Why are people angry at Greece? What is going on in the EU

[VladKEasternTiger]

Hi everyone, okay this has nothing to do with electronics, from last week I been speaking to a lot of people in real life and online and yes Ive seen the riots in Greece but why are people angry with this particular country, its not only this country, the peope ive spoken to were general people i.e. taxi drivers, hair dressers, shop keepers, traders in my country the UK and all off them are very angry with the southern european countries such as Italy, Spain, Greece. I got mixed answers from them when I asked, so if people can explain in leymans terms why people are mad at these countries id appreciate it? Im not a politics person so no big words. Sure I know what Hung parliament means could I ever get away from that phrase  

[Simon]

I think the countries you mention had to buy into the euro. I know Italy certainly paid the EU to enter the euro because it's economy did not meet the euro requirements, personally I saw this as a contradiction but then maybe we are seeing the result of that very contradiction. It might mean help for those countries for fear of crashing this precious currency for all but really if they had to pay to be in it I can't see the point, economically or politically.

I think the biggest disaster is that the people of the country who have no fault will have to pay the bill and this is what makes them very angry

[charliex]

Because people are generally sheep, know very little about the running of the world, believe the media, and don't want to think too much. You just blame what seems obvious, and most people will be ok with it.

Its always fascinated me how easily entire populations are lead around by the nose by advertising and commerce, fish in a barrell.

[Simon]

Because people are generally sheep, know very little about the running of the world, believe the media, and don't want to think too much. You just blame what seems obvious, and most people will be ok with it.

Its always fascinated me how easily entire populations are lead around by the nose by advertising and commerce, fish in a barrell.

very true and one of the reasons I don't have a television, because i don't particularly have time for the unrealistic view it gives of the world and the catching adds and headlines that are in fact very shallow.

[Kiriakos-GR]

Every country has two or more political groups .

Those groups trying to prove that they have deferent philosophy - views - believes

Every group uses the media to create impressions , gain the public interest, and with it voters.

The long story sort ,  we should stop the bankers from playing "the masters of the universe" .
The weakness of our politicians "world wide" are that they get payed by the bankers .
And they do not care for the interest of their own country men .
They politicians had build special laws , and they can stay protected by them,
even if they do the biggest crimes.

My only advice to the young people are , to go forward and involve them selfs with politics,
they should learn few basics, about the state it self , how it operates.
Only then,  they will be able to judge what is right and what is not , and by their force ( Vote ),
to fight and change any injustice of the system.

Staying home .. watching TV ... trusting unworthy people ... soon enough your country will be called as Greece too. 

       

[kc1980]

The island of Mykonos is being auctioned on Ebay!!  Hurry up and bid folks. 

[EEVblog]

Because Greece got their debts called in first. That's what happens when you continually live on credit and beyond your means in a crazy illusionary worldwide monetary system. The rest of the world is no different, it's just that Greece got caught out first, rotten luck. My money was on the US going belly up first, guess I lost that one.

Dave.

[Kiriakos-GR]

debts and credit are tools.
Powerful to help, or to cause distraction.

I have a dept of 8000 EUR on two credit cards, card holder for 10 years.
My Status was good , at the two first years, then I stayed with out stable work for 4 years ,
I had to get cash from the card to pay the card, so to avoid temporarily the problem.
The word "temporarily" lasted longer than expected.
The last 3 years  I have hide my self, in one program against unemployment.
Half payment than a real job.
Even so I was able to keep my Bank happy , and from time to time I gain some extra cash from doing repairs of electronics - computer repairs - or installing small networks .

In six months from now, the program stops , and there is no way , to become an permanent worker,
in the factory that I work as electrician , that it haves to do with the national defense.      
 
I own a shop , (property of my father - died ) ,  its full of tools , and even today I am still buying  
and so , I am hopping that I will use it , as my only hope, to deal the future.

Now , by all the country to be economically suppressed , please tell me , how I can survive even as an freelancer , when the man next door are dry too ?

The factories releasing people , not hiring .. and everything statical as frozen movie.

I am not going to move else ware ,  I am from the crazy ones, who gives their blood for the flag,
until the last drop.

I am not aware the size of the crimes that the Americans like Leeman brothers, and other jerks had play over my country ,
but no one will touch Greece as long  we are  10.000.000 of crazy ones , with 100.000 as army forces.  

I will pay all my dept , if I get the chance.

But even so , I am not loosing my humor , and I will continue to tease you, and give you Hell.. with the quality of my English   

[flolic]

In my country, when you have money problem people will often tell you that 'you are in debt like Greece'.
And that is very old saying, so problem is obviously not new. 

(I am not saying that my country is any better, actually I believe that we are in much deeper sh*t). 

[Kiriakos-GR]

well, i'm not entirily sure whats going on here. but what i'm really certain is... POLITIC SUCKS !!!!

Thats why I am advising the young people mostly , and everyone who likes to call him self as a " citizen ",
to act properly as " citizen " , and spent some time of his daily life , so to help the "Democracy" to operate correctly , and to baby seat it , so to remain " Healthy ".

The "Democracy" its like a little flower ,  needs work and care , so to remain healthy.
The " citizens " should always act as guardians of it, and  be in a " surveillance mode ".

The corrupted Politicians , its a known issue ,  If all of us are staying home and not interfere with the operation of our own countries, we open the door to " corruption ".  

Greece, no matter the troubles right now , it will recover , it always does .

The damage would be mostly ,  the delay of catching up again , one productive rhythm ,
that will guaranty the prosperity of every one who lives in the country.


I am well informed , about the problems that other countries haves too.
Political or financial ..

Greece even as one small geographical location, always was first in the line , to help others..
By sending  Doctors  and supplies, or even cash, to any one in need worldwide .
Today it needs our "own"  Help , and it will have it.  

Also problems like this, are always one good opportunity to "test" your "Friends" worldwide ..    
( In a Countries level )

And In a Countries level ,  I can not hide my negative feelings about the  "British - English- UK " politicians.
They feel safe staying next to the European Union,  but they do not helping it.
Looks to be sold out to the enemies of the European union .        




 


  

[EEVblog]

It's kind of like negative gearing an investment property. You can only win if things keep going well and you hop off the merry-go-round at the right time.
The US are ultimately screwed too, it's just a matter of time. It's easy fixed though, just pull the troops out of the fake war, scrap the nuke budget, and then pay off that Chinese debt.

Dave.

[Kiriakos-GR]

From the today head lines, the News are very positive for the European currency and everyone related to it.

I agree that US are ultimately screwed too, but they have not learn anything from the past,
and this is worrying me the most.
 
With all those fake wars and hostile financial games , they damage the positive profile ,
of any proud American citizen, who is peaceful, creative, and honest as individual.


No I am not going to scream  " Make Sex " and no War ...  but having Sex its not a bad idea  

[Simon]

No I am not going to scream  " Make Sex " and no War ...  but having Sex its not a bad idea  

well it's the one pleasurable activity that does not cost.

[kc1980]

Well, if anything, the global economic slowdown is somewhat curbing our relentless raping of our planet's natural resources.  If only we were a prudent species who had the foresight and discipline to used this economic lull as an opportunity to reign back excessive consumption and war-mongering. 

It is entirely possible -- but not plausible --  for all nations to agree to stop military spending and invest the saving directly into healthcare, public infrastructure, R&D, etc.  Overwhelmingly, technological progress enables humans to enjoy a high standard of living.  It is also true that as a nation's standard of living increases, the nation's birth rate decreases, which improves the per-capita wealth -- in real terms.  So, why don't we invest in the things that foster innovation?  Because our existing economy rewards short-term capital gains and penalizes long-term investments.  And, fundamentally, the goal of "the system" is not to maximize human happiness.  The "invisible hand" needs a brain and pair of eyes.

The Western world is not a populist democracy; instead, it is a democracy consisting of exceedingly powerful institutions and interest groups.

Off my soapbox...

[Simon]

It is entirely possible -- but not plausible --  for all nations to agree to stop military spending and invest the saving directly into healthcare, public infrastructure, R&D, etc.  Overwhelmingly, technological progress enables humans to enjoy a high standard of living.  It is also true that as a nation's standard of living increases, the nation's birth rate decreases, which improves the per-capita wealth -- in real terms. 
Off my soapbox...

well might not be the case in the UK where having children is a good money earner with our current welfare system, so we have lots of children who are not really brought up very well running around with the best they can get of technology (which is ever cheaper due to the high turnover of technological sales and the high speed at which goods are thrown away even in this recession) but without the foggiest how any of it works and with very little basic skills in life.

[hans]

I reckon it is impossible to stop military spending at all. Here in holland we had a very big issue, as our international image was damaged, when was announced we as a country will pull our troops back out of Afghanistan. Personally I find it important to do this kind of stuff, to stabilize a country if possible. Still though, I thought the decision to pull back was good as well because there wasn't so much happening in that way, just a lot of fighting instead of building. Sadly military is also for fighting, partly for defending. Some abuse this as a cover (look at Korea or something).

Anyway, what I think went wrong in Greece is just a complete wrong set of 'rules' in the government hold up for way too long. I read through some of the facts a few days back and I was stunned. I believe you can get out of work when you're 53 years old there. We're already debating whether we should raise the age in our country to 67 (even some say 68!) instead of 65. Now that's a whole different story.

I also believe government people get paid for like 13 and 14 months. Personally I find that the biggest piece of arrogance I have ever seen. I have never heard that people get a 14 month here. I didn't even know companies would pay a 13 month at all here. If you were unlucky, they didn't pay you at all. What gives them the right to even think of having a 13month salary?! I don't know who told all of those people to be mad about it, but I don't see the point. Must be some kind of nationwide brainwashing, because I don't see any lunacy in this at all.

What I do know is that the government has been spending way more than they could for a lot of years. Now that's actually illegal when it's a state of the EU , because you may only spend like 3% more than you have for income. So they lied about it. All of this leads to huge debts, which leads to less trust, which leads to high rates, which leads to even higher costs, more debts, and the circle continues. So the government is cutting costs quite dramatically for them, but at the same time; we pay about the same amount of tax in Holland too. So it's all about the change I think that's so drastic, rather than the result is really that bad. We live like this for years, and some complain, but not like this scale at all.

[Simon]

I also believe government people get paid for like 13 and 14 months. Personally I find that the biggest piece of arrogance I have ever seen. I have never heard that people get a 14 month here. I didn't even know companies would pay a 13 month at all here. If you were unlucky, they didn't pay you at all. What gives them the right to even think of having a 13month salary?! I don't know who told all of those people to be mad about it, but I don't see the point. Must be some kind of nationwide brainwashing, because I don't see any lunacy in this at all.

go easy on that one, I don't know about Greek working regs but in Italy when I finally got a legal job I was paid a 13th wage and some people like dustmen got a 14th, it was handy as it was in December so helped with general xmas and winter expenses, but then i don't know if this is a rule for the whole of Greece or just higher paid jobs. It is easy to make something you don't know everything about look bad by exposing snippets of truth instead of the full picture

[hans]

It's only for people with wages of 2500+ euro per month.

Personally I find people (these are, people with higher incomes that will lose some of it) shouldn't be complaining too much about 13 and 14 months. If you would be getting it all the time, then add it to the basic wage instead of calling it a 13 and 14 month. I personally see it as a bonus right now, and I think there are enough reasons to hate it at this moment.

It might also be because I'm also a bit jealous of how less tax they paid in the last years in a way of personal gain. Now their government has some very deep trouble though, so that jealously is quickly gone. But really, I think people should understand that the economy is having it heavy, their government even more, the Euro (which is the economy); but all they are complaining about is their personal interest. Which is somewhat.. doubtful if it's the right thing

[Simon]

well I suppose giving it only to higher paid earners makes it a bit of a bonus but then it is probably calculated within their yearly wages. basically they may be getting less per month and then the 13 and 14th wage, what you need to look at is are they worth what they are paid

[kc1980]

Yeah, I try to remind myself not to be an idealist.  The fact of the matter is, the global military-industrial complex underpins our economy -- even during times of peace.  There's no way to get rid of it overnight as it would be a sure way to destroy the economy. 

Politics is all about threats and promises; they would be worthless without military might to back them up.  Also, much of the way we colonize the third-world these days is through proxy wars.

Bottom line:  Einstein was right -- "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."

[Simon]

Yeah, I try to remind myself not to be an idealist.  The fact of the matter is, the global military-industrial complex underpins our economy -- even during times of peace.  There's no way to get rid of it overnight as it would be a sure way to destroy the economy. 

Politics is all about threats and promises; they would be worthless without military might to back them up.  Also, much of the way we colonize the third-world these days is through proxy wars.

Bottom line:  Einstein was right -- "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."

I have a job due to the fact that the UK have ordered new tanks, ok we only do air-conditioning and radiators but we would be no more without military contracts, the commercial stuff is only just picking up

[Kiriakos-GR]

basically they may be getting less per month and then the 13 and 14th wage

This is how it works ...  its money that you had work for , kept all this months by your Boss,
and given back, every Christmas and Easter ...

If you were deposit your money at one bank ... you would probably get even some interest for all that time , that your money are in the bank.

The Greek workers , just get their money back ... and the only one who has any benefit, its your own Boss,
Imagine if some one has 50 workers or more ,  how convenient it is to hold all that money for several months .. and using them for his own interest !!   

[Polossatik]

No I am not going to scream  " Make Sex " and no War ...  but having Sex its not a bad idea  

well it's the one pleasurable activity that does not cost.

I assume you don't have any kids? 

[Kiriakos-GR]

No I am not going to scream  " Make Sex " and no War ...  but having Sex its not a bad idea  

well it's the one pleasurable activity that does not cost.

I assume you don't have any kids?  

Ok we all got it ..  Foreigners and locals    

What you probably does not aware, are the CAT III 600V condoms  

[DJPhil]

CAT III 600V condoms

Those would sell like hotcakes on thinkgeek. You might be on to something!
I can't help being curious now, I wonder what the breakdown voltage is for the average condom.