Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[VK5RC]

Nice score, 0culus. 

Meanwhile, on the bench...




mnem

That is either a REALLY tiny engine, or a friggin' HUGE battery!!  Is it  an early attempt at an EV?

-Pat

@Pat You have had the luxury of rarely having to deal with Lucas electrics in cars - 'Mr Lucas - the prince of darkness - who accidentally invented the intermittent windscreen wiper etc. To get a 1960s Lucas containing car started in winter you will need a bigger battery than that! HiHi
😂

Ahh, yes, I've heard of the three position Lucas headlight switch - off, dim and flicker. 

-Pat

😂, so true, but all in the same position 😜

[beanflying]

This seller was selling old Test Gear and mechanical surplus pre internet    eBay auction: #184935810071

Known issues:
Does not work.
Missing some smoke.
Might be missing a board in the left rear.
Power cord can be included if you REALLY need one.
Obviously nothing other than the counter is included.
Few scratches and LOTS of stickers for you to enjoy removing.

[vk6zgo]

Nice score, 0culus. 

Meanwhile, on the bench...




mnem

That is either a REALLY tiny engine, or a friggin' HUGE battery!!  Is it  an early attempt at an EV?

-Pat

@Pat You have had the luxury of rarely having to deal with Lucas electrics in cars - 'Mr Lucas - the prince of darkness - who accidentally invented the intermittent windscreen wiper etc. To get a 1960s Lucas containing car started in winter you will need a bigger battery than that! HiHi
😂

It is a seriously large battery!
The car, from both memory & Googling, is a late 1950s/early '60s Wolseley 15/60.
The engine is a "BMC B-Series" motor of around 1.5 litres displacement, so it is a fairly small engine.

I never worked out quite why Brit engines were so difficult to turn over------ Lucas starters don't look any wimpier than the Bosch ones used on Holdens, but for some reason, they battle.

Of course, the engines don't seem to like starting, much.

Could it be as simple as the fact that most cars back in the '60 used an 8volt ignition coil with ballast resistor?

When starting, the ballast was bypassed, so when the battery terminal voltage collapsed under starting load, the coil wasn't starved of current, so could still produce a decent spark.

I can't recall seeing that on a Brit car-----maybe Ford Zephyrs & the big Vauxhalls?

It can be a game changer-- in the late'70s, I had a Chrysler Australia assembled Mitsubish Galant, where Chrysler for some reason, had fitted a 12v coil & just connected the direct & ballast connections in parallel.
(Unlike Holdens, the Japanese "home" models had a physical resistor, so the Oz assemblers had to insert another section of plain wire instead of the resistor)

Just like "Pommy cars" it was a pig to start in Winter.
Buying an "after market" 8v coil, & fitting a ballast resistor from a wrecker's Datsun transformed the beast.

Evil as BMC might have been, they never reached the level of the Ford 100E & previous Anglia/Popular/Prefect models, with their 6v batteries, years after most others had changed to 12v.

But, then again, pre-FE model Holdens had 6v sytems, & still started O.K, as did early VWs.

[Robert763]

Well less than £200 for a known working HP diode power sensor is pretty good.
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/153164710761?

Except that it wasnt less than £200, it went for £204.

No,
If you look at their sold listings it went as a buy it now so less than the listing price of £204

/www.ebay.co.uk/sch/m.html?item=153164710761&_ssn=electro_rent_europe&_osacat=0&LH_Complete=1&_odkw=&LH_Sold=1&_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=+8484A&_sacat=0

Even £204 is a good price for a known good one.

[Robert763]

Tek 7633 with timebase and two dual trace plug-ins.   Current high bid is 5.50EUR

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/154492129422  --  Located in Germany.  I asked the seller (in German) about postage to the UK but have not had a reply.

Untested, no guarantee, no returns.     

Hmm nice "patina" of nicotine and tar too.

If you really want a 7633 I have one I could let go (& a 7603) but it would have to be collected from Cambridge area.

[vk6zgo]

Nice score, 0culus. 

Meanwhile, on the bench...




mnem

That is either a REALLY tiny engine, or a friggin' HUGE battery!!  Is it  an early attempt at an EV?

-Pat

@Pat You have had the luxury of rarely having to deal with Lucas electrics in cars - 'Mr Lucas - the prince of darkness - who accidentally invented the intermittent windscreen wiper etc. To get a 1960s Lucas containing car started in winter you will need a bigger battery than that! HiHi
😂

Ahh, yes, I've heard of the three position Lucas headlight switch - off, dim and flicker. 

-Pat

😂, so true, but all in the same position 😜

But wait!---There's more!

My Morris Minor discovered four modes on the floor dipper swtch.
(1)Low beam.
(2)High beam
(3)Pitch darkness
(4)Both high & low beams simulaneously.

Driving on High beam, another car approaches, ----I try to dip the lights.
Suddenly, up comes (4), lighting up the place like a floodlight.

Frantically, I hit the switch again, up comes (3) ---pitch darkness.

I grovel over to where I can just see the edge of the road from the other car's lights.

He sweeps past, blasting me with his horn.

I sit there, recovering my composure, & try all the positions again, finally getting back to (1).
I drive timidly home.

[McBryce]

Nice score, 0culus. 

Meanwhile, on the bench...




mnem

That is either a REALLY tiny engine, or a friggin' HUGE battery!!  Is it  an early attempt at an EV?

-Pat

It's the perspective. The engine is further away.... 



McBryce.

[Peter_O]

For somebody near Mannheim, Germany, this might develop into a proper rescue project:

Two TEKTRONIX 2465B for pickup. Price negotiable.

https://www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/s-anzeige/tektronix-2465b-400mhz/1817480483-168-7975

[med6753]

The last cable guy I had here had no clue as what my stuff was. 

Years ago one of my sons had an auto sparky over who was trying to show off with his "knowledge" and started talking about an oscilloscope, expecting to befuddle my son.

However the shoe ended up on the other foot when my son not only knew what he was talking about, but that we had one in the house.  Seems the sparky was taken aback - significantly.

.... and I missed it.

Like the people sent out by my "Internet Service Provider" back when I had ADSL.
The contractor came out, checked, using an ordinary ADSL modem that it wasn't connecting.
Said "he had to go back & talk to the ISP, who would get back to me".

"Crickets" for about a week, then rang the ISP & nagged them-------they promised to send a bloke out to follow things up.

The same bloke turned up, rubbed his beard, & said he would go get the "Da Dum!!" TDR out of his car.
Looking very scientific, he hung it across the line, mumbled something about having to "pass it to Telstra".

I could not for the life of me see why, if the thing was in the car, he didn't use it the first time!

He really treated the TDR as if it was "the wonder of the age"-------I didn't have the heart to tell him the old PMG Dept used them, in the form of the old PET (Pulse Echo Tester) back in the 1960s!

Further down the rabbit hole, eventually after much more time, Telstra became involved, a tech came out, said the lead in from the pit was faulty & needed replacement, but that "had to be done by a team of contractors".

We had to go away for a few weeks, so were concerned about that, but when Telstra rang us to confirm a date for a visit from the contractors, they said they wouldn't need us to be home.

Coming home, didn't seem to be any sign of disturbance of the ground, so we assumed that the cable had just been replaced, retaining the old conduit.
This was 2012.

All seemed well, but a while down the track, the ADSL failed & the phone became noisy, so I bypassed the ISP & rang Telstra.

The "tech" came out, fiddled in the pit, "let slip" that the leadin hadn't been changed, reterminated a few dodgy connections.
The phone noise dropped to a relatively low level, the ADSL came back, with reduced performance, the tech went away satified.

We weren't but we decided to "live with it"

Over the next few years, we had 2-3 phone fails eacn year, & I became pretty convinced we had an intermittent fault in the leadin cable.
The techs varied in competence around a pretty poor base line.

Ultimately, in 2019, we had become eligible for connection to NBN "Fibre to the curb", so I thought I would have to get the lead in problem sorted "once & for all".

Amazingly, this time they sent someone who knew what he was doing.
He agreed that it was a faulty lead in cable, so he pulled a new cable through the conduit, taking about 30 minutes max.

No more lead in problem!
The bloke in 2012 could have done the same thing, if he had an ounce of competence, as could the others.

What gripes me, is that I could have done it myself, but I'm not allowed to!

I went through a similar fire drill when I moved here 10 years ago. My internet would intermittently drop out but TV would stay up and it was the same copper. They kept sending out these techs who didn't know their arse from their elbow. I think they changed their cable internet modem 3 times but clearly that wasn't the problem. I finally got fed up and called their customer support and demanded to speak to a stupidvisor. That finally got some action and they sent their lead tech who actually knew something and also knew what my equipment was. He identified the issue within 10 minutes. I don't recall exactly what it was but it did involved the pole drop to house interface block.     

[Specmaster]

[...]
And that's why *I* am not inclined to shotgun caps in old test gear.  YMMV.
[...]

Agree.

Why only shotgun the caps, if you are of that ilk?  You'd have to shotgun every component to be really sure nothing has drifted...  and that essentially means... buying new equipment!

Seems a better plan to verify that the old equipment lives up to its specs...  and only start replacing stuff when it doesn't.

Yeah, the latter is the approach I take. When I get something old but new to me I run it through the manufacturer's stated verification procedure* and if that's good and there aren't (from visual inspection) any obvious time-bombs, bulging electrolytics, RIFAs, etc., then I leave well alone.

I'm quite happy to follow Med et al's shotgunning as a spectator sport, but I wouldn't want to participate.

* If there is a written verification procedure. Being mostly an HP fanboy means that there is always one for HP kit and they're usually easy to reproduce, although sometimes you have to be a little creative if you haven't got all the test gear called out in the verification procedure.

This is what e-bay searches are for, and partially why I have an ever expanding collection of gear.  The service manual helps you to find things you didn't realize you needed!   

-Pat

Hopefully you do the visual inspection first to make sure that there are no, RIFA or bulging caps, leaking caps or even anything missing etc before running through the manufacturers verifacation procedure or you could have an experience that you would rather not have. 

[med6753]

For somebody near Mannheim, Germany, this might develop into a proper rescue project:

Two TEKTRONIX 2465B for pickup. Price negotiable.

https://www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/s-anzeige/tektronix-2465b-400mhz/1817480483-168-7975

I don't read German but if it's for both units which I assume don't work and if it's cheap enough I'd be on it like flies on shit in about 10 seconds. Make one good one and have a spare parts unit. 

[Peter_O]

For somebody near Mannheim, Germany, this might develop into a proper rescue project:

Two TEKTRONIX 2465B for pickup. Price negotiable.

https://www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/s-anzeige/tektronix-2465b-400mhz/1817480483-168-7975

I don't read German but if it's for both units which I assume don't work and if it's cheap enough I'd be on it like flies on shit in about 10 seconds. Make one good one and have a spare parts unit. 

Looks like a non-electronic has inherited these two. The short description says: "Sold as spare parts. Display lights up on one of them."
It's maybe more kind of a fairness challenge for the buyer.  :-)

[Robert763]

Todays stupid eBay valuation, I think the seller has been at the magic mushrooms again 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/154058876130

They also have a scope for sale for £48401.00, OBO. Yes, that decimal point is in the correct  place

Well it is a 4 channel, 8GHz, 10 bit Mixed signal 'scope........

The seller is a TE rental company Their target market is professional users not us. You can find the odd bargain amonst their listings but a distinct paucity of phots and descriptions does not help.

For comparison, £48401.00 = US$67,289.44 so roughly $15K off new list price.

mnem
 

Farnell, the UK part of Newark don't list the 8000 series, but taking their most expensive Keysight'scope MSOX4154A it's £24.985 compared to $25622 at Newark. This gives a conversion of 1.0225 not the $/£ rate. This is due to import duty and market prce difference. Taking 1.0255 makes the  UK price £65615 so the ebay price is £17200 less than new.  That's 35% discount on new with ex-stock delivery. Seems a fair price to me.

BUT WAIT! (as all the worst TV ads say) the ebay price includes  VAT at 20% The Farnell / Newark do not. That makes it £78738 new and £48401 on ebay 62% less than list or £30,000 saving (yes a business can reclaim VAT, but that applies to both)

Much better than the people listing and in somecases selling Picoscope 2204A's for 115% to 280% of new price, 
Someone actually bought this one www.ebay.co.uk/itm/143890760715? at £161 when the maker sells it on ebay for £102 /www.ebay.co.uk/itm/124795736537?   

EDIT. Just read vk6zgo's post on the battery after posting this and we both used "but wai" on the same page!
Good car identification too.

[Andrew_Debbie]

Tek 7633 with timebase and two dual trace plug-ins.   Current high bid is 5.50EUR

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/154492129422  --  Located in Germany.  I asked the seller (in German) about postage to the UK but have not had a reply.

Untested, no guarantee, no returns.     

Too risky, I'd walk away from that.

Too risky as in Don't trust eBay?

Or too risky as 7000 series 'scopes are impossible to repair?

Or    £200 and 2 months later, I'd have a barely working 50MHz scope that is not in spec  and wishing I'd bought a Hantek?

Asking because  7xxx's come up on UK eBay sometimes.  I always asume it doesn't work and needs at least the power supply caps replaced.  I have no idea what I'd be getting into.    I have repared a few 545's  and 555's and a 315  but that is entirely different.

[med6753]

For somebody near Mannheim, Germany, this might develop into a proper rescue project:

Two TEKTRONIX 2465B for pickup. Price negotiable.

https://www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/s-anzeige/tektronix-2465b-400mhz/1817480483-168-7975

I don't read German but if it's for both units which I assume don't work and if it's cheap enough I'd be on it like flies on shit in about 10 seconds. Make one good one and have a spare parts unit. 

Looks like a non-electronic has inherited these two. The short description says: "Sold as spare parts. Display lights up on one of them."
It's maybe more kind of a fairness challenge for the buyer.  :-)

Which also means you may be able to get them super cheap. 

[med6753]

Tek 7633 with timebase and two dual trace plug-ins.   Current high bid is 5.50EUR

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/154492129422  --  Located in Germany.  I asked the seller (in German) about postage to the UK but have not had a reply.

Untested, no guarantee, no returns.     

Too risky, I'd walk away from that.

Too risky as in Don't trust eBay?

Or too risky as 7000 series 'scopes are impossible to repair?

Or    £200 and 2 months later, I'd have a barely working 50MHz scope that is not in spec  and wishing I'd bought a Hantek?

Asking because  7xxx's come up on UK eBay sometimes.  I always asume it doesn't work and needs at least the power supply caps replaced.  I have no idea what I'd be getting into.    I have repared a few 545's  and 555's and a 315  but that is entirely different.

7603 scopes are pretty simple and not difficult to repair. Don't know about 7623 with all the storage extra's. These scopes have a linear PSU with power transformer.

But I am also concerned about it's exterior condition. It definitely was owned by a smoker. It may clean up or it may not.

BTW, it's 100MHz...not 50MHz.

It's a crap shoot but might be worth it for the right price.

[mansaxel]

7603 scopes are pretty simple and not difficult to repair. Don't know about 7623 with all the storage extra's. These scopes have a linear PSU with power transformer.

<snip>

It's a crap shoot but might be worth it for the right price.

Shipping to Sweden was not at all horrible -- I'd be tempted except that I've already got a 100MHz scope (465) and a modular (5440), the latter in the repair queue for want of tants with DC isolation. Next scope probably is going to be a newish digital one (think midrange Siglent) or a 2465.

Shame that those 2 2465's in Germany weren't shippable.

[VK5RC]

Nice score, 0culus. 

Meanwhile, on the bench...




mnem

That is either a REALLY tiny engine, or a friggin' HUGE battery!!  Is it  an early attempt at an EV?

-Pat

@Pat You have had the luxury of rarely having to deal with Lucas electrics in cars - 'Mr Lucas - the prince of darkness - who accidentally invented the intermittent windscreen wiper etc. To get a 1960s Lucas containing car started in winter you will need a bigger battery than that! HiHi
😂

Ahh, yes, I've heard of the three position Lucas headlight switch - off, dim and flicker. 

-Pat

😂, so true, but all in the same position 😜

But wait!---There's more!

My Morris Minor discovered four modes on the floor dipper swtch.
(1)Low beam.
(2)High beam
(3)Pitch darkness
(4)Both high & low beams simulaneously.

Driving on High beam, another car approaches, ----I try to dip the lights.
Suddenly, up comes (4), lighting up the place like a floodlight.

Frantically, I hit the switch again, up comes (3) ---pitch darkness.

I grovel over to where I can just see the edge of the road from the other car's lights.

He sweeps past, blasting me with his horn.

I sit there, recovering my composure, & try all the positions again, finally getting back to (1).
I drive timidly home.

I nearly wet myself after reading that - it is so true 🤣😂

[bd139]

Ok this is impressive. Ordered some bits from scan. It’s Sunday here. Getting next day delivery before 12…

Check the timings.

[AVGresponding]

This pair of listings has my spidey-sense tingling:



https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/144108477647



https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/144108477208

[bd139]

Lorries still have backs that things fall off 

[med6753]

Lorries still have backs that things fall off 

My same thought. Them bad boys be hot...as in stolen. 

[Specmaster]

Nice score, 0culus. 

Meanwhile, on the bench...




mnem

That is either a REALLY tiny engine, or a friggin' HUGE battery!!  Is it  an early attempt at an EV?

-Pat

@Pat You have had the luxury of rarely having to deal with Lucas electrics in cars - 'Mr Lucas - the prince of darkness - who accidentally invented the intermittent windscreen wiper etc. To get a 1960s Lucas containing car started in winter you will need a bigger battery than that! HiHi
😂

Ahh, yes, I've heard of the three position Lucas headlight switch - off, dim and flicker. 

-Pat

😂, so true, but all in the same position 😜

But wait!---There's more!

My Morris Minor discovered four modes on the floor dipper swtch.
(1)Low beam.
(2)High beam
(3)Pitch darkness
(4)Both high & low beams simulaneously.

Driving on High beam, another car approaches, ----I try to dip the lights.
Suddenly, up comes (4), lighting up the place like a floodlight.

Frantically, I hit the switch again, up comes (3) ---pitch darkness.

I grovel over to where I can just see the edge of the road from the other car's lights.

He sweeps past, blasting me with his horn.

I sit there, recovering my composure, & try all the positions again, finally getting back to (1).
I drive timidly home.

Firstly, that is only a drawing, not an actual photo, the car itself is a Wolsey 1500 and as you will see from the these 2 photos, is a small car and that the engine layout is totally different, the battery for instance on those cars sat on the engine bulkhead at the back of the bay. I have had a car since the 60s with Lucas electrics and have never experienced anything like the horror stories some of you relate. Also, I have never had the starting problems that some of you have mentioned, just kept the car well maintained, but I suspect that a lot of the issues arose from the bonnet (hood for you yanks) was unlined and so when the temperature dropped, would cause the condensation to drip all over the engine and ignition leads.

[med6753]

Tek 7633 with timebase and two dual trace plug-ins.   Current high bid is 5.50EUR

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/154492129422  --  Located in Germany.  I asked the seller (in German) about postage to the UK but have not had a reply.

Untested, no guarantee, no returns.     

Too risky, I'd walk away from that.

Too risky as in Don't trust eBay?

Or too risky as 7000 series 'scopes are impossible to repair?

Or    £200 and 2 months later, I'd have a barely working 50MHz scope that is not in spec  and wishing I'd bought a Hantek?

Asking because  7xxx's come up on UK eBay sometimes.  I always asume it doesn't work and needs at least the power supply caps replaced.  I have no idea what I'd be getting into.    I have repared a few 545's  and 555's and a 315  but that is entirely different.

7603 scopes are pretty simple and not difficult to repair. Don't know about 7623 with all the storage extra's. These scopes have a linear PSU with power transformer.

But I am also concerned about it's exterior condition. It definitely was owned by a smoker. It may clean up or it may not.

BTW, it's 100MHz...not 50MHz.

It's a crap shoot but might be worth it for the right price.

I did forget to mention that the CRT is a "flood gun" design which is key to it's storage ability. Problem is they have a relatively short lifespan and only so many storage cycles before that feature stops working. But the CRT can continue to function like any other CRT and display the signal only. 

[AVGresponding]

Lorries still have backs that things fall off 

My same thought. Them bad boys be hot...as in stolen. 

And even worse, if you look very closely, those boxes appear to be the same one; the damage on the corners is pretty much identical, though it's tricky to be sure due to the lighting.