Author Topic: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!  (Read 17587 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Online Lukas

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 408
  • Country: de
    • carrotIndustries.net
Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« on: January 29, 2020, 09:18:20 pm »
Hello everyone,

After 3 years of off-and-on development, what began as https://www.eevblog.com/forum/eda/new-work-in-progress-eda-package!/ can finally be recommended for general usage. See https://horizon-eda.readthedocs.io/en/latest/feature-overview.html for a list of features and https://horizon-eda.readthedocs.io/en/latest/installation.html#stable-release for installation instructions.

Have fun!
 
The following users thanked this post: dufflespank

Offline bandgap

  • Contributor
  • Posts: 47
  • Country: us
  • .: no electrons here :.
    • Bandgap.net
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2020, 03:10:01 am »
 :-+ Just installed on Manjaro and runs great. I wasn't expecting as much functionality as what you have now. I'm very impressed and may actually give this go on an actual project - mainly because I love how you've structured the library management!

-Clayton
 

Offline alexanderbrevig

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 602
  • Country: no
  • Musician, developer and EE hobbyist
    • alexanderbrevig.com
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #2 on: February 02, 2020, 08:11:36 pm »
Congrats!
I hope to get some time soon to test it out again and maybe contribute :)
 

Offline magtux

  • Contributor
  • Posts: 9
  • Country: in
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #3 on: February 10, 2020, 11:04:56 am »
Checked it out. It's very good. I'd pay to use something like this. Amazing work man.  :-+
 

Offline BigBoss

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 67
  • Country: fr
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2020, 10:20:56 pm »
Its' Schematic Features look more estethique than some commercial ones..I've liked it..
Layout looks quite promising and if you continue to improve, it may be alternative.
 

Online Lukas

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 408
  • Country: de
    • carrotIndustries.net
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #5 on: February 11, 2020, 12:17:09 am »
Thanks for the nice words everyone :)

Its' Schematic Features look more estethique than some commercial ones..I've liked it..
Layout looks quite promising and if you continue to improve, it may be alternative.

Yeah, it's pretty embarrassing what some big dollar EDA vendors try to sell as a schematic editor...
What's the thing you're missing in the board editor?
 

Offline Warhawk

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 589
  • Country: 00
    • Personal resume
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #6 on: February 12, 2020, 11:30:23 am »
Thanks for the nice words everyone :)

Its' Schematic Features look more estethique than some commercial ones..I've liked it..
Layout looks quite promising and if you continue to improve, it may be alternative.
Will you implement comments from the other thread? On placing, shortucs etc. ?
I am looking forward to test it. Nevertheless, I am quite settled on KiCad now.

Yeah, it's pretty embarrassing what some big dollar EDA vendors try to sell as a schematic editor...
What's the thing you're missing in the board editor?

Offline dr.diesel

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2212
  • Country: us
  • Cramming the magic smoke back in...
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #7 on: February 12, 2020, 03:04:14 pm »
Wow great job!

What are the long term plans?

Online Lukas

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 408
  • Country: de
    • carrotIndustries.net
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #8 on: February 12, 2020, 08:53:10 pm »
Wow great job!

What are the long term plans?

I'm afraid nothing too exciting. Just going on fixing bugs and implementing features as I see fit based on what's on my mind and suggestions from users.

Quote
Will you implement comments from the other thread? On placing, shortucs etc. ?

I haven't read through each and every line in the old thread, but most issues brought up should be fixed in one way or another. Keyboard shortcuts and colors are fully customizable.

 
The following users thanked this post: dr.diesel

Online Lukas

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 408
  • Country: de
    • carrotIndustries.net
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #9 on: March 04, 2020, 11:37:28 pm »
A lot has happened since the 1.0 release at the end of January, so I wrote a blog post summarizing the changes: https://blog.horizon-eda.org/progress/2020/03/04/progress-2020-02.html
 
The following users thanked this post: Warhawk

Offline Warhawk

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 589
  • Country: 00
    • Personal resume
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #10 on: March 06, 2020, 08:30:16 pm »
Lukas, this is great.

Offline Pitrsek

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 166
  • Country: cz
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #11 on: March 21, 2020, 09:16:00 pm »
Hello Lukas,
I've gave it a go and so far I really like it  :-+. For one man project it's mighty impressive. Few library questions:
Is there a way how to customize parametric data? Add new fields, add new classes? I have extensive system of classes and parameters that I'd like to use.
Is there a way how to edit/create multiple components at once? Imagine you have CSV/xls with all parameters you'd need for all capacitors/resistors from one series.

Since you already have database running for parametric search, why do you keep parts as individual json files?
If parts were stored in database, mass edit/creation would be a breeze. And then you could connect it to outside databases, share across the teams etc.
You'd be first open source eda with enterprise library management.

Also your web page is missing donate button :)
 
 

Online Lukas

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 408
  • Country: de
    • carrotIndustries.net
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #12 on: March 21, 2020, 11:19:23 pm »
Hello Lukas,
I've gave it a go and so far I really like it  :-+. For one man project it's mighty impressive. Few library questions:
Is there a way how to customize parametric data? Add new fields, add new classes? I have extensive system of classes and parameters that I'd like to use.
There's the tables.json in the pool directory that contains the definition for the various parametric tables. The exact format isn't documented anywhere, but should be more or less obvious from existing tables.

Is there a way how to edit/create multiple components at once? Imagine you have CSV/xls with all parameters you'd need for all capacitors/resistors from one series.
There's a set of ad-hoc scripts such as https://github.com/horizon-eda/horizon-pool/blob/master/scripts/panasonic-erj/gen.py that should be fairly easy to adapt to your needs.

Since you already have database running for parametric search, why do you keep parts as individual json files?
If parts were stored in database, mass edit/creation would be a breeze. And then you could connect it to outside databases, share across the teams etc.
You'd be first open source eda with enterprise library management.
The thing is that SQLite database files don't mix particularly well with version control/git. Having each item in one file keeps diffs nice and tidy and avoids merge conflicts. Locally, all metadata gets loaded into SQLite database for easy and fast querying.

Also your web page is missing donate button :).

Unfortunately, we haven't yet invented a way to donate time...
 

Offline Pitrsek

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 166
  • Country: cz
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #13 on: March 22, 2020, 09:54:53 am »
Thanks,
for the pointers, I'll look into it!
 

Offline Warhawk

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 589
  • Country: 00
    • Personal resume
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #14 on: March 23, 2020, 07:05:52 am »
Lukas, you mentioned some updates and changes. Will you release a new version any soon?

Online Lukas

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 408
  • Country: de
    • carrotIndustries.net
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #15 on: March 23, 2020, 09:18:43 am »
Lukas, you mentioned some updates and changes. Will you release a new version any soon?
I've pondered on this as well, and came to the conclusion that a once-a-quarter release cycle seems to be a good compromise between providing new features and stability and downstream churn. By this, the next release (1.1.0) should happen on 2020-04-29.
 
The following users thanked this post: Warhawk

Offline Pitrsek

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 166
  • Country: cz
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #16 on: March 23, 2020, 08:56:21 pm »
Feature suggestions:
Pool editor/unit editor
  • import pin list from CSV or from clipboard
  • ability to copy pins - I can select lines and delete them, but I can not copy. In lot of case you have a multiple pins of same name
  • pin selection stays in places after delete. you select line 1,3,5 and delete them. pins will disappear, list will reorder, lines 1,3,5 will be still selected(containing new pins). First time I pressed del. one more time. I would expect the selection to disappear after del.
  • if you add a new line via + button, it fills in the name based on previous name(it does auto increment, which is nice). would be nice if there was option to fill the pin name with content from clipboard.
Part editor
  • swap pads and pin pane/area, so pad numbers are on left. In all datasheets that I have seen you have pad numbers in first column, and name in second. Here it is the other way around. It does not feel right/makes my brain hurt.
  • ability to import csv map file(from datasheet)

Schematic editor
  • standard shortcut ctrl + x is not implemented
  • ability to change sheet while placing a part, so I can place part b directly on other sheet
  • warning(and offering update pool cahe) when user is placing component which cached symbol is out of sync with pool. You place part which you have edited(and is already presnt on schematic), in place part window you will see current(updated version) of schematics symbol. Yet if you place it, you will get old version on the schematics. updating the cache pools will fix this, but the issue is that You are not getting what you are seeing in part browser. 

I haven't spent much time with it yet, the above observations are based on my notion "how it is supposed to work", yours might differ. It's possible that some of the stuff is already there, and I just did not discovered it yet.

But so far in general it behaves as I'd expect, I find what I need at places that I expect. It's consistent, with good help. I actually smiled when I was creating my first part, because the stuff I needed was already there and I was able to find it very quickly. It did what i needed to do in a way I expected.

You did a great job Lukas.

 

Offline Pitrsek

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 166
  • Country: cz
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #17 on: March 23, 2020, 09:27:03 pm »
One more - create  linked unit, symbol and entity from kicad schematic component. It seems that kicad gained a critical mass to be noted. You can get schematic symbols for kicad from parts vendor (through ultra librarian export).
 

Offline Pitrsek

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 166
  • Country: cz
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #18 on: March 23, 2020, 09:32:57 pm »
How can the title block be filled? I've created a key in schematics properties with a same name ($author), both for the particular sheet and global, but title block stays the same.
 

Online Lukas

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 408
  • Country: de
    • carrotIndustries.net
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #19 on: March 24, 2020, 12:07:41 am »
How can the title block be filled? I've created a key in schematics properties with a same name ($author), both for the particular sheet and global, but title block stays the same.

Try the latest build, from https://ci.appveyor.com/project/carrotIndustries/horizon (Aritfacts). There have been some quite significant improvements to titleblocks lately. In the old, one they key has to be author (without the dollar sign).

One more - create  linked unit, symbol and entity from kicad schematic component. It seems that kicad gained a critical mass to be noted. You can get schematic symbols for kicad from parts vendor (through ultra librarian export).

That's been on my list of things I might to at some point for quite while. Their current symbol format is quite messy, but definitely doable.



> import pin list from CSV or from clipboard
> ability to import csv map file(from datasheet)
> swap pads and pin pane/area, so pad numbers are on left. In all datasheets that I have seen you have pad numbers in first column, and name in second. Here it is the other way around. It does not feel right/makes my brain hurt.
Try the part wizard (in the package tab).

> ability to copy pins - I can select lines and delete them, but I can not copy. In lot of case you have a multiple pins of same name
Adding a new pin will copy everything from the currently selected pin.

> I would expect the selection to disappear after del.
The selection staying in place makes it easier to delete a sequence of pins.

> would be nice if there was option to fill the pin name with content from clipboard.
After adding a new pin, the pin's name is focused, so you can press Ctrl-v right away.

> standard shortcut ctrl + x is not implemented
You're the actually first one to bring this up. I haven't implemented it yet as it'll do the same as Ctrl-c followed by delete. If you want to move symbols and everything attached to them to another sheet, "Move to other sheet" is thing you want to use.

> ability to change sheet while placing a part, so I can place part b directly on other sheet
That'll require some in-depth changes, I'll have to see if it's worth the added complexity.

> warning(and offering update pool cahe) when user is placing component which cached symbol is out of sync with pool.
The situation is even a bit worse than this: The schematic editor itself keeps its own cache that only gets refreshed once it is reopened, so we have three places that could be out of sync. Someone else brought up a similar issue to me. I think the easiest way out of this would be to show a message in the part browser if the user selected a part that hasn't been updated in the cache yet.
 

Offline Warhawk

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 589
  • Country: 00
    • Personal resume
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #20 on: March 24, 2020, 09:09:01 am »
Lukas, you mentioned some updates and changes. Will you release a new version any soon?
I've pondered on this as well, and came to the conclusion that a once-a-quarter release cycle seems to be a good compromise between providing new features and stability and downstream churn. By this, the next release (1.1.0) should happen on 2020-04-29.
Lukas, thank you. This is a model I like.
VG, Jiri

Offline Pitrsek

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 166
  • Country: cz
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #21 on: March 27, 2020, 08:47:45 pm »
Try the latest build, from https://ci.appveyor.com/project/carrotIndustries/horizon (Aritfacts). There have been some quite significant improvements to titleblocks lately. In the old, one they key has to be author (without the dollar sign).
Thanks! Title blocks works nicely

Try the part wizard (in the package tab).

I will try next time I create a new unique part. The thing is I've decided to use the fully functionality of your library system. So I have units and symbols for functional blocks. I2C with address line, I2S input etc. And those would get glued together with part specific units/symbols. I'll try the wizard and post feedback.


> ability to copy pins - I can select lines and delete them, but I can not copy. In lot of case you have a multiple pins of same name
> Adding a new pin will copy everything from the currently selected pin.
>

Possible workaround, thanks! Still Ctrl+c/v is a standard shortcut, one that you expect to work everywhere


> would be nice if there was option to fill the pin name with content from clipboard.
> After adding a new pin, the pin's name is focused, so you can press Ctrl-v right away.
>
  Aha
>
> standard shortcut ctrl + x is not implemented
> You're the actually first one to bring this up. I haven't implemented it yet as it'll do the same as Ctrl-c followed by delete. If you want to move symbols and everything attached to them to another sheet, "Move to other sheet" is thing you want to use.
>
  That's exactly what I needed


> ability to change sheet while placing a part, so I can place part b directly on other sheet
> That'll require some in-depth changes, I'll have to see if it's worth the added complexity.
>
  Probably not worth the effort. It's just something that I wanted to do and could not. It belongs to "perhaps, someday,maybe" list when all the more important stuff is implemented.


> warning(and offering update pool cahe) when user is placing component which cached symbol is out of sync with pool.
> The situation is even a bit worse than this: The schematic editor itself keeps its own cache that only gets refreshed once it is reopened, so we have three places that could be out of sync. Someone else brought up a similar issue to me. I think the easiest way out of this would be to show a message in the part browser if the user selected a part that hasn't been updated in the cache yet.
>
Warning window is all that's needed.

In pool editor when you create unit you are offered a "save as" when you save it, save as option disappear and you can only save. If you are making similar components, you have to close it, duplicate and open. Having permanent option to save as would save some work.


Few more questions for you:
How can I move part of schematic without connections. ie. move versus drag?
What does red net line means? I sometime get them when I copy. I don't get the menu on right with the parameters. I'm using default appearance, ie nets are green.
Is it possible to move designator/parts value?
I was not able to find sheet symbols and ports, how far in future is schematics hierarchy?
Is the folder structure used somewhere, or it is only for user to reasonably navigate through the jsons? Ie if I change it(rename folders, move jsons around) will  horizon just pick it up on rebuild/update, or do I need to update something manually?

I have few bugs report as well, I put them on github.
 

Online Lukas

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 408
  • Country: de
    • carrotIndustries.net
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #22 on: March 29, 2020, 12:19:18 am »
> Warning window is all that's needed.
Done

> How can I move part of schematic without connections. ie. move versus drag?
Disconnect the symbol (see context menu)

> What does red net line means? I sometime get them when I copy. I don't get the menu on right with the parameters. I'm using default appearance, ie nets are green.
Red net lines are net lines that haven't got assigned a net since they aren't connected to anything.

> Is it possible to move designator/parts value?
Smash the symbol. (same as in eagle)

> I was not able to find sheet symbols and ports, how far in future is schematics hierarchy?
Dunno, not very high on my priority list yet.

> Is the folder structure used somewhere, or it is only for user to reasonably navigate through the jsons? Ie if I change it(rename folders, move jsons around) will  horizon just pick it up on rebuild/update, or do I need to update something manually?
When moving files around, you'll need to update the pool for horizon to pick up the new location. The only requirement is that the files end in .json and everything is in its proper subdirectory of the pool (symbols in symbols/ etc).
 
The following users thanked this post: Warhawk, Pitrsek

Offline Pitrsek

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 166
  • Country: cz
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #23 on: April 18, 2020, 08:46:23 am »
Hi,
how is the center of rotation defined if I want to rotate a group of components?
It seems that it is not rotating about the "move anchor" point.
 

Offline luzotug

  • Contributor
  • Posts: 9
  • Country: fr
Re: Horizon EDA Version 1.0!
« Reply #24 on: April 18, 2020, 09:23:55 am »
I'm a KiCad fanboy so my opinion would probably sound like a mixed review  :-\

I've just played a little bit and it feels a lot (too much ?) like KiCad : how you use the shortcuts and mouse, the interactive router (it's the same). There are of course some changes and less "eye candy" (no toolbars) but not as disruptive as I thought.
You're probably right on this, why reinvent the wheel when you can reuse and improve on existing software and already established concept. This would help people to migrate and keep the learning curve low.

On the other hand, I found the same usability "tricks" that bugs me. I'll give only one example : when you've selected multiple items, put your mouse on the other side of the screen and press M, your selection follow the mouse with this big distance between them.
It happens to me a lot in KiCad when I forgot to deselect before trying to do a hover move. In horizon at least you have big visual clue when you are in hover mode.

I also judge a software by its documentation (it's often a pain point), there's a reasonable amount of documentation and it only take a few hours to read the docs. Some sections are clear and well explained, others are only superficial.
Of course you can't compare with the huge amount of KiCad documentation, it takes time to write documentation and horizon is in infancy but it's a good start.

I haven't played enough with it, but clearly you've done a huge job in only a few years time, well done. So far horizon-eda have passed my first step : you've got me interested.
I'm still married with KiCad but horizon deserve some consideration, so I'll be making some donation (meaning ... time) soon to help.
 


Share me

Digg  Facebook  SlashDot  Delicious  Technorati  Twitter  Google  Yahoo
Smf