Rigol HDO1000 and HDO4000 12bit oscilloscopes launched in China

[markone]

DHO....
Both series are renamed to this and I wonder what this could mean.
HDO is clear, high definition oscilloscope, but DHO....
Definition high oscilloscope..sounds silly.
Dumb high...Do not buy high...
Nevertheless I´ve played with the thoughts to get a DHO1074 just for curiosity and testing - After that, re-selling would be easy...
But you can´t get it easy here in germany.
Batronix don´t sell them for reasons, Conrad Electronic got them and could deliver inbetween 2 weeks.
But there´s a note, not for private customers....Why....
DHO4000 is no problem so what are rigol doing there...Won´t they sell the 1000s to the public..
Strange selling policy here.

Amazon has a bunch of them in listing from several days.

[markone]

Programming manual is now available for download :

https://www.rigol.eu/Public/Uploads/uploadfile/files/20221123/20221123203638_637e13d653378.pdf

[markone]

Today first tests with of HD1K remote control operation, the good news is that memory transfer speed is decent, around 200Mbps with ethernet interface, something less with USB connection.   

Those number come from a full RAW memory transfer process (100 Mpts @ 16bits, 2 bytes x point) that takes about 8 second.

RAW data can be accessed only with  acquisition is stopped while screen data can be read any time. 

[Alex-lab]

Hi,

Just received HDO1074 oscope. Nice device!
Not sure if it was already reported here, but it seems as "High Res" acquisition mode skips half of the points resulting in 1/2 of the amplitude on the display and measurement results.
Firmware: 01.01.26 26/09/2022.

Could anybody check this on your device?
Thanks.

[2N3055]

Hi,

Just received HDO1074 oscope. Nice device!
Not sure if it was already reported here, but it seems as "High Res" acquisition mode skips half of the points resulting in 1/2 of the amplitude on the display and measurement results.
Firmware: 01.01.26 26/09/2022.

Could anybody check this on your device?
Thanks.

HiRes is lowpass filter.
Try with some low frequency, maybe 1 kHz..

Or you are saying you see every other sample point on screen?

[skander36]

Indeed, the amplitude decrease with half when you select Hires mode, either 14 or 16 bits.

[2N3055]

Indeed, the amplitude decrease with half when you select Hires mode, either 14 or 16 bits.

Thank you for clarification... That is definitely a problem..

[TK]

Indeed, the amplitude decrease with half when you select Hires mode, either 14 or 16 bits.

Maybe it is assuming 50ohm path active?  I noticed that if you try to change vertical setting in HiRes mode, signal gets clipped.

[skander36]

Indeed, the amplitude decrease with half when you select Hires mode, either 14 or 16 bits.

Maybe it is assuming 50ohm path active?  I noticed that if you try to change vertical setting in HiRes mode, signal gets clipped.

Maybe someone with HDO4K could test HiRes with 50 ohm active.
Seem to be an unfinished job. I did not encountered this until now on a scope.
Even is a low pass effect, as 2N3055 has said, it should not cut half of the signal amplitude.

[2N3055]

50Ω has nothing to do with scope amplitude....

And I will repeat: what frequency are you measuring at?
It can be 100x attenuated depending on frequency...

But it is probably a bug in data scaling after calculations for HiRes..

Rigol forced this out too soon..
And just a few days ago I realized why: they just had IPO on Chinese Shanghai Stock Exchange..

[markone]

Indeed, the amplitude decrease with half when you select Hires mode, either 14 or 16 bits.

Maybe it is assuming 50ohm path active?  I noticed that if you try to change vertical setting in HiRes mode, signal gets clipped.

Maybe someone with HDO4K could test HiRes with 50 ohm active.
Seem to be an unfinished job. I did not encountered this until now on a scope.
Even is a low pass effect, as 2N3055 has said, it should not cut half of the signal amplitude.

There are many other quirks, it was expected at launch but now its time to pretend the first FW update, right now what bother me more is wrong settings recover at startup (i.e. AC coupling on channel 1) and FAN noise.

Dunno what you think guys, in my opinion FAN noise is not acceptable, being the speed electronic controlled buy software the hope is they put something like "fan profile" in setting menu.

[markone]

-snip
Rigol forced this out too soon..
And just a few days ago I realized why: they just had IPO on Chinese Shanghai Stock Exchange..

This was already pointed out some weeks ago, aside that there is no doubt that application software is alpha version 0.1, but the price is insane, so it's worth the wait 

[skander36]

50Ω has nothing to do with scope amplitude....

And I will repeat: what frequency are you measuring at?
It can be 100x attenuated depending on frequency...

But it is probably a bug in data scaling after calculations for HiRes..

Rigol forced this out too soon..
And just a few days ago I realized why: they just had IPO on Chinese Shanghai Stock Exchange..

1KHz ...
It is oversampling. From 5 MSs/s to 50 MSa/s.
But whatever the cause it is a bug of course.

[markone]

50Ω has nothing to do with scope amplitude....

And I will repeat: what frequency are you measuring at?
It can be 100x attenuated depending on frequency...

But it is probably a bug in data scaling after calculations for HiRes..

Rigol forced this out too soon..
And just a few days ago I realized why: they just had IPO on Chinese Shanghai Stock Exchange..

It's for sure a bug, the amplitude is halved also with a 100Hz sine wave, noticed first day when I was playing with acquisition menu.
In my opinion this is the last problem of the list, scope's traces are clearly the most detailed that I have seen in a scope of this price as well as the image quality.

[markone]

50Ω has nothing to do with scope amplitude....

And I will repeat: what frequency are you measuring at?
It can be 100x attenuated depending on frequency...

But it is probably a bug in data scaling after calculations for HiRes..

Rigol forced this out too soon..
And just a few days ago I realized why: they just had IPO on Chinese Shanghai Stock Exchange..

1KHz ...
It is oversampling. From 5 MSs/s to 50 MSa/s.
But whatever the cause it is a bug of course.

As was saying 2N3055 "is probably a bug in data scaling after calculations for HiRes", the weird thing is that it passed internal prelaminar test fully unnoticed 

I'm getting some strange high frequency noise in waveform traces dumped with SCPI commands, something that seems not present on ths DSO screen 

I will show later.

[Martin72]

Let´s hope for you and other owners, rigol change it´s "fixing problems policy" and deliver soon the solutions.

[markone]

Here we go, a couple of screens of dumped traces via SCPI command, the first one is "normal" while the second one shows the normal trace plus the high frequency noise that sometime appears among normal waveforms. The reason why there are different traces on second screenshot is because I'm drawing last three traces at the same time.

[markone]

Let´s hope for you and other owners, rigol change it´s "fixing problems policy" and deliver soon the solutions.

I don't expect at all that Rigol will change the habits of the past, i do expect instead this DSO will follow the same fate as the past ones, at best.
I was personally aware about that, dunno other buyers, but if you want a real 12bit DSO @ 1K euro, right now there are not other commercial solutions. 

I would have been concerned if DSO had analog acquisition performance issues, but from this point of view I am very satisfied for what I have seen, there is a huge gap in S/N and analog detail toward any other scope in the price range.

[Martin72]

Demonstration video about the visualization techniques, including the new ultra-acquire mode:

[Martin72]

Another new video about the noise performance:



At appx 1min: Multi-grid display....Impressive.

[thm_w]

Demonstration video about the visualization techniques, including the new ultra-acquire mode:

The actual ultraAcquire info starts at about 4mins in.
Did not guess that the name meant this at all, its more like "record analysis" not really a different acquire mode. Still the waterfall and grid display were cool, although with the grid one you'd need the scope to somehow output a higher res than it internally processes to see much detail.

[Fungus]

At appx 1min: Multi-grid display....Impressive.

Yep.

Just the UI and just generally the way this thing works seems like a game-changer to me.

If you add in the 12 bits and low noise then it's now the only choice in this price range, or even much higher.

[markone]

At appx 1min: Multi-grid display....Impressive.

Yep.

Just the UI and just generally the way this thing works seems like a game-changer to me.

If you add in the 12 bits and low noise then it's now the only choice in this price range, or even much higher.

I would add that UI is very responsive, even more after firmware update, nothing to do with MSO5K.

Also screen quality is quite high, high resolution image with very good contrast, in my opinion better than R&S screens that are way to much glossy.

[Fungus]

I'm actually tempted to save up and get one.

[dreamcat4]

what i dont seem to understand is why they cannot come out later to make an mso version. based on same platform maybe some way down the road

sure it would require a new pcb but they could still re-use the same firmware / software. and all this new analogue hardware pipeline

what is less clear to me however is why they cannot work allongside in parallel for those extra mso bits. if they need to wait for those same software engineers to actually finish these analogue software first. to be trained and competent to develop new software components on this new platform

but at least the hardware could developed and some prototypes made, without such critical path delay.

i suppose the staggering of the mso version for later could be a way to give time for old engineers to come over from previous (now defunct) prior platform(s). while a smaller team had already started early ahead just for the analog only product.

that all sounds like a lot of speculation. however what i am really trying to determine is whether or not there will ever actually be an mso mixed signal version of this scope. or if there will never be one.

because if they will eventually come out with an mso version. then i am much happier to wait for that one. however if there were other reasons why rigol doesnt want to bother. then i am not going to benefit by waiting for such a product...

i understand maybe their previous mso 5000 had some certain issue or difficulties with its digital decoding etc. however that would not influence such decisions for this new platform hopefully? or barring any other clear change in rigol's strategy going forwards in terms of their broader product lineup. then i am struggling to see much solid signs or reasons why they wouldnt want to eventually come out with a mixed signal version. if sales of these models are strong. then it makes sense to want to expand the range, right?