Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[mnementh]

Ahha we have a delivery this morning. Big thanks to BU508A



Also I need to tidy up my desk

Now THAT is fucking art. 

mnem
With a side of resistance.

[Cerebus]

So how come I think the lamp made of auto parts is super cool yet a lamp made of an old and obsolete AVO meter is sacrilege? 

Rational explanation welcome because I don't have one. 

Auto parts is the thing. If someone took a Ferrari Daytona (substitute your own historic car to taste), drilled a couple of big holes in the bodywork and mounted a lampstand through them I suspect you'd get the same gut reaction.

[mnementh]

Now, can we please have some positive interaction? It seems like the only time you ever bother to talk to me any more it's something in a negative tone, or to correct me.

You know that's not true.

It really gets old.

mnem
 

I'll tell you what gets old, not being able to quietly correct a factual error in something you've written before first thinking "Is this worth it? Is the information important enough that it's worth risking sort of reply that Mnem might think somehow insults his understanding and cause him to take three pages to explain how he isn't wrong and I'm picking on him?". I didn't blink before correcting Vince about the silver solder thing earlier because I didn't expect any comeback for having the temerity to offer an alternative, and as far as I know, correct interpretation to him. I think hard every time I ought to reply to you and say "Erm no, it's like this", or "Not quite" or "I think you're misunderstanding this". I certainly genuinely wouldn't dare just say "That's wrong" to you for anything less than something categorically wrong and easily proven because I know that even that you'll quibble over. Think about that for a minute. No, really, think about that. I don't have to do mental weighing like that before risking disagreeing with anyone else on the whole forum, even people who are famously fractious, even the people everybody regards as gobshites.

Here here,
I was doing exactly that about posting a correction to the statement when you beat me to it.
No one knows everything Even in areas we do know about we make slips and mistakes. Much better to say "You're right, thank you for the clarification" or even just accept it without comment.....
I don't think anyone i going out of their way to pick fault with others, but if it's an important point it's worth correcting. We have to remember this will be here for years and others with less knowledge will read it. Accepting that salespeople misuse terms is justifying their actions.

Oh for corn's sake... I never once denied that Cerebus' definition of the word was correct; I knew it was from git-go, and I even said so. EDIT: Where I was wrong was in calling 63/37 eutectic, which point we still have yet to address. I only repeated what was taught me, and then when he very obviously interpreted what I said in a way that was not what I intended, I tried to correct a misunderstanding.

Please stop telling me what I said, and more importantly, what I meant.

Just because words fail does not mean intelligent people have to; we have language filled with so many abstract terms so that we can talk aboot misunderstandings like rational adults and resolve them.

mnem
 

[mnementh]

So how come I think the lamp made of auto parts is super cool yet a lamp made of an old and obsolete AVO meter is sacrilege? 

Rational explanation welcome because I don't have one. 

Auto parts is the thing. If someone took a Ferrari Daytona (substitute your own historic car to taste), drilled a couple of big holes in the bodywork and mounted a lampstand through them I suspect you'd get the same gut reaction.

Now that is something we can agree on.

mnem
But if we did the same thing to a Yugo... now THAT would be art.

[Vince]

Importing them from the US might be very costly though, I guess. If you know of a source in Germany or Europe, please share ! 
In the meantime I will take note of what you said, and will start searching for these pens once I get round to fixing this scope...

Pens for the Atari 1020:
http://plotterstifte-faserschreibfedern.de/K5208-Medizinschreiber-4er-Paket

Oh thanks for that !!! 

Same exact shape, same exact dimensions, and they even give a comprehensive list of compatible printer/plotters... which actually lists the GOULD 1604 my very scope !!! 

OK now the pen problem is 100% solved, thank a million to all who helped ! 

That motivates me to fix this scope, knowing I can get fresh pens and paper to get this plotter going afterwards !! 

[Zucca]

That motivates me to fix this scope, knowing I can get fresh pens and paper to get this plotter going afterwards !! 

[xrunner]

From my experience, it'll start to look uneven quite soon (burn-in).

Pages fly by these days. 

Yea we'll keep an eye on it (no pun intended), I will post what it looks like if it starts to show aging. But it's not a big deal. I'll have a custom 3D model for the front panel so if I want to change to another display I can do it pretty easily. We'll just say this has dual-functions, an NMEA display and a display module tester.

 

If this fails I'll just port over what I have to a new display. The basic functionality of the message parsing is a done deal.

[mnementh]

Okay... so why is this both horrifying and viscerally satisfying at the same time...?

It is one of the definitions of art... a presentation whose intent is to elicit feelings in those who experience it. So I guess it does qualify, even if I don't exactly like what it makes me feel.

mnem
Hmmm... does this mean the Avo & Mallory lamps are trying to do this too...? No, I'm pretty sure they're just not very good art...

[Cerebus]

That’ll be because the auto parts lamp is now greater than the sum of its parts while the Avo lamp is now less than the sum of its parts.

From a philosophical point of view I suppose one is art and the other is 💩

There’s also something horrible about taking an object which has had effort and design put into it and removing its purpose entirely. Prompts an uncomfortable visceral reaction to anyone who sees purpose in it.

Decide yourself....



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fettecke

Ahh that’s another form of art: Taking the piss.

Clearly he could be taking the piss here and simply through reputation and anticipation trolling everyone while making a ton of money. The art is increasing your reputation by doing something trivial or obscure. The application of a hat builds credibility. This is the art us software engineers have and occasionally I wear a hat 

Either that or drugs and the gallery was just lucky that day they had some butter around instead of some readily available bodily solids or liquids.

I used to know a British Surrealist artist by the name of Conroy Maddox (1912-2005) for something like the last 15 years of his life. Conroy had lived in Paris working as an artist between the wars and had actual spoken to people who were around when Marcel Duchamp created and exhibited 'Fountain' by signing R. Mutt onto a urinal and sticking it on a plinth. Conroy was convinced by what he had heard that Duchamp was both making a serious point and taking the piss at the same time. The art scene at the time was no different to today in the sense that there were a lot of people around talking pretentious bollocks and doing pretentious things and Conroy felt that it was aimed mostly at this crowd. I'm a little disappointed that Duchamp didn't leave a note to be opened years later saying something to the effect "Ha! Fooled you all!" which would provide definitive first hand proof of Connroy's version of Duchamp's intent.

[xrunner]

That motivates me to fix this scope, knowing I can get fresh pens and paper to get this plotter going afterwards !! 

Those pen-plotted graphs have a neat "mechanical" quality that to me look appealing. Once you see the thing print out the screen, you'll probably use it to create pen-plotted art using the appropriate signals.

A whole new hobby coming ...

 

[mnementh]

Plotters are hypnotic to watch. Most people get fixated when they are drawing block colour or characters from non-stroked fonts.

Can confirm this. I built a Lorenz attractor circuit (in fact two) to drive a XY-recorder on the Hannover Makerfaire in 2019. That seemed to be magnetic to a lot of people. One young lady watched it for apparently quarter an hour.  https://photos.app.goo.gl/1VXPSJJqAHhCvnAZA

I gave away the paper charts for visitors every hour or so.

See it in action here at the start, with the second, faster one using the Knott display to the right of it: https://photos.app.goo.gl/Ncxbd42rruVudCyV7

With the HP pen plotter Martin.M made hard copies of the HP scope at the right end of the table.

The LED panel controller seen in the vid was built by madao.

mnem

[Kosmic]

Anybody is looking for a good old 26GHz VNA for 450$ ? Shipping might be a bit expensive though

https://www.ebay.com/itm/284461294599



This is sad but I don't think I have the place for a giant like that.

[Kosmic]

Also a cheap HP 3457a with scanner card for 160$ on the bay

https://www.ebay.com/itm/124913065280

[Kosmic]

Oh hell... someone hide all my bank cards and hit me in the head before I do something foolish...

Current price is about the same as the cost of the Fischer connector (with a minumum order of £250, IIRC).

You just need to install some proper binding post. Not those Fischer rubbish

Vandals, the lot of 'em

The Fischer connectors are wonderful to handle; they ooze high precision engineering (as well as causing money to ooze from bank accounts).

Besides, I was just trying to be friendly and provide a disincentive to buying it. It has to be noted that your comments are more in keeping with TEA/GAS ethos!

You might be interested in this then (80$).

https://www.ebay.com/itm/234198036430

[Cerebus]

But the Imp, I remember them as being hateful little cars with an alloy rear mounted engine with little access for maintenance and had a reputation for overheating and blowing core plugs due to inadequate airflow to the engine?

The access for maintenance thing is completely true. Never had any overheating problems. I suspect the latter comes from the large number of people who modified Imp engines and then thrashed the life out of them. The Imp was briefly a successful rally car and therefore attracted exactly the crowd who do that sort of thing. The all aluminium FWMA engine was based on the Coventry Climax Featherweight which was one of the favourites of the engine tuning crowd back in its day and the same basic engine was used in a lot of 60s sports and racing cars.

I got to drive it a little bit and it was fun to drive. Lots of torque for a piddling little 875cc 1960's engine and would leave Minis choking on its dust and exhaust fumes. It was supposed to become my car but my mum snaffled it as her shopping car and I had to settle for a motorbike instead.

[bd139]

Don't worry, this is not its normal state. If it looks tidy it's merely because the other day he spent half a day clearing his desk, room, of half a ton of stuff that was covering the desk and keep him from even accessing that desk, had to walk over stuff to just grab his chair...... he cleaned all that stuff just so that he could take a nice pic of his work environment for us to see.  But I am sure as weeks go by, it will progressively come back to its previous, natural, clusterfuck state. Have I got that right BD ?? 

Ok so this thread actually made me tidy it up and file the paperwork away properly while on zoom calls 



It shall return to clusterfuck on Sunday morning 

[Cerebus]

Just received a small envelope with two tubes of IC's, Beiling Shanghai BL3101 and BL3207, admitted clones of the Matsushita MN3101 and MN3207. They're, respectively, clock generators and bucket brigade delays for analog signals,  used together to create an analog delay, most often today with some clock LFO modulation causing  Doppler distortion effects known as "flanger" and "chorus" to the musicians. There is an abundance of borderline cargo cult level "knowledge" on these effects among the "circuit benders", but also in this flood of misunderstandings, cause/effect mixups, beliefs and folklore there can be found solid engineering tips. Currently sorting through all those sources trying to decide which circuit to start with.

This is a winter evening project with the Middle Boy.

Back in my studio days we got an Eventide Harmoniser stuffed full of BB delay lines. For the next three months it was the most overused bit of kit in the back rack until we and and all the producers that came in got tired of putting pitch shifts, flanging, delays and all the other things it could do onto almost every bloody rock or pop track that we mixed. Cost a small fortune.

[xrunner]

Ok so this thread actually made me tidy it up and file the paperwork away properly while on zoom calls 



It shall return to clusterfuck on Sunday morning 

Oh no ... now it's too neat. It's some kind of sign you aren't accomplishing anything. The dirty desk crowd will be coming for you. Ask me how I know. 

[Cerebus]

Personally I'm fond of my desk being tidy, also my house being tidy. However, both are signs that I have done nothing other than tidying. Tidy is a situation that lasts around me only for so long as I am not doing anything productive. Therefore I am deeply suspicious of anyone with a tidy desk or house, to my natural way of being it suggests that they have nothing productive to do.

[bd139]

Oh no ... now it's too neat. It's some kind of sign you aren't accomplishing anything. The dirty desk crowd will be coming for you. Ask me how I know. 

I am between accomplishing things 

Here's an old photo to show how bad it can get here 

[McBryce]

[..] Medical stuff, was that the hobby you had in mind Bryce  ?

No actually, vintage computers. There were several printers / plotters such as the Atari 1020 that used the same pens. They are often on offer on retro computer sites. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atari_1020
The original Atari pens were made of metal and the top can be popped off and re-filled.

McBryce.

P.s. Where's the close-up picture??

Oh interesting ! Yes if you know of another source for these pens, please share !

Piccies ? Oops sorry forgot to attach them, a disease of mine !

I edited my message to add the pics, you can scroll back to see them.... well I will attach them here as well for convenience...

Yes, they're the same ones. Here's some I have. These are from 80's Atari and Tandy printers, so there should be quite a few sources in the US for these. You can carefully pull the tip out of the metal barrel and refill these as often as you want.

McBryce.

Oh wow, indeed they are 100% the same pens, thanks for that !  

Importing them from the US might be very costly though, I guess. If you know of a source in Germany or Europe, please share ! 
In the meantime I will take note of what you said, and will start searching for these pens once I get round to fixing this scope...

Sorry, I broke my own rules and posted before my third coffee: Mixed you up with Zucca who just moved to the US recently. 

McBryce.

[Vince]

Oh no ... now it's too neat. It's some kind of sign you aren't accomplishing anything. The dirty desk crowd will be coming for you. Ask me how I know. 

I am between accomplishing things 

Here's an old photo to show how bad it can get here 

AHHHHH, that's more like it ! I like it much better that way  ! 

[Vince]

[..] Medical stuff, was that the hobby you had in mind Bryce  ?

No actually, vintage computers. There were several printers / plotters such as the Atari 1020 that used the same pens. They are often on offer on retro computer sites. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atari_1020
The original Atari pens were made of metal and the top can be popped off and re-filled.

McBryce.

P.s. Where's the close-up picture??

Oh interesting ! Yes if you know of another source for these pens, please share !

Piccies ? Oops sorry forgot to attach them, a disease of mine !

I edited my message to add the pics, you can scroll back to see them.... well I will attach them here as well for convenience...

Yes, they're the same ones. Here's some I have. These are from 80's Atari and Tandy printers, so there should be quite a few sources in the US for these. You can carefully pull the tip out of the metal barrel and refill these as often as you want.

McBryce.

Oh wow, indeed they are 100% the same pens, thanks for that !  

Importing them from the US might be very costly though, I guess. If you know of a source in Germany or Europe, please share ! 
In the meantime I will take note of what you said, and will start searching for these pens once I get round to fixing this scope...

Sorry, I broke my own rules and posted before my third coffee: Mixed you up with Zucca who just moved to the US recently. 

McBryce.

That's OK !

I am no Zucca for sure ! For I can't tell a router from a smartphone, and the only Italian I know is limited to "Pizza" and "Lamboghini Diablo", that's not much ! 

[Cerebus]

Sorry, I broke my own rules and posted before my third coffee: Mixed you up with Zucca who just moved to the US recently. 

McBryce.

Oh dear, you've got it bad; or are drinking coffee that's too weak. It takes me one coffee to become cogent, two before I can bring anything like incisiveness to the situation, and three? You wouldn't want to be around me after three consecutive coffees. You know those signs that say "Unattended children will be given a double espresso and a drum"? Something like the outcome of that. There's a fine titration of caffeine dose that has to be maintained between somnambulism and insanity.

[Kosmic]

...But in this video he simply substituted NiMH packs. I thought they had different charge requirements vs NiCad. Is that really a good idea without modifying the charge circuit?

In principle, yes... in practice, modern low-impedance and LSD NiMH AAs as sold for consumer use are amazingly abuse-tolerant and will serve for many years, as long as you get in the habit of fully discharging them and recharging them like once a month or so, and don't leave them on a constant trickle charge. I've swapped over to NiMH on oodles of RC transmitters and calculators over the last couple decades with zero change in the charge circuitry.



Alternately, could build a cheap 18650 pack with a cheap BMS PCB, but you'd need to add a CV/CC regulator set to 12.6V/~.5A in the charging circuit. That's what I did for the boi's BT speaker here:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/3d-printing/3d-printer-yet/msg3566783/#msg3566783

Works a treat!

mnem
*juicy*

You know if they sell a board somewhere that include the charger and protection for lithium battery ? on aliexpress I only find protection boards