https://twitter.com/SHillforVegas/status/1398497136623247361QuoteCongratulations
@boringcompany
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@LVCVA
Loop capacity testing exceeded 4400 passengers per hour on Tuesday, confirmed today after reviewing results. #OnlyVegas
Congratulations
@boringcompany
-
@LVCVA
Loop capacity testing exceeded 4400 passengers per hour on Tuesday, confirmed today after reviewing results. #OnlyVegas
I think the long term goal here is small van like vehicles. That would increase capacity some. In any event many people don't understand Vegas from the comments seen here:
- Everything on the strip is an attraction. Corporations go out of their way to try new things there, that can be a new building facade or a new approach to transportation. The idea of course is to present a bit of the future and of course do the all important testing.
- Musk's underground solution is as much an attraction as anything else on the strip. However if developed in the right way it could actually be a very useful solution for a variety of city needs across the world.
- The Boaring Companies bid was extremely competitive. Beyond being a competitive bid, Vegas is an ideal place to bring potential customers to demo what is on offer. In a year or two I would expect purpose built vehicles to increase appeal to areas with real transportation problems.
- Vegas can be extremely hot in the summer, so comments about walking a few blocks can be seen as pretty silly. Been there and tried to do that
- Being underground means nothing ugly to influence the view tourists see.
- The comments about fires are completely off, especially if one is proposing that gasoline is a better solution. Beyond all of that most of the reported fires of Tesla's are due to stupid drivers crashing at high speed.
- Attacks on Musk and his accomplishments, do little to diminish the value of this project. It is as much an experiment in new transportation ideas as it is a fleshed out solution. Vegas frankly will be out far less money that with other ideas presented if it fails and for that 35 million they get another Vegas attraction.
https://twitter.com/SHillforVegas/status/1398497136623247361QuoteCongratulations
@boringcompany
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@LVCVA
Loop capacity testing exceeded 4400 passengers per hour on Tuesday, confirmed today after reviewing results. #OnlyVegas
Also the fanboys that are saying "But it will eventually do 120mph"
Science & Math:
120mph = 53m/s = let's call that 50m/s for simplicity
0 to 50m/s in let's say 10 seconds (which is really fast), or an acceleration of 5m/s² (½G) - very uncomfortable as a passenger, and impossible if you're sitting sideways
Distance traveled during 0 to 50m/s = ½at² = 0.5 * 5 * 10 * 10 = 250m
The tunnel is about 650m between stations, so that's
- 10 seconds ½G accel (250m)
- 3 seconds at top speed (150m)
- 10 seconds ½G deceleration (250m)
Oh, and as I've mentioned in another post, that 4400 number is actually 4x the normal pphpd number used to measure regular transit systems.
Also the fanboys that are saying "But it will eventually do 120mph"
Science & Math:
120mph = 53m/s = let's call that 50m/s for simplicity
0 to 50m/s in let's say 10 seconds (which is really fast), or an acceleration of 5m/s² (½G) - very uncomfortable as a passenger, and impossible if you're sitting sideways
Distance traveled during 0 to 50m/s = ½at² = 0.5 * 5 * 10 * 10 = 250m
The tunnel is about 650m between stations, so that's
- 10 seconds ½G accel (250m)
- 3 seconds at top speed (150m)
- 10 seconds ½G deceleration (250m)
For sceptics, 120 mph is a figure for longer tunnels . At no point of time there was any claim that existing segment will operate at 120 mph. So all you math does is fighting a straw man.
QuoteOh, and as I've mentioned in another post, that 4400 number is actually 4x the normal pphpd number used to measure regular transit systems.Isn't the number 2 times too high?
No, he's counting A-B and B-C simultaneously in each direction.
Firstly transit systems are not measured from each station, but the line as a whole (so that's 2x)
Secondly, transit systems are measured per direction. (that's another 2x).
No, he's counting A-B and B-C simultaneously in each direction.
Firstly transit systems are not measured from each station, but the line as a whole (so that's 2x)
Secondly, transit systems are measured per direction. (that's another 2x).I don't think it's true. You take a ride to where you want, there are no intermediate stops. So it can be A to B, B to C or A to C.
A-C passes through B, it's not a triangle.
No, the fan boys are still saying 120mph; even Vegas press are touting 155mph still for 'the loop' at the LVCVA.
The LVCVA itself said:
"...The innovative transportation system will allow convention attendees to be whisked across the LVCC’s 200-acre campus in just over one minute -- free of charge -- in all-electric Tesla vehicles capable of holding between 3 and 16 people..."
https://press.lvcva.com/Events/las-vegas-convention-center-makes-history-as-elon-musk-s-the-boring-company-begins-tunneling-the-des/s/a313340f-1f36-4dd7-a53b-76c399215586
"Just over a minute" to: start, accelerate, decelerate, slow to 15, accelerate, decelerate, stop, for 8/10ths of a mile (1.3km); and that's assuming not stopping in the middle. If you watch people's videos of this actually with real traffic from this week, you can already see the central station is a bottleneck, and cars waiting in the tunnel to enter.
Erica Johnson "First Look Inside Elon Musk's Underground Transportation System Beneath the Las Vegas Convention Center" LVCVA, 9 April 2021Quote from: LVCVA, 9 April 2021Vehicles have capacity to go 150 mph but will travel at 35-40 mph due to the short distance of the tunnels.
The LVCC Loop system — a three-station transportation system consisting of 1.7 miles of tunnel — was built in approximately one year (using the now-legacy Godot Tunnel Boring Machine). LVCC Loop's cost was approximately $47M (firm fixed pricing) for the two tunnels and three stations (two surface and one subsurface). Tunneling occurred during large conventions (>100,000 attendees pre-COVID) with zero road closures and zero attendee disturbances.
LVCC Loop connects the LVCC New Exhibit Hall with the existing campus (North/Central/South Halls), and reduces a 45 minute cross-campus walk time to approximately 2 minutes.
The LVCVA itself said:
"...The innovative transportation system will allow convention attendees to be whisked across the LVCC’s 200-acre campus in just over one minute -- free of charge -- in all-electric Tesla vehicles capable of holding between 3 and 16 people..."
https://press.lvcva.com/Events/las-vegas-convention-center-makes-history-as-elon-musk-s-the-boring-company-begins-tunneling-the-des/s/a313340f-1f36-4dd7-a53b-76c399215586
A-C passes through B, it's not a triangle.
Let's show it another way. Station B, in the middle, capacity 5 cars in any direction
car unload/load time = 45 seconds (rough guess)
car every 9 seconds, 400 cars/hour
3 people per car = 1200 persons/hour;
which is oddly close to my 1100 number.
Face it, you don't want to hear it, but in this case Elon has sold them snake oil.
The LVCVA itself said:
"...The innovative transportation system will allow convention attendees to be whisked across the LVCC’s 200-acre campus in just over one minute -- free of charge -- in all-electric Tesla vehicles capable of holding between 3 and 16 people..."
https://press.lvcva.com/Events/las-vegas-convention-center-makes-history-as-elon-musk-s-the-boring-company-begins-tunneling-the-des/s/a313340f-1f36-4dd7-a53b-76c399215586A-C passes through B, it's not a triangle.
Let's show it another way. Station B, in the middle, capacity 5 cars in any direction
car unload/load time = 45 seconds (rough guess)
car every 9 seconds, 400 cars/hour
3 people per car = 1200 persons/hour;
which is oddly close to my 1100 number.
Face it, you don't want to hear it, but in this case Elon has sold them snake oil.Are you really going to contradict your own information so hard to try prove a point?
Also if you read any of the other posts you'd know if The Boring Company does not meet contract requirements then LVCVA is barely paying anything. Particularly if you compare to similar project costs in the locality. Even for a "technology demonstrator" it has good value for money. LVCVA would be fools for not going with TBC.
As for your last statement, this is where the LVCVA may be wily like a fox. It's entirely possible they knew full well Elon couldnt deliver the pph, and chose this system for exactly that reason, realizing they could get most of what they wanted, for basically nothing. if the Boring company walk away from this (which wouldn't surprise me if they do), LVCVA can just put a moving walkway in there
yep, you're quite right, the 16 people was pure undelivered BS from Elon.
The 3 number I used is what is actually happening.
In reality it's a tad over 3 minutes (5:50 for a loop without stopping) https://youtu.be/-RPMt_FS-s8?t=284
As for your last statement, this is where the LVCVA may be wily like a fox. It's entirely possible they knew full well Elon couldnt deliver the pph, and chose this system for exactly that reason, realizing they could get most of what they wanted, for basically nothing. if the Boring company walk away from this (which wouldn't surprise me if they do), LVCVA can just put a moving walkway in there
The reality is that underground transport systems can easely be outperformed using a simple bicycle (let alone an electric bicycle). The effective speed of underground public transport is really low.
The reality is that underground transport systems can easely be outperformed using a simple bicycle (let alone an electric bicycle). The effective speed of underground public transport is really low.So, I looked up the speed of subway that I was taking on the daily basis in Budapest. The effective speed (with stops) is 32 Km/h. The average cycling speed 12.4 KM/h in the Netherlands.
Good on you for doing the maths Boffin but I think you're still missing my points here.
107s for fastest possible most aggressive driving versus 159s real demonstration video. I mean you did the calculation yourself using "real" physically achievable values and you are getting a "just under 2 minutes" number. What's the problem? It is unreasonable for them to have done a similar calculation and used that as an estimated/advertised result? This is hardly on the level of Solar Roadways and Batteriser.
I think the lack of critical thinking is to look at this as anything other than an amusement park ride. This is *LAS VEGAS*, where people build pyramids and Eiffel Tower replicas. The passengers don't care about how many seconds they save, they just want a fun ride from the convention to the casino, then to the show. The project is a success if it brings in more customers and they gamble away more money.
Well done, jumping in and not even understanding where this is.
People wont use this for a 'fun ride', not to the casino, nor to the show.
This is *not* open to the average Las Vegas visitor. This is a private connection between two sections of the Las Vegas convention centre, that are separated by Paradise Road, a major 6-lane north-south corridor running parallel, and just east of the 'strip'.
You may be right, but the Las Vegas Convention Center??? You mean the Las Vegas Convention Center where CES and so many other trade show events take place? Where I used to go annually for COMDEX (before that one shut down)? These trade shows bring in huge crowds, and OK, I guess the route doesn't hit the casinos, but the Loop is still there to encourage the trade-show visitors to come to Las Vegas. They go to the casinos, shows, strip-clubs, restaurants, hotels, etc, when the trade show lets out for the day. So what it it's not the most efficient people-mover?
https://twitter.com/SHillforVegas/status/1398497136623247361QuoteCongratulations
@boringcompany
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@LVCVA
Loop capacity testing exceeded 4400 passengers per hour on Tuesday, confirmed today after reviewing results. #OnlyVegas