REVIEW - Rigol DS2072 - First Impressions of the DS2000 series from Rigol

[Hydrawerk]

The graph looks good.

[martinv]

I have a DS2072 and am finding I may have a need to do CAN decoding.  It appears this is not available on the DS2000 Series, but is available on the DS4000 series. 
I'm wondering what the chances are that CAN decoding will become available on the DS2000 series? 

The price is a little scary.  At least it's not as scary as Flexray!

http://www.tequipment.net/RigolSD-CAN-DS4.html

[Pinkus]

I have a DS2072 and am finding I may have a need to do CAN decoding.  It appears this is not available on the DS2000 Series, but is available on the DS4000 series. 
I'm wondering what the chances are that CAN decoding will become available on the DS2000 series? 

The price is a little scary.  At least it's not as scary as Flexray!

http://www.tequipment.net/RigolSD-CAN-DS4.html

It can be done in software with exported data of course. Maybe Marmad one day includes it in his, maybe somebody else writes some piece of software which analyzes the Rigol export data.

But before you go and pay $500, you better invest in a logic analyzer such as the famous Intronix Logicport. This comes with a CAN analyzer (and RS232, I2C etc.) with no extra costs and costs only $389. It is usually much more convinient than any analyzing stuff which comes with an oscilloscope. I own one and I do not want to miss it.

Peter

[DEHiCKA]

Hi guys! Just bought DS2202 (v.00.01.00.02 HW 1.1.0) from my local Russian dealer and lost all the trials right away after selfcal 
No help from the dealer though. Can someone help me get last FW for the damn thing? Thanks!

[Salas]

Hi!

PM me your email to send you the last release one. Although Rigol is to fix a couple of minor bugs we spotted here with an upcoming release, it still fixes a list of previous bugs.

Regards

[DEHiCKA]

Salas, I've already got it from another fairy That was darn quick, thank you guys for the help.

[EV]

The self-cal bug is mentioned several times in this blog, you can ask your dealer for a replacement code.
or read the blog again.

It is also better to read the first page of this thread if you are going to upgrade the firmware.

[marmad]

This is a re-post from another thread - because I thought the info might be interesting to DS2000 owners.

In regards to how the Rigol decimates a larger number of samples to a smaller number of pixels (e.g. 14k sample length to 700 pixels = 20 samples per pixel when the time base is >= 500ns) - the two common methods being 1/N or Peak-to-Peak:



I did some experimentation using an AWG file of three consecutive short pulses with increasingly higher voltages - with the DSO triggering on the second of the three pulses.

It appears (so far) that the Rigol DS2000 does Peak-to-Peak Decimation from sample to display memory in Normal mode, since if it only displayed every 20th point (using 1/N Decimation), you wouldn't see the amplitude of the third pulse when looking at the display at the 100ms/div setting.

The attached images show 100ms/div and 200us/div displays of Normal mode (@ both 14k and 56Mpts sample lengths) and 100ms/div and 200us/div of Peak Detect mode @ 14kpts.

Peak Detect is a completely different mode of acquisition - I've included it just to show that it can affect the contents of sample memory (as shown at 200us/div) - while Peak-to-Peak Decimation in Normal mode does not.

[EvgenyKV]

Hi guys! Soon expires the trial period for options of my DS2102. I heard that there is a method to prolong it. Tell please, whether probably it?

[egonotto]

Hi,

i also affilitate to the question from EvgenyKV.

In the 500uV/Div-setting my DS2072 has an offset off about 0,3 Div's. Can a self-cal correct this behavior?

It seems that the bandwidth of the DS2072 is greater than 70MHz.

I look the signal of a 48 MHz crystal oscillator on the DS2072 and a Fluke PM3392A (a nice 200MHz scope). The picture of the two scopes are very alike.
Perhaps the bandwidths graph from Wim13 is typical for all DS2072.
But then, what get a DS2102 buyer more for the money?

I like the hires modus. But the 400 pixels are not enough to display all the 12 bits. Is there a vertical zoom? How can one get  full benefit from the hires modus?

Thanks in advance
egonotto

[Hydrawerk]

Many people talk about the bandwidth of DS2072. It seems that this scope is really cheap for a like 100MHz model... Bang per buck!

[bonanz]

Note: If you do this wrong you will lose your trial options - so be patient and take the time to do it right!

Do the upgrade ONLY during bootup - not from the GUI/Menus/OS asking for file/etc. or you will lock up the scope - losing any trial options you have remaining - and requiring you to do the upgrade again anyway using the method listed below:

You do this by using two hands when booting up - one thumb on the 'Power On' switch - one thumb on the 'Help' button. When you press 'Power On', all of the scope LEDs will light for ONE SECOND - during that brief period, you must PRESS AND LET GO of the 'Help' button. It can be a little tricky, but if it works, bootup will stop before the Rigol logo with the 'SINGLE' button lit (if it doesn't, turn off power and try again until you get it). Then insert the USB stick with the file on it. The CH1 LED will flash as the DSO loads the file.

Once updating is finished, several of the LEDs will light up - and all flashing, etc. will stop. That's it! Remove the USB stick and reboot, and check your firmware version using the method listed above.

am I to understand that if you hose up your trial options, flashing firmware with this method will restore them?

[dpenev]

Hi Guys,

Thanks Marmad about the decimation displaying method you have explained.

As far as I know the latest firmware is v.01.00.00.03 and it has only a few small issues.
I would expect Rigol quickly issue a 'fix' release.
Do you guys know if it is planned for the near future? Probably already available?

Thanks
Dimitar
 

[marmad]

I would NOT expect new firmware for quite a while.

This is contrary to what I know: there is already a new firmware version being bug-tested before release.

[marmad]

am I to understand that if you hose up your trial options, flashing firmware with this method will restore them?

No, flashing FW does not restore erased trial options.

[TP]

I like the hires modus. But the 400 pixels are not enough to display all the 12 bits. Is there a vertical zoom? How can one get  full benefit from the hires modus?

Thanks in advance
egonotto

Yes.  If you stop the acquisition then just use the V/div knob to expand the trace the extra resolution of the Hires mode shows up.  Some screen shots I posted near the beginning of this thread shows this.

[EV]

Have you tried feeding back the "Trigger out" fast pulse to test?

Use 50 ohm feedthru terminator with BNC cable!

[egonotto]

Hi,


@TP: Thanks for the hint. But you can not go below 500uV. I think here is yet a improvement  in the firmware possible. I will try this with the sample data on PC.

@Teneyes: I have compare the Trigger out with BNC and 50 Ohm termination of the DS2072.
First with the DS2072 . There I got 3ns rise time.
Second with the PM3392A (a 200MHz scope). There I got 2ns rise time.

A 70 MHz scope has from popular opinion 5ns rise time.

So I think the bandwidth of my DS2072 is circa 120 MHz

I will try to compare the bandwidth of the two scopes with a grid dip meter.
 

Best Regards
egonotto

[EV]

Here are rise times of my DS2202 measured from trig out and risemime tester MK2 signal.

[EV]

Here are rise times of my DS2202 measured from trig out and risemime tester MK2 signal.

Trig out is connected with 50 cm RG174 cable. So the rise time (1.52 ns) could be faster with a shorter cable. Rise time tester MK2 is connected without any cable to the terminator and it is connected directly to CH1 BNC input. Rise time is 1.32 ns.

[EV]

Here is the rise time (848 ps) of DS2202 trig out signal measured with TDS3032 scope and P6243 Fet probe.

[TP]

@TP
I went back and re- read your post on Hi Res and other problems
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/first-impressions-and-review-of-the-rigol-ds2072-ds2000-series-dso/msg172191/#msg172191

And I wonder if you agree that the DS2072 has more Bandwidth than 70MHz

Inputting a pulse that should have a rise time of 5 ns (according to the specs for the chip I used) gives a rise time of 7.1 ns on the scope.  That means the scope rise time is 5 ns which matches the 70 MHz spec.

Have you tried feeding back the "Trigger out" fast pulse to test?

My BW "measurement" was only a wild guess, as I don't really know the rise time of my homemade pulse generator source (which is only a 74123 driving a 75451 driving 50 ohm).  When I feed Trigger Out into the input I get 3.8 ns rise time (into a 50 ohm 10X terminator via about 31" of RG58U).  Since I don't know the rise time of Trigger Out, I can't calculate the rise time of the scope.  However, worst case is Trigger Out is 0 nsec rise time meaning the scope BW would be 92 MHz minimum.  If Trigger Out rise time is 0.8 ns then the BW of my scope is 95 MHz minimum.

So what exactly is the point of the DS2102?

[marmad]

So what exactly is the point of the DS2102?

Do you really need to ask?    Also, I don't know if anyone has ever tested the real bandwidth of the Agilent DSO-X 2002A - perhaps it's the same as the DSO-X 2012A as well.

[Hydrawerk]

  Well, I don't have a 0 to 200MHz generator to test the bandwidth of my DSOX2002A... Or is there a more simple way??

[TP]

Hi,

@TP: Thanks for the hint. But you can not go below 500uV. I think here is yet a improvement  in the firmware possible. I will try this with the sample data on PC.

Unfortunately when I checked the data saved on a USB stick (CSV format) it was 8 bit quantized even when it had been taken in HiRes mode.  I don't know about data transfered directly to the PC via USB or Ethernet (say using Marmad's program).