Velleman WFS210 wireless oscilloscope for only £20 !

[sorenkir]

Hi,

I have received mine from Amazon UK yesterday:
 Firmware 4.4 Build 1708.
 Windows Application V1.1.0.295.
 Android Application V1.2

The first hour with it was quite disappointing:
I have tried it on my old XP machine connected with USB. I did not succeed to have any trace on the screen although I heard relay clicks when changing settings. Tried a scope calibration and I had to abort it after a few minutes of no visible activity. Then switched to WiFi with no more success until I noticed that it was trying to connect to the IP address 169.254.1.1.
After changing this address to the correct address 192.168.1.1, I managed to connect to the oscilloscope, but still no trace. When playing with the controls I eventually started to see a trace but with a huge offset and no sync. Replaying the calibration finally fixed all issues and I managed to have the toy work reasonably well.



500kHz seems to be the maximum usable frequency:



Above that frequency, the trace is slightly distorted, but the triggering is unstable :



No peak detect, the sync. pulse is not always sampled (but it can perfectly trigger on the pulse) :



Did not check the accuracy.

At first, I did not give much attention to the warning message when used with a USB link (Probe ground and charger ground at different voltage level).
In fact, when using such a connection, it is impossible to connect the ground pin of the oscilloscope to the ground of the computer. Doing that sends the trace out of the screen, with no way to have it come back.
As a consequence, an isolated USB link or a laptop with no ground connection seems mandatory to use it on a bench.

The android application did not work on my old Sony XPeria Tab (Android Jelly Bean): it is able to connect to the scope, but the interface is totally unresponsive.
It seems OK on a more recent Samsung Tab.

Michel.

[Fraser]

All seems to have gone quiet on the Velleman front. They last asked for a link to the GitHub branch for correcting the link issue. Nothing more heard.

We need to keep this Velleman call 'open' so please do make comment on Velleman support forum in the thread that I started for this unit.

We need a new Android app release with the suggested corrections and a revisit of the units firmware may be order ?

Fraser

[Fraser]

Velleman have asked Avacee for a link to his excellent work on the App. Not sure if Acacee has seen this request, so copying it here.

"@Avacee Thanks for the tips!
Do you have link to your GitHub fork?
If you feel your code is stable don’t hesitate to do a pull request."

Avacee, are you able to help the chap at Velleman please ?

Fraser

[R_G_B_]

I think if they have given up then why don't they open up the firmware hardware and software.

Lame excuse to say they released this to the hacking community when all they opened up is the software.

What use is that if the firmware also has problems which seems to be the case. Some people on here have said it's only £20. What about those who paid around 5 times this much. I have other oscilloscopes and even if it's £20 for this one. I would have expected it to work because that's what to  expected.

[janoc]

I think if they have given up then why don't they open up the firmware hardware and software.

Lame excuse to say they released this to the hacking community when all they opened up is the software.

What use is that if the firmware also has problems which seems to be the case. Some people on here have said it's only £20. What about those who paid around 5 times this much. I have other oscilloscopes and even if it's £20 for this one. I would have expected it to work because that's what to  expected.

They actually may not have the firmware or the rights to open it. That is quite common when you just rebadge stuff or have it developed for you.

[Fraser]

R_G_B,

I have not seen any evidence that Velleman have abandoned this product yet.

I contacted their chap on the forum today and he fully intends to release a new version of the Android App just as soon as he can incorporate Avacee's improvements.

As to release of the firmware, much will depend upon Velleman's ownership of that firmwares rights. We assume Velleman designed the WFS210 but that is not a proven fact at this time. It may be a bought in design ?

I have made it clear to Velleman that this forum contains members who are keen to see this product improve and who will help where able. They may, or may not be interested in spending much time on this product depending upon its history and projected life in their range.

As to the units sold for £20, I am under no illusions that Maplin are effectively dumping unwanted stock. This unit may have caused them problems with returns, so they just want rid.

I doubt people who paid £100 for such a unit, in it's current state, would want to keep it when a refund may be obtained.

Fraser

[Mr. Scram]

After some messing about, I got things working. Initially, the WFS210 wouldn't be recognized using USB. Windows wouldn't even indicate that something had been plugged in. I swapped the USB cable and tested the new one with another device before use. Still nothing. After trying all the possible permutations of installing the software, rebooting and powering up the device and starting the program, I decided to test yet another USB cable. This time I took one from a microcontroller development kit, so it should be a decent quality one. Suddenly, the oscilloscope shows up! It's either quite picky about the cable used, or I just got lucky this time. I did notice the quality cable snapped into the socket in a much more convincing fashion. After this, the WFS210 still didn't yield any traces, but a quick self calibration fixed that problem. It actually works!

First impressions aren't terrible. The hardware seems to be better made than feared. I see little wrong there. The software isn't as ugly as I feared it to be. However, functionality is very, very basic. Lots of data I would expect to be available is missing, or requires manually measuring it. As people have discovered, viewing frequencies at even one tenth of the specifications is a challenge. All in all, it so far seems to be a nice-to-have-toy. I don't think I would be happy if I paid $100+ for this. At this price, it's not terrible.

I just wish Velleman didn't lie so blatantly about the bandwidth. If waveforms don't turn out looking nice at higher frequencies, that's not really great. But the fact that the equipment can't even tell 720 KHz from 8 MHz means the specifications are completely fabricated.

[Mr. Scram]

I might be missing something, but is it possible to have the software tell you the frequency without setting markers, or to turn off a channel?

[Avacee]

Apologies for going quiet. I'm away until Friday.
I've seen Velleman's comment about a Pull Request but I need to test my changes to check they are stable. Any testing volunteers?
I was in the middle of adding a demo/live/connected indicator hence why I didn't do the Pull Request before coming away.
Also had a suggestion via PM to add a regular keep-alive ping to stop the 15 min timeout.

Regarding turning off a channel keep increasing the V/div.

[jimmc]

Count me in as a volunteer.

Jim

[kripton2035]

I will try for iOS as my wfs210 should arrive this week.

[Fraser]

Avacee,

I am happy to test the updated App as well

Fraser

[R_G_B_]

I have two units with two versions of firmware.

I'm also willing  test out   Avacee  updated app.

[Mr. Scram]

Apologies for going quiet. I'm away until Friday.
I've seen Velleman's comment about a Pull Request but I need to test my changes to check they are stable. Any testing volunteers?
I was in the middle of adding a demo/live/connected indicator hence why I didn't do the Pull Request before coming away.
Also had a suggestion via PM to add a regular keep-alive ping to stop the 15 min timeout.

Regarding turning off a channel keep increasing the V/div.

That's hidden well. Thanks!

[Mr. Scram]

The more I tinker with this thing, the more it irks me that it's so close to being pretty good. The hardware seems to be constructed reasonably well and the software isn't horrible to look at or work with. If it would actually meet its rated bandwidth and if the software had a bit more of the niceties normal oscilloscopes have, it would be a very cool addition to the workshop indeed.

Now, it's basically a marginally useful toy. Damn it, Velleman. You were so close.

[b_force]

The more I tinker with this thing, the more it irks me that it's so close to being pretty good. The hardware seems to be constructed reasonably well and the software isn't horrible to look at or work with. If it would actually meet its rated bandwidth and if the software had a bit more of the niceties normal oscilloscopes have, it would be a very cool addition to the workshop indeed.

Now, it's basically a marginally useful toy. Damn it, Velleman. You were so close.

I have that with a lot of products (not only from Velleman).

If they just.......

[Mr. Scram]

I have that with a lot of products (not only from Velleman).

If they just.......

Sure, that's the bane of tinkering with things. As soon as you discover things can be changed, made better, you never buy a finished product again. Everything is just a starting point for something better. Soon, everything becomes a project, even before you buy it. Been there, done that.

This one strikes an awkward balance, though. It's like having a word on the tip of your tongue. So close to useful, yet mostly useless.

[R_G_B_]

Velleman hps140i jitter problem over a certain frequency there was a discussion about it on this forum. Velleman asked customers who had bought them to return them  to velleman for the  firmware to be updated.  Would this mean they own the firmware  and would it also seem likely in this case.  They do there firmware in-house ?

They have a product that they think works in terms of the  oscilloscope  And they just develop variations of the same product.
Using what they have and know

[b_force]

I have that with a lot of products (not only from Velleman).

If they just.......

This one strikes an awkward balance, though. It's like having a word on the tip of your tongue. So close to useful, yet mostly useless.

I have that with a lot of products (not only from Velleman).

If they just.......

 

It's exactly what I meant with my previous post.
There are so many products that are ALMOST there, but because it's not quite there it's a total fail.
It's so unfortunate, you just need a little more time and energy to get it right.
I just don't get why (certain) companies make this mistake over and over again.

[Pinkus]

I am tempted to test one and use it at my secondary work desk and to give one to my nephew.
Unfortunately Maplin_Outlet does not export.
Anbody from UK willing to order one or two and to send it to me to Germany?
I will cover all costs of course.
Thx

[Fraser]

The nice chap at Velleman (Vel337) has just advised me that they have kindly released the firmware to us 

Here it is.....

https://github.com/Velleman/WFS210-Firmware

Thanks Velleman 

Fraser

[Mr. Scram]

The nice chap at Velleman (Vel337) has just advised me that they have kindly released the firmware to us 

Here it is.....

https://github.com/Velleman/WFS210-Firmware

Thanks Velleman 

Fraser

Not just the firmware, but the actual source files of the firmware? That's awesome!

[Fraser]

Yes, I saw that.

Not that I have the skills to do much with them, but someone else might ?

I am pleased to see this move from Velleman though. It suggests that they are embracing this forums comments and intentions to improve their product. 

Now I need to find out whether I can obtain a firmware update for my HPS140i scopes.... I have one already upgraded and 5 with original firmware that has the Trigger issue.

Fraser

[Fraser]

Pinkus,

I would offer to help but sadly I am ill at the moment so house bound. I hope someone else can help you.

Fraser

[lukier]

Wow, firmware sources - nice!

However, I didn't find anything related to the grounding issue, so I guess it is not some software "safety" feature, but it is in the hardware design. Pity.