I absolutely love JLCPCB+DHL. I've ordered from seeedstudio and I was happy with them, but JLC is just faster. I've never had issues with customs or fees or anything(I'm in the US).
Hi,
Here (Spain, not sure if this is the same in the remaining EU), law says that me, as an individual, can cope with the import procedures and pay only the import taxes. I have done this many, many times in the past. But, from some years ago, it has become more and more difficult, as the first notice you get about your shipment is that it has been managed by some 3rd party agent (no matter if it comes from DHL/UPS/... or even the state post service "Correos") that will perform such import procedures and will charge you its fare (in top of the import taxes).
DHL/UPS etc. say that you can notify them, prior to the entrance of the shipment in the destination country, that you will be in charge of the import procedure, but they always forget/lose such notifications and always deliver your shipment to such 3rd party custom agents.
That is, DHP/UPS/state post force you to contract a 3rd party for a service you have not demanded and that you can do by yourself. Well, in fact, they contract it in your behalf and without your authorization.
Ugly, isn't it?
For that thing to happen, you must find the product you want inside the EU.
Yes, I forget to mention – I have option to clear customs myself (it's a nightmare...)
Yes, I forget to mention – I have option to clear customs myself (it's a nightmare...)
Sorry, but this was the point where your argument collapsed, I think.
DHL's request for customs clearance fees is essentially an offer of a service. You can chose to decline that offer and handle customs clearing yourself. So what is you complaint?
(My only complaint is that DHL don't make this option very clear, and word their "offer" in a strange way. Obviously they would prefer that you use their services and pay, and hence they are not very transparent about this.)
EDIT: Hmm, this option may in fact not exist for "DHL Express" shipments. At least here in Germany, regular DHL offers the option to deposit your shipment at the customs office for you to clear it and pick it up. Maybe DHL Express does not?
Did You read part where I wrote that if I want to clear customs myself it will cost me over 50 eur? My complain is simple, while I was ordering there wasn't this line: "Customs clearance fee is not included" Simple as that.
Yes, I saw that part. But you can blame neither DHL nor JLCPCB for the customs clearing fees in your country. Neither import duties nor customs fees are included in JLCPCB's sticker price; why would they?
A 50 Euro fee seems quite excessive, btw. If it is really that expensive in your country, then shouldn't you be delighted about the great low-cost deal you get from DHL when they handle it?
Yes, I saw that part. But you can blame neither DHL nor JLCPCB for the customs clearing fees in your country. Neither import duties nor customs fees are included in JLCPCB's sticker price; why would they?Well it's EU, customs clearance will always be when You import something, so why wouldn't they be included? And if not it's logical to expect it would be declared clearly that it's not. And I think I wrote clear enough that I don't have any issue on paying import taxes.Quote
you are buying from outside the EU so of course you have to pay import tax, and what would a Chinese company know or care about taxes
of other countries?
Dear 3dgeo,
I think you are quite heavily overreacting, because you have done little to none actual legal research before, leaving you uninformed about the matter how the capitalist world works.
I agree, that the extra fee for DHL processing the customs declaration is not fer and is one of the highest rates (but believe me, Fedex or UPS charges WAY MORE THAN THAT).
What is also true, that if you process the customs paperwork yourself, you pay NONE extra fees to DHL.
I am also in EU and quite familiar with how this works. I can (and almost always primarily want to) deal with the customs office directly. In our country. Normally, this takes from 10 up to 20 minutes maximum at the office - i.e. is fast enough and the office in our capital city, easily accessible.
What SUCKS damn hard is that DHL has its own detached customs office, where you have to go in person to do the paperwork. This damn fucked office, is located in samn damn asshole of a city, where it is a half day trip to get to. - this probably is no coincidence, just to force more money out of people, who can't afford a half day trip to pay few tens of € VAT. That just makes no sense.
So I understand your affection and anger, but you shall stop overreacting like this. Do better legal research next time before ordering something.
This is not directly related to the topic, but similar in a way:
A month ago I ordered some stuff via Texas Instrument on-line store. I've done it in the past (5-6 times just last year) and the procedure was simple - they would ship the order from USA, it will arrive to my country (EU member state), carrier will do the customs paperwork and that was it. The whole process took 4-5 days, usually. And for larger orders, shipping was free.
Well - not anymore. Now they shipped the order by Schenker (cargo company, ocean freight !) to Netherlands and then from there by TNT to the destination. Took almost 2 weeks. But the most interesting part is that they charged my credit card with Dutch V.A.T. (although my company is registered business and has valid EU VAT number !). Also, they initially charged credit card with net amount, cancelled that transactions 3 days later and charged with new value (net+VAT), which I never actually authorized. I complained to their customer service, but since they're in the USA I guess they do not understand how the whole VAT stuff wokrks between EU countries. They even claimed that I was notified about that VAT nonsense during ordering process, which I was not. I even got confirmation e-mail clearly stating that the there's no VAT - just goods and shipping.
Nevertheless, they stick to their version and all I can do is to hate them. What a mess...
Dear 3dgeo,
I think you are quite heavily overreacting, because you have done little to none actual legal research before, leaving you uninformed about the matter how the capitalist world works.
If I order shipping I expect one of these: caries to ship and handle all the fuss on the way OR clearly notify me upfront that some services are not included and will cost extra. Is it really that much to ask? According to your logic if you buy food you have to make sure yourself that it does not contain any poison and kill you. I don't see any logic or argument here.I agree, that the extra fee for DHL processing the customs declaration is not fer and is one of the highest rates (but believe me, Fedex or UPS charges WAY MORE THAN THAT).
What is also true, that if you process the customs paperwork yourself, you pay NONE extra fees to DHL.
I am also in EU and quite familiar with how this works. I can (and almost always primarily want to) deal with the customs office directly. In our country. Normally, this takes from 10 up to 20 minutes maximum at the office - i.e. is fast enough and the office in our capital city, easily accessible.
What SUCKS damn hard is that DHL has its own detached customs office, where you have to go in person to do the paperwork. This damn fucked office, is located in samn damn asshole of a city, where it is a half day trip to get to. - this probably is no coincidence, just to force more money out of people, who can't afford a half day trip to pay few tens of € VAT. That just makes no sense.
So I understand your affection and anger, but you shall stop overreacting like this. Do better legal research next time before ordering something.I repeat again – it's not about customs clearance amount, they can charge as much as they want as long they inform me up front so I can pick caries that fits my needs.
Also I notices people mix custom taxes and customs clearance fee – I will make an edit on my main post to clarify this.
They have no legal duties to inform you upfront, that you pay for customs clearance. You are the one to read the terms and conditions for importing goods.
International Shipping - items may be subject to customs processing depending on the item's declared value.
Sellers set the item's declared value and must comply with customs declaration laws.
As the buyer, you should be aware of possible:
- delays from customs inspection.
- import duties and taxes which buyers must pay.
- brokerage fees payable at the point of delivery.
I see nothing complicated here – if someone sells service, they might have no legal duties to do so but they have to provide all information about the service, otherwise whats is the difference between them and scammers?
Does your government have any duty to inform you about your local law? Probably very likely not. You have the look it up yourself. You can't make apologies because you have not known about some specific laws.
Same applies here. Customs clearance fees can be easily found on the DHL website. If I could find them when I was beginning with importing more stuff from China, you could probably find them too.
JLCPCB does not have any responsibility here. They do not have to inform you about customs processing, they no nothing about how that works in your country. That is just the problem between you and the carrier company. They have just paid the carrier to transport the item to you. Additional fees should be claimed at DHL, not JLC.
If you would order something from eBay from for example the US of A, you pay the shipping, and THEN you pay extra if customs processing fees are applied.
Have you ever seen the notice there under the auctions that do not use the GSP (Global Shipping Program - which by the way sucks, because is very slow and often more expensive than to deal customs directly)QuoteInternational Shipping - items may be subject to customs processing depending on the item's declared value.
Sellers set the item's declared value and must comply with customs declaration laws.
As the buyer, you should be aware of possible:
- delays from customs inspection.
- import duties and taxes which buyers must pay.
- brokerage fees payable at the point of delivery.
It does not matter from where you bought an item. Additional import charges are up to the transport company. International sellers do not care about your import laws or taxes. You are the importer, not the seller. That is your duty to fix that yourself.
(See - JLCPCB have never stated anywhere, that your are paying for customs clearance service at your destination).
Well of course there is absolutely nothing complicated. It does not matter if JLC PCB, ALLPCB or other completely different international seller. It could happen with any of them. So it is unfair that you spit on JLC, because you are clearly the one who was not educated enough before purchasing internationally.
The fact that it might not get caught with different seller, is that they (Chinese guys) almost every time give fraudulent information about the item prices. Now if you got caught with this one, you might get into some serious trouble. VAT shortening is a quite heavily punished crime.
Hmm, currently my $2 worth of PCBs from JLCPCB are stuck with DHL, they are asking me to send a form attached with company details to release them. But I am not a company....
I've already paid fees that were two times the cost of the PCBs. The problem seems to be that JLCPCB mislabel the custom declaration, DHL have to follow letter of the law otherwise they get hammered by the government.
Likewise, I don't mind paying legitimate VAT and import duties, I am not trying to evade them. I wish it was just simple and transparent. People like me get forced to be familiar with INCOTERMS. Anything other than "DDP", expect to pay fees to someone.
I've had hassle with DHL before, I won't be selecting DHL again.