s getting partly out of it´s own specs*.
Nevertheless, the ET433 is interesting because of the free adjustable testfrequencies.


*)At the end the shown values are calculation results, so the "frontend" must be the cause.

[NoMoreMagicSmoke]

For the price the DE5000 is unbeatable, the ET4410 is "better" but cost much more (appx 300).
Little bit surprising that the ET432 performs worse vs DE5000.
Reading it´s manual, the part with the accuracy, makes you mad...Diagrams, formulars, tables, correction factors...
But it would be interesting to find out why it´s getting partly out of it´s own specs*.
Nevertheless, the ET433 is interesting because of the free adjustable testfrequencies.


*)At the end the shown values are calculation results, so the "frontend" must be the cause.

Curiosity got the better of me again, and I decided to try to see if I could determine what might cause the 100KHz resistance measurement errors.

I found that in the 100Khz range the output voltage drops from and expected 610mV at the lower frequencies to 440mV. If it's doing its calculations thinking the voltage is still 600mV that would certainly be a cause of error. The DE does not exhibit this behavior. The DE has is off for about a second when switching ranges, but then rapidly recovers to about 630mV.

It appears (speculation on my part) like the ET is controlling the voltage open loop, and the DE has feedback that ensures the voltage is constant.

[NoMoreMagicSmoke]

For the price the DE5000 is unbeatable, the ET4410 is "better" but cost much more (appx 300).
Little bit surprising that the ET432 performs worse vs DE5000.
Reading it´s manual, the part with the accuracy, makes you mad...Diagrams, formulars, tables, correction factors...
But it would be interesting to find out why it´s getting partly out of it´s own specs*.
Nevertheless, the ET433 is interesting because of the free adjustable testfrequencies.


*)At the end the shown values are calculation results, so the "frontend" must be the cause.

So, I heard back from the seller, and they are insistent that the meter is operating normally. First, they tried to blame it on the resistor itself, then when I showed them the DE vs ET measurements, they said the difference is because the ET is a 5 digit, and the DE is only showing 4 digits. 

I did get them to agree to sending me out a replacement set of Kelvin clips, but they said they would provide tracking and I still have not received tracking information 3 days later.

[Martin72]

Most of the sellers don´t have any clue, they´re only selling something from somewhere to someone.

I found that in the 100Khz range the output voltage drops from and expected 610mV at the lower frequencies to 440mV.

How did you measure this ?

If it's doing its calculations thinking the voltage is still 600mV that would certainly be a cause of error

It´s calculating with the measured values.

[NoMoreMagicSmoke]

Most of the sellers don´t have any clue, they´re only selling something from somewhere to someone.

I found that in the 100Khz range the output voltage drops from and expected 610mV at the lower frequencies to 440mV.

How did you measure this ?

If it's doing its calculations thinking the voltage is still 600mV that would certainly be a cause of error

It´s calculating with the measured values.

I am not surprised about the seller, I am more surprised that their response is basically "Don't use that range"  . The seller is listed as "East Tester Factory Store" That means the seller is directly the factory... Right??? Right??? 

I measured the voltage with both a Fluke 189 as well as an oscilloscope. I am certain that my measurement affected the voltage some, but I listed it mostly to point out a difference between the DE (No voltage change) and the ET (drops demonstrably.

The more I did into the ET, the more it confuses me. How on earth are they making a 40k count meter when the only DAQ on the meter is the 12 bit DAQ built into the CPU???

[Martin72]

I measured the voltage with both a Fluke 189

Ah, good(100khz trms)

as well as an oscilloscope.

Better..


Hm-hm...

10M 0.5% carbon resistor
Meter   DCR                 100Hz            1KHz              100Khz
DE       10.080MOhm    9.996MOhm    9.998MOhm    OL
ET        9.901MOhm     9.905MOhm     6.311MOhm   14.075KOhm

You´ve made it also with a 20k - Would be interesting if you can test some more resitors, say between 1k and 1M.

[NoMoreMagicSmoke]

10M 0.5% carbon resistor
Meter   DCR                 100Hz            1KHz              100Khz
DE       10.080MOhm    9.996MOhm    9.998MOhm    OL
ET        9.901MOhm     9.905MOhm     6.311MOhm   14.075KOhm

You´ve made it also with a 20k - Would be interesting if you can test some more resitors, say between 1k and 1M.

I currently only have a 10K and a 20K of the Vishay precision film resistors readily available for testing. The 10k made things more interesting. Here are the results.

10K 0.1% Film resistor
Meter   DCR                 100Hz            1KHz              100Khz
DE       9.998KOhm     9.997KOhm     9.996KOhm     9.997KOhm
ET        10.001KOhm  10.001KOhm    10.000KOhm   9.993KOhm
Fluke    9.998KOhm      -----------        -----------      ------------

So, in that case, the measured resistance drops, but not nearly as much as the 20k. Now, I am wishing I have a 30k on hand to test.

[Martin72]

But we can already foresee a trend this way.
The greater the resistance, the greater the deviation in non-dcr mode.
It annoys me a bit right now that I don't have the ET4410 anymore....
At that time I had only measured capacitors and coils with it.

[mawyatt]

You´ve made it also with a 20k - Would be interesting if you can test some more resitors, say between 1k and 1M.

Here's a couple of precision low TC Caddock TF020R 0.01% types (large flat metal foil types used in DC precision applications), measured with a relatively new KS34465A (Kelvin Clips), TH2830 (Kelvin Clips) and DE-5000 with TL-21.

100K         KS34465A             TH2830                      DE-5000
                100.0088K             99.9994K                   99.92K
                                             99.0222K @ 100KHz   99.53K @ 100KHz
                                              Cp ~ 0.79pF               Cp ~ 0.45pF
20K           20.00119K             19.9991K                   20.00K
                                             19.800K @ 100KHz     20.00K @ 100KHz
                                              Cp ~ 1.26pF               Cp ~ 0.74pF

Anyway, might find this useful for comparisons.

Best,

[Martin72]

A further proof that the DE5000 is simply an absolute godsend for hobbyists on a tight budget.

[NoMoreMagicSmoke]

A further proof that the DE5000 is simply an absolute godsend for hobbyists on a tight budget.

Agreed. I paid $147 USD for it and both sets of probes. I also know the DE-5000 is sold for about 1/2 that in Japan. That meter is absolutely a steal at that price. The ET-432 I paid $190 for the equivalent setup, and It appears that it is really only a 40KHz meter.

[NoMoreMagicSmoke]

It annoys me a bit right now that I don't have the ET4410 anymore....
At that time I had only measured capacitors and coils with it.

Truly a bummer. I am also interested in how the higher end ET4410 handles this.

[Martin72]

I´m thinking about to get this thing back for several reasons(finishing the circuit diagram I´ve started to draw, doing comparisons vs my hioki lcr).
It was a good one, slightly "better" than the DE5000 with more features.

[NoMoreMagicSmoke]

I´m thinking about to get this thing back for several reasons(finishing the circuit diagram I´ve started to draw, doing comparisons vs my hioki lcr).
It was a good one, slightly "better" than the DE5000 with more features.

How was it "better" than the DE?

[NoMoreMagicSmoke]

Update after talking to the ET432 vendor.

They sent me a replacement set of Kelvin clips, and they now measure ESR the same as the DE-5000. The vendor also confirmand that their testing showed that the ET432 is out of specification when measuring a 20K resistor at 100KHz (and gets worse as the resistance goes up). They said that the engineer was investigating, and they would let me know once they have a resolution.

[pope]

Would be interesting to hear what the say.