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#25 Reply
Posted by
PA0PBZ
on 07 Jan, 2014 21:05
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Hiya, not yet. I will send them tomorrow.
Any reason not to put them up here? I appreciate if you have your reasons but I´d like to see them too.
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#26 Reply
Posted by
Fraser
on 07 Jan, 2014 22:15
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I will see what I can do. My concern is in splashing ITAR regulated technology images over the internet and any ID that links them to me.
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#27 Reply
Posted by
mhosier
on 23 Feb, 2014 17:59
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I am new to this forum, but have had a PM675 for 6 years and love it! I have rebuilt the batteries and made up an external battery pack (the Lemo connector for the power socket is part number FHG.2B.310.CLAD82 if anyone needs it).
I do have some problems with the digital camera module though. It doesn't seem to work any more (the external monitor is a bit flakey too) and I think it could be either a dodgy connection or that the video camera module has failed. I'd really like to repair it, but Flir charge a fortune for servicing.
I saw that Aurora had some experience of replacing the camera module (a colour one would be awesome!) and I wonder if he or anyone else might be able to make any suggestions as to what camera modules fit/work in that installation, and maybe if there are any points that I should look out for? Quite unusually, I am a little nervous working on this unit, as I depend on it for work and Flir haven't been all that supportive in the past! Any advice, pictures or suggestions would really help!
Thanks guys!
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#28 Reply
Posted by
Fraser
on 23 Feb, 2014 19:03
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The 675 does not have a visible camera module so I presume you mean the PM695 ?
1. The camera module is a standard commercial product and nothing special. You need to buy the larger format PCB board camera and ensure it is the correct video standard. NTSC or PAL (same as thermal camera output standard, and written on the underside of the EVF). If you buy the slightly smaller PCB cameras you will need an adapter plate that is also easily available via e*ay. I bought decent PCB cameras from e*ay that use a decent resolution CCD as opposed to a cheap CMOS sensor. The original is also CCD based. Do not by the 'top of the line' Sony chipset cameras that have a menu, and joystick controls in the cable feeding them.
2. The camera module feeds its video to the Analogue to Digital converter board in the rear of the camera housing. A fragile ribbon cable connects the A to D board to the CPU board via a slot in the case. The camera PCB may be experimented with without having to dismantle the camera. You just need to undo the two screws that secure the visual cameras front section to the rear and gently pull forward. Test the original camera first to see if it is faulty. If not, check all cables including the ribbon connector to the CPU board inside the thermal camera. Ribbons can pop out of their retainers but this is uncommon on these cameras. If it is not the camera PCB or the cables, you have a problem on the A to D or CPU boards. More in depth diagnostics would be needed. The A to D is a commercial Conexant IC so do not panic if it is dead.
3. The Electronic Viewfinder (EVF) is not a complex design. It is built around a Sony Chipset that includes a Sony LCD panel. The data sheet is available. Common failures are
a) Fractured ribbon cable from EVF module to camera CPU board. Fracture is usually at the flex point near the pivot inside the EVF case. Cable is standard pitch. Buy a long replacement and fit.
b) Backlight transformer suffers dry joints and needs to be resoldered. It is obvious when seen, its an approx 10mm diameter ferrite screened transformer on the second PCB.
c) Backlight tube becomes worn out and does not strike reliably. This can be seen by black discolouration on the tubes fluorescent white surface, near to one input terminal. New backlight tube or replacement LED 'light guide' substitute needed.
The EVF shares parts with some models of JVC VHS-C camcorder(GR 7xx and 9xx) . Look for the ones that have a colour LCD viewfinder on e*ay. I picked some up for less than $10 each as no one wants them these days. Some come with an LED backlight which can be grafted into the 695 EVF.
Finally, what country are you in ?
Aurora
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#29 Reply
Posted by
mhosier
on 23 Feb, 2014 19:27
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WOW!
Thank you SO much for such an awesome list of info and tips. Based on the info you gave me I shall tackle some diagnostics and hopefully upgrade the camera to a colour one as well as fixing the faults. I really appreciate your time - thank you!
You are quite right - I forgot to mention one detail: Although it is a PM675, it has been fitted with a digital camera module removed from a PM695 that was on the same fleet. This was carried out before I bought the camera, and they had installed 695 firmware to enable the camera.
Presumably the 640x480 camera resolution is a function of the A/D and CPU, so image quality cannot be significantly improve by choice of camera element (other than by having a generally decent CCD)?
Thanks again!
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#30 Reply
Posted by
Fraser
on 23 Feb, 2014 20:37
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640x480 is the resolution limitation so any decent CCD camera with 480 or greater TV lines will be fine. 420 or more TV lines will also be fine for the purpose if you cannot find a 480 or higher unit.
I will see if I can find the e*ay advert for the cameras I bought. I used NTSC though so bear this in mind before ordering.
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#31 Reply
Posted by
Fraser
on 23 Feb, 2014 20:55
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My 480 TVL CCD pcb cameras were bought from Sure Electronics and can be found here:
http://www.sureelectronics.net/goods.php?id=1386It claims to be a Sony HAD II CCD, and I have no reason to doubt this, so low light performance will be good. It was on sale at the time for $24 so was good value.
If you order, remember to tell them what video system you need, PAL or NTSC.
NOTE: The camera arrives in a neat little plastic box but, to protect the CCD window, it has a tinted plastic protector fitted. Remove the protector before use.
Sure Electronics are a reliable and honest seller so I have no hesitation in recommending them. They also sell via e*ay and take PayPal.
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#32 Reply
Posted by
mhosier
on 23 Feb, 2014 21:19
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That's brilliant, thank you very much! I feel a purchase coming on...
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#33 Reply
Posted by
Fraser
on 23 Feb, 2014 21:56
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#34 Reply
Posted by
Fraser
on 23 Feb, 2014 22:35
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Visual camera uses a Conexant BT835 ADC video capture IC. Datasheet attached.
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#35 Reply
Posted by
Fraser
on 23 Feb, 2014 22:57
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Some low-res images of my camera that may assist you in understanding the dismantling process.
Note that the Colour Camera is an older generation 2 PCB type and newer ones are far more integrated, but they still fit. This is important when upgrading form monochrome to colour camera, as the monochrome camera housing is smaller.
When you remove the camera PCB retaining screws you will likely find that the camera lens mount is held quite tightly in the metal housing. It is not glued but is in a neoprene 'O' ring sealed hole to stop water ingress. Gently press on the lens to push the camera out of the case. When refitting a camera, lubricate the neoprene seal with a vary small amount of soapy water. It makes assembly far easier.
Edit: I forgot to mention the location of the connector for the visible camera on the CPU board. If you look at picture 4021 you will see a small PCB backed connetor on the far left of the picture, adjacent to an approx 1" wide ribbon. This small pcb backed connector is the only connection to the visible camera module. If it pops off it socket you will not have any supply voltage on the camera so it would be an easy check for you without opening the case.
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#36 Reply
Posted by
mhosier
on 27 Feb, 2014 19:03
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Thank you again for so much information Aurora! Planning on stripping my PM675 down for some tinkering at the weekend, based on your info...
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#37 Reply
Posted by
Fraser
on 27 Feb, 2014 20:45
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You are most welcome.
They are very nice cameras, if a little heavy.
Aurora
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#38 Reply
Posted by
Fraser
on 27 Feb, 2014 20:52
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@mhosier,
A question for you,
Do you get a slightly warmer area on the right hand side of your images. On my three PM695 cameras I can see a small warmer spot half way down the right edge of the picture that increases slowly until a non uniformaty correction when it is corrected. I presently suspect the hot CPU pcb, positioned opposite, contaminating the microbolometer module with radiated heat.
Aurora
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#39 Reply
Posted by
mhosier
on 28 Feb, 2014 19:14
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I will fire the camera up and try to quantify it, but yes, and I think you are 100% right with the cause. When the camera first starts up, images are grainy until the NUC takes place, then they rapidly become grainy again until after several NUC's. I believe this is due to the micro bolometer warming up to achieve temperature stability. It is certainly a lot worse if the camera is cold (I transport it in the cabin of the car now, rather than the boot!).
Along with this grainy effect is the slight thermal distortion that you described, although I would have said it was more widespread around the edge of the image than you suggested. It seems to improve when the camera has reached thermal stability, BUT I still feel it is noticeable when the temperature span is tight (2-4 C), where the settings clearly amplify the effect somewhat. What is your main application?
I love this camera - the image and build quality are SO good, even in comparison with a lot of the modern models.
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Thanks Aurora for the detailed pictures of your camera!
WOW, that thing is BUILT and PACKED with electronics! No wonder they are pricey! Of course, firmware and the name adds to the price also...
In picture 4160 (I assume that is the bolometer?), is that a vacuum seal nib I see at the bottom?
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#41 Reply
Posted by
Fraser
on 28 Feb, 2014 20:11
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@pomonabill221,
Sorry for the poor resolution that I have had to use. I am a little nervous of releasing ITAR covered technology internal images on the NET !
The item with the vacuum nipple is the fluorescent backlight for the EVF LCD.
If you would like to see pictures of the microbolometer board, I posted some decent resolution images here:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/flir-e4-thermal-imaging-camera-review/msg307483/#msg307483The pictures of the microbolometer are from one of my PM570's but this is similar to the PM695.
The Generation 3 microbolometer in the 695 is traditional in that it is mounted on a thermoelectric (Peltier) element inside a vacuum chamber that is gold plated
The microbolometer and optics are large to provide decent sensitivity. The vacuum nipple is visible in the pictures. I believe teh microbolometer and large diamond turned Germanium optics were a significant cost on the BoM.
In the pictures I have shown only the CPU Board. Its pretty high density for the year it was built but easily worked on with the correct tools. It is a combination of MC68340 CPU and several Altera FPA's.
There is a pretty complex power supply PCB that sits on top of the CPU board and a video processing PCB that is as large as the CPU board and has its own CPU , Video RAM and and three huge 340 pin Altera FPA's !
The E4 is an example of the VLSI that has reduced the component count in modern TIC's. It is interesting that the modern FLIR industrial TIC's are still built in a metal shell with several PCB's and lots of chips ! Industrial and consumer TICs are two separate divisions inside FLIR.
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#42 Reply
Posted by
Chanc3
on 07 Mar, 2014 13:47
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Right, looks like the motor in the shutter has gone so you have to hold it upside down and "tap" it to then release it. Essentially it is autocalibrating it, but one you hear the initial click as the shutter goes down, it then won't go back up unless you hold it upside down and tap it.
Any idea how to fix it? have you come across this sort of problem before Aurora?
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#43 Reply
Posted by
Fraser
on 07 Mar, 2014 13:59
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The NUC shutter is solenoid driven and not a motor and so very simple in terms of operation and reliability. There should be a return spring on the bell crank to pull the NUC out of the way when the solenoid is de-energised. Take a look at the pictures I referenced earlier of a PM570 microbolometer. You should see all the springs etc. The bell-crank spindle may be stiff for some reason, worth checking the pivot points and also the solenoid armature for ease of movement. Fortunately this is likely to be a simple mechanical issue rather than electronic.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/flir-e4-thermal-imaging-camera-review/msg307483/#msg307483
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#44 Reply
Posted by
Fraser
on 07 Mar, 2014 14:12
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Just had a horrible thought ! ........
Is your camera providing a focussed image ? I ask becuase when these cameras are dropped it is possible for the focus lens to be dislodged from its mounting ring and it will then end up either floating around inside teh camera or can cause jamming of the NUC shutter. Also check that the focus lens retaining ring is not moving too far forward causing contact with the NUC shutter.
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#45 Reply
Posted by
Chanc3
on 07 Mar, 2014 14:15
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Everything seems to work - including focusing etc, other than when it NUCs. Oh, we cannot seem to change the span/level as it just keeps resetting back to around 20,39.
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#46 Reply
Posted by
Fraser
on 07 Mar, 2014 14:31
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Chanc 3,
Forgive the potentially insulting question but are you sure your camera is not set to auto span & center in the menu options ?
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#47 Reply
Posted by
Chanc3
on 07 Mar, 2014 14:38
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Haha, no offence taken! I asked the same question when my colleague brought it back into the office. I have checked, and even set it manually using our RS232 connection, but alas it keeps reseting back to those values - so I'm thinking it's something to do with the NUCing
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#48 Reply
Posted by
Chanc3
on 10 Mar, 2014 16:41
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Thanks to Aurora for his guide he wrote I have successfully fixed our PM695!
See if you can spot what is missing:
Damn spring had pinged off! Also turned out auto adjust was on, so flicked that to manual and it's all good again!
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#49 Reply
Posted by
Fraser
on 10 Mar, 2014 16:51
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The joys of mechanical faults
If you had sent the camera back to FLIR, they operate a fixed price repair service so that little spring would still have been a very expensive repair. Well done for doing it yourself....you just saved a lot of money
If its not your personal camera, let your Boss know that he owes you a favour
You were also quite lucky that the spring did not find its way accross anything important on the video processing PCB (at the botton of camera case) or anywhere else where it could have caused mischief.
Fraser