Hacking the Rigol MSO5000 series oscilloscopes

[BTO]

I have problem with win11 and ssh <scope-ip-addr> -l root

win11 say "SSH protocol v.1 is no longer supported  !!

I dont now ?

Putty - a great open source ssh client for windows for last 15 years at least.

Exactly, PuTTY is awesome and i encourage people to use it

[rolfdegen]

Putty with Win11 works now. I had some problems with Dr Mefisto's instructions.

[rolfdegen]

Can you measure the bandwidth of the MSO5000 with this signal generator ADF4351

[rolfdegen]

Comparison measurement of the rise time with 100MHz oscilloscope and 500MHz oscilloscope..

[rolfdegen]

OK. I generated and measured a 50MHz puls signal with a Teensy4 (600Mhz Clock)



This is an 50MHz Puls signal from Teensy4

Code: [Select]

// 50MHz Puls signal on Teensy4
const int my_pulse_pin = 22;

void setup()
{
  pinMode(my_pulse_pin, OUTPUT);
  CORE_PIN20_PADCONFIG |= 0xF9;
}

void loop()
{
  while (1) {
    digitalWriteFast(my_pulse_pin, HIGH);
    digitalWriteFast(my_pulse_pin, HIGH);
    digitalWriteFast(my_pulse_pin, LOW);
    digitalWriteFast(my_pulse_pin, LOW);
    digitalWriteFast(my_pulse_pin, LOW);
    digitalWriteFast(my_pulse_pin, LOW);
    //delay(1);
  }
}

I set the Scope probe to x10 to make the measurement more precise and use a spring on the probe head




This is a measurement with Rigol DS4054 500MHz scope in the video

[rolfdegen]

50MHz pulse measurement with 10x Probe, series 450R resistor and 50R Scope impedanz resistor.
I hope this measurement setup is correct 

[BTO]

50MHz pulse measurement with 10x Probe, series 450R resistor and 50R Scope impedanz resistor.
I hope this measurement setup is correct 

1.6ns....
This puts you at 625 MHz

[MarkusAJ]

50MHz pulse measurement with 10x Probe, series 450R resistor and 50R Scope impedanz resistor.
I hope this measurement setup is correct 

1.6ns....
This puts you at 625 MHz

How did you calculate the 625MHz?
Using "bandwidth (Hz) = 0.35/rise time" formula, 1.6ns rise time it's 218.75MHz.
Some vendors (ex. Tektronix) use "bandwidth (Hz) = 0.45/rise time"  formula and in this case 1.6ns will calculate to 281.25MHz.

BTW, for bandwidth measure you should use very fast, <100ps pulses. You may be interested in fast pulse generator from Leo Bodnar, link: https://www.leobodnar.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=295

[rolfdegen]

Thanks for this information. But I'm not sure if my measurement is correct ? Maybe this measurement is better..

Puls source --- 50R Resister -- 20cm Koax kable -- 50R scope input

[JonMorton]

Thanks for this information. But I'm not sure if my measurement is correct ? Maybe this measurement is better..

Puls source --- 50R Resister -- 20cm Koax kable -- 50R scope input

Check this link below, it is very good tutorial how to measure scopes bandwidth.

https://youtu.be/Ly5pmYopEfU

[JCS666]

My system, show my previous post:

[BTO]

50MHz pulse measurement with 10x Probe, series 450R resistor and 50R Scope impedanz resistor.
I hope this measurement setup is correct 

1.6ns....
This puts you at 625 MHz

How did you calculate the 625MHz?
Using "bandwidth (Hz) = 0.35/rise time" formula, 1.6ns rise time it's 218.75MHz.
Some vendors (ex. Tektronix) use "bandwidth (Hz) = 0.45/rise time"  formula and in this case 1.6ns will calculate to 281.25MHz.

BTW, for bandwidth measure you should use very fast, <100ps pulses. You may be interested in fast pulse generator from Leo Bodnar, link: https://www.leobodnar.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=295

I didn't calculate it, I did a quick google search before going to bed.
when i get a second i'll take a better look at it

[rolfdegen]

New  measurement with 50R coax cable
50MHz pulse measurement with 450R series resistor, 50 Ohm coaxial cable and 50R Scope impedanz resistor.

[rolfdegen]

My best result was with a 50 ohm series resistor and a 50 ohm coaxial cable. Oscilloscope input impedance of 50 ohms.



50MHz Puls signal from Teensy4 with GPIO output impedance 50 ohm

Code: [Select]

C:
// 50MHz Puls signal on Teensy4
const int my_pulse_pin = 22;

void setup()
{
  pinMode(my_pulse_pin, OUTPUT);
 // CORE_PIN20_PADCONFIG |= 0xF9;

  int DRIVE_STRENGTH = 3; // vlaue from 0 to 7. (3 = 53R 3.3V)
  int SPEED = 3; // value 0 to 3 (3 = max GPIO speed 200MHz)
  *(portControlRegister(my_pulse_pin)) = IOMUXC_PAD_DSE(DRIVE_STRENGTH) | IOMUXC_PAD_SPEED(SPEED);
}

void loop()
{
  while (1) {
     digitalWriteFast(my_pulse_pin, HIGH);
    digitalWriteFast(my_pulse_pin, HIGH);
    digitalWriteFast(my_pulse_pin, LOW);
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
    asm volatile("nop");
  }
}

Teensy4 GPIO output data

[rolfdegen]

Confusion with the sample rate in MSO5104 (350MHz hack)
I checked the sampling rate of each channel. They should have 8GSa/s in single mode. It's displayed differently in the acquisition menu (see pics).

Channel 1: Single Mode 8GSa/s
Channel 2: Single Mode 2GSa/s
Channel 3: Single Mode 4GSa/s
Channel 4: Single Mode 4GSa/s





MSO5000 manual

[6SN7WGTB]

Using my home-brew pulser, I can resolve a pulse down to around 700ps, which seems to tally with the BW of my unlocked (MSO5104 -> MSO5354) 'scope which is ca. 600MHz.

The response curve of my 'scope is below, and the roll-off post -3dB point is ca. 55dB/decade, which if I am not talking nonsense is almost 3rd order, which means we should expect Rise Time to be 0.45/freq

[rolfdegen]

Do you have a circuit diagram of your DIY pulse generator ?

[6SN7WGTB]

It's the "Jim Williams" basic design. I made a few versions and settled on an SMD one, below.  A full-fat one is also attached, all built on the BNC.

It's fed via the phono plug with 90V DC, through a polarity protection diode.

[Retired2]

Jim Williams pulse generator can be found at:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/projects/jim-williams-avalanche-pulse-generator-build-modern-choice-for-l1/

[macboy]

Confusion with the sample rate in MSO5104 (350MHz hack)
I checked the sampling rate of each channel. They should have 8GSa/s in single mode. It's displayed differently in the acquisition menu (see pics).

Channel 1: Single Mode 8GSa/s
Channel 2: Single Mode 2GSa/s
Channel 3: Single Mode 4GSa/s
Channel 4: Single Mode 4GSa/s
...

To get the maximum sample rate on any single channel, it must be the only channel being sampled. I see that you have Channel 1 set as the trigger source when testing each channel. This means that channel 1 is also being sampled, even though it is not being displayed.
Try again, changing the trigger source to the same single channel that you are displaying.

[rolfdegen]

Confusion with the sample rate in MSO5104 (350MHz hack)
I checked the sampling rate of each channel. They should have 8GSa/s in single mode. It's displayed differently in the acquisition menu (see pics).

Channel 1: Single Mode 8GSa/s
Channel 2: Single Mode 2GSa/s
Channel 3: Single Mode 4GSa/s
Channel 4: Single Mode 4GSa/s
...

To get the maximum sample rate on any single channel, it must be the only channel being sampled. I see that you have Channel 1 set as the trigger source when testing each channel. This means that channel 1 is also being sampled, even though it is not being displayed.
Try again, changing the trigger source to the same single channel that you are displaying.

Yes. Thanks for the good tip.. You have to switch the trigger channel. Now each channel has 8GSa/s.  You never stop learning... 

[rolfdegen]

This is my fastest pulse generator with Teensy4.
I overclocked the processor from 600MHz to 1GHz.
The current rise time is 945ps 

[rolfdegen]

I tried 2N3904 transistors in my Avalanche Pulse Generator. None worked. I use power supply of +129 volts (max). I don't have any more voltage.
I need a little bit help. Thanks

My circuit is like this.

[rolfdegen]

I think this is a problem of transistor dispersion, also known as transistor variability. This refers to the differences in the characteristics of different transistors, even if they are of the same type.
I'm going to desolder a few more 2N3904s from old circuit boards. I hope I get lucky and one of them will work 

[rolfdegen]

I've now ordered 10 of the 2N2369 and want to test them. I'm curious...