Author Topic: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z  (Read 30460 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline rkovvur

  • Contributor
  • Posts: 5
  • Country: us
Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« on: January 14, 2016, 08:26:32 pm »
Hi All:

I am newbie to these forms and I am aware of the heated discussions between Rigol and Siglent. I am planning on buying an oscilloscope soon and I am totally at loss in deciding which one to buy :)
While i like lower cost or the Rigol and its 4 channels, all the new bells and whistles of the Siglent are tempting.

While I am not a newbie to Electronics(I am a digital engineer), I am sorta new to Oscilloscopes.

I would really like to hear what you think would be the better equipment to put hard earned money into :)

Thanks !
 

Offline tautech

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 21232
  • Country: nz
  • Taupaki Technologies Ltd. NZ Siglent Distributor
    • Taupaki Technologies Ltd.
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #1 on: January 15, 2016, 09:57:28 am »
Hi All:

I am newbie to these forms and I am aware of the heated discussions between Rigol and Siglent. I am planning on buying an oscilloscope soon and I am totally at loss in deciding which one to buy :)
While i like lower cost or the Rigol and its 4 channels, all the new bells and whistles of the Siglent are tempting.

While I am not a newbie to Electronics(I am a digital engineer), I am sorta new to Oscilloscopes.

I would really like to hear what you think would be the better equipment to put hard earned money into :)

Thanks !
I've left this thread unanswered for 12+ hrs thinking you'd be recommended the 1054Z as seems to be commonly done here but it seems maybe some are having second thoughts.  :-\

So to offer some info may help:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds1000x-series-oscilloscopes/

I'm aware of further reviews coming soon, so if you can hold off for a bit there should be further info to help you choose.

The Siglent has a better front end, that is capable of higher BW to the -3dB point where signals suffer attenuation making measurements inaccurate.
While many hack the 1054Z, the 500uV range is not recommended, yet the SDS1000X series come with that range as standard and it is much lower noise than the 1054Z.
The other UI concern for some is the channel controls, be it one for each channel or one control shared between all channels, each of us prefer one or the other, this is another choice you'll need to make.

All this aside, you've not given us much to go on relating to your intended use and the features that are important to you.

There will be replies warning you of bugs, and this applies to most DSO's in this price range that are of recent release, albeit a shame this is the case. But you've seen all the threads haven't you?
Avid Rabid Hobbyist
 

Offline Marcos

  • Contributor
  • Posts: 45
  • Country: us
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #2 on: January 15, 2016, 02:03:32 pm »
I was the "proud" owner of a Rigol 1054z. My advice. Don't buy it.
At first I was carried away with so much enthusiasm on this forum and Dave videos and decided to buy it.
Once I got it, I discovered that it is full of bugs and very unstable, noisy inputs a.s.o.
Have no idea how Siglent are managing these problems but probably much better than Rigol. Not to mention that if a bug is reported to Rigol it will take years to fix that. After those years, you'll be surprised to see that after fixing those bugs they will induce new ones to the newest firmwares.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2016, 03:43:20 pm by Marcos »
 

Offline CustomEngineerer

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 459
  • Country: us
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #3 on: January 15, 2016, 03:26:47 pm »
I've left this thread unanswered for 12+ hrs thinking you'd be recommended the 1054Z as seems to be commonly done here but it seems maybe some are having second thoughts.  :-\

My guess is most posters are getting tired of responding to the same exact question every week.
 
The following users thanked this post: tooki

Offline rrinker

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2046
  • Country: us
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #4 on: January 15, 2016, 03:38:55 pm »
 I just bought a Siglent SDS1102CML - no, not exactly comparable to the model you are looking at, but this was more than good enough for my needs, and I am so far quite happy with my purchase - particularly as I got a brand new unit for $100USD less than they usually sell for. I haven't had a chance to get everything set up and actually get to work on things, so mostly I've just been playing around with it and exploring the features. Never used a Rigol, so I have no basis to compare, but I'm happy with my Siglent purchase.
 

Online nctnico

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 20970
  • Country: nl
    • NCT Developments
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #5 on: January 15, 2016, 06:33:19 pm »
Have no idea how Siglent are managing these problems but probably much better than Rigol. Not to mention that if a bug is reported to Rigol it will take years to fix that. After those years, you'll be surprised to see that after fixing those bugs they will induce new ones to the newest firmwares.
Siglent isn't much better so pick your poison...
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline CustomEngineerer

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 459
  • Country: us
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #6 on: January 15, 2016, 06:34:27 pm »
To the OP: My previous comment wasn't a shot at you (or anyone else), hopefully you didn't read it that way. To answer your question, they are both somewhat buggy scopes, both Rigol & Siglent are actively working on fixing issues. New firmware that fixes previous issues (and introduces new issues on occasion) comes out fairly regularly from both. The both also tend to introduce new features from time to time. I've owned a Rigol DS2072A-S for over a year and have really enjoyed it. None of the bugs have affected anything I've needed it for, granted I don't do anything too advanced with it. For what I use it for the Siglent SDS2000 probably would work just as well.
 

Online nctnico

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 20970
  • Country: nl
    • NCT Developments
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #7 on: January 15, 2016, 06:50:46 pm »
If you don't do anything advanced like protocol decoding or need deep memory then you will be much better off getting a second hand scope from one of the big brands (Agilent, Tektronix, Lecroy, Iwatsu, Yokogawa).
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline rkovvur

  • Contributor
  • Posts: 5
  • Country: us
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2016, 08:00:11 pm »
Hi All:

I really appreciate all your responses. I did figure that lot of people might ask the question on which one is better :)

I tinker more with microcontrollers during my spare time and I do have a logic analyzer. However I'd like to get back to analog and spend some time understanding op-amps and mosfets and RC circuits. Hence the oscilloscope.
I definitely dont think i'll be working with anything that might need a 100+mhz scope.  I am also trying to avoid my bad habit of buying the "shiny new toy".

The SDS1202X has 'latest model' cred to it.
The DS105z has the advantage of 2 extra ports and being $160 cheaper, considering my requirements.

As one of you pointed out, maybe i need to wait bit more before I dive in.
 

Offline warnberg

  • Contributor
  • Posts: 28
  • Country: us
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #9 on: January 15, 2016, 08:07:45 pm »
I chose the Rigol 1054Z and have never looked back..I'm completely satisfied with the scope, might be a bug here or there but I haven't run across them with what I am doing..

I too see the "noisy" or "buggy" comments.. but I have no complaints... 400.00 scope and get 4 channels and can unlock it to 100 Mhz, whats there to complain about?

JMO

David
 

Offline Mark

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 222
  • Country: gb
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #10 on: January 15, 2016, 10:52:35 pm »
I bought the 1054z and was more than happy with it.  When I needed another 4 channels I bought a second one.  I also have a Keysight MSO-X 3054A but the Rigols are the best bang for buck, you can't go wrong at $400. 
 

Offline bcbeck96

  • Contributor
  • Posts: 8
  • Country: us
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #11 on: January 20, 2016, 11:18:58 pm »
I own a DS1054z, and have used the SDS1202x, would take the Rigol over the Siglant, not by a large margin but enough not to buy the Siglent.
 

Offline tautech

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 21232
  • Country: nz
  • Taupaki Technologies Ltd. NZ Siglent Distributor
    • Taupaki Technologies Ltd.
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #12 on: January 20, 2016, 11:31:50 pm »
I own a DS1054z, and have used the SDS1202x, would take the Rigol over the Siglent, not by a large margin but enough not to buy the Siglent.
Could you share why?

First DSO?
Familiarity with Rigol products?
Specs?
UI?
Avid Rabid Hobbyist
 

Offline ECEdesign

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 173
  • Country: us
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #13 on: January 21, 2016, 02:27:22 am »
Slightly related topic,what is generally more useful, higher bandwidth or 4 vs 2 channels?

 

Offline tooki

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 6305
  • Country: ch
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #14 on: January 21, 2016, 02:48:04 am »
I've left this thread unanswered for 12+ hrs thinking you'd be recommended the 1054Z as seems to be commonly done here but it seems maybe some are having second thoughts.  :-\

My guess is most posters are getting tired of responding to the same exact question every week.
Quoted for truth.  :-+ This question has been discussed to death, anyone looking for info need only read what's already here instead of pestering with a new thread asking the same thing as the thread a few days ago, and the one a few days prior, ad infinitum.

Slightly related topic,what is generally more useful, higher bandwidth or 4 vs 2 channels?
What's better, a spoon or a knife? In other words, it depends entirely on what you're gonna use it for.
 

Offline lem_ix

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 192
  • Country: cs
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #15 on: January 21, 2016, 02:45:00 pm »
If the bandwidth is non issue, 4 channels seem more useful. Don't have experience with any of their scopes but I do have a rigol dg1032z and a siglent spd3303s and i like the fit and finish of the rigol better. Bottom line both are probably adequate, if possible play around with them a bit and see which UI you like better ;)
 

Offline Wuerstchenhund

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3070
  • Country: gb
  • Able to drop by occasionally only
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #16 on: January 21, 2016, 04:19:07 pm »
Siglent is relatively new

This might seem to be the case but actually Siglent is just 4 years younger than Rigol.

Quote
Rigol has more knowledge beyond electronics gears -- they make bio science and chemical analyzing gears as well, and Rigol has their own ASICs, either rebadged or designed in house.

Yes, they now make a photospectrometer and an automatic sampling system. But I'd be surprised if Rigol really develops their own ASICs, from what I know they are mostly busy withs scrubbing the imprints from the commodity components they buy. 

Do you have any reference to that ASIC?

Quote
Finally, Rigol started as a company that develops scopes on their own and they hold tons of patents

Not sure about the "tons of patents" as I was only able to find a single one:

http://patents.justia.com/assignee/rigol-technologies-inc

Do you have a reference for the other patents they are supposedly holding?
« Last Edit: January 21, 2016, 04:21:08 pm by Wuerstchenhund »
 

Offline rf-loop

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3555
  • Country: cn
  • Born with DLL21 in hand
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #17 on: January 21, 2016, 05:19:06 pm »

Google ds6102 photo, then you will find some rigol branded chips, definitely adc. From Dave's video, some lower end scopes use Rigol branded input diff amps.


Are these ASIC's ?

Also I can buy chips even with my name if I want or with my logo or just with my signature if I want. It is really easy. Just set order and send money.
If practice and theory is not equal it tells that used application of theory is wrong or the theory itself is wrong.
-
Harmony OS
 

Offline tautech

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 21232
  • Country: nz
  • Taupaki Technologies Ltd. NZ Siglent Distributor
    • Taupaki Technologies Ltd.
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #18 on: January 22, 2016, 12:29:00 am »
Hi All:

I really appreciate all your responses. I did figure that lot of people might ask the question on which one is better :)

I tinker more with microcontrollers during my spare time and I do have a logic analyzer. However I'd like to get back to analog and spend some time understanding op-amps and mosfets and RC circuits. Hence the oscilloscope.
I definitely dont think i'll be working with anything that might need a 100+mhz scope.  I am also trying to avoid my bad habit of buying the "shiny new toy".

The SDS1202X has 'latest model' cred to it.
The DS105z has the advantage of 2 extra ports and being $160 cheaper, considering my requirements.

As one of you pointed out, maybe i need to wait bit more before I dive in.
I'll add more findings FYI

The SDS1102X has a  higher BW -3dB point ~280 MHz and a true 500uV low noise range.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds1000x-series-oscilloscopes/msg825532/#msg825532

There is further info in that thread to assist you with any decision.
Avid Rabid Hobbyist
 

Offline Wuerstchenhund

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3070
  • Country: gb
  • Able to drop by occasionally only
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #19 on: January 22, 2016, 06:36:48 am »
Google ds6102 photo, then you will find some rigol branded chips, definitely adc. From Dave's video, some lower end scopes use Rigol branded input diff amps.

As rf-loop said that means nothing, as you can order many commodity parts with your own label if you buy large quantities. Plus Chinese manufacturers often just re-label ICs themselves to obfuscate where they come from.

I very doubt Rigol has the technology to design their own ASICs or even ADCs.

Quote
If you visit Rigol's website, you will see a patent wall, while I believe most of them are Chinese patents.

Could be Chinese, but it's questionable how well many of these patents would stand internationally. There seems to be a lot of stuff on which Chinese grant patents that wouldn't even be patentable in the US (and the USPTO grants pantents on a lot of silly things).
 

Online coppice

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 6315
  • Country: gb
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #20 on: January 22, 2016, 07:00:21 am »
I very doubt Rigol has the technology to design their own ASICs or even ADCs.
Almost anyone can turn out a pure digital ASIC. High quality ADCs are tougher. In fact any mixed signal device is tougher. However, their biggest hurdle with mixed signal would be justifying the NRE for their modest volumes. Especially when they haven't moved into the rarified atmosphere where the merchant market can't supply them with perfectly serviceable parts.
 

Offline Wuerstchenhund

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3070
  • Country: gb
  • Able to drop by occasionally only
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #21 on: January 22, 2016, 07:35:57 am »
I very doubt Rigol has the technology to design their own ASICs or even ADCs.
Almost anyone can turn out a pure digital ASIC. High quality ADCs are tougher.

I meant that Rigol is unlikely to have the capability to design something like a complex high speed ADC hybrid or signal processing ASIC like the ones you find in modern mid-range/high-end scopes (there's little point doing this for entry level scopes for which lots of generic parts are available at low cost).

Sorry I should have been more clear. You're both right of course with that pretty much anyone can design their own ASIC.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2016, 07:37:46 am by Wuerstchenhund »
 

Online coppice

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 6315
  • Country: gb
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #22 on: January 22, 2016, 07:43:40 am »
I meant that Rigol is unlikely to have the capability to design something like a complex high speed ADC hybrid or signal processing ASIC like the ones you find in modern mid-range/high-end scopes (there's little point doing this for entry level scopes for which lots of generic parts are available at low cost).
I doubt their expertise would be the limiting factor. Market acceptance of any exotic products from them would be. Everyone attacking the high end with custom silicon has to accept that a large slice of NRE will be loaded onto each chip produced. If they can't get a lot of people to take them seriously as a supplier of exotic instruments, and go head to head with Keysight and LeCroy, the size of that slice would become unbearable.
 

Offline Wuerstchenhund

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3070
  • Country: gb
  • Able to drop by occasionally only
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #23 on: January 22, 2016, 08:06:08 am »
I meant that Rigol is unlikely to have the capability to design something like a complex high speed ADC hybrid or signal processing ASIC like the ones you find in modern mid-range/high-end scopes (there's little point doing this for entry level scopes for which lots of generic parts are available at low cost).
I doubt their expertise would be the limiting factor.

It certainly will be. There's a lot of proprietary IP in the ASICs from Keysight, LeCroy, R&S & Co, coming as the result of pretty large investments in R&D, and this IP is generally kept under lock and protection. Especially the high speed ADC hybrids (i.e. 20GSa/s and up) that you can find in a modern high end scope are highly complex, and there are only just a few companies that can actually make them.

Rigol would need to do their own research (which they don't do and are unlikely to be able to afford at a similar scale anyways). And even if they did they'd a very hard time to turn it into profits at least in the T&M market (they might do in other markets like defense in China, though, but the question is if this is large enough to justify the costs).
 

Offline miguelvp

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 5550
  • Country: us
Re: Should I buy Siglent SDS1202X or Rigol 1054z
« Reply #24 on: January 22, 2016, 08:14:27 am »
Get either, it's better than a forum member around here that kept on asking on many options for what seemed a full year. I do think he finally got one.

It's like your first place to live on your own, buy it, rent it whatever. Once you experience the place then you know what you need, until then you can rely on other people's needs but those might not match your own.

Whatever you decide wont be a total lost, baby it and if you find out it lacks on some features and the other has them and its a better match, then sell yours for a little lost.
 


Share me

Digg  Facebook  SlashDot  Delicious  Technorati  Twitter  Google  Yahoo
Smf