You also failed to address my point that the authorities gave people unrealistic expectations by claiming it protected those around you and pushing it too hard.I didn't. It is just governments pushing back against mis-information in order to make people do the smart thing after all. You can try to find all kinds of government conspiracy theories behind it but in the end the general public is not informed enough to make the right decission so tell them something that makes them do the right thing anyway.Rubbish. We were told to get vaccinated to protect others which was a lie. Our government even mandated it for care home workers and they were going to also mandate it for all frontline NHS staff. Fortunately they realised it didn't prevent transmission and cancelled mandates. The authorities have pushed far more misinformation, than crackpots on the internet.
I prefer to stick to the hard evidence. I'll believe it when I see proper, randomised data to show it works.
It's nothing to to with being anti-vaccine. The eradication of smallpox proves vaccines do work and I would like to see polio eradicated too. The problem is, the authorities are seriously damaging their credibility by pushing vaccines with weak evidence and making false claims.
I see and read the facts debated immediately, here. Similar to other venues or blogs.
About every time, there can be a quick SKIP;...mention of a 'MISINFORMATION' dynamic 'OUT THERE', very brief and then on with the, uh, FACTS, as you see them.
No disrespect intended, to those making points here, but this is equivalent of, borrowing a legal phrase; factual and intellectual equivalent to a 'Court Mistrial, declared by a judge'...that is, the verbal or written exchanges are so riddled with stubborn and partisan phrases and cliches as render the whole pile as 'unresolvable'! (Sorry)
Sorry, no definitive 'facts' stated.
Sorry, 'Fake News' is not a definitive declaration...just the opposite.
And in the U.S. now, we don't even enjoy the luxury of an 'honest' departure from an airplane or helicopter...all staged complete with 'fake' luggage hauled around, supposedly to block views of stumbles......
You also failed to address my point that the authorities gave people unrealistic expectations by claiming it protected those around you and pushing it too hard.I didn't. It is just governments pushing back against mis-information in order to make people do the smart thing after all. You can try to find all kinds of government conspiracy theories behind it but in the end the general public is not informed enough to make the right decission so tell them something that makes them do the right thing anyway.Rubbish. We were told to get vaccinated to protect others which was a lie. Our government even mandated it for care home workers and they were going to also mandate it for all frontline NHS staff. Fortunately they realised it didn't prevent transmission and cancelled mandates. The authorities have pushed far more misinformation, than crackpots on the internet.
I prefer to stick to the hard evidence. I'll believe it when I see proper, randomised data to show it works.
It's nothing to to with being anti-vaccine. The eradication of smallpox proves vaccines do work and I would like to see polio eradicated too. The problem is, the authorities are seriously damaging their credibility by pushing vaccines with weak evidence and making false claims.Sorry, but you are having exactly the unrealistic expectations I was writing about. As you wrote before respiratory virusses mutate quickly. Therefore these virusses can not be erradicated like measles, polio, smallpox, etc. So expecting vaccines to erradicate respiratory virusses is not going to happen and nobody ever promised that (if you listen/read carefully).
However, vaccines against respiratory virusses do help to prevent people from getting very ill, which in turn reduces the amount of virus particles infected people spread which then leads to slowing down the spread of respiratory virusses (with a better chance of keeping the reproduction rate below 1). So in short: vaccines which target respiratory virusses do help to slow down spreading and are preventing people from becoming seriously ill. In what way is that bad or even a lie?
Then there's all the other misinformation exaggerating the efficacy of masks, keeping 2m apart etc. which lacked rigorous evidence to support and the authoritarian policies copied from Communist China. It appears as though the public health authorities did their level best to destroy their reputation.
What a silly analogy. Most people can understand the difference between getting a cold and pneumonia.
This has beend debated before. You are right about respiratory viruses mutating a lot (hence the big outbreak every 100 or so years and 'flu' vaccines needing adjustment for every flu season) but you are wrong about good respiratory vaccinations not being effective at all. The main problem is that the general public doesn't understand what kind of level of protection to expect from getting vaccinated due to all the mis-information being spread. The truth is that getting vaccinated for any dissease doesn't mean you won't get sick; just not seriously ill to a near 100% number of cases. The cancer called social media however zooms in on the 0.00000001% getting seriously ill (usually combined with other medical issues which are left out) and claiming the vaccines are not effective at all in order to generate more views and money. Add in some government conspiracies paid for by dubious sources and the chaos is complete.
This has beend debated before. You are right about respiratory viruses mutating a lot (hence the big outbreak every 100 or so years and 'flu' vaccines needing adjustment for every flu season) but you are wrong about good respiratory vaccinations not being effective at all. The main problem is that the general public doesn't understand what kind of level of protection to expect from getting vaccinated due to all the mis-information being spread. The truth is that getting vaccinated for any dissease doesn't mean you won't get sick; just not seriously ill to a near 100% number of cases. The cancer called social media however zooms in on the 0.00000001% getting seriously ill (usually combined with other medical issues which are left out) and claiming the vaccines are not effective at all in order to generate more views and money. Add in some government conspiracies paid for by dubious sources and the chaos is complete.I have to agree with this.
I am not going to intervene because there are certain topics I avoid because they are like religion. You cannot reason.
But I have my own data to contribute. I was recently traveling in France and took a flight back from Paris to Madrid with a low cost airline I had never heard of before, Transavia, motto: we unite French rudeness with Spanish inefficiency!
There was a woman a couple seats over coughing a lot. I joked with my wife that she was going to give us all the Covid. Well, I do not know if it was her but a few days later, bam!, I get a terrible flu and I am bed-ridden with high fever for three days and the test confirms it is Covid. Today is the second day I am up and about the house. Still coughing and runny nose but the terrible pain all over the body is mostly gone. And I can't smell the coffee!
It is ironic that I did not get it until now. I have taken all the vaccines and I suppose that might have helped with the fight. I am still weak and I expect to be locked up at home for the rest of the week.
Maybe I should have complained to the airline about the coughing woman. Too late though.
The vaccines don't stop you from getting Covid entirely. Just prepare your immune system so you get less sick.
Nothing has changed since the thread on masks was terminated by moderators.
Even the moderators have little idea of what they are discussing.
The Public Health statements and commentary I have heard in the last few years have not made authorities more believable.
They even referred to Modified RNA as mRNA (mRNA was previously known as messenger RNA for over 50 years) Which added to the confusion,
As someone who has supervised the Respiratory Protection Programs for probably thousands of workers. I am baffled at the paths the so called Experts took us on.
However, you can't just look at the technical aspects where it comes to a pandemic. You have to look at the sociological side as well. The general public wants an answer and wants to take some action to protect themselves. This is where the surgical face masks come in. Even though these are intended to limit outgoing particles and do little against incoming, having people wear them makes them feel safe. You should not underestimate the effect of that from a social perspective. It is better than suggesting people to inject themselves with toilet cleaner like Trump did.
Using the surgical fase masks is also amplified by some Asian countries where they had the SARS outbreak many years ago. I just got back from Taiwan and there is a significant number of people (mostly elderly) wearing surgical face masks in public. Is it useful? Not so much. Does it make them feel better? Yes.
Dr. Barb Petersen, a dairy veterinarian in Amarillo who’d been caring for cows sick with the H5N1 strain of the bird flu in March, told NBC News that at the same time, multiple dairy workers, and not just those who’d come in contact with sick cows, got sick.
Peterson said, “People had some classic flu-like symptoms, including high fever, sweating at night, chills, lower back pain.” In addition to symptoms such as vomiting and diarrhea, Petersen said, “they also tended to have pretty severe conjunctivitis and swelling of their eyelids.” Despite these symptoms, those workers weren’t tested for H5N1.
Those reported ailments, a worker’s testing positive for bird flu infection and the more recent discovery of virus fragments in pasteurized milk being sold to consumers should together serve as our wake-up call that bird flu is evolving. Consumers and government agencies should be just as concerned as virologists are.
In the absence of fundamental changes to agriculture, if we continue to subsidize factory farms that raise billions of animals in disease-ridden conditions and animals and workers alike get sick, we could be sowing the seeds of calamity.
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Did anyone consider the sociological result of lying to the public??? (maybe)
Did Trump actually say to inject yourself with Bleach or Toilet Cleaner??? He did not. Your comment here is politically based.
I regret that you have been successfully indoctrinated to believe things that are not truthful at all.
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However, you can't just look at the technical aspects where it comes to a pandemic. You have to look at the sociological side as well. The general public wants an answer and wants to take some action to protect themselves. This is where the surgical face masks come in. Even though these are intended to limit outgoing particles and do little against incoming, having people wear them makes them feel safe. You should not underestimate the effect of that from a social perspective. It is better than suggesting people to inject themselves with toilet cleaner like Trump did.
...
https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-opinion/bird-flu-spreading-milk-cows-rcna148803QuoteDr. Barb Petersen, a dairy veterinarian in Amarillo who’d been caring for cows sick with the H5N1 strain of the bird flu in March, told NBC News that at the same time, multiple dairy workers, and not just those who’d come in contact with sick cows, got sick.
Peterson said, “People had some classic flu-like symptoms, including high fever, sweating at night, chills, lower back pain.” In addition to symptoms such as vomiting and diarrhea, Petersen said, “they also tended to have pretty severe conjunctivitis and swelling of their eyelids.” Despite these symptoms, those workers weren’t tested for H5N1.
Those reported ailments, a worker’s testing positive for bird flu infection and the more recent discovery of virus fragments in pasteurized milk being sold to consumers should together serve as our wake-up call that bird flu is evolving. Consumers and government agencies should be just as concerned as virologists are.The 2009 H1N1 swine flu should have been a call to phase out factory farming. Now we're potentially dealing with a much worse virus and not enough time to smoothly transition to sustainable farming.QuoteIn the absence of fundamental changes to agriculture, if we continue to subsidize factory farms that raise billions of animals in disease-ridden conditions and animals and workers alike get sick, we could be sowing the seeds of calamity.Indeed, factory farms are pretty much the ideal way to spread disease.
Someone has to look at the technical aspects, if we don't do that we are functioning as an Unscientific,"Magically" based society.
ACTUALLY; No, that wasn't a 'BBC VIDEO' that was a written summary by editorial board.
So, to 'clarify' that clarification; NO, that's not correct, although the words of Former President Trump were to the effect of a casual questioning suggestion, that being an idea tossed out there, to doctor:
"Please check if something SIMILAR to direct injection might work, as direct injection knocks down things effectively". (Paraphrased by myself here).
More election season 2024 crapola.
'Zealots'...I'll accept a traditionally used term like that. At least it's not the language butchered and tortuous twist of words usually seen lately, (like the 'misinformation' smears employed lately).
How about, instead further twisting the non-video words, of Former President Trump, (i.e. now he seems to have spoken about GUNS), maybe someone can, in actuality, produce that supposed video. Next thing you will be concluding the talk was about 'shooting missles' into the body.
One thing about this election year season; the propaganda slingers have managed to teach the general public, to do their work, smears and mis-statements. Old school propaganda was usually a special niche, media experts and all.