Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[GraXXoR]

Another member from Japan! Welcome.

From a quick look at the specs, your scope seems to be a modern-ish version of the TDS210. More measurement capabilities, colour screen, USB, etc.

If it does the job for the right price, then no problem.

Wow... don't often meet other people based in Japan! We're few and far between, I reckon.
Yeah, 70MHz should be enough for most of my needs, it's not like I'm working with RF or anything.

Really wish it was hackable up to 100MHz, though. But that seems to be a no-no...  :'(

That's a decent price for a decent low BW scope. Just don't drop it on the BNC connectors and you'll be golden! The only real advantage you'll get from a more modern scope is integrated serial bus decoding (this can do it using Tek SW on your PC) and a bigger sample memory.

Welcome to the forum!

That's good to hear.... IIANM, the 1000C series only has 20k samples.... Not sure why they gimped these so hard.

[Robert763]

Welcome to the nut teahouse
These 'scopes were designed for the educational market. This means that outright performance is not a priority.  I'm guessing here, but some establishments probably got them at a good price on the basis that the 'scope brand you learned first is the one you are likely to buy for your job.
They seem to be perfectly usable and certainly better than an old 20MHz analog 'scope.  I wouldn't swap my HP 54645D for one though :-)

[factory]

Re: the Tek TBS scope, I seem to remember someone complaining that it isn't hackable as the older ones are, they only bought it because it was cheap and soon sold it on for more.
If I had the choice of the TBS or a Siglent, the Tek would be my choice, but I'm biased and beware of pushy sales people on here, research & make you own choices.

Would anyone happen to have a spare power supply for the Agilent E4406A? I bought a unit for $10 at an auction, but I found out it seems to be missing the power supply. Not sure what else is missing, as it is at a friend's house and I won't be back for break for another two weeks.

Pretty sure the parts inside are easily worth the $10 I paid, but I'd still like to get it working.

Also I've been having a ton of issues lately with the 8620C sweep oscillator. Last time I powered it on, it had some weird issue where sometimes a hex inverter would oscillate. The issue went away if you left the machine powered on for long enough. Now the issue doesn't go away, and on top of that, something went out of tolerance, and now the tuning voltage goes to 10.47V instead of stopping at 10V. Looks like I'll have to spend a few hours fixing it. My HP8566 also started having YTO unlock issues, but I fixed it by turning a few potentiometers.

I know nothing about the Agilent thingy, but the older HP stuff does occasionally fail, guess you have rechecked the PSU voltages & ripple in the 8620C, if that is OK then look for intermittant/flaky IC/transistors, the small plastic cased transistors used in old HP stuff have a habit of randomly dying.

David

[tautech]

If I had the choice of the TBS or a Siglent, the Tek would be my choice, but I'm biased and beware of pushy sales people on here, research & make you own choices.

I once was too but my dead TDS2012B had me see the light and look for more reliable and better spec'ed DSO's.
YMMV

[factory]

Not impressed with JCBPCB this time, I've got three designs on order, two with soldermask completely removed to match the original 1960s boards and the lastly the 3400 board with soldermask to match the 1980s design, the notes for each design highlighted this.

Last night they queried the soldermask removal & asked if it was to be ENIG all over, turns out only do the exposed pads normally (oddly they didn't query the 5236 board with one side removed in ENIG finish last year  ).
Today I get three emails asking to pay extra $15.2 for each design, odd considering only two designs have the soldermask removed. Now waiting for them to confirm what they mean, I will cancel and rework the soldermask if they want 3x $15.2. 

David

[factory]

If I had the choice of the TBS or a Siglent, the Tek would be my choice, but I'm biased and beware of pushy sales people on here, research & make you own choices.

I once was too but my dead TDS2012B had me see the light and look for more reliable and better spec'ed DSO's.
YMMV

That would be a more modern Yokogawa, Tek or R&S scope* then. Not that I need one of course, I don't have enough free time to play with the 20+ scopes I do have and only really interested in vintage TE, i.e. stuff that has proper service manuals and isn't filled with microscopic parts.
Note there are no Fluke products here either, not a fan of them either hated the Fluke 123, didn't like the TDS 210 or TDS 3012 much at work either.

*Other brands are available, such as Rigol, Keysight, etc.

A salesperson for one brand cannot offer an unbiased opinion either.

David

[tautech]

If I had the choice of the TBS or a Siglent, the Tek would be my choice, but I'm biased and beware of pushy sales people on here, research & make you own choices.

I once was too but my dead TDS2012B had me see the light and look for more reliable and better spec'ed DSO's.
YMMV

That would be a more modern Tek or R&S scope* then. Not that I need one of course, I don't have enough free time to play with the 20+ scopes I do have and only really interested in vintage TE, i.e. stuff that has proper service manuals and isn't filled with microscopic parts.
Note there are no Fluke products here either, not a fan of them either.

*Other brands are available, such as Rigol, Keysight, etc.

David

All other mainline brands were already taken/represented in NZ and as luck would have it, 10yrs ago we selected Siglent.
Must have done a fair job for them as every other Asian brand except one has come knocking for us to represent them too.
Such is this industry........

[syau]

And with a bit of a deep dig, I found a laptop battery store in Kobe (where the beef is from) that is selling the batteries in lots of 5 for 3800yen. Order placed, let's see what arrives late next week......

I have the same problem... Could you share the store information? 

Here you go:

http://www.laptopbattery.jp/battery-express-p.php/25+PANASONIC+BR-2,3A+plc-battery-set

I paid with paypal so if they don't turn up, it'll be easy to get a refund (theoretically...)

CR123 may be a good replacement but need some work to spot weld the terminal.

Another source is BR-2/3AGCT4A which is used for PLC memory backup.

[TERRA Operative]

I looked at the CR123, but it seems they are a different chemistry optimised for higher power delivery at the expense of shorter lifetime, whereas the BR-2/3 type are made for low power delivery for many years.

[Robert763]

Generally the high current cells like the CR123 are fine for low drain applications as well. They typically have a 10 year shelf life with usable capacity after that time.  Conversly you can't use the low current ones for high power as the internal resistance is too high.

[Ice-Tea]

Not sure what you wanted the picture for. It's a front. This one isn't broken 

[TERRA Operative]

Looks like it's from a VFD version? My display window is smaller to suit the LCD display. It's likely to be ok though you think?

You can keep the knobs, PCB, buttons and screws etc for your spare parts if you want, mine are fine and I just need the aluminium frame.

[Ice-Tea]

Ah, hadn't considered that tbh.

The display should be fine. Picture of interface included.

[TERRA Operative]

The interface looks the same, but I'm worried of a fading VFD with time that I won't be able to easily replace. I'd think I'd rather keep the LCD if possible.

[factory]

Is there anything special about the VFD for the HP 8648C? as pictures on the web make it look like a standard two row 40 character display.

Could it be the same as this one? https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hp-8647-vfd-display/msg858014/#msg858014
Which uses a DN4025C, sold by Noritake Itron as the CU40025-UW6J ? It does need to be swapped onto the original HP board though.

David

[W6EL]

On a whim I got this "Fluke 633A/TS TEST SET". I figured, with all those fancy precision resistors and that nice panel, it ought to be useful for something.

But... I can't find anything about it online. No manuals, no schematics, and hardly a mention anywhere. I wonder if it was a custom piece? The "remote" plug wiring appears to be all Teflon. What do they mean by "search"?

I will power it up later today and find out!

Any guesses?

[TERRA Operative]

Is there anything special about the VFD for the HP 8648C? as pictures on the web make it look like a standard two row 40 character display.

Could it be the same as this one? https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hp-8647-vfd-display/msg858014/#msg858014
Which uses a DN4025C, sold by Noritake Itron as the CU40025-UW6J ? It does need to be swapped onto the original HP board though.

David

Looks like that VFD panel is available from Digikey for US$130, but that's like half of what I paid for the entire instrument! 

[xrunner]

On a whim I got this "Fluke 633A/TS TEST SET". I figured, with all those fancy precision resistors and that nice panel, it ought to be useful for something.

But... I can't find anything about it online. No manuals, no schematics, and hardly a mention anywhere. I wonder if it was a custom piece? The "remote" plug wiring appears to be all Teflon. What do they mean by "search"?

I came up with nothing even using Google image search. There aren't frequency generating circuits inside are there? I think it's controlling an external / remote device's frequency and sensing whether it's working correctly or not. Doesn't seem very useful unless you want the components for some project ...

[W6EL]

On a whim I got this "Fluke 633A/TS TEST SET". I figured, with all those fancy precision resistors and that nice panel, it ought to be useful for something.

But... I can't find anything about it online. No manuals, no schematics, and hardly a mention anywhere. I wonder if it was a custom piece? The "remote" plug wiring appears to be all Teflon. What do they mean by "search"?

I came up with nothing even using Google image search. There aren't frequency generating circuits inside are there? I think it's controlling an external / remote device's frequency and sensing whether it's working correctly or not. Doesn't seem very useful unless you want the components for some project ...

I haven't looked under it yet.

The two cards on top each contain one of those older-style Fluke references (the ones with the "p" logo on top). The BNC connectors on the front panel produce DC per the selected value with the two knobs. All the negative values are very close to being correct, and there are adjustments inside which are labeled for them. The positive voltages are very low. When I first opened it up, one of the cards was dislodged and it turns out that that card is the positive reference, and the other card is the negative reference. The cards look the same but one is labeled "ckt 1" and the other "ckt 2" on the metal. Presumably one circuit is upside-down voltage-wise. The DC voltages have very low noise. Below 100uV but I will have to hook up the HP 3400A to see exactly how low it is.

Anyway, I will get it fixed up and maybe use it as a cal box. There is lots of room inside, so maybe I can put a proper ovenized reference inside. I think that is what will happen here.

As for the frequency controls, it really seem you are correct and that it was for controlling some other piece of equipment. I'll look underneath the unit later and confirm that there isn't anything else going on.

For $45, I'm happy. It'll turn into something neat, one way or another. 

[W6EL]

Update on the Fluke 633A, a bad electrolytic cap was on the malfunctioning reference board. Both ref boards are working fine now, and they are actually identical and swappable.

[Ice-Tea]

The interface looks the same, but I'm worried of a fading VFD with time that I won't be able to easily replace. I'd think I'd rather keep the LCD if possible.

Well, you know where to find me if you need it or want it 

[ch_scr]

(...)
The two cards on top each contain one of those older-style Fluke references (the ones with the "p" logo on top). The BNC connectors on the front panel produce DC per the selected value with the two knobs. All the negative values are very close to being correct, and there are adjustments inside which are labeled for them. The positive voltages are very low. When I first opened it up, one of the cards was dislodged and it turns out that that card is the positive reference, and the other card is the negative reference. The cards look the same but one is labeled "ckt 1" and the other "ckt 2" on the metal. Presumably one circuit is upside-down voltage-wise. The DC voltages have very low noise. Below 100uV but I will have to hook up the HP 3400A to see exactly how low it is. 

These look like the ref cards from a Fluke 730A. Quite a find, just for that, indeed!

[PA0PBZ]

The frequency source used for preliminary experiments was a Fluke 633A-01 Synthesizer. Although any source with good long term and short term frequency stability characteristics could be used, a synthesizer provides the operator with a readily selectable frequency source. The 633A-01 has a range of 0 to 11 mHz with frequency selection at 0. 1 Hz increments. The internal standard has a stability of better than 2 parts per 10⁹ per day.

FLUKE 633A .1HZ-11MHZ SYNT. SWEEPER, LOW PHASE NOISE.

So frequency generating after all? But why would a synthesizer have those voltage references? 

[DavidKo]

Looks like that VFD panel is available from Digikey for US$130, but that's like half of what I paid for the entire instrument! 

Have you checked the LCD itsef? The driver is usually the identifier. I have bought replacement LCD for my AFG320 on Ali. Last thing which was necessary to check is pinout and dimensions. In your case something like this.

[TERRA Operative]

I don't need a new LCD panel as mine works fine. I just need the front panel for my 8648C to suit the LCD as the front panel to suit the VFD is different.

If I obtain a front panel to suit a VFD, then I'll have to look into buying that one fro Digikey as VFD's are notorious for dimming with age, a problem LCD's tend not to have.