Author Topic: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station  (Read 107207 times)

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Offline EEVblog

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EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« on: October 31, 2013, 10:17:05 pm »
Review, teardown, and testing of the Rhino Tools ZD985 desoldering station on typical through-hole double sided and multi layer PCBs.
http://www.rhinotools.com.au/vacuum-desoldering-station/152-rt985-vacuum-desoldering-station.html
http://www.china-zhongdi.com/2013/?p=121

« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 01:52:05 am by EEVblog »
 

Offline dunkemhigh

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #1 on: October 31, 2013, 11:44:05 pm »
This seems to be a rebadged Duratool D00672:

http://cpc.farnell.com/duratool/d00672/desoldering-station/dp/SD01384

'Course, that might well be a badged something else...
 

Offline sprocket

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #2 on: October 31, 2013, 11:49:09 pm »
Yarrr. First  O0

I have one like yours, just in a different inclosure.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Duratool-D00672-Desoldering-Station-80W-De-Soldering-ZD-915-Faults-R2GK-/370670619489?pt=UK_Home_Garden_PowerTools_SM&hash=item564db0cb61

I very satisfied with mine.. Obviously it's not lab or factory grade desoldering station, but considering that, then it's one of my best bang for buck tools that I have.

I just hate those manual pumps, and solder wick is fine for a just desoldering a a couple of resistors. But anything more then a couple of resistors needing to be removed I tunr on my Duratool desoldring station.. Saved me soo much hassel and time in the past 6 months that I had it.. Should have bought one ages ago.  Cheap as donuts too. 80 punds or so I think it costed.

Cheers


Edit: Crap.. second I guess  :-DD
« Last Edit: October 31, 2013, 11:51:54 pm by sprocket »
 

Offline baljemmett

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2013, 12:09:26 am »
This seems to be a rebadged Duratool D00672:

'Course, that might well be a badged something else...

Yes - the ZD in the Rhino model number suggests the ODM is Zhongdi, who do a lot of this sort of kit.  Their website proved rather harder to find than I remembered, but this appears to be the same machine in its natural habitat.
 

Offline N2IXK

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2013, 12:23:41 am »
You might get even better results on those motherboard caps if you had used a tip better matched to the work.

You really want to use a tip with a hole just larger than the component lead. This gives the maximum amount of heat transfer from the tip into the pad and lead. You shouldn't be able to wiggle around nearly as much as you were.

Glad to see that the suction was sufficient. The unit I use at work (Metcal) uses a venturi tube to develop vacuum from compressed air, so no worries about pump failure. But the consumables (especially tips) are a LOT more expensive.

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Offline sprocket

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #5 on: November 01, 2013, 12:44:35 am »
Dave, why didn't you buy the Hakko 808 kit?


I think he admitted to being a cheap arse.  :P And so am I.. why on earth spend 4 times the money for some thing when the "cheapy" will do fine for the task at hand. I doubt it will be turned on 8 hours a day 7 days a week. Mine certainly isnt.
 

Offline JOERGG

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2013, 12:49:37 am »
Ningbo Zhongdi Electronic Tools Company Ltd is the manufacturer.

http://www.soldering-tool.com/3-desoldering-station.html

I bought the ZD-915 for only 64,95 € at Amazon in July this year, but it is not available at the moment.

http://www.amazon.de/Digitale-professionelle-Entl%C3%B6tstation-ZD-915-Vakuumpumpe/dp/B005CHA7IG

I am satisfied with the produkt for the price.

To open the connector you was on the right way by opening the cord grip. Then you unsrew the screw in the front that holds the black plastic insert in place. Turn then the insert counterclockwise and pull it out. After that you should be able to pull the metal body down the cord. It is a microphone connector as they use them for ham radio mics for example.
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Offline dunkemhigh

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #7 on: November 01, 2013, 01:03:33 am »
'Course, that might well be a badged something else...

but this appears to be the same machine in its natural habitat.

Looks a lot better there, I have to say. That Duratool corporate look could turn out to be a bit of a millstone.
 

Offline Excavatoree

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #8 on: November 01, 2013, 01:34:10 am »
I'm watching the review now, so I'm not sure if I will be upset, and, if so how much.  I finally bit the bullet and bought a Hakko 472 (with 817 gun) for a bit over 500, I think.

I had been using a Weller that was a piece of crap.  I got tired of fighting it.  My dad got it for me, used.   It gives me the impression it was a piece of crap even when new.  Tips were difficult to find, and spare parts were getting difficult or impossible to find.

When I worked at the repair shop, I used something called the "solder gobbler" that didn't have a pump - it was just an iron with a venturi that you connected to a shop air compressor.  That think worked well and was less trouble than the Wellers that the boss and senior tech used.  I'd still use one (they are available on E-bay) but I didn't want to run an air line and keep my compressor on, especially for an iron with no temp control.  The Wellers were also models the used shop air - they worked better than those with the tiny vacuum pumps.

As a poor kid, I'd strip every old board I could get my hands on.  I still have many of those parts.

The Hakko 472 is larger, and "older" looking.  (not modern, no LCD, just LED for temp) The Gun holder is a lot better.  It works well and seems as if it will hold up well.  (no sponge holder, however.) It can be mounted on either side. 

The tube on the ZD985 looks as if it's interchangeable with the Hakko -it looks like the same spring, same filter, looks to be the same size tube, etc.  I bet the whole thing and the parts are interchangeable.  I find that one can use a cheap, hot air gun to drop the solder out of the spring to re-use.

The gun looks like it even takes the same tips as the similar Hakko 817.

The pump sounds the same.  I'm guessing they are at least similar.

I'm tempted to buy a second gun for a different tip, so I don't have to keep switching.

After watching, I'd say I would have put up with  the few problems Dave had for the 300 dollar savings, but, I don't think I regret the Hakko - it's very nice, but that's comparing it with the Weller.  Anyway, it's too late now. If I had, I may have said "I should have spent the money on the Hakko." 
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #9 on: November 01, 2013, 01:46:04 am »
Dave, why didn't you buy the Hakko 808 kit?

I said that, it's something like $600 in Australia. Yes, I can import 110V and use a transformer, but I hate using those.
Plus I prefer the light weight head without the pump.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 01:47:55 am by EEVblog »
 

Offline deisenberg

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #10 on: November 01, 2013, 01:47:15 am »
Can't find this unit on ebay for Canada. Perfect price for how often I would use it.
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #11 on: November 01, 2013, 01:49:13 am »
The tube on the ZD985 looks as if it's interchangeable with the Hakko -it looks like the same spring, same filter, looks to be the same size tube, etc.  I bet the whole thing and the parts are interchangeable.  I find that one can use a cheap, hot air gun to drop the solder out of the spring to re-use.
The gun looks like it even takes the same tips as the similar Hakko 817.

That would be very interesting  to know.
 

Offline mamalala

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #12 on: November 01, 2013, 02:05:53 am »
And what was the real temperature at the nozzle compared to the setting? Did they use magic solder that changes the melting point depending on where it is?

Sure it is a cheap unit, but from the times you have given, i'd say it's really crap as well.

Greetings,

Chris
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #13 on: November 01, 2013, 02:11:32 am »
And what was the real temperature at the nozzle compared to the setting? Did they use magic solder that changes the melting point depending on where it is?
Sure it is a cheap unit, but from the times you have given, i'd say it's really crap as well.

Huh? I don't understand what you are getting at here.
What times?
Actual tip temperature is a complex issue, and depends on a whole range of factors. Every soldering tool tip temperature will drop when placed on a large thermal mass component. Fact this this iron has more than adequate thermal performance for the job, it is not crap in that department.
 

Offline opticpow

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #14 on: November 01, 2013, 02:29:05 am »
I've had one of these from Rhino for about 12 months now, and it does the job. I'm a hobbyist that can't justify keeping a large collection of new parts on hand, so I keep a supply of old boards around. If I can't find something in my parts bin, I can usually get it off a board.  I'm sure I've recovered the cost of the tool just in component savings!
 

Offline mamalala

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #15 on: November 01, 2013, 02:31:50 am »
And what was the real temperature at the nozzle compared to the setting? Did they use magic solder that changes the melting point depending on where it is?
Sure it is a cheap unit, but from the times you have given, i'd say it's really crap as well.

Huh? I don't understand what you are getting at here.
What times?
Actual tip temperature is a complex issue, and depends on a whole range of factors. Every soldering tool tip temperature will drop when placed on a large thermal mass component. Fact this this iron has more than adequate thermal performance for the job, it is not crap in that department.

Once you set the tip to the joint, you get a drop in temperature. To get all the solder into a liquid state you can either drop a lot of "stored" temp into the joint, or have the joint kept a set temp. The former means you have to initially use a much higer temp then needed, because the tip cools down, to cover for the thermal losses. The latter means you have to have a very tight control loop. Seeing the warm-up time of that thing, i may use it for cooking eggs, but that's it.

In other words: The solder at some joint needs 217°C to melt. But it also has a connection to a big power/GND plane. What you put the gun at is "just a pad" in a multilayer board. However, the restring you are placing tha actual nozzle over is way smaller (thermally speaking) then the rest. Now you can either dump 320+ °C (which is over 100°C of the melting point already) into it, to get all the solder melting before the tip cools down too much, or you can have a tip that maintains a temp above the melting point of solder, no matter what the load.

Heck, you have a JBC already, you should know that thermal capacity is not only what the actial tip can store, but what the whole system can deliver on demand. Imagine you have a small pad on one side, connected to a GND plane in one of the inner layers, finishing at a small pad on the other side of the PCB. You may very well put way too much heat into the pad on the desoldering side to get it all melted. At which point it is basically delaminated from the PCB.

Greetings,

Chris

Edit: I used 217!C as an example because that is what the Stannol TSC KS100 lead-free solder i use melts at.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 02:36:36 am by mamalala »
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #16 on: November 01, 2013, 02:37:56 am »
Heck, you have a JBC already, you should know that thermal capacity is not only what the actial tip can store, but what the whole system can deliver on demand.

Of course I know that.
But when it comes to the Rhino in question, I'm claiming (and have demonstrated) it has adequate thermal capacity for the job. IMO (without doing actual side-by-side controlled experiments) equivalent to the Hakko and Pace desoldering tools I have used.
Not industry leading performance to be sure, but probably adequate for most jobs.
You can't use the slow power-on ramp up time as an indicator which is seems to be what you are getting at, and is could be ramping up slowly deliberately. Indeed, if it was a true indicator of thermal performance, then it shouldn't have worked at all for a lot of the repeated joint applications I tried with it. But it does work, and the thermal performance seems pretty good. So I think you are wrong by claiming it is crap without having tried it.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 02:42:02 am by EEVblog »
 

Offline mamalala

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #17 on: November 01, 2013, 02:51:21 am »
Heck, you have a JBC already, you should know that thermal capacity is not only what the actial tip can store, but what the whole system can deliver on demand.

Of course I know that.
But when it comes to the Rhino in question, I'm claiming (and have demonstrated) it has adequate thermal capacity for the job. IMO (without doing actual side-by-side controlled experiments) equivalent to the Hakko and Pace desoldering tools I have used.
Not industry leading performance to be sure, but probably adequate for most jobs.

Sure, and i never questioned that. What i was inquiring is what temp it initially dumps into a small joint. At one place you yourself had to crank up the temp to a ridiculous setting, compared to what solder actually melts at, to get stuff done. And that temp simply is a risk to to the copper cladding/lamination stuff, not to mention the part itself. No need to wiggle around much to get a pad delaminated at those temps. You even suspected you had done so at one place. With a proper tool you would not have had that suspicion.

My thinking is that this is quite important to hobbyists who want to re-use parts. "Did i desolder it correctly?" "Why does my thing not work?" Parts _can_ get damaged due to overtemp. And the hobbyist is left chasing some ghosts just because the way (s)he desoldered it has actually damaged it.

Getting a blob of solder to melt is easy. A red hot glowing piece of metal can do that just nice, even on 12 layer boards. Getting those parts out in a way that the actual board (or the part) can be used again, that is a different matter.

Greetings,

Chris
 

Offline Rasz

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #18 on: November 01, 2013, 04:47:48 am »
Oh Dave, you believed Chinese LCD temperature readout :DDDDDDDDDDDD
now take a thermocouple and check again temp drop when you start to suck. Chinese thermostats almost never show real temperature, even if you have separate set and read displays. They usually show real value until it reaches ~10'C around set state, then some magic happens and you end up with the most stable pid in the world :). Its that whole 'better lie than say something unpleasant' east mentality.

AU price is painful, zd-915 is $75 in Poland.

Btw thermal capacity didnt impress, needing to bump temperature to desolder from motherboard pcb means software inside is total shit and couldnt compensate for temp drop at the tip


watching you work it made me come up with an invention - Vibration motor mounted at the tip! :D
« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 04:52:35 am by Rasz »
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Offline jeremy

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #19 on: November 01, 2013, 07:07:35 am »
I'm looking for a decent desoldering gun (hakko, pace, metcal, weller, etc) that doesn't need shop air for around the $600-800 mark. I'm in australia, so most prices are a complete ripoff (>$1000). Any suggestions? The hakkos on tequipment look nice, but they are 110V only :(
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #20 on: November 01, 2013, 09:31:29 am »
Sure, and i never questioned that. What i was inquiring is what temp it initially dumps into a small joint. At one place you yourself had to crank up the temp to a ridiculous setting, compared to what solder actually melts at, to get stuff done.

Ridiculous temperature?  :-//
I upped it to 350C, or IIRC 380C at one point.
FYI 370C (700F) has been the standard supplied fixed tip temperature on Weller and other fixed temp irons since the dawn of time, and is the recommended temp for "normal" applications by many manufacturers. 600F (315C) is recommend for "sensitive stuff". So if my 350C/380C is "ridiculous" then the entire industry has been doing it wrong for many decades.
Better designed high capacity irons manufactures like Metcal for example recommend 600F (315C) for "normal" work and 700F (370C) for ground planes and other heavier work, almost precisely what I used for this non-high capacity iron (which technically should be higher than a metcal). Do you think Metcal is wrong in their recommendations?, let alone wrong for a lesser thermal capacity iron?
400C would have started to get a bit on the "ridiculous" side perhaps, but certainly not 350C or even 380C.
60/40 solder melts at 190C, good luck trying to solder anything at 200C, or even 250C in many cases.

« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 09:45:21 am by EEVblog »
 

Offline AmmoJammo

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #21 on: November 01, 2013, 09:35:37 am »
Ridiculous temperature?  :-//
I upped it to 350C, or IIRC 380C at one point.
FYI 370C (700F) has been the standard supplied fixed tip temperature on Weller and other fixed temp irons since the dawn of time, and is the recommended temp for "normal" applications by many manufacturers. 600F (315C) is recommend for "sensitive stuff". So if my 350C/380C is "ridiculous" then the entire industry has been doing it wrong for many decades.
400C would have started to get a bit "ridiculous", but certainly not 350C or even 380C.
60/40 solder melts at 190C, good luck trying to solder anything at 200C, or even 250C in many cases.

I run my iron at 400 degrees daily.... for anywhere upto 8 hours a day... I do electronics assembly for a living! :p

I wouldn't even consider 400 degrees to be "ridiculous" its efficient! you can get the heat into the board and component leg quicker, meaning you spend less time heating it, and often actually get less heat into the rest of the component! ;)
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #22 on: November 01, 2013, 09:36:50 am »
Btw thermal capacity didnt impress, needing to bump temperature to desolder from motherboard pcb means software inside is total shit and couldnt compensate for temp drop at the tip

The Hakko's are no better IME.
BTW, I probably didn't need to increase the tip temp, it might have been better with a more optimised tip size , or applying more solder first, or simply leaving it a bit longer at the lower temp.
There is a lot to optimise when it comes to desoldering temps.
 

Offline dr_p

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #23 on: November 01, 2013, 10:04:30 am »
 

Offline Ericho

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #24 on: November 01, 2013, 10:11:57 am »
Quote
The Hakko's are no better IME.

I agree used them before

I also have a auoye 474 at home, a 70w analog older device, it works as good and as slow as the ZD985.

A large part is technique anyway. no matter is you own $100 or $1000 good working one. If you don't get it the first time you could waste a lot of time on that pin.

The holder and case of my 474 seems a bit better build than the ZD985
 
 

Offline FrankBuss

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #25 on: November 01, 2013, 10:24:58 am »
I bought the ZD-987 here in Germany for EUR 150 (AUD 218). Looks like it is the same as the ZD-985, but with an additional soldering iron. I don't need the soldering part, because I have an Ersa i-CON, but the shop had just this combined station and was not that expensive. And always good to have some backup.

The desoldering capability is really nice. Was easy to desolder a 64 pin DIP from an old C64 board, and both the board and the chip survived it.
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Offline Kjelt

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #26 on: November 01, 2013, 10:26:35 am »
That seems to work better then my oldschool Weller, although I pimped that one with an external vacuum pump to reach -0.9 bar  8)

Anyway I am surprised to see it works so quick and clean without any pre-work, I usually first refresh the solder with new lead based solder before any attempt of desoldering, am I the only one doing that?  :-\
 

Offline FrankBuss

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #27 on: November 01, 2013, 10:45:28 am »
Anyway I am surprised to see it works so quick and clean without any pre-work, I usually first refresh the solder with new lead based solder before any attempt of desoldering, am I the only one doing that?  :-\
I do this, too, for old electronics, because the old solder doesn't flow that good anymore. But the boards in Dave's video looked just a few years old, which apparently don't need pre-work. And looks like Dave really enjoyed using it. Reminds me when I was a kid, happily salvaging carbon resistors and transistors with a cheap soldering iron from old TVs :)
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Offline Kjelt

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #28 on: November 01, 2013, 10:53:24 am »
Yup Dave is very enthousiastic  :-+ .
A few years ago I was afraid that electronics as a hobby due to the extreme small components and high learning curve was dying out (just as stamp collectors), Dave is making sure it stays around for some years to come  :-+

On topic: if I desolder very small through holes the solder from the other side just does not come through, I sometimes think at that moment it would be nice to revert from vacuum to hot airpressure to blow the solder out of the hole on the other side, bit messy but as long as the hole is clean the job is done. Anyone seen any of that sort of equipment?
 

Offline alanb

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #29 on: November 01, 2013, 11:19:00 am »
The ZD-915 is available in the UK from Amazon at £84.99. The difference appears to be the way the holder is attached to the case and no sponge.
 

Offline dunkemhigh

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #30 on: November 01, 2013, 12:22:56 pm »
... to blow the solder out of the hole on the other side, bit messy but as long as the hole is clean the job is done. Anyone seen any of that sort of equipment?

Denon SC-7000 should do this - flick of a switch changes it from such to blow, so you can use it to rework SMT stuff as well as remove PTH parts.

http://www.denondic.co.jp/en/doc_sc7000z.php
 

Offline greatal

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #31 on: November 01, 2013, 12:54:56 pm »
Hi all
I do make my own disordering station under 15$(10$ for pump and tubing and under 5$ for iron) from a dual aquarium air pump manipulate to do both suction and blow by connecting dual output to one T junction connection and airtight all pump so it sock air from another hole by attach it to hand pump decoder iron with 65w I think so and it work great almost as good as Dave's there is a picture of it, it is not mine disordering station but just the same solution but with smaller pump than mine.
http://www.instructables.com/id/Hot-air-soldering-gun-from-a-desoldering-iron-with/
 

Offline RRobot

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #32 on: November 01, 2013, 01:03:25 pm »
And what was the real temperature at the nozzle compared to the setting? Did they use magic solder that changes the melting point depending on where it is?
Sure it is a cheap unit, but from the times you have given, i'd say it's really crap as well.

Huh? I don't understand what you are getting at here.
What times?
Actual tip temperature is a complex issue, and depends on a whole range of factors. Every soldering tool tip temperature will drop when placed on a large thermal mass component. Fact this this iron has more than adequate thermal performance for the job, it is not crap in that department.

For tool tip temperatures, I'm probably going to order a HAKKO FG-100 for 15 bucks off of ebay (I'm guessing its most likely a knock off). Also I've got a Hakko 808 and while its worked great for the last 10 years, the temperature adjustment is not nearly as versatile as the ZD985.
 

Offline arekm

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #33 on: November 01, 2013, 01:11:31 pm »
Does any competition that's worth considering exist in the same price range as ZD985?
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Offline nmmbeginer

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #34 on: November 01, 2013, 01:58:02 pm »
This looks nice. right now im desoldering every thin with a soldering iron and desoldering braid.
 

Offline Winston

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #35 on: November 01, 2013, 02:19:19 pm »
The moment you said that such things were virtually guaranteed to work out of the box, I suspected you might be jinxing it.
 

Offline synapsis

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #36 on: November 01, 2013, 02:47:06 pm »
I sometimes think at that moment it would be nice to revert from vacuum to hot airpressure to blow the solder out of the hole on the other side, bit messy but as long as the hole is clean the job is done. Anyone seen any of that sort of equipment?

For this sort of thing I heat up the joint and then hit it with a short squirt of canned air. It blows the solder out of the joint and (most) of the time the solder cools before it hits something. I put an old heatsink up to catch the solder on big joints. Of course you have to be careful when shooting molten metal around. Aim down and away.

My Aoyue desoldering station doesn't give me near the same quality cleaned joints as Dave's station. I need to practice on some old boards again.
 

Offline mos6502

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #37 on: November 01, 2013, 03:49:39 pm »
Looks like it works really well. Unfortunately, I can't find one in Europe (or anywhere). The ZD-915 apparently used to be available, but is sold out everywhere.

Anyone know how the Aoyue 474 compares to this?
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Offline Rufus

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #38 on: November 01, 2013, 03:52:59 pm »
Was a pretty friendly board for desoldering. Clean (oxide free) solder, large holes, straight pins.

I would have liked to see:-

The tip temperature measured.

Considering the slow warm up power measurement (on the mains would give enough of a clue) to see if it really is 80W.

Scope the voltage on the not grounded tip.
 

Offline mos6502

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #39 on: November 01, 2013, 03:55:07 pm »
The ZD-915 is available in the UK from Amazon at £84.99. The difference appears to be the way the holder is attached to the case and no sponge.

No, it's not. Only the gun is available.

That price would be really bad, too. For the same price you can get the ZD-917, which includes a 60W soldering iron:

http://www.octamex.de/shop/?page=shop/flypage&product_id=1445
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Offline mos6502

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #40 on: November 01, 2013, 04:02:03 pm »
My Aoyue desoldering station doesn't give me near the same quality cleaned joints as Dave's station. I need to practice on some old boards again.

I've read some Amazon reviews on the Aoyue, and it seems unlike the ZD's, the Aoyue tips aren't tinned. Meaning they're inert to the solder. Is that true? If so, that'd be bad, you wouldn't get a good thermal contact with that.
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Offline grumpydoc

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #41 on: November 01, 2013, 05:13:09 pm »
The ZD-915 is available in the UK from Amazon at £84.99. The difference appears to be the way the holder is attached to the case and no sponge.

No, it's not. Only the gun is available.

That price would be really bad, too. For the same price you can get the ZD-917, which includes a 60W soldering iron:

http://www.octamex.de/shop/?page=shop/flypage&product_id=1445
Somewhat cheaper at CPC http://cpc.farnell.com/duratool/d00672/desoldering-station/dp/SD0138403?Ntt=SD0138403

I have the Duratool badged one and while it's been very useful it does have a few issues.

The vacuum line was kinked in the pistol grip when I bought it so no suction - it didn't reset itself though like Dave's.

I find the effectiveness varies quite a bit with tip diameter which has to be matched fairly closely to what you're trying to desolder, too large a tip and it doesn't work so well. This is fine except the tips seem to wear out fairly readily. Not a big deal as they're only a quid and a half each but you have to let the iron cool down completely before changing them.

It doesn't, as Dave discovered, do multi-layer boards all that well.

 

Offline mos6502

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #42 on: November 01, 2013, 05:29:36 pm »
I find the effectiveness varies quite a bit with tip diameter which has to be matched fairly closely to what you're trying to desolder, too large a tip and it doesn't work so well. This is fine except the tips seem to wear out fairly readily. Not a big deal as they're only a quid and a half each but you have to let the iron cool down completely before changing them.

I guess I could live with that. Are you saying the tips get eaten away by the solder like cheap soldering iron tips? Any guess on how many hours a tip might last?

It doesn't, as Dave discovered, do multi-layer boards all that well.

What temperature do you use? When I do it with the soldering station and the manual pump, I crank the temp up to 450C on stubborn PCBs. I find it's actually easier on the board to do it hot and quick instead of slow-frying it at a lower temp.
for(;;);
 

Offline grumpydoc

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #43 on: November 01, 2013, 05:43:08 pm »
Quote
I guess I could live with that. Are you saying the tips get eaten away by the solder like cheap soldering iron tips? Any guess on how many hours a tip might last?
Partly but also because wiggling the leads wears the inside of the tip - probably at some point you do wear through any plating and, assuming the tip is copper, it will start to dissolve in the solder.

Quote
What temperature do you use? When I do it with the soldering station and the manual pump, I crank the temp up to 450C on stubborn PCBs. I find it's actually easier on the board to do it hot and quick instead of slow-frying it at a lower temp.
350oC for most jobs, probably would benefit from going a bit higher but I find it becomes easier to lift pads and/or mark the board - probably need to practice a bit more on that one.
 

Offline mos6502

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #44 on: November 01, 2013, 06:07:29 pm »
Thanks for the info. I think I'll wait for them to show up on eBay again. The last price was 56 Euros.

There's also the Hakko 808 that you can get fairly cheaply from the US. Now that's a quality tool, and completely self contained. But it needs a step down transformer in 230V countries.

for(;;);
 

Offline Ericho

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #45 on: November 01, 2013, 06:16:35 pm »
Quote
I've read some Amazon reviews on the Aoyue, and it seems unlike the ZD's, the Aoyue tips aren't tinned. Meaning they're inert to the solder. Is that true? If so, that'd be bad, you wouldn't get a good thermal contact with that.

Yes its true, I have no problem with that, works just fine. I do have a bit of fresh solder in my other hand to add if the pcb is realy old and corroded or with battery acid damadged pcb's

I have like a 1.5mm nozle on there permanently, they last a long time. Can't be bothered to change it all the time, temp controll is good enough.
 

Offline darko31

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #46 on: November 01, 2013, 09:07:53 pm »
I've once desoldered 20-pin molex connector from a motherboard with cheapo 8 bucks soldering iron (also ZD) and a crappy desoldering pump. The most grueling bloody job I've ever done, pretty much destroyed the donor board that didn't work anyway, and did even messier job at desoldering the old molex, wiggling it around, and soldering back the good one. Somehow everything survived, good thing it was a multilayer board, otherwise every pad would been lifted. It's still working happily in my friends PC.

If I had something like this, I would made my life a lot easier, nice test/review/teardown Dave, keep it up!  :-+
 

Offline Lagger

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #47 on: November 01, 2013, 09:19:35 pm »
Hi all

I own a similar model SSD-15 rebadged Lafayette it's around 70Euro on ebay ( i'm in italy ).
Work quite well, cheap plastic but worth it.

 

Offline grumpydoc

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #48 on: November 01, 2013, 09:25:56 pm »
Anyone know if you can use  the Aoyue tips in the ZD-915 - the actual heating element looks very similar.
 

Offline LaurenceW

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #49 on: November 01, 2013, 10:05:47 pm »
I've had a BlackJack (nope, me neither) BK6000 soldering station for a couple of years. It has a temp controlled soldering iron, hot air gun and desoldering tool, all in one. You can probably get a breadmaking attachment, too (not sure - haven't looked). It's OK, but has a couple of issues.

The desoldering gun looks identical to the ZD985, with the exception of the cream handle moulding (mine is black, and slightly differently shaped). The replacement desoldering tips include a thin hollow shaft, maybe 60mm long. This fits down through a hole in the heating element, and I guess is in part to transfer the heat to the tip. It also acts as the pipe through which the molten solder is drawn, into the spring-lined reservoir behind.  I find that this narrow tube is VERY prone to blocking. Looks like the end of the tube nearest the reservoir (furthest from the tip) runs cool, and the solder tend to solidify, there. GRR! Much poking with the wire tool (provided), and swearing (not provided). :--

It's still a useful tool, and MUCH better than a soldering-iron-and-bodge, for anything with two or more legs (which is most things...)
If you don't measure, you don't get.
 

Offline Rory

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #50 on: November 01, 2013, 10:54:41 pm »
Dave, I'm wondering if an aluminum or glass fiber screen disc flat against the first filter would make it last longer. I saw you peel away a layer of filter material when you cleaned it, certainly a screen would stop the solder from sticking to the filter material.
 

Offline AmmoJammo

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #51 on: November 01, 2013, 10:56:11 pm »
Dave, I'm wondering if an aluminum or glass fiber screen disc flat against the first filter would make it last longer. I saw you peel away a layer of filter material when you cleaned it, certainly a screen would stop the solder from sticking to the filter material.

Put a small bit of steel wool in the inside/end of the spring ;)

It will keep the filter cleaner, and make it easier to remove the cold solder from the spring, as it won't get stuck in the end.
 

Offline Rory

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #52 on: November 01, 2013, 11:20:17 pm »
Dave, I'm wondering if an aluminum or glass fiber screen disc flat against the first filter would make it last longer. I saw you peel away a layer of filter material when you cleaned it, certainly a screen would stop the solder from sticking to the filter material.

Put a small bit of steel wool in the inside/end of the spring ;)

It will keep the filter cleaner, and make it easier to remove the cold solder from the spring, as it won't get stuck in the end.

In our humid environment, steel wool decomposes rapidly and it's a real pain to deal with after it's been sitting idle a while. Maybe a piece of pink fiberglass batting would work as well? The object is to have readily available expendables instead of something you would have to order and wait for delivery.
 

Offline AmmoJammo

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #53 on: November 01, 2013, 11:36:29 pm »
Then use stainless steel wool ;)
 

Offline Fraser

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #54 on: November 01, 2013, 11:36:39 pm »
Dave,

I considered the unit that you have purchased but reports of poor quality gun quality put me off.

I bought a Hakko clone desoldering gun from Circuit Specialists CSI 474A). It performs very well and the gun feels solidly made. The solder tube is held securely in place with no air leaks. I mention this because I also managed to buy a bag of 20 (yes 20) complete new guns that came from the Duratool model (same gun as yours) sold by Farnell. The whole bag cost me GBP10  ;D

I intended to use the guns as spare parts for my 474A and also to make my own desoldering gun kits. The Duratool gun is very similar to the CSI unit but the quality of the CSI guns case is far higher with a better finish and fit of all parts. The plastic used for the case is a thermoset type with resistance to melting, much like high temperature glass reinforced plastic.

After I dismantled the Duratool guns I discovered a serious design flaw in them. The spring loaded mechanism that holds the solder collection tube in place is terrible and prone to failure. You can easily dismantle your gun without risk to it. Take a look at how the little spring release 'button' works. The moulding inside the gun case is inadequate and eventually fails completely. This is why The spare guns were scrapped by Farnell. It would be a good idea to check yours to see if it has been rectified. The small release button 'side wings' also snap off with use, preventing correct operation. From your video your gun appeared to have the same poor release 'action' as my 20 guns and you will find the release button very awkward to use. As this is a regular maintenance requirement, the release mechanism should be nice and easy with a smooth action. My Circuit Specialists unit has such a gun.

Like many cheap tools, they do work, but they can have very annoying issues...the gun on your unit is such an example. For the sake of some more careful design the gun could have been so much better.

My Circuit Specialists unit has a large and powerful pump and has served me well for around 2 years now. Web page and manual download is here:

http://www.circuitspecialists.com/csi474a.html

I have looked inside and it is well made. It looks to be from the Aoyue factory.

Excellent support from Circuit Specialists as well. Not bad for $94.50 !

Circuit Specialists Europe page is here:

http://www.circuitspecialists.eu/esd-safe-compact-desoldering-station-csi-474a

It costs GBP90 for us in the UK .... but I still think it value for money.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2013, 01:21:55 pm by Aurora »
 

Offline open loop

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #55 on: November 01, 2013, 11:56:20 pm »
I agree it looked like it was doing a great job... We  got a JBC de-soldering station a while ago at work and it is very nice. But really expensive.

http://www.jbctools.com/dis-premium-electrical-desoldering-station-product-93-category-2-menu-2.html

I think that how much you spend on a piece of kit is largely based on how often you use it, I use a very nice Logitech mouse at work as it is worth it. Same goes for a soldering Iron, you are going to be using it every day. I also think on what is really needed to get the required job done. I don't have a problem spending good money on hand toolset, it's amazing how many things I have worked on have been damaged because someone in the past did not think to spend the money on a decent screwdriver
May get one of these cheap de soldering stations to fix the batch of zx spectrum boards that I have, as I think it will be ok and it will also come in handy for future jobs.
 

Offline John Coloccia

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #56 on: November 02, 2013, 02:10:03 am »
Very timely post, Aurora.  Glad to hear that the CSI gun is a little higher quality than the Duratool.  I don't really much care about digital control for desoldering, but I do care about a hand piece that won't fall apart.  I've been looking for a cheap desoldering station, so this thread is perfectly timed.

I think I'll order one of these.

 

Offline orin

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #57 on: November 02, 2013, 03:16:02 am »
Just a couple of comments from my interpretation of Ted Smith's book, "Quality Hand Soldering and Circuit Board Repair". 

He suggests mounting the board vertically so you don't put excess pressure on the board and for through hole plated boards, so you can see if the solder has melted on the other side before applying the vacuum (yes, I know you often can't see the other side of the joint anyway).

He also says you should keep the vacuum on until after you remove the tool from the lead to allow (all of) the solder to reach the collection chamber.   You don't want it falling back, solidifying and clogging things up is my interpretation, but it would be less of a problem with the board vertical and gun horizontal.  Even so, giving it an extra half second or so isn't going to do any harm.

He prefers pencil type tools rather then the gun type - says they give better control.  I wish I could afford such a tool.  I have a Hakko 808 (about $180 US at the local Frys) which is heavy and I'd have to agree with that.  The pad survival rate desoldering components on my Fluke 731B was low.  (I suspect I could improve things by adding flux and new solder first.  Also, contamination from leaking NiCads may have weakened the bond between the pads and the board.  I got good practice putting in eyelets and repairing pads on this one.)

Orin.
 

Offline SgtRock

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #58 on: November 02, 2013, 03:29:57 am »
Greetings EEVBees:

--One advantage the Hakko 470 has over the Rhino ZD985 (Are there marsupial Rhinos?), is that it has a Vacuum Indicator. When you apply vacuum, the little round blue window in the 802 Hand-piece shows more and more red as the vacuum is increasingly obstructed, reminding you to clean everything. This has saved me time on more that one occasion when I thought I just had a troublesome joint. Have a look at the Ceramic Paper Filter. It has no bits of solder on it, as the Spring Filter, stops all of the solder. And even though it looks obstructed by the oxidized flux and dirt, the vacuum indicator (and performance) indicates no need to perform any cleaning yet. In this case, if a Hakko 470 Spring Filter, if it will fit would probably do a better job.

--Some of you have expressed interest in whether or not the pipe and/or components are interchangeable. I do not have a 985 to compare to, so I have posted below pictures of the components with dimensions and a picture from the parts list. If someone with a 985 would like to compare and let us know, that would be nice. If it turns out that the Ceramic Paper Filter will, or can be made to fit, and/or that the Spring Filter will fit, I would be glad to send Dave a few of each.

--In the case of plastic parts that might break off inside the Hand Piece, I would recommend seeing if they can be reinforced with epoxy. I often repair broken plastic parts by gluing them back together with a high quality Super Glue, and then reinforcing them with JB Weld. This has worked well for tubular screw hole projections, that have broken off, in TVs and Laptops. Never through those little pieces of plastic away in haste.

"In the first place, God made idiots. That was for practice. Then he made school boards."
Mark Twain (Samuel Langhorne Clemens ) 1835 - 1910

Best Regards
Clear Ether
 

Offline Fraser

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #59 on: November 02, 2013, 01:36:33 pm »
As an additional comment on the CSI offering....

It has an analogue temperature setting control and this works fine. I see little need for a super accurate (?) digital display when neither my unit nor the Duratool type even gave a temperature sensor at the tip !

The CSI gun is a VERY close copy/clone of the unit shown in SGTROCK's post. It has the same construction and the useful vacuum performance display to indicate when cleaning is needed.

I bought a complete spare gun from Circuit Specialists at a very reasonable price. Spares supply is excellent.

My ONLY complaint is that the desoldering tips do not seem to be designed to be tinned and older does not stick to it. Unusual but I have not found it to be a major issue.
 

Offline Excavatoree

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #60 on: November 02, 2013, 01:50:02 pm »
Thanks to SgtRock for the dimensioned pictures.

I thought I'd post a couple of inside photos.  I set my camera at the lowest resolution and most jpeg compression, but the files are still large.

This is the pump of the Hakko 472D.  It's difficult to see, but the pump assy chassis is mounted on rubber isolator mounts.

I've got more, but  I won't take up any more of Dave's drive space.  I need to did out my older camera for forum photos - it is lower resolution and will write smaller files.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2013, 02:53:35 pm by Excavatoree »
 

Offline Excavatoree

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #61 on: November 02, 2013, 01:51:36 pm »
This is the gun holder for the Hakko 472D with 817 desoldering gun. 

It can mount on either side.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2013, 12:27:21 am by Excavatoree »
 

Offline atw60444

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #62 on: November 02, 2013, 01:55:39 pm »
Thanks for the review Dave. After seeing it I went onto eBay and ordered a new reel of Servisol solder wick  :-DD
 

Offline SgtRock

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #63 on: November 02, 2013, 02:24:27 pm »
Dear Excavatoree:

--That is one beautiful piece of equipment. I notice that the Hand Piece Holder can be placed on either side. With regard to your picture size issue, I would recommend you try Irfan (see link below). It is a great program, and I use it as my default image program. You can re-size, re-sample crop, combine, change bmp to jpg etc. and almost anything you can think of, including capture the screen. I even got it to play a slide show of 5000 images at 20 images per second, unbelievable. The Panda thumbnail image program allows you to view thumbnails of images in files of what ever size you want, and moving images from file to file makes the Windows Image Handler look positively stupid. Included below is combined panoramic image, made from screen captures, which shows some of the thing you can do.

--P.S. Be sure to decline the Spam software that CNET will offer you when downloading Irfan.

http://www.irfanview.com/

"A thing of beauty is a joy for ever:
Its loveliness increases"
John Keats 1795 -1821

Best Regards
Clear Ether
 

Offline Molybdo42

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #64 on: November 02, 2013, 03:43:38 pm »
I have the Duratool version. It works great ! It has a metallic case and the iron tip is grounded.
 
@ SgtRock I measured the dimensions of the different parts, they almost have the same dimensions but I don't think that the plastic tube and spring filter would fit. Also my soldering gun has more pieces.

I have taken some pictures of the soldering tip, would be interesting to see if Hakko ones fit on that gun.

Up until now, the only inconvenient I can point out would be the oxidation of the metallic parts surrounding the heating element, because they are made of steel instead of stainless steel. I don't know if Hakko ones are better. Best thing would be to see whether or not the Hakko gun could fit the Duratool. I will try to identify the signals going to my soldering iron. For the moment I can only tell that apparently it works with 24V and the soldering gun has 6 wires, the earth seems separate and provided by the cable shielding.
 

Offline FredF

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #65 on: November 02, 2013, 05:58:21 pm »
Hi all,

First thank you Dave for your blog !!

We have Pace MBT 301 & MBT 350 at work and the desoldering pen doesn't work properly!! (iron is better but it is not Weller...)
Metals for nozzle & iron are cheap (oxidation issue). "start and stop" is an option for iron only.
The nozzle won't fit exactly in the heater. So the temperature is not the same on two extremity of the nozzle.
I think they did this because they are cool tin before it is stored. If not, in case of intensive use they could burn the user.
But now, as the nozzle is not at the same temperature everywhere, the nozzle becomes clogged very often and doesn't work properly!

For Weller WMD-1D & WD3000, I have many issue to clean the nozzle because the desoldering iron is curved.

For me the best is a gun (e.g. Hakko). Because the tin storage is not in your hand (don't burn your hand) and not curved (easy to clean).

For iron, the best choice is inductive iron with "start & stop" option. (I buy my Weller WD1M on ebay for 250€)

1 question : Do you know a desoldering gun with inductive heater and "start and stop" option !? (I have a dream...)

Best regards,
Fred
 

Offline Fraser

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #66 on: November 02, 2013, 08:13:00 pm »
For those wishing to see inside the Duratool and CSI guns, I have taken some pictures for you.

I will post the CSI here and the Duratool in a separate post, along with my comments.
 

Offline Fraser

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #67 on: November 02, 2013, 08:15:58 pm »
Now for the Duratool

My comments on the guns:

CSI

1. Solid feel with good quality plastics
2. Easy operation collection tube ejector
3. Vacuum indicator (simple but effective, using a small bellows)
4. Claimed, high performance heating element
5. Tips incorporate the whole heated metal suction tube for less blockages, easy change.
6. Closed loop temperature control using thermocouple in heater.
7. Brass screw thread inserts for all load bearing screws.

Duratool

1. Light and flimsy plastics
2. Difficult operation of the collection tube ejector
3. No vacuum indicator so the first you know of a blockage is poor performance.
4. Tips fit to the end of the combine heating element and suction tube. If blocked, heater is U/S.
5. defective design of collection tube release plastics.
6. Appears to have the capability for closed loop temperature control using thermocouple in heater.
7. Self tapping screws used throughout.


As you can see, I am not a fan of the Duratool gun.

The CSI has a tip that incorporates the suction tube and this is an advantage when it comes to blockages that are difficult to shift. Another tip can be quickly fitted. The blocked suction tube may be worked on outside of the gun. The Duratool would be out of service until the blockage is shifted or a new heater fitted.

The collection tube ejector mechanism is very poor indeed. The plastic parts that hold the release trigger in place are not msn enough for the job, resulting in twisting and stress on the thin trigger 'wings'. The top 'wing' fails and the trigger twists further causing a serious jam. The plastic trigger retainer is too thin at the rear and fails over time. This causes complete failure of the trigger release mechanism. In short....its a crap design when used wit the poor quality plastic of the  gun casing.

I have suffered no such issues with the CSI gun.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2013, 10:11:55 pm by Aurora »
 

Offline Fraser

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #68 on: November 02, 2013, 08:57:08 pm »
Now if you need the best....go for a Soldermaster 3 !

Its as likely to electrocute you as desolder a component   :scared:

240V mains electricity presented to the user via uncovered connector blocks  :o

Joking aside, the Soldermaster was an effective desoldering tool. It uses a quality Anderson pump and the user controls the vacuum on/off by covering and uncovering a vacuum port positioned behind the collection tube ! The vacuum pump runs whenever the hand-piece is removed from its rest.

The unit still works well. I bought it as a curio as much as anything. I will be moving it on to a new home soon as it will never see use with me.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2013, 09:01:05 pm by Aurora »
 

Offline LaurenceW

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #69 on: November 02, 2013, 11:17:31 pm »
For those playing along at home, I can now see that the CSI hardware is EXACTLY the same as the BlackJack (from Solderwerks).  The following comments are related to the CSI/Blackjack desolder tool:

The filter release mechanism has also jammed on me, refusing to move down far enough to release the filter. Fix - file a bit of the top of the red plastic moulding.

I find the vacuum indicator is USELESS - you can hear when the nozzle is blocked anyway - it stops hissing.

Unless the gun is run HOT, the central metal tube down the centre of the heating element (part of the tool tip in the CSI/Blackjack station) tends to block too easily and is a pain to clear.

Still, it's just made (reasonably) light work of removing six wire-ended 11 wire nixie tubes from a PCB, with no damage to the latter - phew.

The Blackjack soldering/desoldering stations can still be had for around £220 on eBay. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BK-6000-desoldering-rework-soldering-station-with-hot-air-gun-and-irons-UK-Co-/321180963337?pt=UK_Home_Garden_PowerTools_SM&hash=item4ac7e09209   I think if I was buying again, I'd push the boat out a little further (i.e. go upmarket).
If you don't measure, you don't get.
 

Offline Fraser

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #70 on: November 02, 2013, 11:22:16 pm »
Faulty Unit ?

No such problems with my gun or its spare and I have used it for two years.
 

Offline DL8RI

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #71 on: November 03, 2013, 11:28:50 am »
Hi,

For Weller WMD-1D & WD3000, I have many issue to clean the nozzle because the desoldering iron is curved.

For me the best is a gun (e.g. Hakko). Because the tin storage is not in your hand (don't burn your hand) and not curved (easy to clean).
I didn't really like the Hakko-Desoldering-Iron. It felt not very ergonomic without the grip and with the "Gun"-look it was not very precise to use.
BTW: Changing the Tip is REALLY stupid! You have a little plastic-tool but the whole thing is so hard to remove sometimes I threw the hot Tip on the bench because I had to use so much force. For proper cleaning you also have to remove the Tip and turn it by 90 degrees. And the solder gets always stuck in the latter part (there's a little pipe behind the heater), so you have to do this often.

Another issue I hated: Combined heater and Tip. Maybe it's faster, but ~40€ for a Tip (and you  have to have a collection for proper desoldering). I would have to invest ~150€ just for Tips, thanks but no!

As for the Weller, there are not-curved Irons too (DSXV80), but i like the curved one. It is less precise in use than the straight one, but quite comfortable. And the cleaning is not such a big issue, you have to put this needle once in a while into the nozzle, but that's just a matter of 3-4 seconds. And that issue I had with every Desoldering Iron including the Hakko.

The PACE (I think it was a MBT-350) ones I did like, but they have (at least the one I used) a fatal design flaw. There were "flying" wires going into the heating-element that broke after a few years due to heat and mechanical stress -> buy a new heater. The SMD-Tweezers were also troublesome, the rubber on the grip was not really heat-resistant. But the soldering-results were great. :)

From all stations I used, the Weller WMD 3 is (for me) the best. Only Issue are the small tips. For big desoldering-work (BNC-Plugs soldered at the case) it's a bit annoying (I have only a 50W-Unit, not the DSX80 :( ). In that case I use a WSP80 to give a little extra heat, and that iron has power :) There is one "extra-thick" Nozzle for higher thermal capacity, I will try that one.

From first impression (but never used it) the new ERSA-Units look pretty cool (i-Con Vario).
« Last Edit: November 03, 2013, 11:58:28 am by DL8RI »
 

Offline ErikTheNorwegian

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #72 on: November 03, 2013, 07:46:18 pm »
Dave,

I considered the unit that you have purchased but reports of poor quality gun quality put me off.

I bought a Hakko clone desoldering gun from Circuit Specialists CSI 474A). It performs very well and the gun feels solidly made. The solder tube is held securely in place with no air leaks. I mention this because I also managed to buy a bag of 20 (yes 20) complete new guns that came from the Duratool model (same gun as yours) sold by Farnell. The whole bag cost me GBP10  ;D

I intended to use the guns as spare parts for my 474A and also to make my own desoldering gun kits. The Duratool gun is very similar to the CSI unit but the quality of the CSI guns case is far higher with a better finish and fit of all parts. The plastic used for the case is a thermoset type with resistance to melting, much like high temperature glass reinforced plastic.

After I dismantled the Duratool guns I discovered a serious design flaw in them. The spring loaded mechanism that holds the solder collection tube in place is terrible and prone to failure. You can easily dismantle your gun without risk to it. Take a look at how the little spring release 'button' works. The moulding inside the gun case is inadequate and eventually fails completely. This is why The spare guns were scrapped by Farnell. It would be a good idea to check yours to see if it has been rectified. The small release button 'side wings' also snap off with use, preventing correct operation. From your video your gun appeared to have the same poor release 'action' as my 20 guns and you will find the release button very awkward to use. As this is a regular maintenance requirement, the release mechanism should be nice and easy with a smooth action. My Circuit Specialists unit has such a gun.

Like many cheap tools, they do work, but they can have very annoying issues...the gun on your unit is such an example. For the sake of some more careful design the gun could have been so much better.

My Circuit Specialists unit has a large and powerful pump and has served me well for around 2 years now. Web page and manual download is here:

http://www.circuitspecialists.com/csi474a.html

I have looked inside and it is well made. It looks to be from the Aoyue factory.

Excellent support from Circuit Specialists as well. Not bad for $94.50 !

Circuit Specialists Europe page is here:

http://www.circuitspecialists.eu/esd-safe-compact-desoldering-station-csi-474a

It costs GBP90 for us in the UK .... but I still think it value for money.

I also use a station from them, BK6000, and their Products, price and support is very good!
They have spare parts and deliver fast and to the right price.

http://www.circuitspecialists.eu/soldering?cat=49
 

Offline ErikTheNorwegian

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #73 on: November 03, 2013, 08:16:18 pm »
For those playing along at home, I can now see that the CSI hardware is EXACTLY the same as the BlackJack (from Solderwerks).  The following comments are related to the CSI/Blackjack desolder tool:

The filter release mechanism has also jammed on me, refusing to move down far enough to release the filter. Fix - file a bit of the top of the red plastic moulding.

I find the vacuum indicator is USELESS - you can hear when the nozzle is blocked anyway - it stops hissing.

Unless the gun is run HOT, the central metal tube down the centre of the heating element (part of the tool tip in the CSI/Blackjack station) tends to block too easily and is a pain to clear.

Still, it's just made (reasonably) light work of removing six wire-ended 11 wire nixie tubes from a PCB, with no damage to the latter - phew.

The Blackjack soldering/desoldering stations can still be had for around £220 on eBay. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BK-6000-desoldering-rework-soldering-station-with-hot-air-gun-and-irons-UK-Co-/321180963337?pt=UK_Home_Garden_PowerTools_SM&hash=item4ac7e09209   I think if I was buying again, I'd push the boat out a little further (i.e. go upmarket).

I have only good experience with the gun.. i do think there must be somthing wrong with your unit.. i would contact the dealer and presentded them the problem. Do you use the silicone grease and the tip cleaner som you can applay some grease on the cleaner and "prime" the tip  after cleaning , that way solder wount stick to the tip. Works very good for me.. :-)

Try the tips they got on their website, best practice using the desoldering..   :)
http://www.circuitspecialists.eu/blog/?p=36

« Last Edit: November 03, 2013, 09:07:46 pm by ErikTheNorwegian »
 

Offline M. András

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #74 on: November 03, 2013, 09:19:00 pm »
just a bit related, but anybody have a source for those vacuum pumps? which used in these stations?
 

Offline dunkemhigh

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #75 on: November 03, 2013, 11:01:06 pm »
a source for those vacuum pumps? which used in these stations?

Not those particular pumps, but this 12V one from Sparkfun can't be a million miles away:

https://www.sparkfun.com/products/10398

As they say, it sure does suck.
 

Offline Synergy Hub

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #76 on: November 04, 2013, 03:35:19 am »
Thank you Dave for the presentation AND for you folks commenting back.  We have been looking for a good desoldering station that fits our needs ( read simple to use and affordable ). As a Non-Profit budget is everything, and is ease of use since we teach all ages.  Now we have a much better ( and trusted ) view of what is out there from the comments in the thread.  Thank you ALL.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2013, 03:48:20 am by Synergy Hub »
 

Offline Synergy Hub

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #77 on: November 04, 2013, 04:07:41 am »
Sorry, having trouble following some references in the thread.   This Photo is of Which unit... we like the metal chassis and left / right tool mount...  is it a "Good Witch, or a Bad Witch" and where is it available from?
This is the gun holder. 
 

Offline Excavatoree

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #78 on: November 04, 2013, 02:56:24 pm »
Sorry, having trouble following some references in the thread.   This Photo is of Which unit... we like the metal chassis and left / right tool mount...  is it a "Good Witch, or a Bad Witch" and where is it available from?
This is the gun holder. 

Sorry, I didn't label the pictures.  (I've edited the posts)

That is my Hakko 472D with Hakko 817 desoldering gun.  There is a pencil type desoldering tool available as well.

The consensus seems to be that while the Hakko is a very nice unit, for a small penalty in quality, there is a large savings.  That is, there are tools that are a better value - cost difference is larger than the quality difference.
 

Offline M. András

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #79 on: November 04, 2013, 05:10:59 pm »
a source for those vacuum pumps? which used in these stations?

Not those particular pumps, but this 12V one from Sparkfun can't be a million miles away:

https://www.sparkfun.com/products/10398

As they say, it sure does suck.
yeah but 500hours max operation time its sucks too
 

Offline dunkemhigh

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #80 on: November 04, 2013, 06:53:29 pm »
$0.03 per hour running cost. Cheaper than solder :)
 

Offline djlorenz

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #81 on: November 04, 2013, 10:13:57 pm »
hi guys, hi Dave! thanks to you i'm going to ebay looking for a new soldering/desoldering station  :-DD

i was looking for an hot hair soldering/desoldering station but now i seen this...
so i wanna ask you, is easy to desolder also with hot air?

i found a complete station hot air + soldering iron + spare parts for about 80euros in germany.. free shipping...
any suggests? i don't want to spend money twice for two items :D

cheers
Lorenzo
 

Offline djlorenz

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #82 on: November 05, 2013, 08:43:12 am »
i was looking for an hot air soldering/desoldering station but now i seen this...
so i wanna ask you, is easy to desolder also with hot air?

What do you want to desolder? smt or through-hole?

usually TH, but i wanna have possibility to desolder smd... that's why i was thinking about hot air station...
 

Offline hammy

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #83 on: November 05, 2013, 11:47:41 am »
usually TH, but i wanna have possibility to desolder smd... that's why i was thinking about hot air station...

For smt hot-air and/or tweezer-type tools are very popular. It all depends about the type of smt you want to desolder.
For th the vacuum-station is a really good tool.
Important is the question: Do you want to desolder the components with minimal thermal stress to re-use it? Or is it only important to get the component removed?

For me it is not only one tool. Sometimes I only use my solder station and solder wick, sometimes the tweezer-tool ... for some bga chips I used a heat gun and aluminium foil ... it all depends.  :-//

hammy
« Last Edit: November 05, 2013, 11:50:19 am by hammy »
 

Offline djlorenz

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #84 on: November 05, 2013, 01:41:44 pm »
usually TH, but i wanna have possibility to desolder smd... that's why i was thinking about hot air station...

For smt hot-air and/or tweezer-type tools are very popular. It all depends about the type of smt you want to desolder.
For th the vacuum-station is a really good tool.
Important is the question: Do you want to desolder the components with minimal thermal stress to re-use it? Or is it only important to get the component removed?

For me it is not only one tool. Sometimes I only use my solder station and solder wick, sometimes the tweezer-tool ... for some bga chips I used a heat gun and aluminium foil ... it all depends.  :-//

hammy

i know, i'm a hobbist so i don't use them every day the same thing... i had a lot of problems deoldering some TH connectors, ICs from board for re-using them... or some items i need to change for fixing a device.... it depends...
i think i will start with hot air + standard solder tip station and try to desolder TH parts then if i need i will also buy the vacuum desolder station...
i wanna re-build my little lab and that's the occasion for spend some money :D

stupid question: can i also solder smd parts with hot air?
 

Offline hammy

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #85 on: November 05, 2013, 01:54:02 pm »
stupid question: can i also solder smd parts with hot air?

Yes.
Look at first this video from Dave:
http://www.eevblog.com/2011/07/18/eevblog-186-soldering-tutorial-part-3-surface-mount/
or this:
http://www.eevblog.com/2013/03/04/eevblog-434-smd-thermal-pad-drag-soldering-tutorial/

And then look this video, he use the hot-air station:
http://www.eevblog.com/2013/01/25/eevblog-415-smd-stencil-reflow-soldering-tutorial/

If you want to desolder through-hole stuff with a lot of pin's, like IC's and connectors, the best tool is the vacuum-station. Especially if you want to reuse them.

It is also necessary to get some practice. Make a dumpster dive and get some old boards. Desolder parts from it. Develop your skills.  :)

hammy
« Last Edit: November 05, 2013, 02:04:29 pm by hammy »
 

Offline djlorenz

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #86 on: November 05, 2013, 02:41:16 pm »
yep, that was a really stupid question, then i opened dave's channel and said... dammit, why i asked that?  :palm:

stupid question: can i also solder smd parts with hot air?

Yes.
Look at first this video from Dave:
http://www.eevblog.com/2011/07/18/eevblog-186-soldering-tutorial-part-3-surface-mount/
or this:
http://www.eevblog.com/2013/03/04/eevblog-434-smd-thermal-pad-drag-soldering-tutorial/

And then look this video, he use the hot-air station:
http://www.eevblog.com/2013/01/25/eevblog-415-smd-stencil-reflow-soldering-tutorial/

If you want to desolder through-hole stuff with a lot of pin's, like IC's and connectors, the best tool is the vacuum-station. Especially if you want to reuse them.

It is also necessary to get some practice. Make a dumpster dive and get some old boards. Desolder parts from it. Develop your skills.  :)

hammy
« Last Edit: November 05, 2013, 02:45:01 pm by djlorenz »
 

Offline poppniete

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #87 on: November 06, 2013, 09:56:53 pm »
Hi folks,

does anybody know what kind of thermal sensor is being used inside this Zhongdi desoldering gun? I couldn't find any information at all.

Regards,

Jan
 

Offline 99tito99

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #88 on: November 08, 2013, 05:47:14 am »
Just received my ZD985, $179.99 delivered from eBay seller memotronics_llc (http://www.memotronics.com).  Five day shipping from Houston, Texas, double boxed, very good.

Desoldered an UPS board similar to the one Dave did and it worked just as Dave showed.  No draaaama!

Differences between mine and what I saw on Dave's video:
1) All wires to the output plug are shrink-tubed, remembers Dave had a loose wire and it looked like no shrink tubing.
2) My solder collecting tube is clear (glass), Dave's was dark blue(?).
3) The spring in mine is an open coil, doesn't do much.  Dave's tight coil looks like a better design.
4) Color: Blue gun and case with white trim.

Copy of spare parts list attached.

Cheers, Mark
 

Offline poppniete

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #89 on: November 09, 2013, 09:13:25 am »
Hi folks,

does anybody know what kind of thermal sensor is being used inside this Zhongdi desoldering gun? I couldn't find any information at all.

Regards,

Jan

I did some measurements and it appers to be a K type thermocouple.

Regards,

Jan
 

Offline AndersAnd

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #90 on: November 11, 2013, 09:33:25 pm »
A couple of European webshops selling ZhongDi ZD-985

Evita (Lativa): 75.30 € (101 US$) http://www.evita.lt/en/det-1399631-desoldering-station-zd-985-80w-220v-480c.html

Panda (Bulgaria): 174.00 BGN (89 € | 119 US$) http://www.panda-bg.com/product.php?lang=en&code=321740
 

Offline AndersAnd

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #91 on: November 11, 2013, 10:37:36 pm »
The ZD-915 is available in the UK from Amazon at £84.99. The difference appears to be the way the holder is attached to the case and no sponge.

No, it's not. Only the gun is available.

That price would be really bad, too. For the same price you can get the ZD-917, which includes a 60W soldering iron:

http://www.octamex.de/shop/?page=shop/flypage&product_id=1445
Somewhat cheaper at CPC http://cpc.farnell.com/duratool/d00672/desoldering-station/dp/SD0138403?Ntt=SD0138403
Octamex only charges 57,50 € (48,14 £) incl. VAT for ZD-915 http://www.octamex.de/shop/?page=shop/flypage&product_id=1454&category_id=e321c44a79d30c8a3235116f2f4f6f25&/ZD-915_Digital_Entloetstation,_Entloetpumpe_kaufen.html
So it's still cheaper than CPC charging 65.94 £ incl. VAT.
 

Offline mos6502

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #92 on: November 12, 2013, 10:22:11 am »
for(;;);
 

Offline elgonzo

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #93 on: November 12, 2013, 10:38:02 am »
Octamex only charges 57,50 € (48,14 £) incl. VAT for ZD-915 http://www.octamex.de/shop/?page=shop/flypage&product_id=1454&category_id=e321c44a79d30c8a3235116f2f4f6f25&/ZD-915_Digital_Entloetstation,_Entloetpumpe_kaufen.html
So it's still cheaper than CPC charging 65.94 £ incl. VAT.

It is obvious that Octamex' price can't be trusted. Note that the product is not available in the Octamex store, you cannot even put it in the basket. Often the reason for not allowing customers to order an out-of-stock item is that prices in online stores are not being adjusted/updated for such items until the vendor confirms availability (together with a vendor price and approx. shipment date).
« Last Edit: November 12, 2013, 10:40:31 am by elgonzo »
 

Offline mos6502

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #94 on: November 12, 2013, 10:52:00 am »
The Octamex price is realistic, that's the amount these things went for:

http://www.ebay.de/itm/Professionelle-Entloetstation-80W-ZD-915-Vakuumpumpe-/310692568895

It's just that this thing seems to be sold out everywhere. Maybe they stopped making them and the factory switched to toilet seats or whatever ...
for(;;);
 

Offline elgonzo

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #95 on: November 12, 2013, 11:02:39 am »
The Octamex price is realistic, that's the amount these things went for:

http://www.ebay.de/itm/Professionelle-Entloetstation-80W-ZD-915-Vakuumpumpe-/310692568895

It's just that this thing seems to be sold out everywhere. Maybe they stopped making them and the factory switched to toilet seats or whatever ...

Thanks for the update. Considering the date of this ebay "sofortkaufen" auction was summer this year, the price indeed looks realistic.
 

Offline vasonline

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #96 on: November 12, 2013, 06:20:20 pm »
Hi,

I asked my local dealer about the Zdhongi station, and the Ajouya/CSI stations.
He found another one.
It is a bit more expensive: around 300€ euro's.

It does look good. (I think)
Anyone who recognises it?



Web site: http://www.soldering.com.tw/desoldering-station/SL-928.html
« Last Edit: November 12, 2013, 06:29:53 pm by vasonline »
 

Offline Fraser

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #97 on: November 12, 2013, 06:52:58 pm »
I do not recognise it but you need to consider the reliability of spare parts supply if you are going to spend that much on such a unit.
 

Offline arekm

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PLD/Linux Team. Electronics as a hobby.
http://readme.maven.pl/
 

Offline krivx

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #99 on: November 17, 2013, 06:29:04 pm »
 

Offline arekm

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #100 on: November 17, 2013, 06:38:19 pm »
Doesn't seem to be. Ask them directly, email, phone, skype addresses is at top left corner of their page.
PLD/Linux Team. Electronics as a hobby.
http://readme.maven.pl/
 

Online all_repair

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #101 on: November 18, 2013, 10:23:47 am »
The ZD-915 still isn't available.

Just found this. Looks like it was "inspired" :P by the Hakko 808:

DON'T buy this.  I bought one from aliexpress.  Tested 20 min, OK.  Mindful that the other end also running a business so I did not want to hold on payment, acknowledged the acceptance of good.  Continued using for 1hour, and smoke came out, and the motor was burned.  When I asked for help from seller, and even wanting to buy a motor, she asked why would I want a burnt-desoldering iron for and asked me to send it to a repair shop for repair.

Anyway, I managed to buy the replacement motor from China, and so far the desoldering iron still hold, but I found that the motor could not be run for a prolong duration.  If you press the suction for more a minute, the motor shall overheat; and if you do that for 5 minute, it shall smoke out.

This "Hwang Hua", or yellow flower brand is still a few year away. 
 

Offline dunkemhigh

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #102 on: November 18, 2013, 10:21:44 pm »
I also managed to buy a bag of 20 (yes 20) complete new guns

Did you win these on Ebay, and then have the vendor ship them to the wrong person?
 

Offline Fraser

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #103 on: November 18, 2013, 10:31:44 pm »
Sorry I don't understand your question.
 

Offline dunkemhigh

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #104 on: November 19, 2013, 01:20:11 am »
Your message just rang a bell. A while back I won some parts on Ebay, and lost on a job lot of the guns. The vendor (same for both auctions) shipped everything to me, and I then had to figure out who actually won the guns and then get in contact and ship them to the rightful owner. I reckon you would have realised if that (the rightful owner) was you, so it obviously wasn't.

Mind, knowing what I do now maybe I should've kept quiet and kept the lot :)
 

Offline Fraser

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #105 on: November 19, 2013, 10:27:53 am »
ahhh OK.

No not me. There have been a lot of these guns sold in batches though. I surmised that they were scrapped due to a production fault.
 

Offline Six_Shooter

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #106 on: November 23, 2013, 09:35:08 pm »
I hadn't considered getting a desoldering station until I watched this video, I didn't think they could be that much easier to use than a soldering station and a hand held desoldering pump, but man, this video made it look very easy. I'm going to be looking into getting one now.
 :-+
 

Offline AndersAnd

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #107 on: November 23, 2013, 11:38:13 pm »
For anyone who has access to an air compressor I highly recommended getting a desoldering station you can just plug into a compressor instead of the models with an internal suction pump.
The ones that use an external compressor instead has much better suction.
The internal pumps first have to accelerate when you press the button so the suction isn't instant like with an external air compressor, but instead the suction accelerates much slower. This makes it harder to suck up all solder. For some holes to pin sizes the difference is bigger than for other.

I've used Weller desoldering stations both for compressed air and with internal suction motor a lot in previous jobs, and they are worlds apart when it comes to sucking out all solder in very tight spaces between hole and pin. And the one with internal motor is loud as hell, it actually sounds a lot like a sheep when you press the button, so at work we just called it the sheep. But of course an air compressor can be very loud too if it's the piston type and located in the same room as you. You can get silent air compressors based on refrigerator/freezer compressors instead, or you can build your own DIY compressor from and old refrigerator/freezer compressor (Google it).

Of course the ones with internal suction motor has the advantage of being much more portable if you need to use it outside your regular workshop.

Not sure if there's any cheap Chinese desoldering stations for air compressors though, has anyone come across any cheap ones?
 

Offline AmmoJammo

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #108 on: November 23, 2013, 11:43:17 pm »
The internal pumps first have to accelerate when you press the button so the suction isn't instant like with an external air compressor, but instead the suction accelerates much slower.

The Pace desoldering station I have appears to have a much higher suction at the exact moment you press the trigger, then the suction drops back to normal.

You can hear the pump and motor run faster for a fraction of a second to create a higher vacuum surge when you first press the trigger.

Perhaps these cheaper stations could be modified to do this, by over driving the pump motor for quarter a second or something ;)
 

Offline Joule Thief

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #109 on: December 25, 2013, 12:29:16 pm »
ahhh OK.
I surmised that they were scrapped due to a production fault.

I recently purchased the ZD-915 unit from a seller in Florida, USA.  $119 USD
The new unit powered up fine and I reelocated the unit to my bench. The very next powerup resulted in no digital display (the backlight was on) and no heat or vacuum functions. The seller accepted a return and sent out a replacement unit. The replacement unit lasted about 3 weeks and died in the very same manner. When I asked if they had issues with this model, the answer was as expected, "No". When I suggested this was getting expensive shipping units back and forth they said "keep the defective unit and we will refund your money".

OK. Now I have what appears to be a dead control board and a free desolder station if I can get it to work.

On disassembly of the control board, I found the following


several soldering issues are present over the entire pcb






there are components under there somehere  :palm:





and a few places that need less solder and a few that need more





and this gets a little scarey too



time to pick up some solder wick to fix my desoldering station

wait - is that like dividing by zero on a calculator?   
« Last Edit: December 25, 2013, 12:36:53 pm by Joule Thief »
Perturb and observe.
 

Offline Fraser

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #110 on: December 25, 2013, 03:15:48 pm »
Those soldering faults are truly appalling !.

That almost looks like sabotage by the manual soldering operative.
 

Offline Skimask

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #111 on: January 18, 2014, 05:46:46 am »
My notes on my just received ZD985.
Clean up the motor wires, replace the tubing aroud the motor, remove a few solder bridges and blobs... Should be good to go for awhile.

NOTE:  I do not claim to be any sort of video production professional.  This will most likely be 10 minutes of your life that you won't get back.  Complaints are hereby ignored.



I didn't take it apart.
I turned it on.

The only stupid question is, well, most of them...

Save a fuse...Blow an electrician.
 

Offline GreyWoolfe

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #112 on: January 19, 2014, 11:55:36 pm »
I received my ZD985 over Christmas and played with it on a board that came out of something.  After a little practice, I am able to remove solder and leave the pad.  I am very happy with it.  I will go into the shed and grab some fiberglass batting to see how that works.  I really see no issues for hobbyist use especially with the availability of cheap parts/consumables.  How long it lasts, remains to be seen.
That which doesn't kill you still requires a co-pay.
 

Offline N2IXK

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #113 on: January 20, 2014, 12:55:41 am »
For anyone who has access to an air compressor I highly recommended getting a desoldering station you can just plug into a compressor instead of the models with an internal suction pump.
The ones that use an external compressor instead has much better suction.
The internal pumps first have to accelerate when you press the button so the suction isn't instant like with an external air compressor, but instead the suction accelerates much slower. This makes it harder to suck up all solder. For some holes to pin sizes the difference is bigger than for other.

For many years I made do with a homebrew contraption using a fridge compressor as a vacuum pump, evacuating an old freon tank as a "vacuum reservoir", to provide instant suction.  On off control was a footswitch, triggering a solenoid valve between the tank and the handpiece (one of the Radio Shack cheapies, with the rubber suction bulb removed and replaced with an inline filter and hose.). A vacuum switch on the tank cycled the vacuum pump on and off as needed to maintain a vacuum level in the tank, so the pump wasn't constantly running.

Worked great for salvaging/removing parts, from single or double sided boards. Multilayer stuff was a bit much for it, so it was replaced with a air-powered Metcal system a few years ago.
"My favorite programming language is...SOLDER!"--Robert A. Pease
 

Offline rolandpenplotter

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #114 on: January 20, 2014, 12:57:57 am »
The irony of a soldering product that isn't soldered properly...

The (just noticed) punnery of using "irony" in the above sentence...
 

Offline vasonline

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #115 on: February 28, 2014, 06:16:42 pm »
After looking for the ZD-915 and ZD985 in europe.
 I settled for a US Hakko 808 with 230->120V transformer. Even with shipping and import tax, it's still a good deal.
Bought it from Matt. (got it very fast over here - Thx!)

I unpacked it today...
However I am less than happy with it: the pump motor runs uneven. It speeds up and slows down every 2 seconds
Is there something wrong with it? Does your hakko's 808 motor runs uneven on 110-120V ? Or has it something to do with
me trying to run a US 120V @ 60Hz Hakko on 120V @ 50Hz ?
The heater works fine.

I did desolder some single side pcb components with ease. But I can bring the motor almost to a standstill when
doing a double sided pcb.

- Weight balance is excellent.
- It all feels and is very well made.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2014, 06:27:15 pm by vasonline »
 

Offline linux-works

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #116 on: February 28, 2014, 07:42:04 pm »
my 808 does not speed up or slow down.  maybe you have some clogs or need to change filters?

hard to believe the 808 costs THAT much on oz!  what a crime that is.  it was $150 at frys a few years ago and I grabbed one.  I don't love the weight, but as an all-in-one unit, its hard to beat, especially if you can afford it where you live.

I'd love to have better temp control and regulation, but for what it is, its still very usable and beats the hell out of manual blue vacuum pumps.  I stopped using wick a long time ago since I never found it to be the proper thing for unsoldering.  absorbing excess solder, yes, but useless for desoldering.

(I will admit to using wick to help me solder smd chips; what people call a 'flood and suck' method, lol; you oversolder, almost like the videos show on chipquick, then you drag the wick across the pins (gently!) to pick up excess solder.  it works well but is abrasive and I stopped doing that once I gained proper smd soldering skills).
 

Offline linux-works

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #117 on: February 28, 2014, 09:57:48 pm »
time to pick up some solder wick to fix my desoldering station
wait - is that like dividing by zero on a calculator?

2014: the year the soldering machines became self-aware
 

Offline vasonline

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #118 on: March 01, 2014, 09:20:07 am »
Hi,

Linux-works.

Thanks for the reply.
I have made a quick video to show what is happening.
Tried a different 230/120 transformer (a 500VA variac should be way overcapacity) Stiil the same.



I think it's time to notify the dealer?
Thanks for the comments. Hakko in Europe is almost impossible to find. And the UK distributor does not want or is not allowed
to ship to mainland europe.

« Last Edit: March 01, 2014, 09:21:50 am by vasonline »
 

Offline Rasz

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #119 on: March 01, 2014, 10:54:40 am »
its a mating call. its just lonely
Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
My fireplace is on fire, but in all the wrong places.
 

Offline linux-works

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #120 on: March 01, 2014, 03:57:42 pm »
"its pining for the fjords!"

(what kind of talk is that?)

lol

does the unit make that sound if you remove the barrel that holds the filter and the used solder?

does it matter if its warmed up and then you apply suction or does it do this only when its cold and on its way to warm up?  if there is a clog in the nozzle (heated end) then you have to wait for it to warm up before it can suck out the debris in there.  have you cleaned the nozzle using that spring wire they supply?
 

Offline vasonline

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #121 on: March 01, 2014, 07:39:42 pm »
Hi raz & linux-works

 :D

Now for the serious part:
Indeed you asked some very good question!

- The sound it makes is the same, with barrel that holds the solder removed.
- I acually popped the cover of the vaccuum compressor: you can actually see the motor slowing down.
- Just to make sure: I put the cleaning wire in...it went trough the nozzle and heater without problem.

Here is one observation I found:
The turning speed of the motor is influenced by the ON/OFF cycles of the heater.
It goes slower each time the heater is ON. And goes faster each time the heater is OFF
- If let the Hakko warm up, form cold, you can actually hear the pulsing of the motor changing.

I had bought 200W step down transformer for it. So just in case, I switched to my 500W variac (autotransformer)
...no change. Both work equally well.
Strange.

Thx for all the help!

Must say: eevblog is one of the most helpfull forums I saw in quite a while.
:)

Greetings.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2014, 07:43:12 pm by vasonline »
 

Offline SeanB

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #122 on: March 02, 2014, 06:50:01 am »
So high resistance in a switch, connector, cable or PCB trace is dropping voltage to the pump.
 

Offline linux-works

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #123 on: March 02, 2014, 08:43:03 am »
also, are you -sure- your ac wall connection can handle the current?  does it do this on all outlets?  are you using a power strip or direct into the wall?

just something to check in case you haven't.  not all home wiring is good ;)
 

Offline vasonline

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #124 on: March 03, 2014, 07:17:49 pm »
Hi,

I think we are on something....
I see the transformed voltage dropping to 100V each time the heating element kicks in.

Line voltage 230V keeps stable. Transformed voltage drops.
Maybe I should try a bigger 230/120V transformer?

My variac handles it better, It's rated 2A but still drops quite a bit.

Something like this might work better (300W):
http://www.factoryprices.nl/product/hq-psup37hq-spanningsomvormer-220-110v-300w-144127.html


« Last Edit: March 03, 2014, 07:19:44 pm by vasonline »
 

Offline linux-works

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #125 on: March 03, 2014, 07:26:01 pm »
oh!  you are going thru a transformer?

I bet that's it.  was not aware you were 220v based and were using a 110v hakko.

very likely its the power going into it that is not strong enough and that's the dipping (and peaking) you are hearing.
 

Offline vasonline

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #126 on: March 07, 2014, 06:25:46 pm »
Hi,

I bought the 300W transformer. It works now much better :)
Lesson learned: even tough it only uses ~100W, you need to have quite a bit more overcapacity, for correct operation.
It really needs a stable voltage supply.


 

Offline Janaha

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #127 on: March 08, 2014, 08:14:44 pm »
Hy.

Thanks to this Video i bought the ZD-987 Desoldering Station from a lokal distributor. It looked much like the ZD985, only it had an aditional soldering iron.

To my shame it didn't last the first day after opening the paket.

Two things brought it down.

First the desoldering Gun itself. I tried it on an old ATX- Power supply board. I sucked on the pins of one of the transformers when the downfall began.
Some of the Solder didn't made it trough the heated part of the gun into the glassy tube witch should catch the solder and cool it down. Some of the solder just get stuck at the last milimeters into the glassy tube. I noticed it realys quick as no more air could be sucked into the desoldering gun. I could even see the tiny bloob of solder that got stucked. So began the second part of the downfall of my lovely new toy.

With the solder stucked into the end of the heated tube, i took apart the gun trying to get rid of the solder bloob when it happend. I layed the glassy tube on my bench and right in the trouble of fixing the stucked solder, the glassy tube roled of the bench onto the concrete floor. And there it shatterd into pieces. So my advice for today. Those tube is realy fargile, take care with it. 

Now i must wait till the end of the month because the spare part isn't aviable right at the moment from my distributor. And to make it worse. Those glass tubes dosn't come allone. I must by the whole desoldering gun. as spare part...

Oh an a second advice i also have. It looks like those Desoldering Guns come in two different versions. With an 6 pin connector caled ZD-552 or an 7 pin connector caled ZD-552B. My one is of the second type with a 7 pin connector.

And one question i also have.. can any one give me an advice how to clean the solder from the tube ? I've tried everything i could thinks of and i don't get the solder out of the tube. Those neeldes i got with the tube aren't of any help. I tried to heat it up to just around 380 degree celcius and poked around with the needle. I olso tried ti heat it from the back with my soldering iron. But i coudn't get it out.

Greetings from Germany
Janaha
 

Offline vasonline

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #128 on: March 21, 2014, 08:55:44 pm »
Hi Janaha,

Sorry to hear your ZD 987 has trouble.
In the manual of hakko I read that it's best to wait at least 5 minutes after you plugged it in.
That allows all of the heating parts to get up to temperature.

With the 300VA transformei can report the Hako 808 works fine on 230V
 

Offline Tuoppi

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #129 on: March 28, 2014, 06:09:05 am »
Hi, this question might come a little bit late and considering that I am relatively new to electronics it might even be stupid. But in minute 10:37, when you check if the tip is earthed, shouldn't you have the mains cable plugged?.
 

Offline Porto

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #130 on: March 28, 2014, 05:46:11 pm »
For some weeks I have the Aoyue Int474A++ desoldering station and it's performing very well.
The pistol internals looks much alike this Rhino tools thing but it does its job and that's the important thing.
As a reworkstation I use the Aoyue Int968A+, also to my satisfactory.


 :-+
 

Offline N2IXK

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #131 on: March 28, 2014, 11:33:45 pm »
Hi, this question might come a little bit late and considering that I am relatively new to electronics it might even be stupid. But in minute 10:37, when you check if the tip is earthed, shouldn't you have the mains cable plugged?.
No real need, unless you are concerned about testing the ground connection through the mains cord.

Dave just made a continuity test between the tip and the IEC inlet ground pin.  The tip ground was NOT brought through to the mains ground, but appeared to be tied to power supply common (inside the PSU).



"My favorite programming language is...SOLDER!"--Robert A. Pease
 

Offline Tuoppi

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #132 on: March 29, 2014, 05:45:57 am »
No real need, unless you are concerned about testing the ground connection through the mains cord.

Dave just made a continuity test between the tip and the IEC inlet ground pin.  The tip ground was NOT brought through to the mains ground, but appeared to be tied to power supply common (inside the PSU).

Seems that my observation skills are lacking. I hadn't noticed where the other multimeter lead was attached. Thanks N2IXK !
 

Offline somlioy

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #133 on: April 06, 2014, 12:50:13 pm »
Just bought a ZD985 aswell. This is supposed to be a "new batch" and the gun looks slightly different compared to daves. This aint rhino branded tho.
 

Offline kondy73

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #134 on: April 13, 2014, 12:20:12 pm »
Yes this is a new batch. We recently bought a new spare desolder gun and looks the same. This is a better solution, it can be seen when the cylinder is full and have greater capacity. Overall, I welcome this new solution. We use 5 pieces ZD915 already 4 years.
 

Online poorchava

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #135 on: April 14, 2014, 07:24:31 am »
seems like a better design. I have one with the old "dense" spring and it's surprisingly difficult to get the solder out (i have to melt it out with a soldering iron...).
I love the smell of FR4 in the morning!
 

Offline Rory

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #136 on: April 14, 2014, 08:18:47 pm »
seems like a better design. I have one with the old "dense" spring and it's surprisingly difficult to get the solder out (i have to melt it out with a soldering iron...).
Try stuffing a wad of glass fiber batting in there and see if it helps.  I don't get solder on the spring and it cleans up with a pair of tweezers.
 

Offline TSL

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #137 on: December 26, 2014, 11:48:15 am »
Hi all,

Just received a Rhino ZD-985 for Christmas :)

I can report that this upgraded unit now comes with both the dense spring and a dark colored cylinder as well as a glass cylinder and lighter spring, just like somlioy's unit.

Additional spares that come with it are 3 cylinder filters, 1 case filter and 2 additional tips.

Also the display also now has a transparent cover over it so you can't press on the LCD.

The best improvement is the heat up time, looking at Dave's video it seemed like it was taking 2 - 3 minutes to reach 300deg. Heat up time from 25 to 300deg was timed at about ~1 min 21 seconds for this unit.

Another indication that its "upgraded" is that, when power is applied, the screen flashes "u03"

One thing I'm not sure of for previous units is that this unit remembers the set temp even if power is removed from the unit.

Other than that it all functions just like Dave's.


cheers

Tim
VK2XAX :: QF56if :: BMARC :: WIA :: AMSATVK
 

Online poorchava

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #138 on: December 26, 2014, 02:47:25 pm »
Mine does rememberthe temperature. I think this would be seriously annoying if it didn't
I love the smell of FR4 in the morning!
 

Offline TSL

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #139 on: December 26, 2014, 10:44:00 pm »
I forgot to mention... the barrel is now earthed unlike Dave's unit.

cheers

Tim
VK2XAX :: QF56if :: BMARC :: WIA :: AMSATVK
 

Offline bingo600

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #140 on: December 28, 2014, 01:15:33 pm »
Is there any recommended placed to get one suited for EU (230v) ?
I mean should i watch out for fakes etc ?
I found a one seller on ebay

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261528749712

/Bingo



 

Offline FunkEngine

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #141 on: February 16, 2015, 02:30:28 am »
Anybody here have a lead on spare heaters/entire gun assemblies for these in the US?  I'd like to lay in a spare as an investment in the future.  I should have grabbed one while memotronics still had the heaters in stock back in July.  |O
 

Offline AHT52

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #142 on: April 01, 2015, 10:14:14 am »
Just got my ZD-915 from bourne electronics in Melbourne at the bargain price of $189. Best thing I have bought in ages! The desoldering pump works like a dream. No more burnt fingers and the components just drop off the board like Dave showed in the vid. I got a bit carried away desoldering a pcb from a old pc power supply trying all the different components. My only slight criticism is the filter in the pump seems to get clogged after a bit. Has anyone tried cotton wool as a cheap alternative to the little filter pads? Dunno if the solder might be a bit too hot for it and start to burn it? My missus was nt impressed, when I suggested I can now grab peoples electrical rubbish for component salvage.  :-+
 

Offline Rasz

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #143 on: April 01, 2015, 11:12:10 am »
Just got my ZD-915 from bourne electronics in Melbourne at the bargain price of $189.

Australia is crazy, just checked again and this model is still ~$70 with free shipping in Europe.
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Offline krivx

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #144 on: April 01, 2015, 11:26:48 am »
Just got my ZD-915 from bourne electronics in Melbourne at the bargain price of $189.

Australia is crazy, just checked again and this model is still ~$70 with free shipping in Europe.

Where are you seeing that price?
 

Offline Rasz

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #145 on: April 01, 2015, 11:46:11 am »
Just got my ZD-915 from bourne electronics in Melbourne at the bargain price of $189.

Australia is crazy, just checked again and this model is still ~$70 with free shipping in Europe.

Where are you seeing that price?

Poland
http://www.gotronik.pl/rozlutownica-zd915-zd915-p-1302.html
255
http://allegro.pl/stacja-lutownicza-rozlutownica-zd915-gw-24m-ce-i5160531956.html
268zl = $70

gun alone $17
http://allegro.pl/kolba-rozlutownicy-do-stacji-zd915-zd917-zd-915-i5192292501.html

auctions ship internationally
Im guessing its because there is a bigger market for rework equipment here - we have a booming business of idiots importing whole containers full of electronic garbage from german supermarket chains, "recycling" EU style.
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Offline Muttley Snickers

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #146 on: April 01, 2015, 01:12:40 pm »
Just got my ZD-915 from bourne electronics in Melbourne at the bargain price of $189. Best thing I have bought in ages! The desoldering pump works like a dream. No more burnt fingers and the components just drop off the board like Dave showed in the vid. I got a bit carried away desoldering a pcb from a old pc power supply trying all the different components. My only slight criticism is the filter in the pump seems to get clogged after a bit. Has anyone tried cotton wool as a cheap alternative to the little filter pads? Dunno if the solder might be a bit too hot for it and start to burn it? My missus was nt impressed, when I suggested I can now grab peoples electrical rubbish for component salvage.  :-+

Sorry, but you got done like a dinner sunshine, I paid $165.00  AUD from Radio Parts, who now have increased the price to $209.00 AUD and not for the ZD-915 but for the dual ZD-917, admittedly even the soldering iron sucks compared to my Weller but for what I paid (account price) bloody good value I thought.

I have posted this stuff before, your consumables, filter's, tip's, etc, are best sort from Rhino Tool's in Sydney, whom I think is actually a forum member, anyway that's where Dave got his from and that's where I get my tip's and stuff from, I'm also in Melbourne.

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« Last Edit: December 15, 2015, 01:34:18 pm by Muttley Snickers »
 

Offline Fungus

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #147 on: April 01, 2015, 01:20:08 pm »
Just got my ZD-915 from bourne electronics in Melbourne at the bargain price of $189. Best thing I have bought in ages!
Sorry, but you got done like a dinner sunshine

Gee, guys. He was happy before you all came along...!

("Value" is in the eye of the beholder - it's OK to advise people before, not after).
 

Offline Muttley Snickers

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #148 on: April 01, 2015, 01:30:39 pm »
Greeting's Fungus,

I didn't mean to rain on his parade, but they pay the price for not searching the forum properly, also I have my own exchange rate and my money is worth more than eveyone else's I reckon anyway.

Muttley

« Last Edit: December 15, 2015, 01:32:28 pm by Muttley Snickers »
 

Offline Fungus

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #149 on: April 01, 2015, 02:02:40 pm »
Greeting's Fungus,

I did'nt mean to rain on his parade, but they pay the price for not searching the forum properly

Sure, but when somebody's happy...  :-X
 

Offline Muttley Snickers

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #150 on: April 01, 2015, 02:21:29 pm »
Just got my ZD-915 from bourne electronics in Melbourne at the bargain price of $189. Best thing I have bought in ages! The desoldering pump works like a dream. No more burnt fingers and the components just drop off the board like Dave showed in the vid. I got a bit carried away desoldering a pcb from a old pc power supply trying all the different components. My only slight criticism is the filter in the pump seems to get clogged after a bit. Has anyone tried cotton wool as a cheap alternative to the little filter pads? Dunno if the solder might be a bit too hot for it and start to burn it? My missus was nt impressed, when I suggested I can now grab peoples electrical rubbish for component salvage.  :-+

 :palm: You did really good dude... :-+ if you need some filters or tips then let me know with a PM because I bought a few to many last time from Rhino, I am also " happy " to advise on a few tricks for the best performance of the unit that you have purchased.

Best Regards and Life Solder Sucks

Muttley
« Last Edit: December 15, 2015, 01:37:03 pm by Muttley Snickers »
 

Offline AHT52

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #151 on: April 02, 2015, 08:41:08 am »
Sorry the confusion. I meant the ZD-917 the dual desoldering/soldering iron. It was after a long day hv switching, I was a bit cream crackered. :=\ I still love it tho the solder station that is, although being a A.P keeps me in job. I do agree tho about the price of stuff here in oz, when you compare it to the U.K can be a bit dear. In screwfix you could buy 1000 BZP m5 nuts for £5.65=>$11.30ish where as here I have nt found anywhere as cheap here yet. Does anyone know any cheap fixture and fasteners shops/online companies here in OZ?

I had a look at Rhino tools Muttley and for a dollar for a set of filters can`t be bad.
« Last Edit: April 03, 2015, 03:13:16 am by AHT52 »
 

Offline Jidis

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #152 on: April 04, 2015, 05:21:36 pm »
Try stuffing a wad of glass fiber batting in there and see if it helps.  I don't get solder on the spring and it cleans up with a pair of tweezers.

Thanks for the tip. I'm going to try that on my next desoldering job. I use a CSI (Aoyue?) 474 and I dread that part. Like the previous poster, with mine, I have to wedge a hot iron tip into the spring while holding it with a pair of pliers, then pull up on it and let it snap back down until it releases the glob. It's as much of a PITA as it sounds like and usually takes several tries. I was anxious to see what happened on Dave's, but his just popped right out. I did notice his spring was a bit larger at the tapered end than mine.

Take Care
 

Offline GreyWoolfe

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #153 on: April 04, 2015, 07:42:43 pm »
Is there anywhere else besides Australia to get parts for the ZD-985.  The prices are fine but shipping to USA has to suck.
That which doesn't kill you still requires a co-pay.
 

Offline Rasz

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #154 on: April 05, 2015, 11:02:18 am »
Is there anywhere else besides Australia to get parts for the ZD-985.  The prices are fine but shipping to USA has to suck.

what parts? the gun is the same as 915-917, and costs $17
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Offline dav

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #155 on: April 26, 2015, 07:29:04 am »
Due to the poor quality of the gun, did anyone replace it with a better one?
Are there better quality compatible guns for ZD985?
 

Offline Rasz

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #156 on: April 26, 2015, 08:10:34 am »
Due to the poor quality of the gun, did anyone replace it with a better one?
Are there better quality compatible guns for ZD985?

What are your main complaints about this gun? I only used this and xytronics desoldering irons, so have no comparison to the top shelf stuff :(
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Offline dav

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #157 on: April 26, 2015, 09:11:33 am »
I would buy it (it costs about EUR 90 in Europe), but I'm unsure due to several people claim poor quality of the gun.
So I was wondering if I could replace the gun with a better quality one (if anyone tried this)
 

Offline Rasz

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #158 on: April 26, 2015, 10:19:47 am »
I would buy it (it costs about EUR 90 in Europe), but I'm unsure due to several people claim poor quality of the gun.
So I was wondering if I could replace the gun with a better quality one (if anyone tried this)

ehh, so you never used one (this or any other), and base it on 'some people claim" without linking to those people :/

price is ~$70
http://diolut.pl/stacja-rozlutownicza-rozlutownica-zd985-esd-grzalka-80w-p-4789.html
same as zd915
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Offline dav

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #159 on: April 26, 2015, 05:38:17 pm »
How do you rate it?
Do you suggest it? (for a non intensive use)
 

Offline Rasz

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #160 on: April 26, 2015, 06:10:34 pm »
How do you rate it?
Do you suggest it? (for a non intensive use)

I have no comparison :( I also had no problems using one, so no complaints.
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Offline boffin

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #161 on: April 27, 2015, 07:26:46 am »
It strikes me you could vastly improve one of these inexpensive desoldering tools by doing the following
1) Create a small vacuum chamber out of a couple of inches of 1" PVC/ABS pipe and hook that to the internal pump.
2) Change the pump switch to run off a vacuum switch to pull the chamber down to negative pressure (trial and error rqd here)
3) Change the trigger on the tool itself to open an air valve between the tool and the new vacuum chamber. 

This way when you pull the trigger you get an initial whoosh of suction.
 

Offline Rasz

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #162 on: April 27, 2015, 10:55:54 am »
It strikes me you could vastly improve one of these inexpensive desoldering tools by doing the following
1) Create a small vacuum chamber out of a couple of inches of 1" PVC/ABS pipe and hook that to the internal pump.
2) Change the pump switch to run off a vacuum switch to pull the chamber down to negative pressure (trial and error rqd here)
3) Change the trigger on the tool itself to open an air valve between the tool and the new vacuum chamber. 

This way when you pull the trigger you get an initial whoosh of suction.

I think this
http://www.hakko.com/english/products/hakko_fr400.html
might have valve in the handle instead of pump switch
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Offline N2IXK

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #163 on: April 28, 2015, 11:44:11 pm »
Anyone else have to replace the heater element on one of these? I just did, and it is a relatively painless job... Except for the fact that the temp sensor is a thermocouple which is not marked for polarity in any way.  :-//  If you get it hooked up backwards you don't get a screwy temperature reading (as with most industrial TC systems). You get a display that stays stuck on 77F while the heater warms up.  After a few seconds the unit drops out on a fault. Presumably when there is no response from the thermocouple within X seconds,CPU sets an error (and hopefully) shuts down the element to prevent overheating.  Nice to see that they did put some thought to protect against this (or a shorted sensor), as well as having a separate fault for an OPEN thermocouple.

The replacement heater comes with tiny brass crimp sleeves, which need to be used because the thermocouple and heater element wires are not copper, and won't take solder easily. I did flow solder over them after crimping to fill any voids left in the dodgy crimps.

I replaced my heater because the tube got clogged with something that is resistant to melting, presumably oxides and carbon from flux, etc.  Got most of it reamed out with a drill but need a longer drill to get it all out.  Hopefully can save it for a spare. Not sure how it happened, as I'm pretty religious about running the cleaning rod through the thing.
« Last Edit: April 28, 2015, 11:48:45 pm by N2IXK »
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Offline dav

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #164 on: April 29, 2015, 09:21:41 am »
 

Offline max666

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #165 on: April 30, 2015, 04:49:27 pm »
http://www.hotair.pl/pl/sklep/stacje-lutownicze/rozlutownica-odsysacz-cyny-zd-985-esd.html?keyword=zd-985
http://allegro.pl/rozlutownica-odsysacz-cyny-zd-985-okazja-i3689307025.html

~70$ (without delivery)

Site in polish but the shop sells in whole EU.
Thanks for the tip! I got one for 71,25 EUR + 25,52 EUR shipping. Site is in Polish, but they do speak English if you contact them.

I did some recreational desoldering and for the price this thing works really well.



this is how far I got until suction declined



some cleaning was in order



as I understand it the ZD-985 now has a new spring assembly and I had no issues separating the spring from the funky grown solder column



PS: I don't find the stand is that bad, yes it is flimsy, but I don't see me breaking it that easily.
 

Offline SeanB

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #166 on: April 30, 2015, 05:15:14 pm »
When you put the spring in put some motor oil on it, along with the seals. that way the solder is easy to remove.
 

Offline Jidis

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #167 on: May 03, 2015, 09:20:37 pm »
FWIW,

I've been using Rory's suggestion of fiberglass batting (from back at post #138) for the past few desoldering jobs. If there's a downside to it, I have yet to hit it. The solder never makes it back into that small end of the spring and it doesn't seem to noticeably impede the airflow either. Wish I had been doing it all along.

- this of course is for those more tightly wound springs with the cone shaped end
 

Offline gl

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #168 on: May 11, 2015, 04:37:04 pm »
Does anyone know a ZD985 supplier in the UK or Europe that accepts Paypal, preferrably the ESD version?

Diolut in Poland (also on Allegro) have ignored my messages (even with a Google translation to Polish)?

Hotair (also Poland) have the ESD but only accept bank transfers (expensive for me + slow and no protection if something goes wrong) and shipping to UK is expensive.

Emporio Tecnologico in Italy take Paypal but only have the non-ESD version + waiting on new stock (this week appt.).

I wouldn't even mind importing from China, my usual go-to AliExpress doesn't seem to have it.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2015, 04:39:52 pm by gl »
 

Offline Rasz

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #169 on: May 11, 2015, 08:30:21 pm »
Does anyone know a ZD985 supplier in the UK or Europe that accepts Paypal, preferrably the ESD version?

Diolut in Poland (also on Allegro) have ignored my messages (even with a Google translation to Polish)?

Hotair (also Poland) have the ESD but only accept bank transfers (expensive for me + slow and no protection if something goes wrong) and shipping to UK is expensive.

Emporio Tecnologico in Italy take Paypal but only have the non-ESD version + waiting on new stock (this week appt.).

I wouldn't even mind importing from China, my usual go-to AliExpress doesn't seem to have it.

in the repair forum was a thread about broken pump, dude was able to directly mail Zhongdi(?) and they were happy to sell to him directly. You might try that route.
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Offline gl

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #170 on: May 11, 2015, 08:38:23 pm »
Thanks Rasz, I actually tried that (using their web form IIRC) but I haven't had a reply yet.  I'll try the two email addresses on that page.  Really strange that they're not even on AliExpress though, and nobody else in UK / EU?
 

Offline Rasz

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #171 on: May 12, 2015, 05:05:58 am »
Thanks Rasz, I actually tried that (using their web form IIRC) but I haven't had a reply yet.  I'll try the two email addresses on that page.  Really strange that they're not even on AliExpress though, and nobody else in UK / EU?

Diolut sells them in Poland, but they dont ship internationally.
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Offline wilhelm

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« Last Edit: May 12, 2015, 03:49:15 pm by wilhelm »
 

Offline gl

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #173 on: May 12, 2015, 04:22:29 pm »
@Rasz, good to know.  They coulda still sent a reply saying so though.

@wilhelm right, those are both ZD-915's (the other seems a rebadge), like the Duratool rebadge which is available in the UK here (this is a cheaper code then you get if you search for it), I could buy that here.

I prefer the 985 for the clear tube & overall design though (blue and white is nice :)).  And the new version heats up faster than the 915 right?
 

Offline gl

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #174 on: May 17, 2015, 07:37:48 pm »
Zhongdi got back to me, but wanted 75USD (courier) / 65USD (airmail) shipping to UK.  They say the package is about 4kg, that can't be right surely?
 

Offline max666

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #175 on: May 18, 2015, 01:52:22 am »
The unit itself weighs 2,5 kg, so I don't think 4 kg for the package is that far off (mine got shipped double packed).
 

Offline gl

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #176 on: May 20, 2015, 10:14:57 pm »
Cool.  I just ordered from panda-bg.com.  According to the Zhongdi model no it's the ESD version.  Worked out around 80 GBP all-in as the others, but they take Visa/Mastercard so there's some protection there.  Let you know how it works out.
 

Offline max666

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #177 on: May 21, 2015, 08:36:01 am »
What's the difference between the ESD an none ESD version anyway?
 

Offline gl

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #178 on: May 21, 2015, 07:53:43 pm »
I think it just means that the tip is earthed, right?  So no static can build up on it.
 

Offline max666

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #179 on: May 23, 2015, 12:53:33 am »
Well the tip of my ZD-985 is earthed, so ...
 

Offline orion242

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #180 on: May 23, 2015, 02:39:42 am »
Got mine today from memotronics also, and ran it though a wad of repairs.  Quick shipping, very happy with it.

Can't believe I waited this long for something that saves a load of time.

Thanks for the review Dave!
 

Offline gl

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #181 on: May 24, 2015, 02:04:50 pm »
@max666, you got yours from Hotair right?  Theirs is the ESD version.  Zhongdi model nos for the 220V versions are:

non-ESD: 89-8512
       ESD: 89-8514
 

Offline max666

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #182 on: May 26, 2015, 08:55:02 pm »
@max666, you got yours from Hotair right?  Theirs is the ESD version.  Zhongdi model nos for the 220V versions are:

non-ESD: 89-8512
       ESD: 89-8514


Yes from Hotair. I didn't notice it, but it actually says ESD it on the website "Rozlutownica ZD-985 ESD", but on the unit itself there's no markings whatsoever to tell them apart.

After using it some more, I noticed increasing difficulty cleaning the spring, because the solder much more engulfed the windings. And I made the mistake of heating up the spring with a Bunsen burner to melt off the solder ... took the springiness right off  ::)
So I have to figure something out to fix that.
 

Offline N2IXK

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #183 on: May 26, 2015, 09:29:24 pm »
I wipe down the spring and the inside of the glass tube with a bit of silicone spray lube after cleaning. Makes the solder less likely to stick, and easier to remove if it does.
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Offline gl

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #184 on: May 29, 2015, 01:40:08 pm »
My Z985 from Panda-BG just arrived, took 8 days to UK.  It's the ESD version as advertised, the (correct) Zhongdi model no is stuck on the plain cardboard box, and the back of the unit has a big 'ESD SAFE' sticker.

EDIT: Interestingly the manual says that the handle plastic is conductive on their ESD safe tools (which has safety implications).  So not just the tip.

Will test later ...
« Last Edit: May 29, 2015, 02:02:31 pm by gl »
 

Offline gl

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #185 on: May 29, 2015, 08:28:26 pm »
OK played with it, some newbie impressions (first time I used one of these):

On the whole works well.  English manual with a Bulgarian (I assume) extra page, no idea what it says.

Some plastics (gun handle & unit) had a few scratches on them, superficial though and no biggie for a tool I guess.

I assumed the plating on the tips (which you have to punch through) was lead-free solder, but it doesn't seem to be (my lead-free doesn't take)?  It's also not melting but instead starting to flake (break) off in places - is that normal?

At first tried lower temps - 260C melts my lead-free fine, but it seems to cause regular clogging half-way to the chamber (pump then gives up).  First time I couldn't clear it with the cleaner sticks and didn't want to force it (also didn't know if they are supposed to reach all the way into the chamber, they are) - so just turned it up to max (480C) and then it cleared fine with the sticks.  So running a bit hotter is probably a good idea, 280C seems OK so far.

Other than that works great, suction is good, and usually cleans so well that components just fall out.  I briefly had a Duratool basic heated sucker (just a solder pump and a basic AC iron smashed together) and while it worked OK it didn't suck as good, legs often sticking to the side (mainly because the tip hole was too large I think).  And the recoil from the pump was horrible.

No problems with Panda-BG either, they were helpful, spoke good English & told me the cheapest way to pay.  There's an issue with their order form converting all postcodes to numbers (no good for the UK where you have letters too) but I emailed them and they did actually correct it on the parcel.

Seems a good investment, thanks for the review Dave and all the input from everyone.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2015, 08:31:52 pm by gl »
 

Offline Brumby

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #186 on: December 11, 2015, 11:09:01 am »
I've been thinking about getting one of these ever since viewing Dave's review and I've now taken the plunge - through eBay.

Reason?

The regular price from the seller is still $190 and eBay are doing a promotion where you get 10% off for purchases over $100.  This made it $171 - delivery included.

I'm not going to be using it 8 hours a day 5 days a week, so I won't need industrial strength - so it would seem to be a good fit for my needs.


If anyone else is still considering this, the eBay offer is good until 23.59 (AEDT) on Sunday 13 December 2015.
 

Offline mstck

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #187 on: December 11, 2015, 10:47:15 pm »
I received one of these units today and I am in the process of getting used to it.  I find removing the barrel rather tricky(difficult). Is  there a "trick" to doing this that I might be missing?

Would appreciate any advice based on your experiences with the unit so far. Thanks.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2015, 04:02:30 am by mstck »
 

Offline mikerj

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #188 on: December 13, 2015, 11:45:55 am »
After using it some more, I noticed increasing difficulty cleaning the spring, because the solder much more engulfed the windings. And I made the mistake of heating up the spring with a Bunsen burner to melt off the solder ... took the springiness right off  ::)
So I have to figure something out to fix that.

You could try re-hardening by heating to red and quenching in water.  It will then be brittle, so temper it by heating to straw colour and quenching again.
 

Offline krivx

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #189 on: December 14, 2015, 09:46:09 am »
I received one of these units today and I am in the process of getting used to it.  I find removing the barrel rather tricky(difficult). Is  there a "trick" to doing this that I might be missing?

Would appreciate any advice based on your experiences with the unit so far. Thanks.

Are you sliding the switch at the back of the gun? It makes it much easier.

 

Offline tombi

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #190 on: December 15, 2015, 12:55:02 am »
Removing the tube where the solder gets caught is really hard on mine too. Mine is the Rhino tools version bought from an Australian supplier.

So you click the latch to release the slide, pull back on the slide as much as possible but it is still a tight fit between the rubber and the tube.

Mine came with both a glass tube and a plastic tube. I queried the seller and he said some people prefer one or the other. I've been using the glass.

The unit works really well overall. The only issue is sometimes I find I get a build up of solder at the back end of the metal tube where it doesn't get hot enough to melt. I think you have to keep running the cleaning rods through it or it can get stuck there. I had to disassemble the unit and run a find drill up the back end of the tube a couple of times to fix it.

Tom
 

Offline krivx

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #191 on: December 15, 2015, 10:11:16 am »

The unit works really well overall. The only issue is sometimes I find I get a build up of solder at the back end of the metal tube where it doesn't get hot enough to melt. I think you have to keep running the cleaning rods through it or it can get stuck there. I had to disassemble the unit and run a find drill up the back end of the tube a couple of times to fix it.


Yes, I've noticed this too. I clean out the gun as soon as I notice any drop in performance. It's hard to say how often as it depends on the volume of solder but I have done in after about 20 minutes of heavy use, which seems like a fair enough balance to me.
 

Offline Brumby

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #192 on: December 15, 2015, 11:19:15 am »
Mine is due to be delivered tomorrow.  Will Australia Post come through?

Interested to read the experiences of others.  So far I'm feeling positive.  I have a few old computer boards I'll be attacking to try it out.
 

Offline Muttley Snickers

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #193 on: December 15, 2015, 12:03:06 pm »
I've posted about mine before even in this thread, practice makes perfect, watch your temperature and time on board, what works well on one board will lift pads on another, tips and filters from Rhino Tools in Sydney.

I keep mine super clean and a smear of silicone grease around the cylinder seals does help, these as mentioned earlier are a tight fit but they have to be to maintain a vacuum seal, I use the temperature display as a guide only as the first unit I had was a mile away from the true tip temperature, it was getting way too hot and went back to RPG.

I have drilled out a few tips for larger pins and pads and it seems to aid in letting the melted solder get past the pin and out of the hole freely in some applications, the supplied ones were slightly smaller than I needed so a mod was in order.

If I am gutting a board then I crank it up and go to town but if it is a repair then more care is required so as not to do any damage. Only once have I had to dismantle the gun and run a drill bit up the spout to clear some solder and I regularly run the cleaning rods through whilst the unit is being used and still hot.
 

Offline Brumby

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #194 on: December 16, 2015, 01:17:59 am »
Well, I've got mine.

Bloody lazy Australia Post parcel contractor didn't deliver it, just left a card and updated the tracking with "Attempted Delivery - Unable to gain access". 

GIVE ME A BREAK!

His only obstacle was a 3 foot high gate that was not locked.  They had to get out of their vehicle to leave the card and it would only have taken them another 10m to have done their job properly - or is expecting them to operate one of the most common gate latches around asking too much?

This morning a driver from Couriers Please seemed to manage it with a box twice the size, even with scanner in hand.

Complaint lodged with Australia Post.

My next frustration is that I can't start playing with it right away....
 

Offline max666

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #195 on: December 21, 2015, 11:38:27 pm »
I wipe down the spring and the inside of the glass tube with a bit of silicone spray lube after cleaning. Makes the solder less likely to stick, and easier to remove if it does.

I have an anti-stick spray for welding; I imagine that would work well too. I always thought that spray was silicone based, but it explicitly says no silicones on the can.

I assumed the plating on the tips (which you have to punch through) was lead-free solder, but it doesn't seem to be (my lead-free doesn't take)?  It's also not melting but instead starting to flake (break) off in places - is that normal?

Just checked my tip and it does look like the plating flaked off, however I remember that the solder never actually wetted to the tip, which surprised me at first, but it never impede the desoldering process as far as I can tell. Also if not wetting means the tip doesn't get eaten away as fast as on previous desoldering stations I had, then that's fine with me.
I desolder at 380 °C, seems to work best for me, it's fast and no clogging. I also accustomed myself to hold the trigger a little longer when I pull back, which also seems to help with clogging.

I find removing the barrel rather tricky(difficult). Is  there a "trick" to doing this that I might be missing?

Yes, removing and putting back the tube is rather tricky. I tend to push on the sledge in order to take force of the latch and then pull down the latch. Then I push the glass tube and everything back towards the latch and pull the glass tube out from the front. Back in reverse.

You could try re-hardening by heating to red and quenching in water.  It will then be brittle, so temper it by heating to straw colour and quenching again.

Yeah I tried that, well not entirely, I didn't bother with polishing and annealing ... let's just say it broke in one place while others were still ductile like copper ... I'm done with that spring  ::)

I don't think my solution for the spring will help others, but I had an old type spring lying around. That and a piece of aluminium foil in the back works just perfectly. No stuck solder lumps, no stuck solder on the filter and good continuous suction.



The plastic tube has some ridges in the back to hold the filter, the glass tube is supposed to be used with the new spring and the aluminium disc with the notches to hold back the filter. But I got the impression that the aluminium disc pressed against the filter and the build-up of the solder dramatically impacted suction after some time. So I'm using the glass tube with the old spring and an o-ring that just fits inside to hold back the filter ... I'm happy with it.
 

Offline Brumby

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #196 on: December 23, 2015, 12:48:36 pm »
Finally had a chance to check out my ZD985.

Seems I have the new glass tube  :-+  with the new spring and plate setup  :--




Here's how it looks in place:




After removing a dozen DIP ICs and a few headers - this is what it looked like...




After a second similar session, this is what the handpiece filter looked like - after removal of (most of) the solidified solder:



I'm not really enthusiastic about this.

The filter is open to direct impact from blobs of solder that can build up and reduce air flow.  I don't see any reason why that should need to be - other than cheap design.  The cost of replacement filters isn't the issue, just the frequency of replacement and how fiddly that is to do.

I'd be interested in trying something like the aluminium foil baffle by max666 - but with this new spring, I'll have to look at another way.

There is also the occasional vibration from the pump that jumps up in volume by what seems like 30dB or so.  I suspect Dave already picked this in his tear down - but I'm reluctant to open the unit at this stage to implement a fix, such as the one he suggested, even though there are no tamper indicating stickers.

Aside from that, the unit seems to be performing quite well - but I might need some more practice.
 

Offline krivx

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #197 on: December 23, 2015, 01:02:24 pm »
Anyone have a source for a better spring?
 

Offline SeanB

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #198 on: December 23, 2015, 03:28:11 pm »
You probably want to get some thin stainless steel mesh ( around 150grit I would guess) and cut out a few disks to place before the filter to keep it clean. That will catch the solder and it will not stick to the stainless steel.
 

Offline krivx

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #199 on: December 23, 2015, 03:49:17 pm »
 

Offline mikerj

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #200 on: December 23, 2015, 03:54:31 pm »
You probably want to get some thin stainless steel mesh ( around 150grit I would guess) and cut out a few disks to place before the filter to keep it clean. That will catch the solder and it will not stick to the stainless steel.

I was wondering if stainless wire wool could be useful as a filter/catcher? Cheap(relatively) and rather than having to clean a filter or spring you'd just repack with some fresh stuff.
 

Offline SeanB

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #201 on: December 23, 2015, 04:04:08 pm »
I used to use plain steel wire wool, it was cheap enough to throw away after use, though i did use the filter after it. The wire wool was easy to get, the filters from Weller's agents were not. Small piece rolled into a ball, then flattened and held by the spring.
 

Offline Brumby

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #202 on: December 24, 2015, 12:13:36 am »
I'd always use the filter - but the steel wool idea is appealing.  :-+

... it's cheap, easy, doesn't require any mods or detailed fabrication and has the promise of being quite effective.  I like it.
« Last Edit: December 24, 2015, 12:15:35 am by Brumby »
 

Offline SeanB

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #203 on: December 25, 2015, 06:50:42 am »
When we ran out of the Weller filters, and had them on back order, a few sheets of white gold ( the one in the small room with a white seat) stacked on top of each other, with a circle cut out using the tube as former, worked well enough.
 

Offline krivx

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #204 on: March 02, 2016, 01:07:38 pm »
Anyone have a source for a better spring?

I'm going to try the Aoyue part
http://www.ebay.com/itm/AOYUE-201252-FILTER-SPRING-DESOLDER-GUN-701-701A-474-474A-/251958663243

I forgot to update, this part is a perfect fit for the ZD985 and works very well.
 

Offline mos6502

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #205 on: March 07, 2016, 05:20:50 pm »
Cotton pads cut to size work just fine as a filter :-+
for(;;);
 

Offline torch

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #206 on: January 29, 2017, 04:44:12 am »
Dave,

I considered the unit that you have purchased but reports of poor quality gun quality put me off.

I bought a Hakko clone desoldering gun from Circuit Specialists CSI 474A). It performs very well and the gun feels solidly made. The solder tube is held securely in place with no air leaks.

I realize I'm dredging up a 4 year old discussion, but I would like to know how the CSI 474A has held up over the years?
 

Offline EHT

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #207 on: January 18, 2018, 08:40:06 pm »
I just got an Aoyue 474A++ desoldering station. Quite happy with the build of it and seems quite effective. Purchased from the official distributor in the UK.
 

Offline innkeeper

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #208 on: January 18, 2018, 09:38:05 pm »
got mine shipped from a distributor out of italy to the usa.
worked good since day one. i've had experience using a pace unit professionally
id say this unit cloggs no more or less then the pace unit.
good gang for the buck.

Hobbyist and a retired engineer and possibly a test equipment addict, though, searching for the equipment to test for that.
 

Offline orion242

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #209 on: January 19, 2018, 02:38:42 am »
Have the same and use it regularly for home use.  The biggest hassle I have is the glass section and not breaking it when cleaning.  Gravity is a bitch with concrete floors.  Nice thing, its piss cheap to replace.

The other issue I had is the heating element breaking from the hand held piece, seal was hosed.  Putting alot of force on it to bend leads straight for removal will hose it up over time.  Even then, I replaced the whole hand held gun for something like $40.  Hard to complain after a year or two of hard use.  Had mine since shortly after Dave released this video.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2018, 02:42:27 am by orion242 »
 

Offline orion242

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #210 on: January 19, 2018, 02:44:46 am »
I should add I also replaced the internal tubing this year.  It dried out and cracked, lost all suction.  Bit of a PITA, but again replaced it all with locally source tubing and it was back in action.
 

Offline torch

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #211 on: January 19, 2018, 10:47:31 am »
I've had the CSI 474A version for almost a year now. With spare filter pads and shipping, it was US$132 from Circuit Specialists. I'm just a hobbiest, so I don't use it a lot, but when I do, it's great! Way easier and faster than braid, suction bulbs or spring-loaded devices, no damage to traces and pads, no damage to components that weren't already damaged. Nevermind scavenging components, the greatest single use for this is lifting a lead to test suspect components out-of-circuit!  :-+

I will note that it does take 4 or 5 minutes to get up to temperature, and it seems to be happiest at or near the highest temperature setting. Low is just way too low. Maybe the intent is to keep it idling at a warm state between uses through the day? I don't use it that much so for me it would have been far more useful to put the power switch on the front instead of the rear. Now that the warranty is long gone, I may open it up to correct that oversight...

Early in this thread there was some discussion about the heating capacity of these things: No problem at all going from component to component stripping a board. For desoldering something on a large heatsink, my Hakko 888 in one hand with this in the other is a great combination.

I have the tightly wound spring and nothing seems to get past to the filter -- haven't had to change that yet -- but it can be a bear to clean out the spring at the narrow end. A smear of MIG welder anti-spatter gel on the spring sure helps though. My tube is opaque black plastic. I clean it out pretty much after every day of use, so glass isn't necessary and the black is unbreakable.

The vacuum indicator thingy is pretty but too short to be of much use, IMHO. It's a 1/4" hole and the red marker only comes 1/2 way even when the tip is completely sealed against something. I suppose it will let you know if the gun is clogged right up, but you will probably figure that out just from the difference in sound anyway.

Also, I keep the trigger pulled for several seconds after removing the tip from the joint to make sure all solder makes it all the way to the spring before it solidifies. I haven't had a clogged passage yet.

 

Offline fudmuffin

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #212 on: October 10, 2018, 02:09:01 pm »
I have had a ZD-985 for a few years (since Dave's video). Only big complaint so far is that the heating element part (i.e. barrel of the desoldering gun) can break off waaaay too easily with any medium level of sideways force, as is fairly common when doing circular motions around a stubborn pin while in contact with a board. In pulling the gun apart I see there is only a tiny T-shaped piece of plastic on each side preventing the barrel from bending sideways, and that's the part that keeps failing/breaking on me (so far I have had to buy 2 replacement guns). I'm sure the designers could do something to strengthen this part of the design. Great product otherwise!

edit: I've tightened a 32mm hose clamp around the join between the barrel and the handle part to help prevent it breaking again.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2018, 09:30:11 am by fudmuffin »
 

Offline fudmuffin

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #213 on: October 14, 2018, 09:26:24 am »
Does anyone know if there is a method to calibrate the ZD-985? I've just realised mine seems to be showing about 50c higher temp on the display than reality (measured with a FG-100 thermometer). Unfortunately I haven't yet found any reference to calibration in the instructions or anywhere online. Thanks for sharing if anyone knows.
 

Offline EJP

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Re: EEVblog #542 - ZD985 Desoldering Station
« Reply #214 on: August 14, 2019, 01:04:56 pm »
I agree, it does seem to read a little high, as does the matching 60W soldering station.

I've just discovered I have a cracked diaphragm in the vacuum pump. Does anybody know where/how to get a replacement? I've asked Rhino Tools and if they respond will advise here. The item seems like a pretty standard 1" part.
 


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