REVIEW - Rigol DS2072 - First Impressions of the DS2000 series from Rigol

[Muxr]

cool, cheers!

[lr1234]

00.03.03.02.06  HighRes on > 1ms qause long freezes
with only 1 ch in use.

[arny]

00.03.03.02.06  HighRes on > 1ms qause long freezes
with only 1 ch in use.

its also freezes in dot mode.

[EV]

15 improvements and how many new mistakes??? 

[EV]

lr1234, arny or EV ; Did anybody roll back to previous FW version??

I have not but I can try it if you want. I think there is no problem to go back because the loader is the same.

[lr1234]

Downgrade to relative stable ver 00.03.03.01 do not work .
Some SCPI also.
Maybe He Xiaohua going to Siglent?

[EV]

I managed to load FW ver 00.03.03.01, but I had to do it twice. First time was not succesful. It was loaded quite short time and there was no system button under utility menu (or I did not find it).

[Muxr]

Pretty disappointing that they can't catch these issues before they release the firmware. You'd think their regression tests would have a frame rate / waveforms-per-sec test on all the common options. Kind of amateur hour if you ask me.

[marmad]

HighRes on > 1ms qause long freezes
with only 1 ch in use.

What memory setting(s)? Other pertinent settings?

BTW, do you understand that when you have HighRes on at > 1ms that the bandwidth of your DSO is less than 22kHz (much less if at even slower timebases)? Mostly useful only for specific things; i.e. audio work or low frequency.

its also freezes in dot mode.

What memory settings? Timebases?

If people want to report bugs, it's not very constructive unless you report any/all settings that it occurs with so that others can try to replicate it or find precise parameters.


EDIT: Actually, the bandwidth is less than 22kHz with HighRes >1ms/div. Changed above.

[lr1234]

Default settings,test signal on ch1
Memory auto
Only 1Ch enabled (for 2Gs/s)
 If HighRes or Dot Mode changing time base lover as 500us cause freeze.
2Gs/s memory arithmetic’s  with bugs.
Temporary help-  enabling second channel(2Gs/s/2)

[DD4DA]

Default settings,test signal on ch1
Memory auto
Only 1Ch enabled (for 2Gs/s)
 If HighRes or Dot Mode changing time base lover as 500us cause freeze.
2Gs/s memory arithmetic’s  with bugs.
Temporary help-  enabling second channel(2Gs/s/2)

Default settings,
deactivate CH2,
Any Signal on CH1,
Aquire->Mode "Hires"
Memory Auto (is a Default setting)

Move over SweepTime 500µs to 1000µs and back - Scope freezes or hangs in a Loop.

In my Scope DS2202, the entire scope freezes only in Hires-Mode, not in normal mode as i found out for now.

Gerd

[DD4DA]

Ich habe den Fehler an Rigol Deutschland gemeldet und die wiederum haben diesen an das R & D weitergegeben, nach dem Sie ihn nachvollziehen konnten. Ich muss schon sagen - das geht echt unkompliziert gut. Wieder ein Punkt der mir an Rigol gefällt. Bedenkt man die Komplexität dieses Messgerätes, so kann diese Fehlerart schon mal vorkommen. Wichtig ist es eben, dass sich der Hersteller sich diesem Fehler zur Brust nimmt. Ich kenne das auch anders.   

Ich hatte zu beginn diesen Fehler auch ohne HighRes erzeugen können. Das wiederholen des Flash-Vorgangs der gleichen Firmware erledigte den Fehler allerdings - jedenfalls habe ich ihn nicht mehr nachstellen können. Mit HighRes lässt er sich jedoch sehr gut und zuverlässig reproduzieren.
Was sich bei dieser Prozedur geändert haben könnte, vermag ich nicht zu beurteilen.
Mein DS2202 ist schon ein "Big Bang for a Buck" und gemessen am Preis bekommt man schon eine Menge Leistung geboten. Für ein R&S HAMEG muss man schon sehr viel mehr zahlen. Die I2C-Decoder Option habe ich dazu gekauft und wurde nicht entäuscht. Leider ist die Option CAN-Decode für mein Gerät nicht erhältlich - erst für die "A" Fassung. Daran hätte ich noch interesse gehabt. Derzeit löse ich es mit einem USB-Logikanalyser der diese Aufgabe auch gut meistert.

Einzig die Tastköpfe sind im 1:1 Betrieb mit 9Mhz Bandbreite sehr schmalbandig. Es gibt ja auch native 1:1 Tastköpfe die die 200Mhz schaffen oder man verwendet eben ein direktes Koaxkabel.

NUn, schauen wir mal was der kommende Update für uns bereit hält.

[Muxr]

Google translate did surprisingly well for me:

I have reported the bug to Rigol Germany and in turn have these passed on to the R & D, as they were able to understand him. I have to say - that's really straightforward good. Another point of what I like about Rigol. Bearing in mind this can fault occur, the complexity of this instrument before. It is important to specify that the manufacturer this error takes to the chest. I know the other way.

I had been able to start producing this error without HighRes. The repeat of the flash process the same firmware completed the mistake, however - at least I no longer have to readjust him. With HighRes he can, however, very good and reliable reproduce.
What could have changed in this procedure, I can not judge.
My DS2202 is already a "Big Bang for a Buck" and in terms of price do you get a lot of power on offer. For an R & S HAMEG you really have to pay a lot more. The I2C Decoder option I bought it and was not disappointed. Unfortunately, the option CAN Decode is not available for my device - only for the "A" version. That's what I would have been interested. Currently, I'll solve it with a USB logic analyzer of this task also copes well.

Only the probes are in 1: 1 mode with 9MHz very narrow bandwidth. There are also native 1: 1 probes that create the 200Mhz or you just used a direct coaxial cable.

Well, let's see what the upcoming update for us keeps ready.

[DD4DA]

some here response that the last firmware update 3.3.SP2 has a bug in Hires mode and a fallback to older firmware seems tobe impossible - me to.
Well, this is wrong  - there is a supported way available to install an older Version of firmware. I did that and my scope works as proper as before the 3.3.sp2 Update was installed.
The DS2202 HW Rev1 (without an A) has more options to update as just install the latest firmare on a Memory stick and start the Scope oder via System Menu option. The third way looks like an Update via boot-loader, instead installed operating system.
 
The description of this procedure is attachted this message and was released by RIGOL.

Beware - Do not remove the Memorystick until the Scope is response, that the update process is finished - especialy it looks like the scope don't do anything -  be sure, it do.

The CH1 Backlight switch blink's  about 2 Minutes after the update start and the access of the Memorystick will be do a couple of times.
Do not plug-in the Memorystick into the USB recepticle at boot time, instead follow the instruction.

I had downgrade my scope to 3.3.SP1 succesfully and reset then to the default values after downgrade process. No Hires bug is left - of course.
We still wait to the next firmware release and hope this will be in better quality.



Deutsch:

Nach dem einige Mittsteiter und "Leidensgenossen" vom HIRES-Acquire Fehler in der Firmware 3.3-SP2 berichteten und nachvollziehbar war, habe ich dieses Problem an Rigol weitergegeben.
Nun suchte ich nach einer legalen und unterstützten Möglichkeit die Vorgängerversion der Firmware 3.3-SP1 wieder einspielen zu können.  Der reguläre Weg über den vor dem Start eingestecktem Memorystick mit dem Updatefile, funktioniert offensichtlich nur bei gleicher oder neuerer Version möglich.
Der Weg über den Boot-Loader des Geräts lässt aber den Downgrade zu. Er ist leider wenig kommunikativ - also es ist Gedult angesagt.
Die Prozedur ist in dem angehangenem PDF von Rigol beschrieben. Dieser Weg hat sehr gut funktioniert und ich habe mein Gerät (DS2202) wieder mit 3.3-SP1 ausgestattet. Dieser Weg ist von Rigol unterstützt da er offiziell beschrieben ist. Bitte jedoch die nötige Sorgfalt walten lassen und GEDULDIG warten  bis der Update durch ist. Zu Begin könnte man meinen, dass nicht passiert (das emine ich mit wenig kommunikativ) aber es passiert was - da kann man sicher sein. Nach etwa 2 Minuten kann man viele kurze Zugriffe auf den Stick beobacheten und kurz danach ist das Flashen abgeschlossen.
Das erkennt man an der nun nicht mehr blinkenden CH1 Hintergrundbeleuchtung, die wärend des Updates blinkt. Den USB-Stick nicht beim Starten einstecken !!. Nach Abschluß des ersten Starts müssen die Default-Werte via Storage->Default eingesteltl werden, damit die Reaktion des Skope wieder nachvollziehbar sind.

So warten wir nun geduldig auf den nächsten Update, der hoffendlich etwas besser ausfällt. 

vy 73 de Gerhard, DD4DA

[DD4DA]

ILeider ist die Option CAN-Decode für mein Gerät nicht erhältlich - erst für die "A" Fassung.

the option CAN Decode is not available for my device - only for the "A" version.

I have DS2000 Non -A and here is CAN

Load the option Key for CAN

Check what version of FW,

Ich habe DS2000 Non -A und hier ist CAN Laden Sie die Wahltaste für CAN Überprüfen Sie, welche Version von FW

Well, does the 300Mhz option works? I would assume that this needs more different parts and the HW version 2 got them. The firmware maybe works, but none of the articles in this thread confirms the reliablity of the messurement at 300mhz bandwith with hw version 1.
Your Scope shows 100Mhz, 200Mhz, 300Mhz - i owen an DS2202 that works with 200Mhz bw and this shows just 200Mhz. 

DD4DA

[nbritton]

How many years of service do you figure you can get out of a 2000A? Am I right in assuming that the first thing to go on these is the capacitors in the power supply?

[Teneyes]

Am I right in assuming that the first thing to go on these is the capacitors in the power supply?

No, the caps are Ok
See Dave's tear down , at 5 min.


There were some failure points, but  corrections have been made in the production.
Time will tell

[EV]

Are there any FW updates after ver 00.03.03.02.06?

I have downgraded back to ver 00.03.03.01 as I told some posts ago.

[JDubU]

Are there any FW updates after ver 00.03.03.02.06?

I have downgraded back to ver 00.03.03.01 as I told some posts ago.

This page shows all of the current firmware versions:
http://beyondmeasure.rigoltech.com/acton/form/1579/0012:d-0001/1/index.htm

[EV]

This page shows all of the current firmware versions:
..

Thanks, so no new updates yet. The latest is that buggy one!

[Orange]

Was anyone successful in down grading from 03.03.02.06 to 03.03.01.00 firmware on a DS2000A?

[Godzil]

I have one question about the DS2000 series, I've bought mine 2 month ago, and I thinking about getting something to travel with my DSO, but of course the original box is not something really interesting for that and Batronix (its where I bought it) have an official bag from Rigol for that, but I've found nearly no information about it.

Does any of you own this bag, and what is your though about it?

And does anyone have another reference that would work for the DS2000?

Thanks

[Orange]

Was anyone successful in down grading from 03.03.02.06 to 03.03.01.00 firmware on a DS2000A?

Just an update.

On a DS2000 (non a) it is possible to down grade, I did this and works OK. Presumably the A models have a new boot loader installed.

[jhufford]

Now they're giving away all the advanced options (except bandwidth) on newly purchased scopes. To me, this removes all moral qualms about unlocking the bandwidth. Since memory and bandwidth are physically in the scope already it's not stealing to unlock them (few would think tearing the governor off of your car is stealing).. But getting the advanced decoding and triggers did seem like stealing, but now they're free! 

Which leaves the question: are they doing this to get rid of stock so they can come out with a new model? If so, will they start dropping the upfront price too? Anyone heard any whispers?

[Orange]

Now they're giving away all the advanced options (except bandwidth) on newly purchased scopes. To me, this removes all moral qualms about unlocking the bandwidth. Since memory and bandwidth are physically in the scope already it's not stealing to unlock them (few would think tearing the governor off of your car is stealing).. But getting the advanced decoding and triggers did seem like stealing, but now they're free! 

Which leaves the question: are they doing this to get rid of stock so they can come out with a new model? If so, will they start dropping the upfront price too? Anyone heard any whispers?

I never had any moral qualm as you call it. Companies don't have a moral, so why should I have this towards a company. To me its all in the game, RIGOL could have easily closed the loop hole, but they did not. In fact I suspect that RIGOL helped the guys that needed to unlock the scopes with hints and private keys, all too boost the sales. For example the DS1000Z license system was also suddenly unleashed with the help of an anonymous source.  That's now almost 2 years ago.

You might be right that RIGOL is soon coming with a new series, perhaps a 3000, with 4ch, 500MHz, 4Gsa/s for the same price as an 70MHz DS2000 (Wishful  thinking)
It could also be that they want to make live touch for Siglent, and make this DS2000 as attractive as possible.