R&S MXO3/04/05 - Reviews, Bugs & Wanted Features/Improvements Thread

[Martin72]

Hi at all,

Another quick review thread...
Due to the limited time I have for testing.
In this case, it will be just under 4 weeks.
Thanks to Batronix, I have the opportunity to test the latest oscilloscope from R&S’s MXO series, the MXO3.
It is the smallest model in the MXO series, but still offers up to 8 channels.
The demo unit arrived yesterday, and as it is a demo unit, there is a corresponding R&S sticker on the housing.
This has one advantage: all options are available, including the maximum bandwidth of 1 GHz.
Despite the 8 channels, it is rather small and handy.
Compared to the larger MXO4 and MXO5 series, for example, the reference input and output are missing, and the screen is smaller, though it also features Full HD resolution.
I hope to take a few pictures of the device tomorrow, time permitting,
and, of course, turn it on and measure the boot time.
Due to the relatively short testing period, the program will be streamlined accordingly and focus on the “standard” testing procedures.
Feel free to suggest what else you'd like to see.
More coming soon—stay tuned.

Martin

[KungFuJosh]

You know what comparison I want to see.

[Rydda]

Hi.
IF you have firmware version 2.7.2 and IF you do an update to 2.8.2 I would be interested to know if you notice an improved UI response.
/Rydda

[egonotto]

Hello,

I’d be interested in the noise performance.
Specifically, 1 mV/div and 1 V/div with 1 ms/div and enough memory to reach the maximum sampling rate of 5 GSa/s. Preferably with a “short-circuited (50-ohm termination)” input.

The zone trigger is also very interesting, because it is extremely powerful on the MXO devices.

Thank you.

Best regards,
egonotto

[Martin72]

Hi,

Today I was able to take a few more pictures and turn the device on for the first time.
The build quality is very good—or rather, it’s appropriate for this price range; only the Magnova, with its all-metal housing, can top it.
I really like the layout of the front controls, as well as the design of the individual elements.
Sober and unpretentious....Good.
As I said, despite having 8 channels and a fairly large screen, it’s turned out to be quite compact, as you can see when comparing it to the Magnova, for example, which is also a very compact scope.


There’s a power switch at the back near the power connector—you don’t see those very often these days (the Magnova also has a power switch).
Then I turned on the Scope—you can barely hear anything; the fan is really quiet.
But that’s no surprise—it’s a massive 160mm fan from Noiseblocker.
Boot time is 1 minute and 16 seconds, which isn’t exactly fast, but it’s not super slow either—it’s fine.

Once the scope had finished booting up, the first thing I did was turn down the brightness of the buttons—at “100%,” they can practically burn your retinas, to put it bluntly...
What I see on the home screen is, at first glance, a neat menu bar that runs along the top and bottom of the screen.
I immediately noticed one great feature, and then another shortly after.
“Undo”....It sounds simple, but it's fantastic, and I think every scope should have this feature (....Insert brand here....)

Then my eye fell on the “Annotation” menu...
Nothing new for R&S Scope owners, but for me it's a brilliant tool for quickly marking something on the screen, e.g., for presentation purposes.
Great!

Tomorrow I plan to work my way through the menus to see what’s available and try out a few basics.
My first impression is definitely positive.

[Martin72]

Rest of the pics...

Hi.
IF you have firmware version 2.7.2 and IF you do an update to 2.8.2 I would be interested to know if you notice an improved UI response.
/Rydda

I need to check first whether I'm allowed to make any changes to this device.

[MASCH]

Hi,

I am currently also evaluating a demo unit of the MXO3.

Something that I find really annoying is that the user interface becomes very sluggish fast.

Even when just running with one trace displayed, it sometimes just doesn't react to changing the volts per div or time per div settings, completely ignoring the knobs.
How can a scope in this class be so slow in response?

Also when when doing a little more processing, the mouse pointer (using wireless mouse) becomes sooo laggy.....

Did you experience the same issue?

BR
Markus

[Rydda]

Hi.
@Martin and Markus.
To give some context to my comment on the UI response: my impression the first time I powered up my scope was ' god, that is slow'. When I dragged a menu across the screen, the menu slowly followed the cursor after a noticeable delay. And sometime I had to click a button twice before it reacted.
Since most complaints are first met with 'do you have the latest firmware?' I upgraded from 2.7.2 to 2.8.2, and all these problems disappeared.
I have no explanation for this. I don't know if this was something else entirely. There is nothing in the upgrade description that could explain it. And I did not feel like downgrading to explore further.

Anyway, my scope now works perfectly. I think the UI is brilliant, and works just like I expect it to. I really like it. Maybe the designers were KDE-plasma users?.
I found one small bug: after power-up, the 'backlight-level' does not restore to the value selected in the menu.     

/Rydda

[Martin72]

Hi,

I haven't noticed anything like that yet—the delay when moving a menu window.
And I do this without a mouse and with a screen protector on the display.

There is nothing in the upgrade description that could explain it.

This is either not mentioned at all or falls under the category of “minor improvements”....
Especially not if it doesn't happen with every model, but maybe with a specific production run.
As I said, I haven't seen it here yet—but it could still happen; I'm only just getting started.
There’s a slight delay when you open a menu, but I think that’s normal.
I need to check if I’m allowed to update the firmware on a demo model—and then I’ll have to get it first...It looks like you have to register with R&S to do that.
Here’s a picture of the Bodnar pulse; nothing exciting to see, and the rise time looks reasonable.

[Martin72]

Hello,

I’d be interested in the noise performance.
Specifically, 1 mV/div and 1 V/div with 1 ms/div and enough memory to reach the maximum sampling rate of 5 GSa/s. Preferably with a “short-circuited (50-ohm termination)” input.

Hi,

Done, with shielded 50R input....

[KungFuJosh]

Hello,

I’d be interested in the noise performance.
Specifically, 1 mV/div and 1 V/div with 1 ms/div and enough memory to reach the maximum sampling rate of 5 GSa/s. Preferably with a “short-circuited (50-ohm termination)” input.

Hi,

Done, with shielded 50R input....

How does it look with the 20MHz filter applied to the channel?

[Bud]

Wow, screen reflection is atrocious in the original post's photo. How dows it look under the same angle with the scope turned on?

[mkissin]

Wow, screen reflection is atrocious in the original post's photo. How dows it look under the same angle with the scope turned on?

It still has the screen protection film applied.

[2N3055]

For comparison, with equivalent settings (1ms/div, 40MPts, 4GS/s, 50Ω no termination on input only shielding cap) SDS3104xHD noise:
1GHz BW:
At 1V/div -> 5,4 mV RMS
1mV/div ->   121 µV RMS
20MHz BW
At 1V/div -> 4,9 mV RMS
1mV/div ->   34 µV RMS

[Martin72]

How does it look with the 20MHz filter applied to the channel?

Not bad...
I still had the Scope connected, so I was able to take these measurements again.
Good:
You can select more than the usual two bandwidths.
Since it’s been running for a few hours, I quickly grabbed my Flir and pointed it at the Scope.
Even after all that time, you can’t hear a fan; the case has naturally gotten warmer, but the hotspot at the inputs is only 47°C—nothing to worry about.
@2N3055:
I'm in the middle of it too...

[Martin72]

I just took another look in the box to see what else was in there....

In addition to the protective cover for the front, there’s a pouch containing BNC cables and 8 probes—nice.
However, I find the build quality of these probes to be rather poor, especially the accessories, which are rather flimsy.
So there’s room for improvement, as Magnova demonstrates with its high-quality probes from Testec.
I kept looking in the box, but couldn't find anything:
The probes for the digital input aren't included—that's disappointing for an official demo unit, especially since this option is enabled....Too bad.

[KungFuJosh]

I find the build quality of these probes to be rather poor, especially the accessories, which are rather flimsy.

Those probes are only about $112 USD each, so you shouldn't expect too much from them.

[egonotto]

Hi,

thanks.

R&S seems to be a bit stingy with accessories. My RTA4000 didn’t even come with BNC adapters. However, it did include RT-ZP10 probes, which are supposed to be pretty good.
The digital probes only came with 16 clips. (Siglent and Rigol include 20) I guess you’re not supposed to connect the ground with clips?

Best regards,
egonotto
 

[egonotto]

Hello,

Two R&S® MXO34-1PK (100 MHz) units, priced at €6,366.50 each, are cheaper than a single R&S® MXO38-1PK (also 100 MHz), which costs €14,875.

Best regards,
egonotto
 

[Martin72]

Yes, the pricing is a bit steep; Siglent's 5000X HD is a bit more reasonable.

[MASCH]

According the laggy user interface:

Today I applied the latest firmware update V2.8.2.0

--> there's no improvement in the instruments response to the front knobs

--> sometimes it is missing roughly 5 encoder steps until there's a response in the vertical volts/division

Anyone can confirm this?

Is the MXO4 as bad or does it have a faster application processor?

BR
Markus

[Martin72]

Hi,



I don't see any major delays there.

[Rydda]

Hi.
@Markus:
 When I change the V/div setting, the display is redrawn immediately. There is no noticeable delay or missing encoder steps.
(This is  with 2 channels and the spectrum analyzer running.)

/Rydda

[MASCH]

I just took a video of what I experience with the unit.

[Daniel Bogdanoff]

I've been testing the 2.8.2 beta and release for a couple weeks, it definitely improves the GUI responsiveness (specifically it handles the encoders with a bit more nuance).

I hadn't noticed that the knob detents/clicks don't always match up to the FW changes on this release, but if I do slow 1-at-time knob clicks I do sometimes not get a matching change on the screen. I'll bring this up with the team, and I'm not sure if it's due to that new encoder reading scheme or not. I highly suspect it's something that a future FW update could address.

I have been super impressed with how much new functionality/enhancement comes out with each release as well as how many of those enhancements are free (not paid options).

@MASCH the MXO4 and MXO5 do have a more powerful processor, so if there's a level of lag that you are unhappy with I'd definitely look into getting your hands on a 4 or 5.