PCB design software with components autoplacers.

[nigelwright7557]

PCBCAD51 and PCBCAD360 available at https://www.murtonpikesystems.co.uk

Its been around since 1990 and been rewritten 3 times ! 8086 Assembler, Delphi pascal, C# then C++ for speed.
I have designed around 300 pcb's with it for my own projects.
Also done a few projects for other people.

[Spirit532]

Kinda pointless to buy something so obscure and unsupported that has less functionality and costs more than KiCAD($0)

[Mr. Scram]

Kinda pointless to buy something so obscure and unsupported that has less functionality and costs more than KiCAD($0)

Diversity doesn't hurt. KiCAD isn't quite perfect either.

[free_electron]

yikes. butt ugly schematics and symbols and a layout that is drawn by a 4 year old using finger paint.  no. thanks.

[exe]

I personally don't care about how it looks. For me only productivity matters. However, this website is one of the worst I've ever seen. It doesn't give even a single clue what it feels like to use this software. I also found zero youtube videos showing it in action.

[ebclr]

Apear to be simple, fast amd good value, I liked , Kicad is a mess

[nigelwright7557]

Kinda pointless to buy something so obscure and unsupported that has less functionality and costs more than KiCAD($0)

Diversity doesn't hurt. KiCAD isn't quite perfect either.

While KICAD is free and has great libraries it is very poor to use and its updates are bug ridden (admitted by their website)
PCBCAD51 has features not seen in much more expensive PCBCAD software.
It has gridded and gridless autorouters.
The auto component placers are a godsend.
The "swap autoplacer" very quickly swaps around components to find best net.
This means I can often route pcb's that I could never have done by hand.
I have sold around 3,000 copies so  its hardly obscure !
The software is FULLY supported by email and phone lines.
Also, updates are free permanently.

[Mechatrommer]

PCBCAD51 and PCBCAD360 available at https://www.murtonpikesystems.co.uk

I have sold around 3,000 copies so  its hardly obscure !
The software is FULLY supported by email and phone lines.

no download button for trial version?
no GUI screenshot?
no sample no help no nothing, just pay now buttons?
this is novel...

I have designed around 300 pcb's with it for my own projects.

you mean the latest pcb is this?.. (in https://www.eevblog.com/forum/microcontrollers/10-meg-sample-home-made-scope-project/?topicseen)

[nigelwright7557]

That pcb is just a prototype.
I have designed around 300 pcb's with the software.

The website gives a good description of the software and it many functions.
Its a lot of software for the money.
I did a demo version and no one was interested in it, they just wanted to buy it.
You can download demo from http://murtonpikesystems.co.uk.servepreview.net/pcbcad51demo.html

[Mechatrommer]

I did a demo version and no one was interested in it, they just wanted to buy it.
You can download demo from http://murtonpikesystems.co.uk.servepreview.net/pcbcad51demo.html

that is novel... of course no one interested because you dont provide the link in the main page... i wonder what is your main job?

[nigelwright7557]

I did a demo version and no one was interested in it, they just wanted to buy it.
You can download demo from http://murtonpikesystems.co.uk.servepreview.net/pcbcad51demo.html

that is novel... of course no one interested because you dont provide the link in the main page... i wonder what is your main job?

I did have the demo link on the page but there were no hits on it so I took it down.

I have been in electronics hardware and software design for 40 years+.

I have sold over 3,000 copies of PCBCAD software so the software cant be too bad !

As it is paid for software I can spend time improving the software as time goes on. You wont get that with free software.
KICAD make improvements but don't debug them for many months.
My software is guaranteed bug free, if I find a bug it is fixed same day.

[sn4k3]

why not eagle? It's free 

[Mechatrommer]

from youtube, i still can see one most noticeable bug... it looks a little bit oldish, i hope you can fix that to be more modern than GUI like Altium at least, or Cadence Allegro better, and then differential and length match routing supported? any example?

[Mr. Scram]

from youtube, i still can see one most noticeable bug... it looks a little bit oldish, i hope you can fix that to be more modern than GUI like Altium at least, or Cadence Allegro better, and then differential and length match routing supported? any example?

I'm pretty sure that's a feature. If you want slick GUIs that change every few years according to the latest fads, rent a big bucks EDA.

[nigelwright7557]

from youtube, i still can see one most noticeable bug... it looks a little bit oldish, i hope you can fix that to be more modern than GUI like Altium at least, or Cadence Allegro better, and then differential and length match routing supported? any example?

It cant be a bug if it is deliberate !
I could have added loads of tool bars etc but decided I preferred the screen real estate would be better used for the schematic or pcb.
All functions are either on the menu, the toolbar or right click context menu's or short cut key presses.

A major failing of a lot of pcbcad packages is fine scale SMD snapping.
They allow snap to grid but its usually to part of inches or mm. Trying to do it freehand is very messy.
A recent addition I found invaluable when working with SMD was the ability to route/snap  a track backwards or forwards to an off grid SMD pin.
It turned a messy SMD layout into an excellent layout.

[Spirit532]

I don't see any features in your software that don't work flawlessly(and without bugs) in KiCAD, Eagle(shudder), PADS, Altium, etc. I have been using KiCAD with minimal issues(if any) for the last few years. There are some pet peeves, but your software seems to just have the same quirks, but magnified.

The schematic entry looks painfully ugly, and the PCB layout seems to lack any modern features.
All of the aforementioned design packages let you freehand off-grid with some tweaks, but freehanding is a wonderful way to violate DRC(does your software even have a full DRC system?) and screw up the board, as I have done a few times.
The autorouter is not very useful for anything remotely complex, and simple boards... well, if you're lazy, I suppose.

I see no instruction manual, I see no tutorial videos, only a few demos showing... how it looks like(which is abysmal, but I'd be willing to let that go if it had superior features).

I also somehow doubt you've sold anywhere close to 3000 copies of this at full price.

[nigelwright7557]

That pcb is just a prototype.
I have designed around 300 pcb's with the software.

After 300 PCBs and you still design PCBs like that? You must be Treez's brother.

It was just a quick and dirty pcb for a prototype.
With the onset of $2 Chinese pcb's it doesn't really matter.
Proof of concept doesn't need an amazing pcb.
Here is my next version but still needs a little tweaking.
The SMD tracks are laid out much neater.

[Mechatrommer]

from youtube, i still can see one most noticeable bug... it looks a little bit oldish, i hope you can fix that to be more modern than GUI like Altium at least, or Cadence Allegro better, and then differential and length match routing supported? any example?

I'm pretty sure that's a feature. If you want slick GUIs that change every few years according to the latest fads, rent a big bucks EDA.

unfortunately i already have one.. those 'sarcasm' well, is really meant as costructive comment, if he really want to make some improvement on it.. btw i have not done up to 300 pcbs yet, maybe something like 10-20 pcbs only, i must be really young and newbie in this,..

otoh, i must be really careful not to put the OP off, like the earlier germany eda developer who took people c&c negatively and swore by his creation..he has better more polished gui and website and youtube videos how to btw except functionalities.. i forgot the  eda name already, but he didnt claim 3000 sales....

[Mr. Scram]

unfortunately i already have one.. those 'sarcasm' well, is really meant as costructive comment, if he really want to make some improvement on it.. btw i have not done up to 300 pcbs yet, maybe something like 10-20 pcbs only, i must be really young and newbie in this,..

otoh, i must be really careful not to put the OP off, like the earlier germany eda developer who took people c&c negatively and swore by his creation..he has better more polished gui and website and youtube videos how to btw except functionalities.. i forgot the  eda name already, but he didnt claim 3000 sales....

It's important to distinguish between choice and error. Reporting the GUI as a bug when it's obviously a deliberate choice isn't very helpful. Ragging on OP isn't either. Suggesting something like better examples  could be helpful, but I get the feeling most people don't intend to be helpful at all. If it's not for you, it may be best to just move along.

[Mechatrommer]

i believe you mixed up with that hand sketched dso pcb thread..

[maginnovision]

I look at that screen shot and it's hard on my eyes. The blue or green(not sure) keeps changing colors on me. Parts of your tracks are hidden some don't seem to connect with vias where they should... It's just too ugly to ever bother blindly switching from what I know. I'm not sure if I'm seeing software issues or designer issues. Best of luck but I'll never touch it.

[Zucca]

1) redesign your website and put some youtube video of yours unique super functions.... .
2) wait some days to see if everything works properly.
3) come back here.

these are suggestions, do not take them as a personal attack.

[Spirit532]

That layout shot looks like garbage because it was autorouted. Poorly autorouted, to be specific. I spotted a few optimization issues after a few seconds of looking at it, which leads me to the conclusion that the autorouter is just playing "connect the dots" and has absolutely no optimization in place. Hell, even the FreeRoute Java autorouter that's used in KiCAD(unoficially and hasn't been supported for ages due to legal reasons) does a much better job with more complex boards.
And given how the manually routed boards look... well...

[exe]

I'd be happy with software optimized for _manual_ routing.

[nctnico]

And given how the manually routed boards look... well...

I'd assume that that is just how the person designed the board so you can't really blame the software for that. I think it would be nice if Dave (or Dave2) could do a quick review on this package.