Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs

[Martin72]

Hi,

Starting a new one for the new one...
Bugs I don´t explore one so far, but missing features I got some on my wishlist. 

Let me start with three.

- 4 mathchannels, nearly every 4-ch scope from other brands got this.
- Possibility to choose Black and White for "printing" the screen.
Choosing channel/function colours, this already exists - But not explicit for the "printing".
Means, you could different colours for on screen and what´s printing.
- Digital filters (HP, LP, BP) with the possibility to choose cutoff independend from the actual timebase.

This are the same features I´ve requested for my former SDS2K+.
I was told, for performance reasons this wouldn´t be possible(math) and I´ve accepted that.
But now I got a scope which costs more than double, they shouldn´t tell me the same again.

[Martin72]

Bug:

After ending the Bode Analyze function, system returns to the last settings ( last several times...) but internal AWG still remains ON.
(Also with external AWG)

Another Bug :

No screenshots possible when Bode Analyzer is activated ( NO Operation, just the Mode) 
(Works after Restart)

[Martin72]

Maybe a bug:

After ending Bode analyzer and returning, one channels´ratio will not turned back correctly.
My tests are with the 10x probes on 2 channels (ch1 and ch3), both were detected as 10x.
After ending Bode and falling back, ch3 is 1x, you have to plug out/in the probe again for 10x.

(Hope I described it nearly clear)

[TopQuark]

Feature request:

1. Bode plot - Speed

The speed of the bode plot is awful, especially compared to other scopes on the market. Hopefully the implementation can be improved to increase the speed.

2. Bode plot - Phase unwrap

When measuring a circuit with output inverted compared to input, the phase jumps from -180 deg to 180 deg frequently, polluting the graph. Would be nice if the phase can be unwrapped.

3. Acquisition - Low/High/Band pass filters

My first oscilloscope, the Rigol DS1052E, which I believe is more than 10 years old, had fast Low/High/Band pass filtering performed (I beleive) in hardware, and is extremely helpful for characterising analog signals, which I believe is what 12-bit scopes are really for. I really hope some form of LP/HP/BP filtering function can be added to the scope.

4. FFT - Logarithmic X axis

Would be very helpful to get an option to display the frequency scale in log scale, so that lower frequency content can be viewed more clearly on measurements spanning multiple decades.

5. FFT - Power/voltage density Y axis units (dBm/rt Hz, V/rt Hz)

Given how low noise the front end is, and with a 12 bit ADC + hardware 3-bit ERES, makes this instrument great at analysing noise - potentially. Having the ability to display Y-axis in units like dBm/rt Hz, V/rt Hz in addition to the Log X axis feature requested above, would turn this instrument into an alternative to dynamic signal analysers (DSA). Hopefully Siglent can be the first to be able to do this, given their recent launch of multiple 12 bit scopes, I'd actually happily pay for such a software option  .

[Martin72]

1. Bode plot - Speed

The speed of the bode plot is awful, especially compared to other scopes on the market.

Directly compared side by side or from your mind ?
And: by the same amount of points ?
Otherwise you can´t compare it.
I´ve did bode plot with maximum points between 10hz and 1Mhz (99 points/dec), this last long without a question.
But this won´t disturb me so much as the "fallback" time and the still activated generator and the not flawless recovered user settings on the channels before using bode.

[TopQuark]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qlJPiJpY6oQ&ab_channel=Rudi%E2%80%99sElectronicsLab

Rudi recently compared the Bode Plot function between the Siglent, Keysight and R&S entry level scopes, although the SDS2000X Plus was shown in the video, not the HD, the HD is just as slow as the Plus in my experience.

[mawyatt]

Don't have an HD but do have the X+. One thing about the comparisons for Bode Plots I recall was the SDSX+ averages multiple times before plotting the data point, think the HD does also, which can extend the overall Bode Plot time to render the entire plot.

Here's some comments on your (TQ) points.

#1) Ability to select number of sample averages would be be useful.

#2) Unwrap or ability to add phase offset.

#3) Various filter implementations (LP, BP, HP) including types (Butterworth, Bessel, Chebshev, FIR) and order.

#4) Maybe show a couple frequency marks within the decade when only one or two decades shown.

#5) dBm/rt(Hz) or V/rt(Hz) would be really nice.

Best,

[TopQuark]

Feature request:

Bode Plot - External AWG channel selection

When using external AWG for performing bode plots, allow users to select which output channel to use for generating stimulus signal. Sometimes I have different setups for bode plot measurements, and it would be wonderful to not have to reach my AWG to swap out the cables every time. 

[TopQuark]

Bug :

When ERES is turned on, channel BW indicator should show resulting BW of measurement channel, or how much the BW is divided compared to "FULL", instead of showing "FULL", which according to the manual is not the case for ERES.

[TopQuark]

Feature request:

Add SCPI commands for controlling the Bode Plot function and retrieving data.

AFAIK, currently the only way to transfer the raw measurement data of the Bode Plot result to a computer, is by saving the data to a USB stick, and the only way to config and start a Bode Plot measurement is through the scope UI.

Would be really nice if the Bode Plot can be configured, launched and have data retrieved remotely using SCPI commands.

[Martin72]

Hi,
"Enhanced" features for the bode plot:

If Siglent is "listening", this has demonstrated that the SDSX + and even better SDSX HD are capable of generating useful Impedance Plots. If they had the ability to plot a Resistance scaled Y axis then the display would be in dB ohms, and with the ability to do a short open calibration and utilize such in the display.

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/east-tester-et4410-esr-measure/msg4337092/#msg4337092

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/capacitive-impedance-plots-with-sds2104x-plus-bode-function/msg4337104/#msg4337104

This would be a really nice thing and maybe not too complicated to realize..
I just wonder why none of the "siglent-near bys" in the forum react to the idea of mawyatt so far(like "forget it", "nice thing, will forwarded it", etc).

[Martin72]

Hi,

After the first new FW release, the bug of closing the saving message manually still exist.

[Martin72]

Filemanager:

Can´t recognize the memory of the usb stick before, when it´s full it simply aborted it with a short failed message.
(Example: 8GB Stick is nearly full, nevertheless it starts to save data until stick is full)

[Martin72]

I wonder if someone from siglent or their testers takes notice about this thread..

[tomud]

I wonder if someone from siglent or their testers takes notice about this thread..

I'm afraid that unfortunately not...
I guess they mostly rely on private bug reports from users. Some distributors, such as Tautech, seem to report problems described in the forum as well.

This topic is probably the most useful for users and potential people who want to buy this oscilloscope (evaluation of the number of errors).

[tautech]

I wonder if someone from siglent or their testers takes notice about this thread..

I'm afraid that unfortunately not...
I guess they mostly rely on private bug reports from users. Some distributors, such as Tautech, seem to report problems described in the forum as well.

This topic is probably the most useful for users and potential people who want to buy this oscilloscope (evaluation of the number of errors).

Yes be afraid of a statement such that couldn't be further from the truth.

Martin, why do you even ask such when you know better.
Proving reported bugs takes time then more to write code to do the fix and it is not like a new firmware will be released for just one bug ! When a # have been solved and sent to beta testers for checking and another release is due then the public will get it.
2 weeks since the last release is a little to soon to expect miracles.
Last from 16/9/22
https://int.siglent.com/upload_file/zip/firmware/Oscilloscope/SDS2000X_HD_V1.2.1.1_EN.zip

[2N3055]

I wonder if someone from siglent or their testers takes notice about this thread..

I'm afraid that unfortunately not...
I guess they mostly rely on private bug reports from users. Some distributors, such as Tautech, seem to report problems described in the forum as well.

This topic is probably the most useful for users and potential people who want to buy this oscilloscope (evaluation of the number of errors).

Lots of the stuff written in this topic are not bugs at all, but personal views of some users and even some wishful thinking.
Things you don't like how are implemented is not a bug. Some things will never be added because there is a limit what can be added.

This topic (and others) are monitored.. It's just that real bugs need to time to investigate, make a solution, test and then release.
Suggestions need to taken for consideration and vetted for validity and feasibility...
Sometimes what seems simple (just another button you press and something happens) takes major rewrite of the part of the software... Or is limited by hardware.. In this world of daily software patching, people forget that you cannot download new part of PCB via firmware update..

Also there must be understanding that a company won't publicly discuss (neither deny nor confirm) adding any features that might give it upper hand with competition..

With all that said, feedback is welcome... And there are many things added based on feedback, but it might not be noted by users because it seems logical or someone else requested it so their request is unknown to you ...

[Martin72]

Martin, why do you even ask such when you know better.

I don´t expected to get an answer...
Reactions here were a little bit low.
Example when thinking it´s a bug but it isn´t, post it.
Example when wishes are too "fantasy" because of limitations, post it.
But no reaction makes you think none take notice about.

[danils]

Hi Guys,

I confirm that on mine, after update to v1.2.1.1 the clock still "get confused". I set it to the right time and date and the next time I power it up, the clock is two hours ahead.
Can you check on yours?

Dan

[Martin72]

Hi,

Setting the right time, switch it off and then on - Time remains with right adjustment.
But this was inbetween one minute, I´ll left it off till tomorrow, then check the time again.

Martin

[Martin72]

Update, after 3 hours without power turned the scope on...
Date/Time remains the same as before, no problems so far.
Perhaps you did not confirm the settings correctly?

[danils]

Thank you Martin, I will check it again today.

Just a question, is your scope connected to LAN? Mine is not.
Edit: I also completely remove power from the mains when not in use.

[Martin72]

Hi danils,
Yesterday power was completely off for 3hrs and it´s not connected to LAN.
Martin

[danils]

Hi all,

I experimented again with the clock setting and I still experience what, afaik, looks like "clock getting confused" bug.
As you can see at the beginning of the video, firmware version is the last (1.2.1.1)

It displays 00:11, I set it to 22:11 and cycling power, time is back to 00:11

Do I miss something performing clock setting? The procedure I perform is the same showed in the user manual,

Please refer to the video below
https://youtu.be/2gQLOtG5NPU

[Martin72]

Hi,

After days where my scope was powered totally off, switched it on and the date/time is still correct...

[danils]

Thanks for feedback,

I'll open a ticket with Siglent.

Dan

[Martin72]

Yepp, it seems to be a failure, me I I didn´t nothing different than you in your video.

[tautech]

Hi all,

I experimented again with the clock setting and I still experience what, afaik, looks like "clock getting confused" bug.
As you can see at the beginning of the video, firmware version is the last (1.2.1.1)

It displays 00:11, I set it to 22:11 and cycling power, time is back to 00:11

Do I miss something performing clock setting? The procedure I perform is the same showed in the user manual,

Please refer to the video below
https://youtu.be/2gQLOtG5NPU

FWIW try installing the latest firmware again as how you changed the time is correct but it's not remembering it. 
Also try powering OFF with the power button to check if it remembers the time instead of OFF with the UI SW.

[2N3055]

Hi all,

I experimented again with the clock setting and I still experience what, afaik, looks like "clock getting confused" bug.
As you can see at the beginning of the video, firmware version is the last (1.2.1.1)

It displays 00:11, I set it to 22:11 and cycling power, time is back to 00:11

Do I miss something performing clock setting? The procedure I perform is the same showed in the user manual,

Please refer to the video below
https://youtu.be/2gQLOtG5NPU

FWIW try installing the latest firmware again as how you changed the time is correct but it's not remembering it. 
Also try powering OFF with the power button to check if it remembers the time instead of OFF with the UI SW.

I don't know if this was mentioned, but it is recommended to reset scope to factory defaults after FW update...

[tautech]

Hi all,

I experimented again with the clock setting and I still experience what, afaik, looks like "clock getting confused" bug.
As you can see at the beginning of the video, firmware version is the last (1.2.1.1)

It displays 00:11, I set it to 22:11 and cycling power, time is back to 00:11

Do I miss something performing clock setting? The procedure I perform is the same showed in the user manual,

Please refer to the video below
https://youtu.be/2gQLOtG5NPU

FWIW try installing the latest firmware again as how you changed the time is correct but it's not remembering it. 
Also try powering OFF with the power button to check if it remembers the time instead of OFF with the UI SW.

I don't know if this was mentioned, but it is recommended to reset scope to factory defaults after FW update...

Where ?
Actually I'm pursuing a thought danils clock issue could be shutdown method related. 
We need feedback to eliminate that it might be.

[2N3055]

Hi all,

I experimented again with the clock setting and I still experience what, afaik, looks like "clock getting confused" bug.
As you can see at the beginning of the video, firmware version is the last (1.2.1.1)

It displays 00:11, I set it to 22:11 and cycling power, time is back to 00:11

Do I miss something performing clock setting? The procedure I perform is the same showed in the user manual,

Please refer to the video below
https://youtu.be/2gQLOtG5NPU

FWIW try installing the latest firmware again as how you changed the time is correct but it's not remembering it. 
Also try powering OFF with the power button to check if it remembers the time instead of OFF with the UI SW.

I don't know if this was mentioned, but it is recommended to reset scope to factory defaults after FW update...

Where ?
Actually I'm pursuing a thought danils clock issue could be shutdown method related. 
We need feedback to eliminate that it might be.

Well let's say I recommend it then... :-)
Sometimes new firmware does changes in internal data structures, and it makes sure all variables are properly initialized...

I do think that your suggestion is a good one, don't get me wrong.... I just wanted to add another possible thing to try...

[Martin72]

Reset to factory defaults could be a good idea to prevent seeing ghost things...

[tautech]

Reset to factory defaults could be a good idea to prevent seeing ghost things...

Nah, ghost stuff appears at boot before you get the chance to run a Default.

[danils]

Hi,

Following your advice:

1) I reinstalled the the last firmware
2) I reset the scope to default
3) I switched it off via the button instead of UI SW

Unfortunately the bug is still there.

Two hours ahead the time I set, but it is not incremental, so it is:

12:00 -> 14:00 -> 14:00 -> 14:00 etc.

and not

12:00 -> 14:00 ->16:00 ->18:00 etc.

[luudee]

Hi,

Following your advice:

1) I reinstalled the the last firmware
2) I reset the scope to default
3) I switched it off via the button instead of UI SW

Unfortunately the bug is still there.

Two hours ahead the time I set, but it is not incremental, so it is:

12:00 -> 14:00 -> 14:00 -> 14:00 etc.

and not

12:00 -> 14:00 ->16:00 ->18:00 etc.

From this discussion, it sounds like the back-up power source (battery or super cap) for the RTC has failed.

I do not know how they are built, if the battery is in a socket, it might have gotten loose, or just expired ...

Should be an easy check if you want to open the baby up ...


luudee

[2N3055]

Hi,

Following your advice:

1) I reinstalled the the last firmware
2) I reset the scope to default
3) I switched it off via the button instead of UI SW

Unfortunately the bug is still there.

Two hours ahead the time I set, but it is not incremental, so it is:

12:00 -> 14:00 -> 14:00 -> 14:00 etc.

and not

12:00 -> 14:00 ->16:00 ->18:00 etc.

From this discussion, it sounds like the back-up power source (battery or super cap) for the RTC has failed.

I do not know how they are built, if the battery is in a socket, it might have gotten loose, or just expired ...

Should be an easy check if you want to open the baby up ...


luudee

No it is not RTC battery...
It doesn't forget time and date.
It is some kind of time zone recalculation problem.

[PartialDischarge]

Not a bug, but it would be interesting to be able to reduce the significant digits in the measurements to 2 or 1 digits. 4 is too much imo

[2N3055]

Not a bug, but it would be interesting to be able to reduce the significant digits in the measurements to 2 or 1 digits. 4 is too much imo

Which ones exactly do you mean?

[PartialDischarge]

These ones, seeing 4 digits after the comma makes it harder to read the number

[danils]

A mini bug,

Two different mouse pointers before and after the screensaver activated

[Martin72]

LOL, didn´t recognize it so far...

[tautech]

Hi,

Following your advice:

1) I reinstalled the the last firmware
2) I reset the scope to default
3) I switched it off via the button instead of UI SW

Unfortunately the bug is still there.

Factory Tech support can reproduce it.
It caused by the time zone set to Europe/Rome.
Sent to R&D to fix.

Suggested workaround is instead set time zone to UTC.

[tv84]

Factory Tech support can reproduce it.
It caused by the time zone set to Europe/Rome.
Sent to R&D to fix.

Suggested workaround is instead set time zone to UTC.

Better: Europe/Berlin   

[Martin72]

Better: Europe/Berlin   

Gentlemen, we have a bug....

As mentioned the last posts here, my adjusted time never gets "lost", even when it´s completely powered off for days.
Now:
Seeing tv84 post and thought, good idea.
My timezone was UTC, so I´ve switched it to European/Berlin and bingo...
After re-start, the adjusted time is lost, instead of e.g. 22h35 it shows 0h35, Date stays correct.
Switching back to UTC, adjusting the time to 22h35, restart....It stays, no lost.
Thx to danils for finding this. 

Feature wanted :
Today we did a kind of "technology transfer":
A project where we use a old lecroy 9310, we want to use the siglent in the future for it.
So we test it if this was a problem concerning math and several measure displying - Not it wasn´t, good.
But:
We got both scopes on, on the lecroy when you change the vertical scale, the zeroline always stays where it is while on the siglent the line is gone and you have to readjust to have it in the middle.
Example : 5V/div., decreasing to 2V/div., old lecroy let the trace where it is, a marker appear and shows in which direction the 0V are (above or under).
Very nice, want to have it on the siglent also...

Wanted polish:

FFT....
Splitscreen mode is a nice and useful thing, but it has an annoying effect:
To get the full amplitudes visible the minimum scaling is 20dB/div. which is sometimes too much, when switching to 10dB/div., it goes "out of the screen".
A kind of compressed displaying would be good like the lecroy did when it is in split mode /dual grid.

[tautech]

Feature wanted :
Today we did a kind of "technology transfer":
A project where we use a old lecroy 9310, we want to use the siglent in the future for it.
So we test it if this was a problem concerning math and several measure displying - Not it wasn´t, good.
But:
We got both scopes on, on the lecroy when you change the vertical scale, the zeroline always stays where it is while on the siglent the line is gone and you have to readjust to have it in the middle.
Example : 5V/div., decreasing to 2V/div., old lecroy let the trace where it is, a marker appear and shows in which direction the 0V are (above or under).
Very nice, want to have it on the siglent also...

Floating not Fixed Vertical Reference level setting ?

[Martin72]

Hmmm....RTFM again, Rob ? 
Will have a look.

[tautech]

Hmmm....RTFM again, Rob ? 
Will have a look.

Maybe you just haven't used the Reference Position feature on the Siglent DSO's you've had. 

It offers fixed reference positions for both horizontal and vertical adjustments so when your waveform has reference positions that are not default (0s, 0V) the positions or waveform remain on the display regardless of adjustments made.
Really handy for the Horizontal position in particular when you need the 0s position off near the left edge of the display to accommodate full packets of data for example.
For the Vertical reference it allows for a vertical zoom onto the top of a waveform but drives the 0V reference position off the bottom of the display.

Utility>System>Reference Pos is where you set all this to best suit your job or just preferences.
Do remember that both H and V reference positions (0s, 0V) are always displayed in the timebase and channel tabs.
Screenshot for study with the Reference Pos menu open.

[jord4231]

Yep I got bugs with the time aswell
Set to Australia/Sydney.
More annoying than that it keeps dropping my static IP I set.
Keeps defaulting to 0.0.0.0

[jord4231]

Actually scrap that, something else hopped on the network taking its assigned ip 

[Frankupthehall]

Hey Folks,

I got a demo unit the other day from my local Siglent guy, I played around with it over the day. It's a fun and cute (compared to the SDS6000) little unit , no major issues until I turned the unit off.

I noticed an audible hum from, what I presume, is the power supply; probably some low power instability. I had to actually unplug the unit for it to go away (which first makes the hum climb in frequency; sounds funny).

Curious if anybody else has noticed this or if it may just be a bad power supply?

[PartialDischarge]

Curious if anybody else has noticed this or if it may just be a bad power supply?

Nope mine is completely silent

[Martin72]

Hi,

Yes in Standby you can hear the supply - How loud depends on your own sensivity.
Possible solutions were to use a load resistor at the cost of low standby power or to glue the "singing" components inside.
Or, best, totally powering off.

[Frankupthehall]

Curious if anybody else has noticed this or if it may just be a bad power supply?

Nope mine is completely silent

Glad to know I'm not crazy!

Yes in Standby you can hear the supply - How loud depends on your own sensivity.
Possible solutions were to use a load resistor at the cost of low standby power or to glue the "singing" components inside.
Or, best, totally powering off.

It sounds like a mosquito flying in your ear; intolerable. I used my phone to see where the hum was in the spectrum, attached for curiosity sake.

I can't imagine opening a brand new scope (brand new demo unit mind you!) and adding a load resistor to the power supply to fix something that shouldn't even be there in the first place. It would be an option if I had actually purchased the unit and was a few months into it's use before it showed up.

[jord4231]

Mine has a high pitched sound when in standby, it drives me crazy my lab is fairly quiet.
Does the scope you have sound like mine? I've got an audio clip in this video towards the end. https://youtu.be/rvn4mzTLlnA

[Frankupthehall]

Mine has a high pitched sound when in standby, it drives me crazy my lab is fairly quiet.
Does the scope you have sound like mine? I've got an audio clip in this video towards the end. https://youtu.be/rvn4mzTLlnA

The whine during stand-by, that's it! Mine also does the same pitch "shoot into space" when pulling the plug; no point in making a recording or video myself since your video does a perfect job at pointing it out. I wouldn't be able to have the thing sit around plugged in for the same reasons, my office/lab space is rather quiet and it'd drive me nuts.

I suspect it's either some audible range pulse-skipping frequency in low power mode, some mechanical vibration in an XMFR in the PSU, or maybe even instability at low power. I doubt it's fixable in software unless perhaps a sub-system is left on during standby to add enough load to have the whine exit the audible range. Just my thoughts.

[Martin72]

It´s a supply from meanwell:

EPS120-12
I think the coil from the output could be the "singer" (Pic)...
My solution is on the other pic.

[Frankupthehall]

What happens if you encase the coil in nail polish (if you have some handy)? That or varnish, something to stop the wires from moving.

I can appreciate the practicality of simply turning the bar off. But I'm of the opinion that a scope at this level should at least not whine about being off once and a while. 

[Martin72]

Mostly the psus of other scopes are hiding under the metal-case, so if they "sing" (not unsual behaviour under no load condition) you probably won´t hear it.
This one here is outside this case mounted.
Got the advantage, it couldn´t stray directly into the circuits, disadvantage sensitive people could hear something.
Sure it´s not nice, maybe siglent could do an exchange of "noisy" psus or let the warranty remain if it will be fixed by customer himself.

Edit see pics

[TopQuark]

Bug, or massive oversight.

Digital channels have sluggish response and low update rate, with waveform update rate of 16 wfm/s (100ns/div, 2kpts, 8 channel) observed by a couple of owners.

[Martin72]

Here a wish, siglent can fulfill when they´re having nothing else to do or lost a bet or got a apprentice who needs a task...
Decoder-feature:
Decoding of IR-transmitting codes, Like RC-5 and others for checking functionality of remote controls.
This would be absolute unique in the scope world, no one have this feature...
So maybe someday in the future, when everything was done, before EOL a last present...

Martin

[kripton2035]

I have a problem with the time, more precisely the time zone.
if I set it to UTC, the time is correct and stays correct
if I set it to europe/paris as it should be, then set the time, it is ok if I restart the time is 1 hour too much
couldn't you set it with an ntp server ? it would be automatic.
I have the last actual firmware 1.2.1.1

[Martin72]

Hi,

See:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds2000x-hd-missing-features-and-bugs/msg4458874/#msg4458874

[kripton2035]

Hi,

See:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds2000x-hd-missing-features-and-bugs/msg4458874/#msg4458874

noted, but I still consider this as a bug that can be fixed in a future firmware...

[Martin72]

Therefore I´ve wrote in the linked post:

Gentlemen, we have a bug....

 

[kripton2035]

one feature I would like, is to have a way to measure calculated values.
like the formula editor for maths channels, but for advanced measurements.
measure built-in things, like width and duty cycle, and for example display also some calculated value with these two.

[kripton2035]

something I don't understand too is why the AWG is only a 25MHz one, and the AWG in the SDS plus is a 50MHz one
also this AWG doesn't have any modulation capabilities ? only simple straight frequency signal ?
it is then only usefull for making bode plots ?

[colorado.rob]

Here a wish, siglent can fulfill when they´re having nothing else to do or lost a bet or got a apprentice who needs a task...
Decoder-feature:
Decoding of IR-transmitting codes, Like RC-5 and others for checking functionality of remote controls.
This would be absolute unique in the scope world, no one have this feature...
So maybe someday in the future, when everything was done, before EOL a last present...

Martin

Add support for the SDS2000X HD to Sigrok.

https://sigrok.org/wiki/Protocol_decoders
https://sigrok.org/wiki/PulseView

You can do this with any of the existing supported scopes.

Now, finding a way to integrate sigrok & PulseView into their scopes natively would be truly mind-blowing.

[kripton2035]

the sds2000(plus) is already detected by sigrok pulseview. so the HD should also be in. will test in a few hours.


edit: tried to connect to the 2000hd with pulseview using lan connexion (my computer is too far from the scope to use usb)
and I did not succeed to connect to the scope... using port 5025. any hint ?


edit2: after playing with pulseview trying to connect, just found the scope completely stuck. no button no touch screen. had to force restart.

[kripton2035]

if you hit the default button, it resets everything, but does not detect the 10x probes (the ones that are shipped with the scope)
you must unplug and replug the probe and it detects the 10x again.

[colorado.rob]

the sds2000(plus) is already detected by sigrok pulseview. so the HD should also be in. will test in a few hours.


edit: tried to connect to the 2000hd with pulseview using lan connexion (my computer is too far from the scope to use usb)
and I did not succeed to connect to the scope... using port 5025. any hint ?


edit2: after playing with pulseview trying to connect, just found the scope completely stuck. no button no touch screen. had to force restart.

You might try the SCPI commands listed here:

https://siglentna.com/operating-tip/spd-local-front-panel-lock-out-scpi-commands/

@tautech does the 2000HD have a front-panel lockout when using SCPI?

[tautech]

@tautech does the 2000HD have a front-panel lockout when using SCPI?

Dunno, is it not in the HD programming guide ?
https://int.siglent.com/u_file/download/22_07_25/SDS2000X%20HD_ProgrammingGuide_EN11C.pdf

[kripton2035]

the sds2000(plus) is already detected by sigrok pulseview. so the HD should also be in. will test in a few hours.


edit: tried to connect to the 2000hd with pulseview using lan connexion (my computer is too far from the scope to use usb)
and I did not succeed to connect to the scope... using port 5025. any hint ?


edit2: after playing with pulseview trying to connect, just found the scope completely stuck. no button no touch screen. had to force restart.

You might try the SCPI commands listed here:

https://siglentna.com/operating-tip/spd-local-front-panel-lock-out-scpi-commands/

@tautech does the 2000HD have a front-panel lockout when using SCPI?

the web interface of the scope was stuck too. so not possible to send a scpi command. no other option than force restart...

[tautech]

the sds2000(plus) is already detected by sigrok pulseview. so the HD should also be in. will test in a few hours.


edit: tried to connect to the 2000hd with pulseview using lan connexion (my computer is too far from the scope to use usb)
and I did not succeed to connect to the scope... using port 5025. any hint ?


edit2: after playing with pulseview trying to connect, just found the scope completely stuck. no button no touch screen. had to force restart.

You might try the SCPI commands listed here:

https://siglentna.com/operating-tip/spd-local-front-panel-lock-out-scpi-commands/

@tautech does the 2000HD have a front-panel lockout when using SCPI?

the web interface of the scope was stuck too. so not possible to send a scpi command. no other option than force restart...

Hmmm, just went looking for HD drivers and there isn't any. 
https://int.siglent.com/download/drivers/?ProId=63

Sinisa, can you check this stuff out as we still don't have an HD ?

[Martin72]

Dunno, is it not in the HD programming guide ?
https://int.siglent.com/u_file/download/22_07_25/SDS2000X%20HD_ProgrammingGuide_EN11C.pdf

The link won´t work (404 error)..

[tautech]

Dunno, is it not in the HD programming guide ?
https://int.siglent.com/u_file/download/22_07_25/SDS2000X%20HD_ProgrammingGuide_EN11C.pdf

The link won´t work (404 error)..

Thanks, will report.
Got from here:
https://int.siglent.com/download/documents/?ProId=63


Looking into Siglent EU resources:
https://www.siglenteu.com//wp-content/uploads/dlm_uploads/2022/07/SDS_ProgrammingGuide_EN11C.pdf
USA:
https://siglentna.com/wp-content/uploads/dlm_uploads/2022/07/SDS_ProgrammingGuide_EN11C-2.pdf

[kripton2035]

Got from here:
https://int.siglent.com/download/documents/?ProId=63

does not link too. you get to siglent main page.
must be some restricted area we folks can't access ?

[tv84]

Here.

[Martin72]

Got from here:
https://int.siglent.com/download/documents/?ProId=63

does not link too. you get to siglent main page.
must be some restricted area we folks can't access ?

Wenn tautech are linking to int.siglent I must click twice on it, first click redirects you, closing it and click on it again.

[kripton2035]

is it possible to decode channels 1-4 as hex value ? the decode analysis seems to work only for digital channels ?
and I did not find how to display pure hex values, without any i2c or spi or else protocol.
should be the same problem on non HD models.

[tautech]

is it possible to decode channels 1-4 as hex value ? the decode analysis seems to work only for digital channels ?
and I did not find how to display pure hex values, without any i2c or spi or else protocol.
should be the same problem on non HD models.

You will find it from Decode main menu/Bus Display.
Quickly snapped screenshot attached.

[2N3055]

is it possible to decode channels 1-4 as hex value ? the decode analysis seems to work only for digital channels ?
and I did not find how to display pure hex values, without any i2c or spi or else protocol.
should be the same problem on non HD models.

Can you please explain in more detail what you mean?

[kripton2035]

I don't have the digital probe. I would like to use the analog channels to display a decoded hexvalue from these channels only.
and they don't have any protocol, just display the hex value that the 4 analog channels represent.
it seems you are forced to choose a protocol among i2c,spi,uart etc..., you can't have no protocol, just hex values displayed ?
like a basic logic analyzer ?
it should be "grouping" on a bus, but seems you can only make a bus from a selection of digital channel.


seems I will have to use sigrok to do that. ... once sigrok will be able to connect to the scope with LAN...

[2N3055]

I don't have the digital probe. I would like to use the analog channels to display a decoded hexvalue from these channels only.
and they don't have any protocol, just display the hex value that the 4 analog channels represent.
it seems you are forced to choose a protocol among i2c,spi,uart etc..., you can't have no protocol, just hex values displayed ?
like a basic logic analyzer ?

Oh like a 4 bit digital bus...?
No,you cannot do that. 
You can trigger like that (logically from analog channels) but paralel decode is only for digital channels... Sorry.

[kripton2035]

It would also be nice to have access to the file manager and the files stored in the scope like a screenshot made with the save button,
from the web interface.

[2N3055]

It would also be nice to have access to the file manager and the files stored in the scope like a screenshot made with the save button,
from the web interface.

What you can do is that you can map windows share on the scope, so save goes directly to server (or PC)..

[kripton2035]

yes I've seen that, but I think it would be more user friendly to do it the other way, from the web interface
you press save on the scope each time you want to have a screenshot, it's faster than save to a network drive you have many buttons to clic
then go to your computer, and download all the saved screenshots at once.
what do you think ?

[tautech]

yes I've seen that, but I think it would be more user friendly to do it the other way, from the web interface
you press save on the scope each time you want to have a screenshot, it's faster than save to a network drive you have many buttons to clic
then go to your computer, and download all the saved screenshots at once.
what do you think ?

Some models in webserver mode offer a virtual Save Screenshot button that ports screenshots directly to your browsers download folder. SDS11/1204X-E certainly has this feature.

[kripton2035]

not ideal too as my computer is quite far away from the scope.
better (for me at least) to save directly on the scope, then download all needed screenshots once I am on the computer.

[tautech]

not ideal too as my computer is quite far away from the scope.
better (for me at least) to save directly on the scope, then download all needed screenshots once I am on the computer.

You might need to set up a folder with File Manager and use Save/Recall to direct the screenshot to that folder then when at the PC grab the whole folder.

[kripton2035]

yes, but as I said above, this involves many clics before the screenshot is saved
pressing the save button once for each screen capture is far easier and faster.
I don't think implementing a file download from the web interface should be that difficult.


I could do the save button, then use the file manager to copy all the screenshots to the network drive
again, I don't do scope firmware programming, but implementing a file download from a web interface must be easy ?

[2N3055]

yes I've seen that, but I think it would be more user friendly to do it the other way, from the web interface
you press save on the scope each time you want to have a screenshot, it's faster than save to a network drive you have many buttons to clic
then go to your computer, and download all the saved screenshots at once.
what do you think ?

No it does not. You map drive and make it permanent. And then you need to save to that mapped folder once, and all following saves go into that folders.

So map folder, one save with menu to mapped folder, and then you only keep pressing Save button....

[Martin72]

I think after 4 pages it could be the time to get all wanted features and (maybe) bugs together in a table as a oversight.
Maybe the forthcoming weekend I´ll do it.

[tautech]

yes, but as I said above, this involves many clics before the screenshot is saved
pressing the save button once for each screen capture is far easier and faster.
I don't think implementing a file download from the web interface should be that difficult.


I could do the save button, then use the file manager to copy all the screenshots to the network drive
again, I don't do scope firmware programming, but implementing a file download from a web interface must be easy ?

That's something we need explore as a required functionality that certainly could lead to a feature request.
I only have SDS6000A here currently but I expect it has the same functionality as the HD but I'll try to find time to dig deeper into what functionality is currently available.
Give the beta testers a chance to explore this and maybe propose a request to Siglent as it might cover a # of models.

yes I've seen that, but I think it would be more user friendly to do it the other way, from the web interface
you press save on the scope each time you want to have a screenshot, it's faster than save to a network drive you have many buttons to clic
then go to your computer, and download all the saved screenshots at once.
what do you think ?

No it does not. You map drive and make it permanent. And then you need to save to that mapped folder once, and all following saves go into that folders.

So map folder, one save with menu to mapped folder, and then you only keep pressing Save button....

Oh is it that simple, need to explore this.....

[2N3055]

Oh is it that simple, need to explore this.....

Well, I like things optimized... 

[Martin72]

Summary of the thread so far, post will be edited the next days with links to the posts.

Bugs (or not):

- Bode Plot: After ending this, system falls back but awg (int/ext) remains on with a signal.
- Bode Plot2: After ending, system fallback is not proper, previous user settings on the channels won´t be fully resumed.
- Eres: When active, bandwithlimit caused through this will not be shown in the dialogbox
- Saving screenshots message : Must be closed manually, should be closed after a few seconds automatically.
- Filemanager: Can´t recognize the saving space on a usb stick before, will do saving until stick is full and then aborted it with a failure message
- Timezone: Setting a timezone will be "forgotten" in some cases.
- Mousepointer "Mini Bug": Different pointer design before/after screensaver was active.
- Digital channels: Very slow updaterate of 16 wfms/s (SDS2000X  plus : over 2000)
- Probe detection: When using the default button, everything will be resetted, but probes ratio won´t be setting correctly, you have to disconnect and reconnect them for detection.

Wanted Features:

- 4 Mathchannels instead of two
- "Printing" in Black&White only possibility
- Bode Plot speed up, it´s one of the slowest on the "market".
- Bode plot2: Phase unwrap function)
- Acquisition: Implementation of LP/HP/BP filters ( should be already done with the first FW update @TopQuark?)
- FFT: Logarhytmic X axis
- FFT2: Power/voltage density Y axis units (dBm/rt Hz, V/rt Hz)
- Bode Plot3: Channel selection on external awgs
- Bode Plot4: Add SCPI commands for controlling the Bode Plot function and retrieving data.
- Bode Plot5: Enhanced Features
- Measurements: Possibility to change the digits of shown value from 4 to 2 or 1 after the comma.
- FFT3: Scaling, when in spilt mode the lowest setting is 20dB/div. which is sometimes too coarse, min. 10dB/div. should be possible without getting the signal out of the visible range.
- Measuring of calculated values
- FFT4: "Distortion Analyzer Mode" : Showing the values of the single harmonics in percent, showing the THD in percent.

[mawyatt]

Don't forget the Bode Cal "Thru" feature, this normalizes amplitude and phase measurements something like with a VNA.

Best,

[kripton2035]

another weird thing I noticed today, trying to trigger on an i2c signal
in the signal submenu, you define the scl and sda channels source and you specify the threshold of the signals
if you clic on the "universal" button, it detects for you the level automatically, but not always, the signals must be on the top of the screen
or it fills some values that are too high, and the trigger signal never happen.

[Martin72]

Interesting, can try to reproduce it on my siglent demoboard.
Apart from this, at work we never use the serial triggers, we use edge with defined holdoff because setting the serial triggers made us crazy...
With one exception:
On our newer lecroy scopes this is never a problem.

[tautech]

HD in our hands before it goes to a customer.
Clock and timezone seem stable with latest V1.2.1.1 FW. < now proven otherwise.

Defaults IMO that need changing, Menu hide = OFF, Save (screenshot) to Include Menu = ON

Negative image Save works OK.

[kripton2035]

can you please try to connect a lan to the scope, then switch off and on and see if the time is still at the same hour ?
and before that select your time zone, not UTC
I have installed 1.2.1.1 FW and I cna assure you time hour is not stable after restart...

[tautech]

can you please try to connect a lan to the scope, then switch off and on and see if the time is still at the same hour ?
and before that select your time zone, not UTC
I have installed 1.2.1.1 FW and I cna assure you time hour is not stable after restart...

Correct, it seems to sync to some NTP server if LAN connected and not account for local DST therefore boots 1hr wrong. 

[kripton2035]

you may be correct, it's possible that just the DST is not taken into account with the timezone setting.

[Martin72]

Summary of the thread so far, post will be edited the next days with links to the posts.

Bugs (or not):

- Bode Plot: After ending this, system falls back but awg (int/ext) remains on with a signal.
- Bode Plot2: After ending, system fallback is not proper, previous user settings on the channels won´t be fully resumed.
- Eres: When active, bandwithlimit caused through this will not be shown in the dialogbox
- Saving screenshots message : Must be closed manually, should be closed after a few seconds automatically.
- Filemanager: Can´t recognize the saving space on a usb stick before, will do saving until stick is full and then aborted it with a failure message
- Timezone: Setting a timezone will be "forgotten" in some cases.
- Mousepointer "Mini Bug": Different pointer design before/after screensaver was active.
- Digital channels: Very slow updaterate of 16 wfms/s (SDS2000X  plus : over 2000)
- Probe detection: When using the default button, everything will be resetted, but probes ratio won´t be setting correctly, you have to disconnect and reconnect them for detection.

Wanted Features:

- 4 Mathchannels instead of two
- "Printing" in Black&White only possibility
- Bode Plot speed up, it´s one of the slowest on the "market".
- Bode plot2: Phase unwrap function)
- Acquisition: Implementation of LP/HP/BP filters ( should be already done with the first FW update @TopQuark?)
- FFT: Logarhytmic X axis
- FFT2: Power/voltage density Y axis units (dBm/rt Hz, V/rt Hz)
- Bode Plot3: Channel selection on external awgs
- Bode Plot4: Add SCPI commands for controlling the Bode Plot function and retrieving data.
- Bode Plot5: Enhanced Features
- Measurements: Possibility to change the digits of shown value from 4 to 2 or 1 after the comma.
- FFT3: Scaling, when in spilt mode the lowest setting is 20dB/div. which is sometimes too coarse, min. 10dB/div. should be possible without getting the signal out of the visible range.
- Measuring of calculated values
- FFT4: "Distortion Analyzer Mode" : Showing the values of the single harmonics in percent, showing the THD in percent.

Update: Adding "FFT4", would be very useful and afaik unique to have it.
And shouldn´t be such a big problem to implement...

Generally it would be nice if siglent would realize some if not the most feature wishes if possible, depending of the model.
With the launch of the new rigol models having more and unique features would be useful to keep them in a distance....

[Martin72]

Hi,

Don´t know if this is a "bug" or a wanted feature:

Roll mode...
You can only reach it in the vertical drop down menu, not in the timebase menu where I expect to find it like other scopes it got.
Wanted feature:
Having Eres access in the channel dialogbox.

[kripton2035]

is it possible to use the internal AWG to make bode plots ? I don't find how to do that ? seems you absolutely need an external (and siglent) AWG.
wouldn't it be a great feature to implement ?

edit: ok found it 30s after asking here ...

[Martin72]

 

[2N3055]

is it possible to use the internal AWG to make bode plots ? I don't find how to do that ? seems you absolutely need an external (and siglent) AWG.
wouldn't it be a great feature to implement ?

edit: ok found it 30s after asking here ...

 

[kripton2035]

this is the consequence of reading the Fu... manual or experiment with the scope....
and here the manual tells nothing about it !
I just powered the scope, and found the answer within some clics...

[Martin72]

Hi,

and here the manual tells nothing about it !

Two times...In the overview(page 248):

At this time, either the SIGLENT SAG1021I arbitrary waveform generator
or one of a SIGLENT SDG series arbitrary function generators are supported.

Where the SAG is the internal generator and here, 28.2.1 (page 249):
C. Arbitrary waveform generator connection settings. Touch Interface to select the
connection type

OK, it´s not crystal clear but it´s mentioned.

[Martin72]

Gentlemen, either it´s a bug or I got a defective scope...
It also only affects the 2nd channel, not other channel.
Problem: Feeding a signal, e.g. a sinvewave with an amplitude of say 700mVpp, setting the vertical to 200mV/div., no problem at all, will be correct displayed (+/-350mV).
BUT:
If you decrease to 100mV/Div. the signal gets out of the display range as if you decrease it to much.
And now the scary thing:
Turning on ch1...everything gets fine on ch2, signal will be correct displayed inbetween +/- 350mV....
It´s only on ch2..
And it must be ch1, if you turn on ch3 or 4, it stays out of range....
I´ve been away from keyboard now, for good reasons...
In a few hours I´ll load a short vid up.
Man, this makes me scary...

[rf-loop]

Gentlemen, either it´s a bug or I got a defective scope...
It also only affects the 2nd channel, not other channel.
Problem: Feeding a signal, e.g. a sinvewave with an amplitude of say 700mVpp, setting the vertical to 200mV/div., no problem at all, will be correct displayed (+/-350mV).
BUT:
If you decrease to 100mV/Div. the signal gets out of the display range as if you decrease it to much.
And now the scary thing:
Turning on ch1...everything gets fine on ch2, signal will be correct displayed inbetween +/- 350mV....
It´s only on ch2..
And it must be ch1, if you turn on ch3 or 4, it stays out of range....
I´ve been away from keyboard now, for good reasons...
In a few hours I´ll load a short vid up.
Man, this makes me scary...

Ethanol clearance speed is roughly 6 - 8g/h (variations depending personal individual parameters) 

[2N3055]

Gentlemen, either it´s a bug or I got a defective scope...
It also only affects the 2nd channel, not other channel.
Problem: Feeding a signal, e.g. a sinvewave with an amplitude of say 700mVpp, setting the vertical to 200mV/div., no problem at all, will be correct displayed (+/-350mV).
BUT:
If you decrease to 100mV/Div. the signal gets out of the display range as if you decrease it to much.
And now the scary thing:
Turning on ch1...everything gets fine on ch2, signal will be correct displayed inbetween +/- 350mV....
It´s only on ch2..
And it must be ch1, if you turn on ch3 or 4, it stays out of range....
I´ve been away from keyboard now, for good reasons...
In a few hours I´ll load a short vid up.
Man, this makes me scary...

 On mine with fw 1.2.11 I cannot reproduce.. Even with glass of whiskey. 

[Martin72]

https://youtu.be/zkSxjn4w6tg


No alcohol..

[tautech]

No alcohol..

My deepest sympathies.
On our way out for Xmas brunch quite soon where I guess we will tuck away a few with our lifelong friends as our kids are all elsewhere this Christmas.

Have a good one everybody. 

[Martin72]

First link was a short, here the full one

https://youtu.be/th9l7JA4lbc

[2N3055]

https://youtu.be/zkSxjn4w6tg


No alcohol..

You'll need to explain me better the setup. On mine it is not happening when toggling CH1.
I will look into it in detail, one of these days.. Like Rob, family time..
Reset to defaults and try again. Try also toggling 50Ω/1MΩ on both channels.

[Martin72]

Home at last...

It´s only channel 2 affected.
Settings on scope to default, it stays.
Also when turning off/on.
When ch1 is active, you can decrease ch2 under 200mV/div and it "follows" the setting as expected.
But when ch1 is off, it "freaks out" when you setting it below 200mV/div.
It´s depending on ch1 active/not active.
Ch1 is not affected.
It´s only on ch2....
"Tomorrow" I´ll test and report it again.

Martin

[Martin72]

Apart from this, for my comparison thread I´ve used both mathchannels at the same time, for the first time..

Scope is getting slow when both channels are active, in my case both with FFT, more slowish it gets when measurings are active.
But that was to be expected, therefore no problem.
The following caught my eye:

-In exclusive mode, both traces are visible in one grid area, as expected(changed the trace colours for better visibility).
-Wish: Having the split mode in such manner, that the two FFT traces will be displayed in different grid areas without the sources.
When you change from exclusive in split mode, in the upper grid area the two sources will displayed, in the lower the two FFT traces.
-Labeling: I´ve renamed the math traces in SDG1062X and SDG2122X, so far so good.
But the tables won´t be renamed, they still got F1 and F2 as name - Wish: Tables could be also renamed.

[Martin72]

"Tomorrow" I´ll test and report it again.

Did it before the next family round starts..

"Effect" still persists.
Regardless of the input impedance 1M or 50ohm.
And it´s getting more weird:

Feeding a signal with 100mVpp (50mVpeak)....As written, at 200mV/div. everythings OK.
100mV/div only function when ch1 is also active, if not the signal is way out of range from the display.
This is what I´ve wrote yesterday and it´s still persist.
But I test further:
It is 100mV AND 50mV/div (or 1V and 500mV when probe 10:1) and now the weird part:
At 20mV/div signal is normal displayed regardless if ch1 is active or not.
Summary:
Ch2 stand alone, 20mV/div, 50mV/div., 100mV/div, 200mV/div.
Ch2 and Ch1 active 20mV/div, 50mV/div, 100mV/div, 200mV/div.
Make a video from when phone is charged.

Martin

[Martin72]

UPDATE:

Now everything works OK....What have I done ?
Setting to defaults didn´t have an effect yesterday, also turning on/off the scope.
Today the "error" persists as I´ve written the last post here.
The last "joker" that came into my mind was to let the scope doing self calibration.
And now...no issues on ch2..Should I be happy ?
What was the explanation for this behaviour...
See again the longer video:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds2000x-hd-missing-features-and-bugs/msg4600561/#msg4600561
Never got this before with all my scopes including the sds2000X+.
Why adding ch1 and then everything was OK on ch2...
Now doing a self cal and the haunting is over as it came.
I should be glad and happy now, but I´m not.
I have a suspicion that I will investigate today.
After visiting the family...

[Martin72]

I have a suspicion that I will investigate today.

Nothing, leaving the scope on for hours (warming up) doesn´t have any effect.
After self-calibration a few hours ago, it still works normally.
I mean, when you got a little bit offset on a channel you use self-cal to minimize it, but this ?!
Well, it is what it is and now it´s fine.
Hm.

Martin

[Martin72]

Maybe a bug:

FFT, tracecolour is red, when in split mode, tracecolour is pink....

Edit:

When you have a closer look to the pics in the link, there´s some pink in it, somekind of "overlay"...is it a kind of "integrated color-grading" ?

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/comparison-between-siglent-sdg1000x-and-2000x/msg4602865/#msg4602865

[Ulrich.G]

Hi all,

got my SDS2104X HD in December. Sent it back because of a minor pixel defect, and got another one one day before Christmas. I did't read each post here in detail, but I wonder if anybody already played around with the cursor functionality. When I try to select the cursor mode [Measure], under measure item there is only the item "NULL" visible, and the activated universal rotary knob only adjusts the screen intensity. Maybe I'm stupid, but that can't be right... Can anybody pls confirm this?

[2N3055]

Hi all,

got my SDS2104X HD in December. Sent it back because of a minor pixel defect, and got another one one day before Christmas. I did't read each post here in detail, but I wonder if anybody already played around with the cursor functionality. When I try to select the cursor mode [Measure], under measure item there is only the item "NULL" visible, and the activated universal rotary knob only adjusts the screen intensity. Maybe I'm stupid, but that can't be right... Can anybody pls confirm this?


(Attachment Link)

Drop down that Mode menu..

You will have a choice of  Manual, Track and Measure..
Measure works together with, well, Measurements.
Which means you need to enable some measurements first, and then chose which one will be connected with cursors.

[Ulrich.G]

Drop down that Mode menu..

You will have a choice of  Manual, Track and Measure..
Measure works together with, well, Measurements.
Which means you need to enable some measurements first, and then chose which one will be connected with cursors.

Aaaaah- got it (the penny has dropped)

I figured it out - but its only working with custom measurements, and the activated universal knob is still adjusting the screen brightness

To defend myself - the manual is not really clear about this topic...

Thanks for your help!!

[2N3055]

Drop down that Mode menu..

You will have a choice of  Manual, Track and Measure..
Measure works together with, well, Measurements.
Which means you need to enable some measurements first, and then chose which one will be connected with cursors.

Aaaaah- got it (the penny has dropped)

I figured it out - but its only working with custom measurements, and the activated universal knob is still adjusting the screen brightness

To defend myself - the manual is not really clear about this topic...

Thanks for your help!!

(Attachment Link)

You have to make sure that topic you want to adjust with knob is selected in menu.

What do you mean by custom measurements?

[Ulrich.G]

You have to make sure that topic you want to adjust with knob is selected in menu.

Right, otherwise the cursor(s) would not show anything. As you can see on the attached screenshot, the cursors are attached to the period measurement of channel 1. When turning the knob, the intensity is adjusted.

What do you mean by custom measurements?

The Measurement menu offers Basic and Custom measurements, only when I choose Custom - the Cursors Measure Item box shows the available measurements.

[JBK]

Just purchased a Siglent SDS2104X HD from TEquipment.com thanks to this forum. This is my first scope. It should arrive sometime next week. Is there an owners thread for the SDS2000X HD series?

[Martin72]

Hi,
Yes, two...This one here and the other:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds2000x-hd-12bit-(published-for-chinese-domestic-market-only)/msg3932408/#msg3932408

[Performa01]

Maybe a bug:

FFT, tracecolour is red, when in split mode, tracecolour is pink....

Edit:

When you have a closer look to the pics in the link, there´s some pink in it, somekind of "overlay"...is it a kind of "integrated color-grading" ?

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/comparison-between-siglent-sdg1000x-and-2000x/msg4602865/#msg4602865

Well, the time domain representation got the color of the corresponding input channel (Ch. 2) whereas the math trace got the color of the corresponding math channel (F 1). They both happen to appear somewhat similar, but nothing out of the ordinary

[Martin72]

Hi,
When I select the color red for F1, I expect F1 to be displayed in red and not in pink (while the axes label is displayed in red).

[Martin72]

I have a suspicion that I will investigate today.

Nothing, leaving the scope on for hours (warming up) doesn´t have any effect.
After self-calibration a few hours ago, it still works normally.
I mean, when you got a little bit offset on a channel you use self-cal to minimize it, but this ?!
Well, it is what it is and now it´s fine.
Hm.

Martin

After another owner had the same problem, and he even had to do the self-calibration more often, it is worth keeping an eye on...

[temperance]

SPI bus decoding doesn't work properly.

0x44 is decoded as 0x45 and 0x00 as 0x01. It seems a one is added at the end because the SPI MOSI is high when idle.

Me bad, it does work. The various options to select the phase and edges are under the trigger menu...

[tautech]

Try using the Clk Sense for the trigger channel.
Unusual some waveforms are Idle High but not all. 

[temperance]

Thanks, I got it working now. The various trigger options are located under the trigger button. I edited me original post to which now reflects my own stupidity.

[tautech]

The various trigger options are located under the trigger button.

Yes but how you configure decoding is more important.
All you need for simple decoding is to get the edge set correctly on the correct trace and Holdoff to prevent retriggering until after the largest byte. Without a CLK we would use the CS.
We can work through this more if you wish but in the HD thread.

[temperance]

Thank you for the offer, I found out how it works and the displayed numbers agree with what's being sent.

Meanwhile I've been reading the manual.

[Martin72]

IMHO a bug:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds2000x-hd-12bit-(published-for-chinese-domestic-market-only)/msg4632094/#msg4632094

When zoom mode is active, changes in channelsetting won´t be refreshed in the infobox.
(Example infobox shows 10V/div and won´t change, even when you set the vertical down to say 2V/div.(on screen display).

[Performa01]

IMHO a bug:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds2000x-hd-12bit-(published-for-chinese-domestic-market-only)/msg4632094/#msg4632094

When zoom mode is active, changes in channelsetting won´t be refreshed in the infobox.
(Example infobox shows 10V/div and won´t change, even when you set the vertical down to say 2V/div.(on screen display).

Sorry, but I cannot see any anomalies here.

What I can see in your linked screenshot are the following settings (correctly displayed in their respective places):

Main Window:
Timebase: 20.0 ms/div, 2.79 ms offset
Ch.2: 1x 200 mV/div, 0.00V offset
Ch.4: 10x 2.00 V/div, 0.00V offset

Zoom Window:
Timebase: 200 µs/div, 2.694 ms offset
Ch.2: 100 mV/div, 0.00V offset
Ch.4: 1.00 V/div, 0.00V offset

The measurement doesn't tell its source, but I suspect it's still taken from the main window. If you want it to be specifically from the zoom window, then you have to specify the zoom trace Z as measurement source. And - the next trap for youngplayers - any RMS measurement on the zoome trace will give false results except when the period of the signal is an integer fraction of the screen width (seems to be the case in your screenshot). RMS is good for long captures with many periods, but dangerous otherwise. Use Cycle-RMS when in doubt.

[Martin72]

Hi,
The pic in the post doesn't show it.
I'll make a short video from it, at the evening.
The reading was taken at random, had no other meaning/intention.

[danils]

Well, just a personal thought:

I'd enlarge the scroll bar on the right side menu.
Actually it's barely visible and almost impossible to grab using mouse...

[kripton2035]

Well, just a personal thought:

I'd enlarge the scroll bar on the right side menu.
Actually it's barely visible and almost impossible to grab using mouse...

or allow the scroll using the mouse wheel when the mouse is over the menu ?
it would leave space, and still allow to scroll the menu.

[rf-loop]

Well, just a personal thought:

I'd enlarge the scroll bar on the right side menu.
Actually it's barely visible and almost impossible to grab using mouse...

or allow the scroll using the mouse wheel when the mouse is over the menu ?
it would leave space, and still allow to scroll the menu.

With mouse it is not nessessary to use this scroll bar at all. It is only information for your eyes. Just position mouse to what ever place on side menu, and drag with the mouse left button pressed.
Just same as you do without mouse with finger (somehow same kind of logic, finger press (touch) screen and drag. With mouse, finger touched (pressed) left button and drag moving mouse.

Still I hope Siglent think again what is right place for "return" button in menu. My opinion is that it need be visible always so that if I open what ever menu  and if want return to previous menu no need scroll for find return button.

Sidenote / cannot be done with the mouse wheel. There need do redesign so many things if do this. Now with mouse + left button it works well.
The mouse wheel has another important function in menus and should not be interfered with in any way. Namely, if we use the scroll to move the menu, what about when the cursor hits the field during the move where we use the scroll to change the numeric value. The result was a complete mess.

[Martin72]

IMHO a bug:
When zoom mode is active, changes in channelsetting won´t be refreshed in the infobox.
(Example infobox shows 10V/div and won´t change, even when you set the vertical down to say 2V/div.(on screen display).

This is not correct what I´ve written.
When in zoom mode, you can´t change the main setting on the channel as I wanted to do yesterday.
Channelbutton is highlighted, channel infobox is highlighted but this means only that you now change something in the zoom of this channel.
So no bug, but irritating (because by highlighting the channel you think you can now set something on the channel itself, as is otherwise the case).

[2N3055]

IMHO a bug:
When zoom mode is active, changes in channelsetting won´t be refreshed in the infobox.
(Example infobox shows 10V/div and won´t change, even when you set the vertical down to say 2V/div.(on screen display).

This is not correct what I´ve written.
When in zoom mode, you can´t change the main setting on the channel as I wanted to do yesterday.
Channelbutton is highlighted, channel infobox is highlighted but this means only that you now change something in the zoom of this channel.
So no bug, but irritating (because by highlighting the channel you think you can now set something on the channel itself, as is otherwise the case).

Martin,

if you are in a zoom mode, you can tap with finger in upper portion of screen (that shows full channel data ) and you will control channel directly. If you tap zoomed portion, you control zoomed view. So:
1.Select channel
2. Tap the inside top window  or zoomed portion window
3. set Vertical with knob for the item in question..

Also tapping on shown V/div for zoom or channels  selects and calls up respective window. THere is also zoomed timebase dialog

[Ulrich.G]

Hello,

I have not been able to reproduce it, but about a handful of times during the last 6 weeks, the scope has frozen while the screensaver was active. Last night it happened, when I stick in a memory stick into the front usb port. Anybody experienced simillar?


Best regards - Ulrich

[tautech]

Hello,

I have not been able to reproduce it, but about a handful of times during the last 6 weeks, the scope has frozen while the screensaver was active. Last night it happened, when I stick in a memory stick into the front usb port. Anybody experienced simillar?


Best regards - Ulrich

We need know firmware version, USB stick brand, size and format type.

[Ulrich.G]

We need know firmware version, USB stick brand, size and format type.

Scope FW is 1.2.1.1

USB Stick is a SanDisk Ultra Fit USB 3.1 Flash Drive - 64GB

Just reproduced it : Remove the stick, wait until the screensaver comes up, stick the memory stick in - scope freezes

[2N3055]

We need know firmware version, USB stick brand, size and format type.

Scope FW is 1.2.1.1

USB Stick is a SanDisk Ultra Fit USB 3.1 Flash Drive - 64GB

Just reproduced it : Remove the stick, wait until the screensaver comes up, stick the memory stick in - scope freezes

Format?

With Sandisk extreme 32GB I cannot reproduce.. FAT32, 16K sectors

[Ulrich.G]

Format?

With Sandisk extreme 32GB I cannot reproduce.. FAT32, 16K sectors

That might be the problem for USB sticks >32GB, with a size of 64GB its formated as exFAT?(I didn't check when I bought it)

Reformatted the stick with NTFS, seems working now...


Thanks for checking.

[tautech]

Reformatted the stick with NTFS, seems working now...

Please be aware FAT32 is the recommended format:
https://www.siglenteu.com/operating-tip/save-external-usb-sds-series-oscilloscopes/

[kripton2035]

even if FAT32 is recommended, a simple stick formatted with something else should not freeze the scope ...

[tautech]

even if FAT32 is recommended, a simple stick formatted with something else should not freeze the scope ...

100%

I've been lobbying Siglent to provide a USB stick with every instrument preloaded with all manuals and SW like they do on the CD's supplied to some markets......but who has CD players these days ? 
This would have the benefit of providing a known compatible USB stick for every instrument and should it ever need to be recovered the correct disk format is crucial to success.
We help with a lot of these worldwide and the USB stick format is absolutely crucial to success.
8GB max in FAT32 with 4k clusters and it works most every time.

[rf-loop]

even if FAT32 is recommended, a simple stick formatted with something else should not freeze the scope ...

It is not just only "recommended".

It is absolutely mandatory to use native FAT32.

---
What makes an engineer put something other than what the manufacturer says is compatible in that hole. Nevertheless, even if mechanical compatibility exists.

There are three things. Mechanical compatibility. Electronic compatibility. These two are called as HW compatibility.
In addition to these, there will be SW compatibility.
All of these three conditions must be true togehter (AND). Only when all conditions are true then insert it in hole.

Should measuring devices, designed for trained engineers and technicians, also have so-called "blonde compatibility": Put anything in the hole and everything will work, or at least not lose consciousness.

[switchabl]

What makes an engineer put something other than what the manufacturer says is compatible in that hole. Nevertheless, even if mechanical compatibility exists.

[...]

Should measuring devices, designed for trained engineers and technicians, also have so-called "blonde compatibility": Put anything in the hole and everything will work, or at least not lose consciousness.

So basically... real men don't need error handling?  Sorry, but it's a USB port, not a test connector. There is no reason it can't just beep, complain and then ignore it. Everyone else seems to manage. It's a bug, should be fixed, probably will be fixed. End of story, no need to defend it.

A cynic might add that, of course, engineers don't read the manual, are probably on a deadline and think they know better anyway. So unless there is a big yellow warning label on the front panel, they will push anything into that connector that can be made to fit with a reasonable amount of force. But I am not a cynic, so I don't say things like that.

[Martin72]

In addition, the system cannot detect the memory size of the stick.
I had already reported here that the stick is simply written to until the memory is full and then it is aborted.

[danils]

Technically idk if define it a bug...but it looks an abnormal behaviour to me:

I just discovered if you are using the scope via its web interface, in "instrument control mode" you cannot control the instrument via the web interface if the TOUCH button on the instrument is disabled.

[kripton2035]

it's not a bug... it's a feature !

[Ulrich.G]

Got the confirmation today from Siglent support, that switching on the Universal Knob LED when using cursors in mode [Measure] is a bug. It is confusing, because it suggests that there is something to adjust. Its not - in this mode the measurement is taken from, and the cursors are always attached to, the first period of the signal.

[JeremyC]

even if FAT32 is recommended, a simple stick formatted with something else should not freeze the scope ...

It is not just only "recommended".

It is absolutely mandatory to use native FAT32.

It doesn’t bother me, but most of modern pen drives are formatted as exFAT out of box, and the vendors (Siglent, Rigol, etc.) should recognize it...

[Martin72]

I wonder when the next update will come...
The longer it lasts the better it gets, I hope.

[teddychn]

I wish Siglent could consider allocate a specific place for trace labels. In case they will be overlapped together when all the trace references were aligned at the same vertical level.

Or displace the labels to prevent the label stacking.

Just find this thread is for the HD, though I'm on SDS2000X plus, I guess the HD needs this feature as well.

[Ulrich.G]

Its teardown time!!!

https://youtu.be/lUAevbBh0rQ

Seems everybody already knew - except me 

[Martin72]

This is the bug/feature thread...

BTW:

A few weeks ago at work on a SDS2104X+, a colleague showed me a screenshot which was not complete.
It happened one time so I´ve forgot it.
Now and here, I got this on my HD too, today and a few days ago.
What could be the reason...

[tautech]

What could be the reason...

USB stick wrong format ?
Or are these from the webserver ?

[Martin72]

Hi Rob,

No webserver, from the stick.
All sticks here are in FAT32 format.
As written, at work we had this one time only and with the 2104X+.
Now I got this two times inbetween days and with two different sticks.

[tautech]

Hi Rob,

No webserver, from the stick.
All sticks here are in FAT32 format.
As written, at work we had this one time only and with the 2104X+.
Now I got this two times in between days and with two different sticks.

Good, full info.

USB sticks removed too quickly ?
Had this too and now I count to 5 before removing sticks.

[Martin72]

Hmmm...Good question.
BTW, I´ve found a third pic from last year, from another different stick.

[Ulrich.G]

This is the bug/feature thread...

Talking about features (which I actually don't use or need, but just out of curiosity) -  what extra silicon, or logic is necessary for the eye diagram feature, which is available as an 1000€ option for the SDS6000A series? Would the SDS2000X HD hardware be capable enough for this feature?

As far I understood this feature correctly, I can mimic it when using an external data clock for trigger and switch the scope display mode to persistent. Is it just the clock recovery what is missing?

[2N3055]

This is the bug/feature thread...

Talking about features (which I actually don't use or need, but just out of curiosity) -  what extra silicon, or logic is necessary for the eye diagram feature, which is available as an 1000€ option for the SDS6000A series? Would the SDS2000X HD hardware be capable enough for this feature?

As far I understood this feature correctly, I can mimic it when using an external data clock for trigger and switch the scope display mode to persistent. Is it just the clock recovery what is missing?

SDS2000X HD cannot do eye diagrams. Yes, clock recovery is missing and that is the big thing. Also, eye in SDS6000A is hardware accelerated and SDS2000X HD does not have same resources. In theory this could be all software but would be slow. And they could not just use same code because of that. So no eye on SDS2000X HD is planned as far as I know.

If you can extract data clock by other means (some helper hardware, or maybe clock is available, which it usually isn't) then you separate trigger on that, and you simply enable persistence to create diagram. You then use histograms (SDS2000X HD has them, V and H) and cursors to make a measurement. Histograms will provide basic stats. You could also simply trigger on signal both up and down slopes, and delay screen from trigger for some significant number of periods, let's say 100 or thousands. This is not proper eye diagram, but in practice it will give you decent approximation for a quick check. Your SI margins should be large enough so this way could be quite OK for a practical check. Mind you I would not publish a scientific paper from that data, but you will be able to tell if you are OK or have obvious problems.

As for Jitter measurements, SDS2000X HD does have CCJ (cycle-cycle jitter) measurement only. You can also enable period and/or frequency measurements and use stats and histicons to analyse distribution of jitter.. That is not full jitter analysis package but also does the job for very many purposes...

[colorado.rob]

What is missing in this case is automatic clock recovery.

One can generate a poor-man's eye diagram by using a sig gen to generate a clock. You will need to manually adjust the the frequency. And you typically need mHz frequency resolution limit noticeable drift. One problem is that the clock phase will be uncorrelated to the clock of the signal, so you will need to adjust the trigger offset.

[JBK]

My new SDS2104X HD all of a sudden won't get past the initial logo startup screen. Has anyone else run into this issue or have any idea how to resolve it?

[2N3055]

My new SDS2104X HD all of a sudden won't get past the initial logo startup screen. Has anyone else run into this issue or have any idea how to resolve it?

Keep pressing Math key at boot...Be persistent..
If it got stuck in some "unusual" internal stat that might help..

[JBK]

Thank you. I have tried rapidly and repeatedly pressing the Math button during startup without success. I'll try again.

[2N3055]

Thank you. I have tried rapidly and repeatedly pressing the Math button during startup without success. I'll try again.

You might need to try a few times. If that doesn't work contact Siglent NA (or a place where you got it from) and ask for support.

[tautech]

Thank you. I have tried rapidly and repeatedly pressing the Math button during startup without success. I'll try again.

Replied to your PM and sorry we/I don't yet have a HD recovery package.
Contact Ohio:
support@siglentna.com

For our info, do you know the firmware version it was running, latest is V1.2.1.1

[Ulrich.G]

I'm wondering whether there is somewhere a counter how many times the scope has been already powered up. I'm pretty sure its not available in the scope system information. Is there a SCPI command which returns this information?

[JBK]

Thanks to everyone who replied about the startup issue I was having. I finally got the 'MATH' button technique to work after about 30 or so restarts.

[2N3055]

Thanks to everyone who replied about the startup issue I was having. I finally got the 'MATH' button technique to work after about 30 or so restarts.

OK now check if firmware is latest one. Also perform full factory reset of the scope. That should clean up any internal variables and settings to safe beginning values..

[Ulrich.G]

Keep pressing Math key at boot...Be persistent..
If it got stuck in some "unusual" internal stat that might help..

Which functionality is behind the Math button during the boot process?

______________

Just saw, thats described in the SDS2000X HD service manual (page 57) as troubleshooting procedure. Maybe starting the scope with default parameters or so.

[tautech]

I'm wondering whether there is somewhere a counter how many times the scope has been already powered up. I'm pretty sure its not available in the scope system information. Is there a SCPI command which returns this information?

It's carefully tucked away in the PW protected Developer Options. Best you keep outta there 

[Martin72]

I know the PW - By three we both are writing it down here and see if it´s the same.
One, two...

[JBK]

OK now check if firmware is latest one. Also perform full factory reset of the scope. That should clean up any internal variables and settings to safe beginning values..

I'm running the latest 1.2.1.1 firmware. I'll perform a factory reset. It's looking like this was just a one-off incident. The scope has been stable otherwise.

[tautech]

OK now check if firmware is latest one. Also perform full factory reset of the scope. That should clean up any internal variables and settings to safe beginning values..

I'm running the latest 1.2.1.1 firmware. I'll perform a factory reset. It's looking like this was just a one-off incident. The scope has been stable otherwise.

Also Secure Erase which IIRC is in the Save/Recall menu. This will erase all User settings.

[Ulrich.G]

I know the PW - By three we both are writing it down here and see if it´s the same.
One, two...

 

[Ulrich.G]

It's carefully tucked away in the PW protected Developer Options. Best you keep outta there 

I'm wondering why Siglent hides this, in their SPD3303X series power supplies its displayed on an info screen.

[tautech]

It's carefully tucked away in the PW protected Developer Options. Best you keep outta there 

I'm wondering why Siglent hides this, in their SPD3303X series power supplies its displayed on an info screen.

Since the new DSO UI was released in SDS5000X the boot # info has been hidden whereas all previous DSO's it was available. Maybe they no longer think it's important to anyone. 

[graybeard]

...but who has CD players these days ? 

I keep a SATA DVD drive in an powered enclosure with a USB cable.   I also have a USB floppy drive.    Both are occasionally useful.

[Martin72]

I wonder when the next update will come...
The longer it lasts the better it gets, I hope.

It will be superior I guess...

[TopQuark]

Probe readout pin customisation

I recently got myself a couple of Cal Test CT4200 x1 probes, they have a readout pin connected to ground with 1k ohms. When I plug the probe in, the scope recognises the probe is plugged in, but sets the input attenuation setting to 10x.

I measured the original probes that came with the SDS2kX HD (SP5050A), and the resistance between readout pin and ground is 11k ohms.

The scope recognises everything between a short to 49k ohms as a 10x probe being plugged in.

While there don't seem to be standards stating the readout pin resistance vs attenuation setting, perhaps the scope can let users set custom resistance ranges to match the probe attenuation setting? (assuming the readout pin resistance is read with an ADC)

As it stands, the scope's behaviour may lead to erroneous readings with certain probes. I know this is an edge case, but point still stands.

[tautech]

Probe readout pin customisation

I recently got myself a couple of Cal Test CT4200 x1 probes, they have a readout pin connected to ground with 1k ohms. When I plug the probe in, the scope recognises the probe is plugged in, but sets the input attenuation setting to 10x.

I measured the original probes that came with the SDS2kX HD (SP5050A), and the resistance between readout pin and ground is 11k ohms.

The scope recognises everything between a short to 49k ohms as a 10x probe being plugged in.

While there don't seem to be standards stating the readout pin resistance vs attenuation setting, perhaps the scope can let users set custom resistance ranges to match the probe attenuation setting? (assuming the readout pin resistance is read with an ADC)

As it stands, the scope's behaviour may lead to erroneous readings with certain probes. I know this is an edge case, but point still stands.

100%

Unfortunately the only sense probes properly recognised are 10x in 2000 class DSO's. 
I've thrown mud about this and it seems only the more upmarket models get the attenuation ratios correct. 

For other than 10x you need set attenuation manually. 

[Ulrich.G]

100%

Unfortunately the only sense probes properly recognised are 10x in 2000 class DSO's. 
I've thrown mud about this and it seems only the more upmarket models get the attenuation ratios correct. 

For other than 10x you need set attenuation manually. 

Maybe its time that at least the active probes are not longer controlled by proprietary connectors but by USB interface. There seems to be an unspoken agreement to support active probes only by oscilloscopes with a bandwidth higher than 500Mhz. Am I wrong with that?

[tautech]

Maybe its time that at least the active probes are not longer controlled by propietary connectors but by USB interface. There seems to be an unspoken agreement to support active probes only by oscilloscopes with a bandwidth higher than 500Mhz. Am I wrong with that?

Yes, it that the only thing that seems drive manufacturers is to capture users into their ecosystem with these horrible proprietary connectors......only horrible in that you can't use them on another brand.

Oh don't worry, many or us behind the scenes have asked for USB powered active probes instantly recognised by the instruments SW and input attenuation and measurement units automatically set to match. However would it be a massive hardship to take active probes to another brand and set them up manually ?

It's not like this is rocket science, our phones have been recognised by PC's for years.

[Martin72]

Hi,

We had already addressed this here months ago, but gladly repeated again:
It would be very good if you could choose the labeling of the vertical axis on the left or right side...

[TopQuark]

Feature Request:

Allow Ch3/Ch4 and Math channel as source for X/Y mode.

I recently ideated about the possibility to measure B-H curves with a scope:

Say you have to characterize a ferrite core, I think the gist of it would look something like: Wind two winding, primary for magnetizing the core, secondary winding for sensing.

- AWG drives primary, an amplifier is probably needed to get reasonable current into the primary to drive it into saturation.
- Measure current into primary + have user input number of pri turns and you get field strength (H), roughly.
- Measure and integrate secondary voltage + have user input number of sec turns and you get flux density (B), roughly.
- Plot in XY and you should have a BH curve.
- Stuff like saturation flux density, coercive force, remanence, hysteresis losses etc. can be calculated with maths.
- Some kind of offset/servo is probably needed to keep the secondary voltage integration in check.
- AWG allows measurement of B-H curves across different frequencies.

I wanted to give it a try with the 2000X HD, but XY mode only support Ch1 and Ch2 as source, but not other physical channels nor math channels 

I really don't want to build an actual integrator circuit to plot B-H curves, when the scope hardware and software is more than capable to do it itself! 

[seronday]

Zone Trigger Issue.

It appears that the Siglent SDS2000X HD has a Zone Trigger issue similar to the one found in the SDS2000X Plus as described in
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds2000x-plus-coming/msg4428769/#msg4428769

On the SDS2000X HD, the Zone Trigger function also fails to trigger at certain frequencies.

The same test as used for the SDS2104X Plus was applied to the SDS2104X HD.

That is, a signal which consists of a Low amplitude pulse followed by a High amplitude pulse.
The objective is to have the oscilloscope only trigger on the Low amplitude pulse and not on both pulses.

The SDS2104X HD is configured as follows:-

Time / Div    100us
Rising Edge Trigger
Fast Acquisation Mode
Zone trigger 1 is set as "Not Intersect" and placed above the Edge Trigger level in the area where the Higher amplitude pulse would be.

The frequency of the test signal is taken from the SDS On Screen frequency display

An example of the test results is listed below:-

   Triggering works correctly :-    4638Hz to 4982Hz.
   Triggering Fails :-                     4984Hz to5306Hz
   Triggering works correctly :-    5308Hz to 5636Hz

   This pattern keeps repeating

Attached are two screen prints.
 One shows when the Zone Trigger is working. The other shows when the Zone Trigger has Failed.

The frequency ranges where the Zone Trigger Fails depends on the Time / Div , Memory settings and Fast or Slow Aquisation mode.

[2N3055]

Zone Trigger Issue.

It appears that the Siglent SDS2000X HD has a Zone Trigger issue similar to the one found in the SDS2000X Plus as described in
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds2000x-plus-coming/msg4428769/#msg4428769

On the SDS2000X HD, the Zone Trigger function also fails to trigger at certain frequencies.

The same test as used for the SDS2104X Plus was applied to the SDS2104X HD.

That is, a signal which consists of a Low amplitude pulse followed by a High amplitude pulse.
The objective is to have the oscilloscope only trigger on the Low amplitude pulse and not on both pulses.

The SDS2104X HD is configured as follows:-

Time / Div    100us
Rising Edge Trigger
Fast Acquisation Mode
Zone trigger 1 is set as "Not Intersect" and placed above the Edge Trigger level in the area where the Higher amplitude pulse would be.

The frequency of the test signal is taken from the SDS On Screen frequency display

An example of the test results is listed below:-

   Triggering works correctly :-    4638Hz to 4982Hz.
   Triggering Fails :-                     4984Hz to5306Hz
   Triggering works correctly :-    5308Hz to 5636Hz

   This pattern keeps repeating

Attached are two screen prints.
 One shows when the Zone Trigger is working. The other shows when the Zone Trigger has Failed.

The frequency ranges where the Zone Trigger Fails depends on the Time / Div , Memory settings and Fast or Slow Aquisation mode.

What FW are you running please?

[seronday]

FW Ver. is   1.2.11

Regards

[Martin72]

From the 2k Plus thread:

The beta has only been available for a few weeks so maybe they're ironing out a few issues however that indicates it's quite close.

Well, (I) we made a table of bugs/wishes a couple of months ago, let´s see which points we can cross off then.
For example, if the four math channels should really come and then still work without great performance losses, that would be a great success(for the users and for siglent).
I'm curious to see whether the 5000X will follow suit and especially what will happen with the Siglent/lecroy models (WS3000Z, WS4000HD).

[Martin72]

Hi,

Maybe I´ve found a bug:
Decoding..
Thresholds of the signals are getting lost after restarting the scope.
Example you set the threshold on both channel used (UART, RX/TX) to 1.6V and data will be displayed, after restart no data because the thresholds are now 3.63V on one channel and 743mV on the other.

Martin

[2N3055]

Hi,

Maybe I´ve found a bug:
Decoding..
Thresholds of the signals are getting lost after restarting the scope.
Example you set the threshold on both channel used (UART, RX/TX) to 1.6V and data will be displayed, after restart no data because the thresholds are now 3.63V on one channel and 743mV on the other.

Martin

hmm..

I will check later...

[2N3055]

Hi,

Maybe I´ve found a bug:
Decoding..
Thresholds of the signals are getting lost after restarting the scope.
Example you set the threshold on both channel used (UART, RX/TX) to 1.6V and data will be displayed, after restart no data because the thresholds are now 3.63V on one channel and 743mV on the other.

Martin

hmm..

I will check later...

Just checked.. went to trigger settings, serial trig, UART, 19200. CH1 and CH2. Levels set to 3V and 2V respectively. Then went to analyze, decode , uart, copy from trigger..
Shutdown.
Reboot and it all came back to same settings.. all OK.
But.. I'm not running same FW as you....

[Martin72]

Aha...
An hour ago I got the same "Issue" with the SPI decoding, must readjust the threshold.

[Martin72]

Regarding the decoder gimmick with the demo boards:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/new-scope-demoboard-from-batronix/msg4900373/#msg4900373

There are things on this planet that I just don't understand.
I wanted to upload videos, once from home two hours ago, how I have a stable signal with the STB-3 on the HD, then the videos from work with the Xplus and the Batronix board, where I had the best will not get a stable signal.
Then I thought, that's not a real comparison, do it again here and with the HD.
So I turned it on again and connected the STB-3 with the SPI demo.
The thresholds were wrong again after startup, I know that by now.
What can I say, still no stable signal with the STB-3...
Tried around, no idea what is different now than before.
Then I changed something that I would never have thought of otherwise.
The signal was stable again, I couldn't believe it.
OK, then I try this now with the Batronix board and lo and behold, with the setting I have a pretty stable signal, the first time ever.
What did I do ?
I set the memory from auto to fixed memory....
100Mpts and the signals become stable....
Final:
Back to auto, the signals remain stable....
This is all very confusing.
I'll summarize again:
-After each restart, the previously set thresholds are no longer correct.
-And I only managed a stable triggering when I set the memory to fixed and max.
-It remained stable even after I set it back to auto.

That's enough for me for today, I'll do another calm and systematic re-try tomorrow or the day after.

[Ulrich.G]

FFT-tools options

I was testing the FFT-tools options (user manual page 197). From my understanding, the options "Show Frequency" and "Sort By" shouldn't be visible in case the option "Show Table" is off... In this case they are making no sense, or is it a misconception in understanding this menu from my side?

[dpenev]

Martin, do you have your trigger time start in the main screen?

[2N3055]

FFT-tools options

I was testing the FFT-tools options (user manual page 197). From my understanding, the options "Show Frequency" and "Sort By" shouldn't be visible in case the option "Show Table" is off... In this case they are making no sense, or is it a misconception in understanding this menu from my side?

You misunderstood. It might not have been explained into details.. Both "Peaks" and "Markers" and are type of markers.

Difference between "Peaks" markers and "Markers" markers  is that "Peaks" are just that. Scope detects them and puts a marker on them. You can sort by frequency or amplitude and can have a table or not. And that is all control. Those are dynamic and will follow changes in signal.

With "Markers" markers , you have more control. Once you enable them, you manually tell scope to make analysis on current snapshot and it will place markers on signal. If signal changes in frequency it will not follow it. Those are stationary markers, and you can also manually add, delete and edit them...

Oh both, displaying a table with details is optional. That is the "Show table" option.

[tautech]

FFT-tools options

I was testing the FFT-tools options (user manual page 197). From my understanding, the options "Show Frequency" and "Sort By" shouldn't be visible in case the option "Show Table" is off... In this case they are making no sense, or is it a misconception in understanding this menu from my side?

You misunderstood. It might not have been explained into details.. Both "Peaks" and "Markers" and are type of markers.

Difference between "Peaks" markers and "Markers" markers  is that "Peaks" are just that. Scope detects them and puts a marker on them. You can sort by frequency or amplitude and can have a table or not. And that is all control. Those are dynamic and will follow changes in signal.

With "Markers" markers , you have more control. Once you enable them, you manually tell scope to make analysis on current snapshot and it will place markers on signal. If signal changes in frequency it will not follow it. Those are stationary markers, and you can also manually add, delete and edit them...

Oh both, displaying a table with details is optional. That is the "Show table" option.

Yep not a bug. Works as intended.

[Martin72]

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds2000x-plus-bugs-missing-features-feature-requests/msg4914481/#msg4914481
The post sbefore and after.
Also interesting for the HD..

[krasimir.k]

Hi,
I tried to use the mask feature with saved mask file : does not work. After the loading of the saved xxx.smsk file, the vertical range is reset to the minimum and the small part of the mask is visible on the top of the screen.
Used FW version : V1.5.2R1

I tried to load the mask file from python - the loading is not happen at all.

Code: [Select]

import pyvisa
#https://siglentna.com/wp-content/uploads/dlm_uploads/2023/04/SDS-Series_ProgrammingGuide_EN11D.pdf

rm = pyvisa.ResourceManager()
inst = rm.open_resource("TCPIP::10.35.89.136::INSTR")
print(inst.query("*IDN?"))

inst.write(":MTESt ON")
inst.write(":MTESt:MASK:LOAD EXTernal,\"local/mask.smsk\"")
inst.write(":MTESt:OPERate ON")


Kind Regards,
Krasi

[2N3055]

Hi,
I tried to use the mask feature with saved mask file : does not work. After the loading of the saved xxx.smsk file, the vertical range is reset to the minimum and the small part of the mask is visible on the top of the screen.
Used FW version : V1.5.2R1

I tried to load the mask file from python - the loading is not happen at all.

Code: [Select]

import pyvisa
#https://siglentna.com/wp-content/uploads/dlm_uploads/2023/04/SDS-Series_ProgrammingGuide_EN11D.pdf

rm = pyvisa.ResourceManager()
inst = rm.open_resource("TCPIP::10.35.89.136::INSTR")
print(inst.query("*IDN?"))

inst.write(":MTESt ON")
inst.write(":MTESt:MASK:LOAD EXTernal,\"local/mask.smsk\"")
inst.write(":MTESt:OPERate ON")


Kind Regards,
Krasi

Is this SDS2000X Plus ?   Only publicly available FW for SDS2000X HD is 1.2.1.1 ..

[tautech]

Is this SDS2000X Plus ?   Only publicly available FW for SDS2000X HD is 1.2.1.1 ..

It is and running older firmware than latest: V1.5.2R3

[krasimir.k]

I'm sorry!
Yes, it is SDS2000X Plus.
I post in the wrong thread.
I just made the same post in the SDS2000X Plus thread for the bugs.

Kind Regards,
Krasi

[Martin72]

Hi,

In my opinion a bug:

Changing Colors...
Default color for F2 is red, so everything is red, makes sense.
Today I want to change it for a better viewing and choosed "white" (looks on the screen like white, in the screenshot light-grey).
Everything changed to white - But the trace changed from red to blue...
When I want white I should get white and not blue.

Wish 1:
Cursors....Lecroy have a "absolute" (and relative of course) cursor function for time and amplitude, this means you then have only one cursor moveable horizontal(when choosing time) - But it will also shows the vertical value at this point.
Yes, you´ll have this when you choose "track" in the siglent cursor menu - but you´ll have all cursor lines in the screen, that´s too confusing sometimes.

Wish 2:
Possibility to change the side of the axis-labeling.
That would be great, because it's not uncommon for the lableling to get "in the way" of the signals, it would be much rarer if the labeling was on the right side.
So a choice left/right would be really useful.

[Martin72]

Hi,

Related to what I mentioned there, this is what lecroy looks like with the cursor values.
I find that much more "charming", because there is nothing in the actual screen.
I'm well aware that this can't be realized, for various reasons (one might be that the UI itself would have to be touched again).
But I at least wanted to show how it can be done differently.
The picture shows a WS3024Z (SDS3000X), but with the larger lecroys it is exactly the same.

[MathWizard]

I'm having fun with my new 2204x-plus. When using the trigger, I haven't seen a line displayed on screen, moving up/down as soon as I adjust the level. On my 1204x-e, it usually appears as soon as I move the knob (although sometimes the line seems to not get displayed, IDK why)

But isn't there a line for trigger on these ? I hope so, It's way quicker to spot the line moving, and position it, especially if you have a time offset.

[tautech]

I'm having fun with my new 2204x-plus. When using the trigger, I haven't seen a line displayed on screen, moving up/down as soon as I adjust the level. On my 1204x-e, it usually appears as soon as I move the knob (although sometimes the line seems to not get displayed, IDK why)

But isn't there a line for trigger on these ? I hope so, It's way quicker to spot the line moving, and position it, especially if you have a time offset.

Yep a trigger level line is not available when trigger is AC coupled.
Put it back to DC coupled where it should be.

[MathWizard]

Thanks, OK I didn't notice this was the HD thread or that's when it disappears on my other scope. So which is better on these, AC or DC trigger coupling, I just heard EEVblog Dave say AC is better, but he skipped why in that video.


Like right now I'm looking at a common base 2MHz colpitts osc. powered from 10V. So no big DC values, what would be better ?

[tautech]

Never used AC trigger coupling, AC channel coupling certainly but not that often.
YMMV

[trp806mo]

@Math,
He explains it with an example at 10 minutes in the video. To sum up briefly, in AC mode when you configure the level of the trigger depending your signal, what ever the DC offset will be you don't have to readjust the level of the trigger.
In other word if I have a 1 volt Vpp signal with a level trigger at 0v, if with my dc offset the vmin of my signal is at 2 volt , my trigger will stay synchronize

[Performa01]

Thanks, OK I didn't notice this was the HD thread or that's when it disappears on my other scope. So which is better on these, AC or DC trigger coupling, I just heard EEVblog Dave say AC is better, but he skipped why in that video.

I can't remember what Dave said in this video back then, but in any case, other than AC input coupling, AC trigger coupling is useful on rare occasions only.

Have a look at the thorough explanation I gave a while ago for the SDS1000X-E - it applies to all other modern Siglent scopes with digital trigger engine as well, just the corner frequencies for the LFRJ and HFRJ might be a little different. This post also answers the question why we don't get a trigger level indicator when the trigger is AC coupled.

Reply #17:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/sds1104x-e-dc-offset-in-ac-coupling/msg4786517/#msg4786517

[MathWizard]

Ok I'll have a look that. I was more wondering if there's a hardware/path difference, so maybe slightly different performance. But yeah maybe it says in the video on most DSO's, it's the same signal, just analyzed differently.

I should look up trigger jitter too, if it's called that. Some signals are just annoying to look at. IDK when it's the signal, or noise or the scopes I'm using, and then I guess the screen update speed on a DSO most be some of it too. Sometimes hold-off helps, or LP/HP filters.

[Performa01]

Ok I'll have a look that. I was more wondering if there's a hardware/path difference, so maybe slightly different performance. But yeah maybe it says in the video on most DSO's, it's the same signal, just analyzed differently.

Of course it is the same signal. All modern Siglent DSOs have a fully digital trigger saystem. That means that the trigger signal path splits off the signal path only in the digital domain, i.e. after the ADC. The frontend doesn't even know about the trigger, except for the external one, which is still oldschool analog.

As a consequence, AC-coupling is just an operation in the signal processing, just like the LFRJ and HFRJ filters, that are implemented numerically in hardware, i.e. some FPGA. The same goes for hold-off, where Siglent offers the rather unique "holdoff by event" (greetings from LeCroy!) in addition to the usual "holdoff time".

I should look up trigger jitter too, if it's called that. Some signals are just annoying to look at. IDK when it's the signal, or noise or the scopes I'm using, and then I guess the screen update speed on a DSO most be some of it too. Sometimes hold-off helps, or LP/HP filters.

There is a scope characteristic called "trigger jitter", but that is very low on contemporary Siglent DSOs - we measure it in picoseconds. You won't notice it at all.

What you mean is "unstable triggering", caused by ambigous trigger levels. As long as the chosen trigger level occurs only at the intended trigger event - and only there and then - you have a stable triggering. Once you get this level associated with other (maybe spurious) events, your trigger isn't unique hence not stable anymore.

The first measure is to find an appropriate trigger level, which is unique and provides stable triggering. If this cannot be found, then we choose the next best thing, i.e. the least ambigous trigger level.

If the spurious trigger is somehow synchronous to the signal you want to trigger on, then holdoff can (and will) help - if setup correctly. In such cases the zone trigger can also solve most ambigous situations.

If there are asynchonous events disturbing your trigger, then filters might help, e.g. HFRJ when you want to trigger on a slow signal with HF interference on it and vice versa for the LFRJ trigger.

Sometimes simply chosing the appropriate trigger solves the problem best. If simple edge trigger does not do the job in certain cases, then more advanced triggers like slope, pulse, window or pattern might work like a charm.

Maybe you should study the trigger section of my review, where I've demonstrated a lot of tricky situations, where edge trigger and even holdoff won't cut it anymore - and how to get a stable trigger in those situations. It is for the SDS1104X-E, but is universally true, since this is a subset of the higher class scopes. SDS1000X-E lacks a few advanced triggers and doesn't support zone trigger. Reply #2, first document:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds1104x-e-in-depth-review/msg1371778/#msg1371778

[mawyatt]

One of the many surprises we had with our 1st Siglent instrument (SDS2000X+) was the triggering features/capability. Coming from an old analog Tektronix background where they had created the finest analog triggering scopes available (cleverly employing ECL gates as analog amps/limiters in the triggering circuitry), we didn't expect these DSOs to behave well wrt triggering, we were pleasantly surprised 

Best,

[Martin72]

The issue with the thresholds I had a couple of posts here ago seems to affect the 2k+ too:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds2000x-plus-coming/msg5024428/#msg5024428
The thing with the wrong setting (1x instead of 10x), I had also experienced.
In addition, there is a unique experience to date:
I had turned on the scope and left the room during booting.
When I came back, it looked like it was ready, but there was a message on the screen:
"Probe disconnected.Channel:3"
Although it was still connected.
The scope was frozen and could only be awakened by turning it off and on again.
Happened over the weekend and as mentioned, only once to date.
Maybe there are sporadic problems with the autodetection of the probe.

[tautech]

Maybe there are sporadic problems with the autodetection of the probe.

Or the probe is faulty.
Have you checked by using other probes on the same channel ?

[Martin72]

Hi Rob,

No, because the freeze thing was a one-time thing - before and after that I didn't have such a crash.
The thing with the 1x/10x, I had however more often, mostly if the Bodeplot mode was terminated, then one channel remained on 10x, the other on 1x - although both were before on 10x.
Maybe this will be resolved when the firmware update is released at some point.
In principle, you have an "old" scope with a firmware version from almost a year ago.

[Martin72]

Here is a current example regarding the error of not being able to remember the thresholds.
"Yesterday" the scope was set to 1.70V, today directly after power on the thresholds are at 7.1V and 4.1V.
Which makes no sense at all, at logic levels.

[teddychn]

"Yesterday" the scope was set to 1.70V, today directly after power on the thresholds are at 7.1V and 4.1V.
Which makes no sense at all, at logic levels.

This should be corrected. No one would want to readjust the logic level every day before using the logic analyzer.

[JPortici]

Here is a current example regarding the error of not being able to remember the thresholds.
"Yesterday" the scope was set to 1.70V, today directly after power on the thresholds are at 7.1V and 4.1V.
Which makes no sense at all, at logic levels.

That is probably the same problem that is present in the SDS5000X.
Disconnect the probe, see if defaults to 1:1 (or to anything else than what the probe is)
If this is the case, there's your problem.
Something bizarre happens during initialization: I don't know how the thresholds are saved internally, but the data gets mangled when the probe type changes during boot.

The scope will start with a preset probe ratio for the channel (and all the values that are tied to that channel will be applied with that scale). Then the autodetect will detect the probe and adapt all the values to the new scale.

scope saves thresholds in FORMAT B (because probe is connected) then on boot loads FORMAT B into FORMAT A because channel is in its default state then autodetect and FORMAT A goes into FORMAT B

The problem here is that autodetect overrides the probe format, but doesn't store it

[rf-loop]

Here is a current example regarding the error of not being able to remember the thresholds.
"Yesterday" the scope was set to 1.70V, today directly after power on the thresholds are at 7.1V and 4.1V.
Which makes no sense at all, at logic levels.

I can not repeat this. (SDS2504X HD   FW: 1.2.1.1)

1st image. Setup as it looks like in your image.

Shutdown. 

Power on again.

2nd image.

I have repeated this many times, always result is same.




 1.


 2.



ETA:  When I write this msg  I have not read @JPortici.  His observations and suspicions may be significant also here.

[teddychn]

Here are my wishes for the SDS2000X HD:

1. Add an option for a comments field when printing or taking screenshots.

2. Channel labels can become difficult to distinguish when they overlap with each other. It would be great to either stagger the overlapped labels or display them elsewhere, perhaps in a side pop-up box or anywhere else on the screen.

3. Include bandwidth information alongside the ERES message.

4. Enable customization of XY chart colors. The dark blue is hard to read in screen captures.

[2N3055]

Here are my wishes for the SDS2000X HD:

4. Enable customization of XY chart colors. The dark blue is hard to read in screen captures.

Can you explain this, please?

[rf-loop]

picture link from:
https://github.com/microsoft/WSL/issues/930

I believe that everyone who has, for example, designed important cockpits / control rooms in industry, knows the basics of visual ergonomics (and other human ergonomics and how body and how all the senses, sight, hearing, touch, muscle control and position sense and fine motor skills work as well as one have to know a little about behavior as well. It would be good for measuring device manufacturers to know these things too...including Siglent also,  least the basics of these things.
But who would teach these things if they themselves don't feel like studying. In the short term, stock prices on the stock exchange are more important...

RGB  B alone on Black background is problematic in many situations..

[teddychn]

Here are my wishes for the SDS2000X HD:

4. Enable customization of XY chart colors. The dark blue is hard to read in screen captures.

Can you explain this, please?

This is a screenshot from the SDS2104X Plus, but I believe the HD should be similar. I find it challenging to me to distinguish the vertical blue line in the picture. The SDS2000X HD allows you to assign trace colors, and I wish the XY chart could be customized in the same way.

By the way, Siglent should include bookmarks in their PDF manuals; it would make them easier to use.

[rf-loop]

Also same for digital (LA) input signals.

[tautech]

Also same for digital (LA) input signals.

Should chance as I proposed. 

[2N3055]

Here are my wishes for the SDS2000X HD:

4. Enable customization of XY chart colors. The dark blue is hard to read in screen captures.

Can you explain this, please?

This is a screenshot from the SDS2104X Plus, but I believe the HD should be similar. I find it challenging to me to distinguish the vertical blue line in the picture. The SDS2000X HD allows you to assign trace colors, and I wish the XY chart could be customized in the same way.

By the way, Siglent should include bookmarks in their PDF manuals; it would make them easier to use.

Here is a snapshot from my scope. On screen blue trace is much brighter, lighter blue than on this image. That is why I was confused, I have no trouble seeing it.
But I think your request is good one, it should be user configurable..

As a side note, to make it easier to read (if you have problem with blue) enable Color grading in Display menu... Maybe that helps a bit..

[Martin72]

Hi,
Here a clip about the threshold thing:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1srETzAoYwZZwdh1fOC-6uWFfBZE9bN9M/view?usp=sharing

(Meh, why is the video quality so bad...(EDIT: Because it´s 360p,can be changed to 1080))

Thresholds changing also when you re-boot the scope.
Threshold-Level is different from channel to channel, for example Ch 1 is falling back to 8.2V, Ch2 something between 800...833mV, Ch3 14.2V, Ch4 I didn´t test so far.

I can not repeat this. (SDS2504X HD   FW: 1.2.1.1)

Got the same FW...
I will test it again tomorrow, but then without the probes - Possibly the autosense function messes the whole thing up.
(For example, I currently have all probes on the scope and after each start it "tells" me that it has detected a probe on channel 4, although I had not disconnected and reconnected them).

[JPortici]

Hi,
Here a clip about the threshold thing:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1srETzAoYwZZwdh1fOC-6uWFfBZE9bN9M/view?usp=sharing

(Meh, why is the video quality so bad...(EDIT: Because it´s 360p,can be changed to 1080))

Thresholds changing also when you re-boot the scope.
Threshold-Level is different from channel to channel, for example Ch 1 is falling back to 8.2V, Ch2 something between 800...833mV, Ch3 14.2V, Ch4 I didn´t test so far.

I can not repeat this. (SDS2504X HD   FW: 1.2.1.1)

Got the same FW...
I will test it again tomorrow, but then without the probes - Possibly the autosense function messes the whole thing up.
(For example, I currently have all probes on the scope and after each start it "tells" me that it has detected a probe on channel 4, although I had not disconnected and reconnected them).

Disconnect probes. set channels mode to 1:10, then retry you are describing exactly the issue i have with the SDS5000X

[Martin72]

Makes me so curious, I´ll test it in the next minutes..

[Martin72]

Bingo...

Disconnecting the probes, setting all the channels manually to 1:10, then adjusting the decoder threshold-levels.
Re-booting the scope, now the threshold values remain.
Siglent, we have a bug in the autosense circuit (programm?)...
And this seems to affect not only the level setting for the decoding, because I had already told early that when fall back from the bodeplot mode a channel is set back to 1:1, although a 1:10 autosense probe was connected and recognized as such before starting the bodeplot.
Or how the scope froze for me for the first time a few weeks ago, with the message that it had detected a probe on channel 3, although the probe was already connected.
So it seems to influence many things, a rather serious bug.

[teddychn]

Here is a snapshot from my scope. On screen blue trace is much brighter, lighter blue than on this image. That is why I was confused, I have no trouble seeing it.
But I think your request is good one, it should be user configurable..

As a side note, to make it easier to read (if you have problem with blue) enable Color grading in Display menu... Maybe that helps a bit..

Thanks 2N3055,

I tried your idea, and it seems a bit better.

Actually, I can see the dark blue details on the oscilloscope screen, but they appeared too dark to be seen on my laptop.

Here are the new captures.

[Ulrich.G]

Firmware update V1.2.2.5 is available!

https://int.siglent.com/upload_file/zip/firmware/Oscilloscope/SDS2000X_HD_V1.2.2.5_EN.zip

Its not just a software update of the OS, but also reprogramming the FPGA to version 2023-05-30 

[Martin72]

YES 

[Ulrich.G]

With the new firmware version 1.2.2.5, we not only got 4 math channels, but also 4 memory channels. The possibilities seem to be almost endless. Import data from other channels, files, math functions...

I'm a little overwhelmed with it, but great feature.

Found the decription in the SDS6000A manual - page 260-262

[kladit]

The description of what?

I  looked at the "SDS6000A User Manual" and at page 260 found a description of "Mask Setup".

Neither "memory channel" nor "memory trace" can be found in this pdf.

So please give link to the pdf you are talking of.

[tautech]

The description of what?

I  looked at the "SDS6000A User Manual" and at page 260 found a description of "Mask Setup".

Neither "memory channel" nor "memory trace" can be found in this pdf.

So please give link to the pdf you are talking of.

Try this manual version:
https://int.siglent.com/u_file/download/22_10_24/SDS6000A_UserManual_EN01B.pdf

Chapter 21 Memory P260

[Martin72]

To the beta testers active here:
Do any of you have a 2kHD at home ?
Then please send me a PM.

As for the new firmware:
The datum thing works..
Window font size I also found and set to "small", I haven't noticed a direct difference yet.
And a bugfix not listed in the revision I also discovered:
The save message now disappears by itself again....

[kripton2035]

I've posted it in the other 2000HD thread, but this one on the bug is a better place
with last firmware, if you press default, the 10x probe is still not detected. you must unplug and plug it to be detected as 10x

[Martin72]

Found the decription in the SDS6000A manual - page 260-262

I am pretty sure that the manual will be revised.
It is still the first version, it also lacks the descriptions for the digital filters and memory management that were added in the first firmware update.
Now 2 more math channels, ARINC decoding, memory channels have been added.
I think it will soon be worthwhile to revise the manual again.

[Performa01]

And a bugfix not listed in the revision I also discovered:
The save message now disappears by itself again....

Not only that - it is now fully configurable to meet everyone's taste and habits.

You can have the path tip permanently visible until you close it, let it automatically fade out after a user configurable time out - or never show it at all.

Personally, I prefer "Fade" after 3 seconds.

SDS2504X HD_Pathtip

[teddychn]

I find I need to bring up side-screen ACQUIRE menu frequently. But there's no hardware key and one need to hassle click [Acquire] then [Menu] or [Timebase] on the screen bottom then [Acquire] .

Given that almost all commands on the menu bar have a second-layer MENU option that brings up the menu on the side screen, I'd like to suggest allowing a single click on a menu command to bring up both its drop-down menu and the side bar dialog box simultaneously. This change would save one step of clicking the MENU command for drop-down menus.

[2N3055]

I find I need to bring up side-screen ACQUIRE menu frequently. But there's no hardware key and one need to hassle click [Acquire] then [Acquire] or [Timebase] on the screen bottom then [Acquire] .

Given that almost all commands on the menu bar have a second-layer MENU option that brings up the menu on the side screen, I'd like to suggest allowing a single click on a menu command to bring up both its drop-down menu and the side bar dialog box simultaneously. This change would save one step of clicking the MENU command for drop-down menus.

For shortcut, Tap on Timebase -> Acquire menu...

As for flyout menus... hmm.. some like them some not...

As for automatic change, I personally would not like that.

The way it is now I can have Channel setup on the right and go to upper menu , tap DIsplay, disable Persistence and still have my Channel setup on the right where I left it and keep doing what I was doing..

[kripton2035]

I find I need to bring up side-screen ACQUIRE menu frequently. But there's no hardware key and one need to hassle click [Acquire] then [Menu] or [Timebase] on the screen bottom then [Acquire] .

can't you do this with the "quick action" button ?

[teddychn]

I find I need to bring up side-screen ACQUIRE menu frequently. But there's no hardware key and one need to hassle click [Acquire] then [Menu] or [Timebase] on the screen bottom then [Acquire] .

can't you do this with the "quick action" button ?

Nope, it doesn't come with this option. I've already assigned QuickAction to switch trigger slope, which is very useful for me. I have to say, I really appreciate Siglent for placing all the keys for Normal, Auto, Single, and Roll modes on the panel. It saves me a lot of time when switching between these modes.

Perhaps I didn't fully grasp the advantage of the menu buttons on the screen. Most of the layer-2 menu buttons seem redundant to me, except for those under Utility and Math options. Take the Acquire option, for example. If a single click could bring up the drop-down menu and side-bar dialog simultaneously, why bother using the Menu key again? If this change wouldn't complicate the operation, I think it's worth discussing. I understand that making changes is a significant undertaking, and Siglent can't please every user. However, if they believe it's worthwhile, it's something to consider.

[2N3055]

I find I need to bring up side-screen ACQUIRE menu frequently. But there's no hardware key and one need to hassle click [Acquire] then [Menu] or [Timebase] on the screen bottom then [Acquire] .

can't you do this with the "quick action" button ?

Nope, it doesn't come with this option. I've already assigned QuickAction to switch trigger slope, which is very useful for me. I have to say, I really appreciate Siglent for placing all the keys for Normal, Auto, Single, and Roll modes on the panel. It saves me a lot of time when switching between these modes.

Perhaps I didn't fully grasp the advantage of the menu buttons on the screen. Most of the layer-2 menu buttons seem redundant to me, except for those under Utility and Math options. Take the Acquire option, for example. If a single click could bring up the drop-down menu and side-bar dialog simultaneously, why bother using the Menu key again? If this change wouldn't complicate the operation, I think it's worth discussing. I understand that making changes is a significant undertaking, and Siglent can't please every user. However, if they believe it's worthwhile, it's something to consider.

Did you see my answer?
It is two touches away.
How is that hassle?

You cannot expect a product manufacturer will customize GUI to one user (in this case you)  or they will try to make GUI that is universal and allows access to many functions with relative ease....

There are many functions and they have to organized in hierarchy. Why? Because there are thousands of them and you can't have them in on linear array of buttons.  We need screen for actual waveform...

Also, because of Web interface, all the functions that exist on physical front panel (buttons and knobs) have to have on screen representation. In addition to that having alternative ways to call up some function can be useful sometimes
 
OTOH I will bring up to Siglent a wish that more options be added to Quick button, including Acquire. More options cannot hurt.. And they reorganized menus occasionally when they added many new features and they needed to do it. We'll see.

[teddychn]

Did you see my answer?
It is two touches away.
How is that hassle?

You cannot expect a product manufacturer will customize GUI to one user (in this case you)  or they will try to make GUI that is universal and allows access to many functions with relative ease....

There are many functions and they have to organized in hierarchy. Why? Because there are thousands of them and you can't have them in on linear array of buttons.  We need screen for actual waveform...

Also, because of Web interface, all the functions that exist on physical front panel (buttons and knobs) have to have on screen representation. In addition to that having alternative ways to call up some function can be useful sometimes
 
OTOH I will bring up to Siglent a wish that more options be added to Quick button, including Acquire. More options cannot hurt.. And they reorganized menus occasionally when they added many new features and they needed to do it. We'll see.

Yes, I have seen your answer. And I feel maybe I shold express my logic clearer. That's why the three pictures were attached above.

My point is, I don't know the advantage of the Menu bottons, maybe somebody can let me understand. But if they are redundant, why can't we bring up the drop-down menu and side-bar dialog with just a click. Besides, that won't change any UI arrangement. Maybe you can tell me what I was wrong. But befor taht, I wold still say that two clikcs is more hassle than one click.

It's just my personal thought with these day's experience. I don't expect Siglent can take my idea. If they won't, it's not a big deal. Just like you've said, two touchs is not that hassel.

[2N3055]

Did you see my answer?
It is two touches away.
How is that hassle?

You cannot expect a product manufacturer will customize GUI to one user (in this case you)  or they will try to make GUI that is universal and allows access to many functions with relative ease....

There are many functions and they have to organized in hierarchy. Why? Because there are thousands of them and you can't have them in on linear array of buttons.  We need screen for actual waveform...

Also, because of Web interface, all the functions that exist on physical front panel (buttons and knobs) have to have on screen representation. In addition to that having alternative ways to call up some function can be useful sometimes
 
OTOH I will bring up to Siglent a wish that more options be added to Quick button, including Acquire. More options cannot hurt.. And they reorganized menus occasionally when they added many new features and they needed to do it. We'll see.

Yes, I have seen your answer. And I feel maybe I shold express my logic clearer. That's why the three pictures were attached above.

My point is, I don't know the advantage of the Menu bottons, maybe somebody can let me understand. But if they are redundant, why can't we bring up the drop-down menu and side-bar dialog with just a click. Besides, that won't change any UI arrangement. Maybe you can tell me what I was wrong. But befor taht, I wold still say that two clikcs is more hassle than one click.

It's just my personal thought with these day's experience. I don't expect Siglent can take my idea. If they won't, it's not a big deal. Just like you've said, two touchs is not that hassel.

Thank you for explaing.

I already explained how everything is compromise. I'm sorry you cannot see logic behind menu system. I personally do. It might not be ideal but is based on logic, certainly.
It is based on combination of hierarchy and shortcuts. It is also a platform. I have SDS6000H12 and it uses same basic platform.
So platform is superset.
On SDS6000A you have physical Acquire button.

And when you have such a sophisticated system, just 2 clicks is fast....

And fact that SDS2000X HD and SDS6000H12 drives exactly the same is very, very big time saver.

And don't think Siglent won't listen to suggestion if it is feasible and is good one.

[tautech]

My point is, I don't know the advantage of the Menu bottons, maybe somebody can let me understand. But if they are redundant, why can't we bring up the drop-down menu and side-bar dialog with just a click.

That's a good idea and something we should investigate as an option.

What we need be careful not to do is to hide dropdown menu items with any changes so maybe 2 modes can be identified as user and webserver modes (existing = returned with Default)

A suggestion would be for menu buttons to be configurable to auto open the side bar menu, perhaps in the Utility System menu.
ie, touch/click menu and the full side bar opens

Can I ask do you use touch or a mouse for work with the menus ?

[teddychn]

Thank you for explaing.

I already explained how everything is compromise. I'm sorry you cannot see logic behind menu system. I personally do. It might not be ideal but is based on logic, certainly.
It is based on combination of hierarchy and shortcuts. It is also a platform. I have SDS6000H12 and it uses same basic platform.
So platform is superset.
On SDS6000A you have physical Acquire button.

And when you have such a sophisticated system, just 2 clicks is fast....

And fact that SDS2000X HD and SDS6000H12 drives exactly the same is very, very big time saver.

And don't think Siglent won't listen to suggestion if it is feasible and is good one.

Sorry for the late reply. Before responding to this post, I wanted to try the web UI on both the 2000X HD and 2000X Plus, both at home and in the office. However, I still can't grasp your point. The web control looks just the same on the touch screen here. So, I'm not sure if this idea violates any aspect of the menu design.

I'm not debating whether two steps are actually a hassle. If someone uses this function frequently, even saving one step is sensible. Sensibility is always subjective. I'm thinking that maybe I shouldn't have used the word "hassle." If it is, please forgive me. English is not my native language, so I may not express my thoughts precisely.

That's a good idea and something we should investigate as an option.

What we need be careful not to do is to hide dropdown menu items with any changes so maybe 2 modes can be identified as user and webserver modes (existing = returned with Default)

A suggestion would be for menu buttons to be configurable to auto open the side bar menu, perhaps in the Utility System menu.
ie, touch/click menu and the full side bar opens

Can I ask do you use touch or a mouse for work with the menus ?

Thanks for your reply. I didn't intent to make the UI different. Just wanted to give an input for reference. I believe Siglent absolutely has their professional determine the design and priority.

I usually use touch for the menus because my work desktop isn't mouse-friendly.

I think I might not fully understand the behavior of the web control, so I'm unsure about how opening the side bar dialog simultaneously could hide the dropdown menu. Nevertheless, it's just an idea, and I don't wish to complicate matters.

[2N3055]

Thank you for explaing.

I already explained how everything is compromise. I'm sorry you cannot see logic behind menu system. I personally do. It might not be ideal but is based on logic, certainly.
It is based on combination of hierarchy and shortcuts. It is also a platform. I have SDS6000H12 and it uses same basic platform.
So platform is superset.
On SDS6000A you have physical Acquire button.

And when you have such a sophisticated system, just 2 clicks is fast....

And fact that SDS2000X HD and SDS6000H12 drives exactly the same is very, very big time saver.

And don't think Siglent won't listen to suggestion if it is feasible and is good one.

Sorry for the late reply. Before responding to this post, I wanted to try the web UI on both the 2000X HD and 2000X Plus, both at home and in the office. However, I still can't grasp your point. The web control looks just the same on the touch screen here. So, I'm not sure if this idea violates any aspect of the menu design.

I'm not debating whether two steps are actually a hassle. If someone uses this function frequently, even saving one step is sensible. Sensibility is always subjective. I'm thinking that maybe I shouldn't have used the word "hassle." If it is, please forgive me. English is not my native language, so I may not express my thoughts precisely.

First of all don't apologize for asking questions and making comments. You are very polite and by no means I disrespect your opinion.
We might have misunderstanding here. Touch screen and Web will be exactly the same. What I meant is that when you work remotely, you don't have ANY of buttons and knobs. And since WEB only shows what is on the screen, GUI has to be made that you can actually use scope completely without knobs. And that means that on screen you need to have all of the stuff that should be on the screen, and surrogate (replacements, proxies) screen elements and functions that are usually on the knobs.

Organizing all that in several layers is hard work and art. There are hundreds of functions, choices, parameters, menus...

As to your  1-2 touch comment, I do understand. On the other hand, my experience is that when I do it all the time it becomes fast and automatic.. Example: single VS double click with a mouse... I also did not dismiss your opinion but shared my experience: once you touch Trig, Acq button pops up 10mm away, so I press it practically in same movement.  If ACQ touch popped on the other side of screen that would bother me too.

And I do use it a lot, because I change ACQ settings all the time while testing stuff.
So I don't find it slowing me down in use after I got used to it. It is completely automatic.

Funny point, I also have SDS6000H12 that has physical ACQUIRE button. And at first SDS2000X HD did not have this Trig-ACQ shortcut. I was missing that button from 6000 so much. After they added the Trig-Acq shortcut it was soo much better than going into menu. So I was testing SD2000X HD for a week, and then I realized that on SDS6000H12 I was not using ACQ button anymore, but Trig-Acq shortcut, reflexively out of habit......  ....

OTOH, I do see how other people will have different thresholds.

Like promised, I did suggest to Siglent to add more functions to Quick button. And few more things were discussed so we will see if there is any fruit from the effort.

Best,

[Ulrich.G]

I also have SDS6000H12 that has physical ACQUIRE button.

Off topic - but where did you guys buy this equipment? You imported them directly from China?

[2N3055]

I also have SDS6000H12 that has physical ACQUIRE button.

Off topic - but where did you guys buy this equipment? You imported them directly from China?

That one came from China, yes.

[tautech]

That's a good idea and something we should investigate as an option.

What we need be careful not to do is to hide dropdown menu items with any changes so maybe 2 modes can be identified as user and webserver modes (existing = returned with Default)

A suggestion would be for menu buttons to be configurable to auto open the side bar menu, perhaps in the Utility System menu.
ie, touch/click menu and the full side bar opens

Can I ask do you use touch or a mouse for work with the menus ?

Thanks for your reply. I didn't intent to make the UI different. Just wanted to give an input for reference. I believe Siglent absolutely has their professional determine the design and priority.

I usually use touch for the menus because my work desktop isn't mouse-friendly.

I think I might not fully understand the behavior of the web control, so I'm unsure about how opening the side bar dialog simultaneously could hide the dropdown menu. Nevertheless, it's just an idea, and I don't wish to complicate matters.

All sound ideas are worth considering.

After some thought and experiments I have suggested tap of the top level dropdown menus activate the side menu.
This can be an advantage for users preferring to use touch however with mouse use directly on the scope or via the webserver there is little to be gained as the 2nd click to bring up the menu is no large penalty.

Ideas of making this configurable are now abandoned as it adds complexity to what is already an efficient UI however a single touch/click of the top level dropdown to access the menu could be of benefit for those only using touch.

Yet if like 2N3055 proposes, more functionality be added to the Quick button this could be a solution also.

[teddychn]

As to your  1-2 touch comment, I do understand. On the other hand, my experience is that when I do it all the time it becomes fast and automatic.. Example: single VS double click with a mouse... I also did not dismiss your opinion but shared my experience: once you touch Trig, Acq button pops up 10mm away, so I press it practically in same movement.  If ACQ touch popped on the other side of screen that would bother me too.

And I do use it a lot, because I change ACQ settings all the time while testing stuff.
So I don't find it slowing me down in use after I got used to it. It is completely automatic.

Funny point, I also have SDS6000H12 that has physical ACQUIRE button. And at first SDS2000X HD did not have this Trig-ACQ shortcut. I was missing that button from 6000 so much. After they added the Trig-Acq shortcut it was soo much better than going into menu. So I was testing SD2000X HD for a week, and then I realized that on SDS6000H12 I was not using ACQ button anymore, but Trig-Acq shortcut, reflexively out of habit......  ....

Thanks for the elaboration. I think I've got your point. But I guess the Trig-Acq you mentioned should refer to Timebase-Acq.

Just played around with the Timebase and Trigger tabs which at the bottom of the screen. Since both Timebase and its Acquire tab are big enough, they make the Timebase-Acquire operation easier than the Acquire-Menu. Now I realize why the Acquire tab was located under the Timebase dialog. Timebase and Trigger are more of shortcuts. And Siglent should include your tips in their menu.

Besides, having too many useful options in QuickAction will definitely trigger my decision paralysis. 

[Martin72]

Besides, having too many useful options in QuickAction will definitely trigger my decision paralysis. 

 
Absolutely.

[Ulrich.G]

FW 1.2.2.5

Switched on my scope for the first time since the clock changed to winter time (Timezone Europe/Berlin). The scope is connected to the internet, shouldn't the scope time also change to winter time?

[kripton2035]

seems there is no ntp sync on the scope ... and no daylight saving time either

[Martin72]

Wanted FFT feature:

I would still like to be able to display the harmonics in % instead of dB (in the table), then you would not have to convert it again.
The absolute crowning glory would of course be a THD display, even if it is to be enjoyed with caution.

[2N3055]

Wanted FFT feature:

I would still like to be able to display the harmonics in % instead of dB (in the table), then you would not have to convert it again.
The absolute crowning glory would of course be a THD display, even if it is to be enjoyed with caution.

 

[teddychn]

I find now it doesn't show FFT peaks in the peaks list. Not sure if it's the symptom of firmware 1.2.2.5?

[Martin72]

Hi,

I can't imagine that you haven't done it, but I'll ask anyway:
Did you set the threshold level appropriately to be able to detect the peaks ?

[temperance]

I would still like to be able to display the harmonics in % instead of dB (in the table), then you would not have to convert it again.
The absolute crowning glory would of course be a THD display, even if it is to be enjoyed with caution.

An other place where I would like to be able to change the units is the bode plot function. It would be nice if one could just change the dB scale to impedance.

[teddychn]

hanks, Martin, it works. I've never set the threshold before. Maybe restoring the default settings after the upgrade revealed the situation. It's actually my fault.

[Martin72]

Hi,

Wanted:

Showing the parallel data in ASCII*:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/new-scope-demoboard-from-batronix/msg5175123/#msg5175123

SDS2000Xplus do not have it - And neither does my HD...
I think this is a useful feature that might be easy to implement.

*)If that is enough to arrive at a directly readable result.

[Ulrich.G]

*)If that is enough to arrive at a directly readable result.

When the characters are inside the first 128 chars of the ASCII table, otherwise you might need the right charset for encoding it properly.

[blurpy]

*)If that is enough to arrive at a directly readable result.

When the characters are inside the first 128 chars of the ASCII table, otherwise you might need the right charset for encoding it properly.

Supporting different charsets would also be nice, but it's a good start to get the same ASCII decode for parallel as is already available for serial.

[Martin72]

A wanted nice to have:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds3000x-hd-and-upgraded-sds1000x-hd/msg5187762/#msg5187762

I find this color coding of the logic channels(3rd pic) very successful, that would also be something for the 2000X HD.

[Martin72]

I think I've found a tiny bug...
The color selection of the traces, a fantastic feature not only in this price range, has a small bug.
If you change the saving of the image from normal to inverted, the color of the changed regular channel is "taken over", but the math channel is not, it gets its original color.
Please change, thank you!

[KungFuJosh]

Isn't that two bugs? Shouldn't it instead be two inverted colors?

[Martin72]

Hi,

Only the background or better everything on the screen except the traces should be inverted.
At least that's how I know it from Lecroy scopes.

[Martin72]

I had previously worked with the Bodeplot for another topic here.
What I still think is suboptimal is the obvious "encapsulation" of this function from the rest of the system.
I just wanted to make a change in the channel menu - I can't, everything that has nothing to do with the Bode function is deactivated.
You first have to get out of the function again (including this annoying "recalling"), then you can adjust and then call up the Bodeplot again.
This is quite inconvenient.
And the unit for the amplitude of the internal generator is still unchangeable (Vpp).

[hpw]

Only the background or better everything on the screen except the traces should be inverted.
At least that's how I know it from Lecroy scopes.

It is always an issue as for documentation or printing. For printing Monochrome should be the option. Otherwise 

[rf-loop]

I had previously worked with the Bodeplot for another topic here.
What I still think is suboptimal is the obvious "encapsulation" of this function from the rest of the system.

There is so many things...  it is like whole other system than oscilloscope..  BodePlot OR Oscilloscope  (even it still in background do timedomain acquistions).
But "recalling" back to oscilloscope mode takes long time... imho.. too long.

I just wanted to make a change in the channel menu - I can't, everything that has nothing to do with the Bode function is deactivated.
You first have to get out of the function again (including this annoying "recalling"), then you can adjust and then call up the Bodeplot again.

This improvement to BodePlot is asked many times over years.
Something like this:
BodePlot function On.
If [Channel Gain:Hold] AND BodePlot [Operation:Off] AND [Display:TimeDomain] (because for adjust there need see level for proper adjust).
There need enable input channels vertical adjustments without shutting off whole BodePlot. Also in this condition AWG need be free for manual frequency set for example find DUT peak... this need come even more clear if using FRA for example high Q resonators...
In all cases when [Channel Gain:Hold] there need keep care that signals top peaks do not clip but top peaks are near ADC full scale for get best dynamic range.
(sidenote: [Channel Gain:Hold] state is nice to use in some cases because it give more speed and many times only small disadvantage in dynamic range)

At the core of FRA's operation is a primary table (all other things (what you see) are secondary, based to this primary non visible table.

Naturally, IF [Channel Gain:Auto] then V/div is totally under FRA control, no need enable channels manual adjustments.


But then there's also the request that sometime in the future we can get an improved BodePlot in some other way.

Example:  Phase normalize function so that with current setup for test, use can first run phase cal specially if working higher frequencies
Also max 500 (or 750) steps is not enough... even when it still can be even when it can be up to 275 204 396 points/decade (119.9995MHz to 120MHz with 501pts )
One other thing what least I hope is rejected dynamic range fast scalar sweep (SNA) because this can be really fast. (there is really many cases we do not need phase)

(and many other smaller or bigger improvements and bugfixes)


 

[Ulrich.G]

Just noticed, that the remaining time for the temporary ARINC decoder licence, which came with the firmware update 1.2.2.5, is still at 30 days. So its never expiring? I doubt that Siglent made this intentionaly.

[2N3055]

Just noticed, that the remaining time for the temporary ARINC decoder licence, which came with the firmware update 1.2.2.5, is still at 30 days. So its never expiring? I doubt that Siglent made this intentionaly.

Do you use it?
Maybe it is not counting scope on time but hours of use of decoder.

[Ulrich.G]

Do you use it?
Maybe it is not counting scope on time but hours of use of decoder.

No, and most likely I never will. But your assumption was right - I switched it on for bus 1 - the licence counter decremented to 29.

Thank you.

[Grandchuck]

Hi.  What am I doing wrong?  Ch1 signal sin 2Khz 1Vpp, Ch2 signal sin 1 kHz 1Vpp.  Math: Ch1xCh2.

[CustomEngineerer]

From your screenshot it looks like you are doing Math: Ch1xCh1, not Ch1xCh2.

[KungFuJosh]

Yeah, math is setup wrong. You need to select the channels you want to use, but you left it default to CH1, CH1.

You should also check your inputs. Are you running high or low impedance? Both channels are set to 10X 1M. If you run 50Ω direct from the AWG, that's how it should be set.

I recreated your experiment on my SDS2504XP, with the SDG2122X:

[Grandchuck]

Yup!  Thanks guys!  Lovin this scope so far.

[Grandchuck]

I am back to report another minor issue.  Could be my thick skull again, but it seems that shut down and power up messes with settings that it should not.  Case in point ... SPI decoding ... the protocol settings (the thresholds) get changed and decoding no longer works after a restart.  Easy enough to fix once one realizes what is happening.

Then I tried saving the setup when decoding was working.  Powered the scope back up and loaded the saved file and the situation was a bit worse because two of the probe settings got changed from X10 to X1 and, once again, the thresholds were wrong.  Again, easy to fix once one realizes what is going on.

[Martin72]

Hi Grandchuck,

The Siglent scopes still have problems with probe sensing.
This causes, among other things, this effect with the incorrectly adjusted thresholds after the restart.
If you have other (non-auto-sense) probes, try it out, then you won't have this (and other) effect.

[Grandchuck]

Thanks Martin and thanks for alerting us about the Batronix board.  It helps to learn this fine instrument.

[tautech]

I am back to report another minor issue.  Could be my thick skull again, but it seems that shut down and power up messes with settings that it should not.  Case in point ... SPI decoding ... the protocol settings (the thresholds) get changed and decoding no longer works after a restart.  Easy enough to fix once one realizes what is happening.

Then I tried saving the setup when decoding was working.  Powered the scope back up and loaded the saved file and the situation was a bit worse because two of the probe settings got changed from X10 to X1 and, once again, the thresholds were wrong.  Again, easy to fix once one realizes what is going on.

Siglent know about this and have shared a bug ID for it on their forum.

[tautech]

Siglent know about this and have shared a bug ID for it on their forum.

Is that a public forum or just for dealers etc.? If it's the former -- where to find it?

Private beta tester forum. Membership by invite only and access only given to the products you are working on.
I can see lots but not all.

[Grandchuck]

I am seeing some trigger instabilities when decoding UART signals.  Screen captures:
  Expected: triggers on falling edge of C1.  This is what is expected.
  DecodeBut: late in the data frame.  The trigger is later than expected.
  JunkDecode: trigger is late.  The trigger is late and the decoding is junk.
  NoDecode: did not trigger in time?  No decoding.

The captures are at 9.6 kbit/s.  At 38.4 kbit/s, there seem to be fewer errors.

[tautech]

I am seeing some trigger instabilities when decoding UART signals.  Screen captures:
  Expected: triggers on falling edge of C1.  This is what is expected.
  DecodeBut: late in the data frame.  The trigger is later than expected.
  JunkDecode: trigger is late.  The trigger is late and the decoding is junk.
  NoDecode: did not trigger in time?  No decoding.

The captures are at 9.6 kbit/s.  At 38.4 kbit/s, there seem to be fewer errors.

Yep, clear retriggering within packets.
Remedy = add Trigger Holdoff of a little larger value than the largest packet width.

[Performa01]

I am seeing some trigger instabilities when decoding UART signals.  Screen captures:
  Expected: triggers on falling edge of C1.  This is what is expected.

Falling edge trigger is a bit ambigous with so many falling edges, don't you think?

Modern oscilloscopes have a bunch of powerful triggers for a reason. In your case use a postiive pulse trigger with time the minimum pulse width little greater than one character duration, e.g. about >1 ms at 9k6 should reliably trigger at the start of each packet, regardless of its length.

[Grandchuck]

Thanks people.  Falling edge trigger with holdoff works a treat.

[tautech]

Thanks people.  Falling edge trigger with holdoff works a treat.

My MO is to display packets then Stop the scope and count the width of a packet with the graticules then adjust Holdoff and Run the scope again.

Note to self, experiment with Performa01's Pulse width method....

[2N3055]

There are also serial protocol triggers.....

[Martin72]

And it is sometimes very easy, thanks to the "copy to trigger" function.

[tautech]

Note to self, experiment with Performa01's Pulse width method....

Screenshot tells all.

[Grandchuck]

The oscilloscope locked up in digital mode.  Nothing worked/responded ... including the on/off button.  The web browser still displayed the instrument, but no response was possible there either.  A power recycle using the AC line cord restored normal operation. 

The lockup was caused by (I think) setting the CAN signal source to CAN_H - CAN_L.

[kripton2035]

if you try to connect with sigrok the interface is stuck too... only force restart is then working.

[Grandchuck]

A new bug appeared.  No mouse?  Tried all the usual things.  No mouse (no pointer on the screen either).  Front panel power cycling did not work but a power cord disconnect and reconnect did.  Back in business

[Martin72]

I had the scope for 1.5 years and had no problems of this kind during that time.
However, I had used a mouse maybe 2 or 3 times during that time.

[Grandchuck]

I had the scope for 1.5 years and had no problems of this kind during that time.
However, I had used a mouse maybe 2 or 3 times during that time.

It is interesting how we all work differently.  I use the mouse constantly.
The scope is going to be connected via its own power strip with an on/off switch in anticipation of more lockups in the future.

[TopQuark]

4. FFT - Logarithmic X axis

Would be very helpful to get an option to display the frequency scale in log scale, so that lower frequency content can be viewed more clearly on measurements spanning multiple decades.

Reading the SDS800X HD review and demonstration thread, I just realised this feature I requested more than a year ago, the decade scaled X axis, is now standard on the SDS800X HD, SDS1000X HD, and the SDS3000X HD, but not the SDS2000X HD. 

Would any of the forum members who has the ears of Siglent firmware development team know of any plans to update the SDS2000X HD with the same feature? I really wanted this function right from day one, but it seems like they forgot to back port this feature back to the 2000X HD.

[Martin72]

Once this feature has been realised there, it will also be implemented in the 2000X HD(why not).
However, Siglent will not be releasing a special update for this, it will probably be included with other features in a new firmware version.

[temperance]

It seems the 2000X HD is on the way out with the 1000X HD and 3000X HD pricing

I hope they will still solve some bugs. The probe recognition not working is very irritating.

[KungFuJosh]

It seems the 2000X HD is on the way out with the 1000X HD and 3000X HD pricing

I doubt that. There's a big price gap between the 1k and 3k ranges. 2k HD will fit in there fine.

[TopQuark]

It seems the 2000X HD is on the way out with the 1000X HD and 3000X HD pricing

I hope they will still solve some bugs. The probe recognition not working is very irritating.

I know they will probably still come around to fix stuff and back port features, but this sentiment is similar with me saying feeling "shafted" in the new 1000X HD and 3000X HD thread.

I understand Siglent does not have massive resources to pump out new software, and I understand the scope is still an unbelievably good deal and device etc. and the 2000X HD was pretty good to start with etc. I do still like my scope, and Siglent in general etc.

But, I do have mixed feelings about my 2000X HD purchase. Since I bought my 2000X HD, they have come out with 3 new HD scopes (800X HD, 1000X HD, 3000X HD), well 4 scopes if you count the 1000X HD black refresh. Yet thus far the 2000X HD has only gotten 1 software update, late last year. Stuff like the hopelessly slow digital channel 12wfm/s refresh rate still isn't fixed, neither are the whole lot of small bugs / missing features mentioned in this thread.

I got my base SDS2000X HD for 23000 RMB, which Siglent has now dropped pricing to 13880 RMB. The base 3000X HD sells at 27800 RMB right now on Taobao. I know I have been using an excellent scope and benefited from it massively between me getting the 2000X HD and today. I bought the 2000X HD and it pretty much did everything it promised (besides the digital channels, I regret buying the official logic probes).

Anyways, I think you can understand where my sentiment is coming from. I feel like the newer 1k, 3k , 800 HD scopes weren't meant to be released in such a rapid pace, until Rigol stepped in and released the DHO4000 and all the other offerings. Siglent had to respond with their own lineup of HD scopes, which is understandable, but it is still frustrating to see all the new features the new scopes are getting, some of which us 2000X HD owners suggested, yet the 2000X HD feels like has been forgotten, at least to me as an end user.

[Performa01]

... it is still frustrating to see all the new features the new scopes are getting, some of which us 2000X HD owners suggested, yet the 2000X HD feels like has been forgotten, at least to me as an end user.

I have big sympathy for you. All I can do is to assure you that the SDS2000X HD is not forgotten. I should know it, as I've just initiated investigations by Siglent engineers for some bug-fixes (bugs that won't affect the average user). I also know that a lot of the new functionality will be part of the software platform. Once it is declared mature after the release on one device, the others will follow.

It happens all the time: Back in mid 2019, Bode Plot II was first introduced in the low-end SDS1004X-E series, whereas the SDS5000X had to wait.

In general, the SDS2000X HD is mature, so that no quick emergency fixes are required. Consequently, Siglent rather waits a bit longer to release only substantial FW-update if necessary.

[tautech]

It seems the 2000X HD is on the way out with the 1000X HD and 3000X HD pricing

I hope they will still solve some bugs. The probe recognition not working is very irritating.

I know they will probably still come around to fix stuff and back port features, but this sentiment is similar with me saying feeling "shafted" in the new 1000X HD and 3000X HD thread.

I understand Siglent does not have massive resources to pump out new software, and I understand the scope is still an unbelievably good deal and device etc. and the 2000X HD was pretty good to start with etc. I do still like my scope, and Siglent in general etc.

But, I do have mixed feelings about my 2000X HD purchase. Since I bought my 2000X HD, they have come out with 3 new HD scopes (800X HD, 1000X HD, 3000X HD), well 4 scopes if you count the 1000X HD black refresh. Yet thus far the 2000X HD has only gotten 1 software update, late last year. Stuff like the hopelessly slow digital channel 12wfm/s refresh rate still isn't fixed, neither are the whole lot of small bugs / missing features mentioned in this thread.

I got my base SDS2000X HD for 23000 RMB, which Siglent has now dropped pricing to 13880 RMB. The base 3000X HD sells at 27800 RMB right now on Taobao. I know I have been using an excellent scope and benefited from it massively between me getting the 2000X HD and today. I bought the 2000X HD and it pretty much did everything it promised (besides the digital channels, I regret buying the official logic probes).

Anyways, I think you can understand where my sentiment is coming from. I feel like the newer 1k, 3k , 800 HD scopes weren't meant to be released in such a rapid pace, until Rigol stepped in and released the DHO4000 and all the other offerings. Siglent had to respond with their own lineup of HD scopes, which is understandable, but it is still frustrating to see all the new features the new scopes are getting, some of which us 2000X HD owners suggested, yet the 2000X HD feels like has been forgotten, at least to me as an end user.

Please take general discussion here:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds3000x-hd-and-upgraded-sds1000x-hd/
or here and preserve this thread for bug reports:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds2000x-hd-12bit-(published-for-chinese-domestic-market-only)/

Then I might comment on your views......

[tautech]

It seems the 2000X HD is on the way out with the 1000X HD and 3000X HD pricing

I hope they will still solve some bugs. The probe recognition not working is very irritating.

Looked back through your posts some months which didn't reveal any previous mentions of this.
Please tell.

[kripton2035]

it was some posts from me ...
when you hit the default button, the connected probes does not get recognized.
the original probes are set as 1x instead of 10x
after "default" if you unplug then replug the probe(s) it then get the good 10x

[tautech]

it was some posts from me ...
when you hit the default button, the connected probes does not get recognized.
the original probes are set as 1x instead of 10x
after "default" if you unplug then replug the probe(s) it then get the good 10x

Every Siglent auto probe detect DSO works this way.

And no other divider than 10x can be recognized at all, if I remember correctly?

Every one I have checked detects 100x probes just fine....although Siglent don't even offer one......

[TopQuark]

Probe readout pin customisation

I recently got myself a couple of Cal Test CT4200 x1 probes, they have a readout pin connected to ground with 1k ohms. When I plug the probe in, the scope recognises the probe is plugged in, but sets the input attenuation setting to 10x.

I measured the original probes that came with the SDS2kX HD (SP5050A), and the resistance between readout pin and ground is 11k ohms.

The scope recognises everything between a short to 49k ohms as a 10x probe being plugged in.

While there don't seem to be standards stating the readout pin resistance vs attenuation setting, perhaps the scope can let users set custom resistance ranges to match the probe attenuation setting? (assuming the readout pin resistance is read with an ADC)

As it stands, the scope's behaviour may lead to erroneous readings with certain probes. I know this is an edge case, but point still stands.

100%

Unfortunately the only sense probes properly recognised are 10x in 2000 class DSO's. 
I've thrown mud about this and it seems only the more upmarket models get the attenuation ratios correct. 

For other than 10x you need set attenuation manually. 

I think temperance is referring to this.

Also there's also some weirdness to how the scope remembers the attenuation settings. It sometimes forgets that the x10 probe is plugged in.

1. Set the channel attenuation to x1
2. Plug in a 10x probe, the scope will adjust the channel attenuation setting to 10x
3. Enter Bode plot mode, you don't even need to run a plot, just exit the bode test app
4. The channel attenuation will fall back to x1, even when the x10 probe is still plugged in.

[KungFuJosh]

it was some posts from me ...
when you hit the default button, the connected probes does not get recognized.
the original probes are set as 1x instead of 10x
after "default" if you unplug then replug the probe(s) it then get the good 10x

Every Siglent auto probe detect DSO works fails this way.

There, I fixed it for you. 😉 That's an annoying bug, that's been reported on every Siglent scope with probe detection.

[Grandchuck]

Latest lockup occurred trying to save a mask:

[KungFuJosh]

Latest lockup occurred trying to save a mask:

Does the lockup occur if you disable coordinate labels?

[Grandchuck]

Latest lockup occurred trying to save a mask:

Does the lockup occur if you disable coordinate labels?

Are you suggesting to turn off the labels before attempting to save? 

[temperance]

@ Tautech

The probes are set to x1 after you press the default button and they are recognized as x10 probes after unplugging.

[KungFuJosh]

@ Tautech

The probes are set to x1 after you press the default button and they are recognized as x10 probes after unplugging.

Yup. The bug has been reported for every model that can sense probes. Unplug and replug them in, or manually set them to x10. It's the only thing that really annoys me with the scope.

[temperance]

An other enhancement I would like to see is the ability to set the horizontal offset at a fixed position.

Let's say you set the offset to -80 µs with 20 µs /div. When the time base is adjusted to 10 µs/div, the offset should should be adjusted to -40 µs. As it is now, the offset is constant and the trigger position is off screen. That's not practical and I have to adjust the offset all the time.


 

[2N3055]

An other enhancement I would like to see is the ability to set the horizontal offset at a fixed position.

Let's say you set the offset to -80 µs with 20 µs /div. When the time base is adjusted to 10 µs/div, the offset should should be adjusted to -40 µs. As it is now, the offset is constant and the trigger position is off screen. That's not practical and I have to adjust the offset all the time.

In Utility-> System-> Reference position you can choose Horizontal Ref to be "Delay" or "Position".
When set to Position timeframe will compress/expand around set Position.
I believe you are now in Delay mode.

[temperance]

In Utility-> System-> Reference position you can choose Horizontal Ref to be "Delay" or "Position".
When set to Position timeframe will compress/expand around set Position.
I believe you are now in Delay mode.

Thank you very much. It's even in the manual...  But not under chapter 8.3 where they discuss the horizontal controls but under 32.2.6 "32.2.6 Reference Position Setting.

[Martin72]

The manual needs to be updated anyway.

[electronics hobbyist]

@ Tautech

The probes are set to x1 after you press the default button and they are recognized as x10 probes after unplugging.

There is a temporary solution that can be used. If you frequently use the 10X probe, you can use the "To Default Key" function.
1. Set the probes to 10X
2. Click on Save/Recall
3. Select Save mode
4. Set the type to To Default Key
5. Set Default Type to Current
6. Click on Save

After completing the above settings, clicking the Default button will load the 10X configuration.

[KungFuJosh]

Yeah, that's what I did. It's annoying though. It should be fixed properly. The coax cables currently connected aren't 10X.

[Grandchuck]

New bug or some kind of anomaly.  I noticed a displayed dc offset that should not have been so I performed self calibration and all channels then showed offset (see screen grab with all 4 set to GND).  Then, I tried measuring a DC voltage and the error was enormous (300% or more).  Since I have had issues with this scope before, I tried the usual and disconnected it from the ac line and then repowered and did another self calibration.  All OK now

This is a fairly serious problem.  Have any of you seen anything like this?

[Martin72]

Hi,
I've experienced something similar before, but I can't find the post(will search for it).
I also had this problem:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds2000x-hd-missing-features-and-bugs/msg4601140/#msg4601140
I was able to get both back in order with self-calibration.
And you could also set something on the scope regarding self-calibration, as I said, I'll have to look again where that was.

[Grandchuck]

Thanks Martin.
This particular problem is unsettling.  If I had not noticed the offset, I could have made who knows how many useless/misleading measurements .

[2N3055]

Thanks Martin.
This particular problem is unsettling.  If I had not noticed the offset, I could have made who knows how many useless/misleading measurements .

Could you please reset the scope to default settings?
Just to make sure all internal variables are properly initialized.

After FW upgrade it is not bad idea to perform reset to default.

[Grandchuck]

Thanks Martin.
This particular problem is unsettling.  If I had not noticed the offset, I could have made who knows how many useless/misleading measurements .

Could you please reset the scope to default settings?
Just to make sure all internal variables are properly initialized.

After FW upgrade it is not bad idea to perform reset to default.

I did reset to default.  If it happens again, I will reset  to default again and will report back here.  Thanks

[2N3055]

Thanks Martin.
This particular problem is unsettling.  If I had not noticed the offset, I could have made who knows how many useless/misleading measurements .

Could you please reset the scope to default settings?
Just to make sure all internal variables are properly initialized.

After FW upgrade it is not bad idea to perform reset to default.

I did reset to default.  If it happens again, I will reset  to default again and will report back here.  Thanks

Thanks for the answer.
Yes, keep an eye on it and if it misbehaves again, report.

[szajsiwo]

Feature Request:

Allow Ch3/Ch4 and Math channel as source for X/Y mode.

I recently ideated about the possibility to measure B-H curves with a scope:

Say you have to characterize a ferrite core, I think the gist of it would look something like: Wind two winding, primary for magnetizing the core, secondary winding for sensing.

- AWG drives primary, an amplifier is probably needed to get reasonable current into the primary to drive it into saturation.
- Measure current into primary + have user input number of pri turns and you get field strength (H), roughly.
- Measure and integrate secondary voltage + have user input number of sec turns and you get flux density (B), roughly.
- Plot in XY and you should have a BH curve.
- Stuff like saturation flux density, coercive force, remanence, hysteresis losses etc. can be calculated with maths.
- Some kind of offset/servo is probably needed to keep the secondary voltage integration in check.
- AWG allows measurement of B-H curves across different frequencies.

I wanted to give it a try with the 2000X HD, but XY mode only support Ch1 and Ch2 as source, but not other physical channels nor math channels 

I really don't want to build an actual integrator circuit to plot B-H curves, when the scope hardware and software is more than capable to do it itself! 

I double it!

Just received my SDS2104X HD and this is my second disappointment after realizing that built in AWG is licensed...

Any other manufacturers supports this?

[kripton2035]

if you bought it from some european seller like batronix, you get a bundle with the scope, and the frequency generator is in and almost all the decoders too ...

[egonotto]

if you bought it from some european seller like batronix, you get a bundle with the scope, and the frequency generator is in and almost all the decoders too ...

Hello,

no, you have to buy the Siglent SDS2XHD-BND separately.

Best regards
egonotto

[kripton2035]

my mistake, but at that price it's a steal why not buy it with the scope ?

[Martin72]

That's a good question, there have been people here who have bought the scope, ignored the bundle and then asked for a hack for the options...
I've been "advertising" the bundle for weeks, even though I don't have any of it (I don't even have the scope anymore).
Because I was electrified by how cheap it is - I paid more for the logic probes alone than for the bundle INCL. the probes.

[TopQuark]

Feature request:

User defined math for measurements (the numbers measurement, not the math traces).

For example, it would be nice to be able to multiply frequency (Hz) by 60, so that it shows RPM when I'm measuring the output of a tachometer.

[skander36]

Just received my SDS2104X HD and this is my second disappointment after realizing that built in AWG is licensed...

Any other manufacturers supports this?

All major manufacturers have inbuilt AWG separately licensed.
But also they sell bundles.

[szajsiwo]

I bought it on taobao for super-duper promo price of 11100CNY and still it was a big expense for me - not every one here earns in EUR/USD guys (USD/PLN=4 EUR/PLN=4,3)..
Bundle relatively cheap in comparison for separate licences but it is still for me a 1/4 of month salary on top of that...Just not realized that such essential functionality can be licensed. At least simple sin/square.

Anyway my post was basically about Math channel as source for X/Y mode.