Author Topic: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.  (Read 937317 times)

0 Members and 9 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline CirclotronTopic starter

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3510
  • Country: au
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4975 on: December 28, 2025, 10:10:00 pm »
And for completeness there is the contraction of "is", which has nothing to do with the possessive but is written identically:

> The elephant's grumpy. (The elephant is grumpy.)
That example may be more of a spoken thing than a written thing.
But could vary from place to place of course.
 

Offline TimFox

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 11256
  • Country: us
  • Retired, now restoring antique test equipment
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4976 on: December 28, 2025, 10:40:06 pm »
His, her, and its are possessive pronouns, which are single words.
He's, she's, and it's are contractions of short phrases ending in "is"
Elephant's (as in the elephant's foot") is a possessive adjective, and may have originated as a contraction.
The oldest English grammar book in my collection is John Wallis's Grammar of the English Language (1653), [Tractatus De Loquela & Grammatica Linguae Anglicanaea], new edition with translation [from Latin] and summary by J A Kemp, Longman 1972.  See pp 305 - 308.
On p 308, "Some people believe that the s is added instead of the word his ... and that an apostrophe should always be inserted or at any rate understood" (translation).
« Last Edit: December 28, 2025, 10:46:57 pm by TimFox »
 

Online vk6zgo

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 8081
  • Country: au
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4977 on: December 28, 2025, 11:06:06 pm »
That is just laziness and always understood intent wise.  >:D

To be fully correct "it is" is what it is. The use of the apostrophe is to shorten it, like "do not" and "don't".

There will be many more of these things one can think of.

Both "its" and "it's" are valid and mean different things.  Technically both 'should' have apostrophes but one is omitted to avoid confusion.... except nobody remembers which is which.
Im going to guess like always and "its" is that 'it possesses' and "it's" is the contraction of "it is".

The confusing factor is that if something belongs to Fred it is written as Fred's, whereas if something belongs to an "it" it is "its".
If it belongs to Mr Menzies, it is Menzies'----aaarrrgggghhhh!
 

Online Analog Kid

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3991
  • Country: us
  • DANDY fan (Discretes Are Not Dead Yet)
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4978 on: December 28, 2025, 11:12:52 pm »
Quote
In fact the proper rule* is if the next word starts with the sound of a vowel, use 'an'.
Hotel? ? ? ?

Easy: that would properly be "a hotel", since the h is aspirated, not silent.
 

Offline woody

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 526
  • Country: nl
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4979 on: December 28, 2025, 11:15:48 pm »
Quote from: vk6zgo
The confusing factor is that if something belongs to Fred it is written as Fred's, whereas if something belongs to an "it" it is "its".
If it belongs to Mr Menzies, it is Menzies'----aaarrrgggghhhh!
Yeah, I often wonder how English became the lingua franca 😀
 

Offline TimFox

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 11256
  • Country: us
  • Retired, now restoring antique test equipment
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4980 on: December 28, 2025, 11:41:07 pm »
That is just laziness and always understood intent wise.  >:D

To be fully correct "it is" is what it is. The use of the apostrophe is to shorten it, like "do not" and "don't".

There will be many more of these things one can think of.

Both "its" and "it's" are valid and mean different things.  Technically both 'should' have apostrophes but one is omitted to avoid confusion.... except nobody remembers which is which.
Im going to guess like always and "its" is that 'it possesses' and "it's" is the contraction of "it is".

The confusing factor is that if something belongs to Fred it is written as Fred's, whereas if something belongs to an "it" it is "its".
If it belongs to Mr Menzies, it is Menzies'----aaarrrgggghhhh!

See my post above yours:  "its" is a single word possessive pronoun, "Fred's" is a possessive adjective made from a proper noun (Fred).
 

Offline langwadt

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 5453
  • Country: dk
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4981 on: December 29, 2025, 03:35:10 am »
Quote
In fact the proper rule* is if the next word starts with the sound of a vowel, use 'an'.
Hotel? ? ? ?

Easy: that would properly be "a hotel", since the h is aspirated, not silent.

yeh, a hotel, an hour
 

Offline CirclotronTopic starter

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3510
  • Country: au
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4982 on: December 29, 2025, 10:52:27 am »
So then, should the word "ain't" have an apostrophe or not?
 

Online Analog Kid

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3991
  • Country: us
  • DANDY fan (Discretes Are Not Dead Yet)
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4983 on: December 29, 2025, 10:59:56 am »
So then, should the word "ain't" have an apostrophe or not?

Definitely an apostrophe.
Perhaps @TimFox will be good enough to give us the reason for this. (I don't know the reason; I know "ain't" is some kind of contraction, but I'm too lazy to even get up and look in my dictionary.)
 

Offline paulca

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 5499
  • Country: gb
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4984 on: December 29, 2025, 11:30:56 am »
Nobody wants to take on:

I wrote an SQL script for an FPGA, but I need a P-SQL script for a DB.

Why do acronyms sometimes use "an" and sometimes "a".
"What could possibly go wrong?"
Current Open Projects:  STM32F411RE+ESP32+TFT for home IoT (NoT) projects.  Child's advent xmas countdown toy.  Digital audio routing board.
 

Offline SteveThackery

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2318
  • Country: gb
  • 50 year novice
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4985 on: December 29, 2025, 11:34:28 am »
So then, should the word "ain't" have an apostrophe or not?

Yes. It represents the missing 'o' from the last three letters: 'not". In this respect it is exactly like "isn't" (is not).

As for the "ai" at the front, I don't know. It's either from "are" (are not) or "is" (is not).
 

Offline SteveThackery

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2318
  • Country: gb
  • 50 year novice
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4986 on: December 29, 2025, 11:35:54 am »
Nobody wants to take on:

I wrote an SQL script for an FPGA, but I need a P-SQL script for a DB.

Why do acronyms sometimes use "an" and sometimes "a".

I've explained this already. The rule is: if it begins with the sound of a vowel, use "an", otherwise use "a".

> "SQL" begins with an 'e' sound, as in "egg", so "an SQL".   ('e' is a vowel)

> "FPGA" begins with an 'e' sound, as in "egg", so "an FPGA".   ('e' is a vowel) 

> "P-SQL" begins with a 'p' sound, as in "people", so "a P-SQL".   ('p' is a consonant)

> "DB" begins with a 'd' sound, as in "deep", so "a DB".   ('d' is a consonant)
« Last Edit: December 29, 2025, 02:07:52 pm by SteveThackery »
 

Offline TimFox

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 11256
  • Country: us
  • Retired, now restoring antique test equipment
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4987 on: December 29, 2025, 03:32:38 pm »
Nobody wants to take on:

I wrote an SQL script for an FPGA, but I need a P-SQL script for a DB.

Why do acronyms sometimes use "an" and sometimes "a".

Acronyms (e.g., a FET) are pronounceable words formed from abbreviations.  The usual a/an rule applies to the pronunciation of the word.  Regular abbreviations (e.g., an FPGA) use the article corresponding to the pronunciation of the first letter.
« Last Edit: December 29, 2025, 04:34:07 pm by TimFox »
 

Offline TimFox

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 11256
  • Country: us
  • Retired, now restoring antique test equipment
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4988 on: December 29, 2025, 03:37:21 pm »
So then, should the word "ain't" have an apostrophe or not?

Definitely an apostrophe.
Perhaps @TimFox will be good enough to give us the reason for this. (I don't know the reason; I know "ain't" is some kind of contraction, but I'm too lazy to even get up and look in my dictionary.)

I haven’t looked this up, but I assume “ain’t” started as a contraction of “am not”.  Personally, I think the first-person singular “I ain’t” fills the gap between “isn’t” and “aren’t” for the other persons, but pedantry still rules.  “He ain’t” is unnecessary, since “he isn’t” makes more sense.
 

Offline paulca

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 5499
  • Country: gb
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4989 on: December 29, 2025, 05:03:15 pm »
Nobody wants to take on:

I wrote an SQL script for an FPGA, but I need a P-SQL script for a DB.

Why do acronyms sometimes use "an" and sometimes "a".

Acronyms (e.g., a FET) are pronounceable words formed from abbreviations.  The usual a/an rule applies to the pronunciation of the word.  Regular abbreviations (e.g., an FPGA) use the article corresponding to the pronunciation of the first letter.

Also, those who say "seequil" instead of S.Q.L might say "A SQL statement"
"What could possibly go wrong?"
Current Open Projects:  STM32F411RE+ESP32+TFT for home IoT (NoT) projects.  Child's advent xmas countdown toy.  Digital audio routing board.
 

Offline TimFox

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 11256
  • Country: us
  • Retired, now restoring antique test equipment
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4990 on: December 29, 2025, 05:18:16 pm »
Nobody wants to take on:

I wrote an SQL script for an FPGA, but I need a P-SQL script for a DB.

Why do acronyms sometimes use "an" and sometimes "a".

Acronyms (e.g., a FET) are pronounceable words formed from abbreviations.  The usual a/an rule applies to the pronunciation of the word.  Regular abbreviations (e.g., an FPGA) use the article corresponding to the pronunciation of the first letter.

Also, those who say "seequil" instead of S.Q.L might say "A SQL statement"

I haven’t used SQL; does anyone pronounce it “squill”?
 

Offline shapirus

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2096
  • Country: ua
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4991 on: December 29, 2025, 05:47:11 pm »
I haven’t used SQL; does anyone pronounce it “squill”?
More like "sequel", I think. Never liked this one, always sounded weird to me.
 

Online NE666

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 665
  • Country: gb
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4992 on: December 29, 2025, 05:56:54 pm »
I used to work with SQL extensively (the query language, and the MS DB engine), within a number of companies during the late 90's through 2015, and I've never once heard anyone pronounce it 'squill'
 
In my experience it's always "S-Q-L" and "sequel", and quite interchangeably.
 

Online Analog Kid

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3991
  • Country: us
  • DANDY fan (Discretes Are Not Dead Yet)
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4993 on: December 29, 2025, 08:04:27 pm »
I haven’t used SQL; does anyone pronounce it “squill”?
More like "sequel", I think. Never liked this one, always sounded weird to me.

I never liked it either, but I always heard it (spoken by others and in my head reading the term) as "sequel".
Or perhaps "squeal" if the speaker was being derisive about it.
Nobody (for certain values of nobody) said "S-Q-L" to my recollection.
 

Online SiliconWizard

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 17203
  • Country: fr
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4994 on: December 29, 2025, 08:30:49 pm »
I've always said S-Q-L, but "sequel" seems to be common, at least in the US.
Americans like to pronounce abbreviations, even those that are unpronounceable, as words (adding imaginary vowels as needed). I think that's because abbreviations sound a lot "smoother" this way (so are much easier to pronounce) due to the way english speakers, and especially americans, tend to emphasize each letter of abbreviations pronounced letter-by-letter (more so than in some other languages). For instance, it's always "fun" to hear americans say "CPU" and how each letter is pronounced in a very detached way. Interesting that a pronounced "word" hasn't emerged from this one. Not sure what it would be. Sea-pyooh?  :-/O
 

Online Analog Kid

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3991
  • Country: us
  • DANDY fan (Discretes Are Not Dead Yet)
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4995 on: December 29, 2025, 08:34:17 pm »
Spoo.
Or spew.
« Last Edit: December 29, 2025, 09:58:21 pm by Analog Kid »
 

Offline shapirus

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2096
  • Country: ua
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4996 on: December 29, 2025, 09:49:53 pm »
and especially americans, tend to emphasize each letter of abbreviations pronounced letter-by-letter (more so than in some other languages).
Abbreviations that have double vowels are even better in this regard.

There are some with triple vowels, but I'm not sure how they're typically pronounced.
 

Offline TimFox

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 11256
  • Country: us
  • Retired, now restoring antique test equipment
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4997 on: December 29, 2025, 10:05:56 pm »
and especially americans, tend to emphasize each letter of abbreviations pronounced letter-by-letter (more so than in some other languages).
Abbreviations that have double vowels are even better in this regard.

There are some with triple vowels, but I'm not sure how they're typically pronounced.

"IEEE" is usually pronounced "eye-triple-ee".
 

Online Analog Kid

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3991
  • Country: us
  • DANDY fan (Discretes Are Not Dead Yet)
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4998 on: December 29, 2025, 10:22:44 pm »
In the US, most unions go by the letters of their name, with some exceptions:
  • IAMAW (International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers)
  • UMW (United Mine Workers)
  • IUMMSW (International Union of Mine, Mill and Smelter Workers)
  • IWW (Industrial Workers of the World)
  • UAW (United Auto Workers, sometimes known as just the "auto workers")
An exception is IATSE (International Association of Theatrical Stage Employees), which I've always heard called "eye-at-see".
 

Offline TimFox

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 11256
  • Country: us
  • Retired, now restoring antique test equipment
Re: Your pet peeve, technical or otherwise.
« Reply #4999 on: December 29, 2025, 10:33:59 pm »
The American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees (AFSCME) is often pronounced as an acronym.
 


Share me

Digg  Facebook  SlashDot  Delicious  Technorati  Twitter  Google  Yahoo
Smf