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Here is a hydraulic diagram of an typical ABS system.
As you can see it has valves for individual wheels. Not only that, parts of it are doubled up for redundancy reasons. That's why you can't just do it as a single line, the brake system is already split in half at the master cylinder for safety reasons (as you can see two pipes coming out of it)
If you step it up to electronic stability control then there are a few more valves after the master cylinder to allow the pumps to build pressure without the brake pedal being pressed down (otherwise the master cylinder vents all pressure back to the brake fluid tank when fully released)
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My experience of ABS has not been good. If one wheel traverses an icy patch you effectively lose all braking as hydraulic pressure is reduced until the wheel in contact with the ice ceases to slip. This was my experience with a 20 year old Honda civic with an early version of ABS and things may have changed by now. Does current ABS have the ability to reduce pressure only on the slipping wheel?
ABS is not intended to improve braking distance. It is to improve handling under braking.
I've done one of those training days, and ABS will allow you to swerve while not having ABS may get you stopped faster, you will have run over the cones.
Often these systems are linked with other traction control, with varying sucess. Perhaps that is what you have experienced?
My civic 2009 didn't like one slipping wheel either. -
Yes, I accept that is a handling criterion though sudden loss of braking efficacy can be terrifying.
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Your claims are not accurate to the vast majority of real world road users:My experience of ABS has not been good. If one wheel traverses an icy patch you effectively lose all braking as hydraulic pressure is reduced until the wheel in contact with the ice ceases to slip. This was my experience with a 20 year old Honda civic with an early version of ABS and things may have changed by now. Does current ABS have the ability to reduce pressure only on the slipping wheel?
ABS is not intended to improve braking distance. It is to improve handling under braking.
I've done one of those training days, and ABS will allow you to swerve while not having ABS may get you stopped faster, you will have run over the cones.
Often these systems are linked with other traction control, with varying sucess. Perhaps that is what you have experienced?
My civic 2009 didn't like one slipping wheel either.
https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/nhtsaabst4finalrpt.pdf "''DOT HS 808 875, NHTSA Light Vehicle Antilock Brake System Research Program Task 4"QuoteThe results of this study indicate that for most stopping maneuvers, made on most test surfaces, ABS-assisted panic stops were shorter than those made with best effort or full pedal applications with the ABS disabled
Despite being on relatively ancient vehicles most with retrofitted (and 3 channel) systems not representative of modern ABS/ESC/traction control.
As much as you might think you can beat out ABS, good luck maintaining racing focus while an emergency is underway, and those 5 feet of yours controlling each wheel independently sure are a convenient mutation....
There may be some small percentage of situations for some small percentage of drivers where ABS degrades their stopping capability but anyone with that level of driving skill to accurately sit on the limit of adhesion would be able to equally predict/feel the limit of the ABS and remain safer/more effective in pretty much all situations. There is no evidence ABS is consistently worse, even for skilled drivers.
Racing drivers, prefer a well tuned ABS:
https://www.hpacademy.com/technical-articles/is-motorsport-abs-worth-it/ -
Electronic stability control is a fantastic innovation. The computer takes the driver's steering wheel input and compares this to the yaw of the vehicle. It adds braking as needed on each wheel to match the steering demand. On high-end vehicles with AWD and electric motors it can even bias power to wheels as needed by using the brake and differential to direct torque as needed. This allows the car to steer much quicker around a sudden obstacle, like an animal appearing on the road.
It is notable that such features are banned in Formula 1 since they are deemed to give the driver too much of an advantage (along with ABS, traction control, etc). -
You left off the rest of that quoted paragraph: "...The one systematic exception as on loose gravel where stopping distances increased by an average of 27.2% overall. Additionally, the vehicular stability during testing was almost always superior with the assistance of ABS. For the cases in which instability was observed, ABS was not deemed responsible for its occurrence."
Your claims are not accurate to the vast majority of real world road users:My experience of ABS has not been good. If one wheel traverses an icy patch you effectively lose all braking as hydraulic pressure is reduced until the wheel in contact with the ice ceases to slip. This was my experience with a 20 year old Honda civic with an early version of ABS and things may have changed by now. Does current ABS have the ability to reduce pressure only on the slipping wheel?
ABS is not intended to improve braking distance. It is to improve handling under braking.
I've done one of those training days, and ABS will allow you to swerve while not having ABS may get you stopped faster, you will have run over the cones.
Often these systems are linked with other traction control, with varying sucess. Perhaps that is what you have experienced?
My civic 2009 didn't like one slipping wheel either.
https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/nhtsaabst4finalrpt.pdf "''DOT HS 808 875, NHTSA Light Vehicle Antilock Brake System Research Program Task 4"QuoteThe results of this study indicate that for most stopping maneuvers, made on most test surfaces, ABS-assisted panic stops were shorter than those made with best effort or full pedal applications with the ABS disabled
Despite being on relatively ancient vehicles most with retrofitted (and 3 channel) systems not representative of modern ABS/ESC/traction control.
It also states later: "This study also establishes that antilock brake systems include compromises of stopping distance versus vehicular stability. Most antilock braking systems maintain vehicular stability while braking by minimizing excessive yaw. In a curve, this stability may be created by sacrificing the shortest attainable stopping distance."
Note also that the study doesn't appear to even mention ice or snow, which IMHO are some of the most important situations for ABS to maintain steering control. (The PDF is not searchable, so I can't be sure without carefully reading it in its entirety, which I'm not going to do.)
So yeah, I think Jeroen3's statement that ABS is not intended to decrease stopping distance is correct, and my knowledge of the history of ABS agrees with him: the intent was to prevent loss of steering control. Note however that the study doesn't contradict that statement, either: just because ABS wasn't intended to decrease stopping distance doesn't preclude it also doing so. -
Does current ABS have the ability to reduce pressure only on the slipping wheel?
At least in a Tesla this is done on a per-wheel basis. Sounds simple, but isn't, as this means an intricate coordination between acceleration, regeneration and braking. In another thread about one pedal driving someone pointed to a document that explains this a bit: https://www.autosafety.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Tesla-Regen-Brakes-and-Sudden-Acceleration.pdf
Most EV has "bleneded brakes" while Teslas only use "gas pedal" to control regen. On most "conventional" vehicles, traction control is active with throttle and wheel slip, reducing wheel slip by reducing throttle or breaking the slipping wheel. ABS works with the brake pedal, selectively reducing slipping wheel's brake while not affecting non-slipping wheel's braking torque.
In a Tesla, what will happen with wheel slippage on no "gas" and no brake? It may lead to a loss of control since neither TC nor ABS are active. The solution, I'm not pretty sure, might be hitting the brake hard. As ABS activation disengages regen, hitting the brakes can, counter intuitively, increases the speed of slipping wheels, regaining traction. -
All of these safety features are a great idea (at least when well implemented)
ABS:
Sure it increases braking distance versus a perfectly managed stop by modulating the brake pedal on a even surface.
But how many times does that happen in a real world emergency braking event? Most of the people on the road are not racing drivers that have the skill to feel for wheel slip and keep it right on the edge. Even less so in a panic situation. So what actually happens most of the time is that people will slam on the brake pedal. This results in a much longer braking distance and complete loss of steering ability. If his is done with one side of the car on a different driving surface (such as the gravel shoulder or on ice) then the car will also go into a spin as soon as you slam the brake all the way. I like to think i am a pretty capable driver, but i would not trust myself to carefully manage the brake pedal in an emergency situation and so i would never want to turn off ABS.
Traction control:
Also makes for worse acceleration versus perfectly modulating the throttle on the edge of grip. But in a well implemented system not by all that much. Yet again for a typical drivers with no racing skills, they will apply too much throttle, spin the wheels and get much less acceleration than what traction control would give them. Even worse if it is a rear wheel drive car as they will end up getting into a drift that they don't know how to control and spin the car off the road or into traffic.
Electronic stability control:
Helps turn your car towards where you are turning the wheel by differentialy braking. No manual equivalent possible for this as you only have 1 brake pedal. Heck it is often even banned in motorsport racing as it is an unfair electronic advantage.
Automatic emergency braking:
Helps save people from crashes of the most common kind, distraction or bad visibility.
I seen a 2016 Volvo with this system go trough 300 000km. The system deployed 3 times in that total time.
1: Braking in front of a parking ramp. I know the exact timing of the ramp so i don't stop and just drive at a speed where it lifts just in time. That time the car tought it was too close and used braking.
2: Same ramp but 1 year later
3: Foggy conditions on a highway and the traffic suddenly stopped ahead. Too low visibility for the driver to see, but the cars radar could see it and applied brakes to prevent rear ending the car in front at quite a speed.
So clearly they had the technology to make these systems work reliably already a decade ago in the year 2016. So if such a system causes false triggers on a new car, that means the manufacturer fucked up in implementing it.
In addition to the manufacturers "fucked up in implementing it" there are also design philosophy changes. Back then, cars were user-centric. ABS maintains directional control of the car. ESC helps the car turning into the direction the driver wants to turn. Automatic(always on, not just active in cruise control) lane centering or lane keeping adds additional decision-making that's not part of the driver. In other words, the car has a mind of its own. ADDW is another level where the car is attempting to "command" the driver into meeting the car's criteria -
In a Tesla, what will happen with wheel slippage on no "gas" and no brake? It may lead to a loss of control since neither TC nor ABS are active. The solution, I'm not pretty sure, might be hitting the brake hard. As ABS activation disengages regen, hitting the brakes can, counter intuitively, increases the speed of slipping wheels, regaining traction.
According to the document I linked to something called Engine Drag torque Control should handle this (page 21, item 7). AFAICS it hits the accelerator. -
Electronic stability control is a fantastic innovation. The computer takes the driver's steering wheel input and compares this to the yaw of the vehicle. It adds braking as needed on each wheel to match the steering demand. On high-end vehicles with AWD and electric motors it can even bias power to wheels as needed by using the brake and differential to direct torque as needed. This allows the car to steer much quicker around a sudden obstacle, like an animal appearing on the road.
It is notable that such features are banned in Formula 1 since they are deemed to give the driver too much of an advantage (along with ABS, traction control, etc).
early 2000 World Rally Championship cars had stupid amount of electronics, much more than F1 ever had. The rally cars had triple electronically controlled differentials, launch and traction control, electronic active Suspension, Roll Control, and ride height, on asphalt rallys ABS
GT3 cars still have ABS and traction control, a pro racing driver might do better than ABS once in a while, but even a "gentleman" driver will do 99%
as good every single time with ABS by just stomping on the brake as hard possible -
Does current ABS have the ability to reduce pressure only on the slipping wheel?
At least in a Tesla this is done on a per-wheel basis. Sounds simple, but isn't, as this means an intricate coordination between acceleration, regeneration and braking. In another thread about one pedal driving someone pointed to a document that explains this a bit: https://www.autosafety.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Tesla-Regen-Brakes-and-Sudden-Acceleration.pdf
Just FYI, Ronald Belt is a known quack in the industry who insists that every Tesla low speed accident is caused by an as-yet-undisclosed sudden unintended acceleration bug that Tesla hasn't found. In one of his papers he claimed the data showed that the 5V reference to the ADC used to read the accelerator pedal sensor was faulty. This fails to account for the design of nearly every automotive accelerator pedal (and Tesla is no exception) which use a CW and CCW wired potentiometer, so when accelerating one input is high and the other is low. A failure of either potentiometer, or the voltage reference, or the voltage supply to the potentiometer, results in the vehicle going into limp mode or no power, as the signals will not sum to the expected 5V or will not be in balance any more. Accelerator pedal logic isn't difficult to get right, and it would surprise me if Tesla has screwed this up and even more so if they haven't fixed it. That it continues to happen suggests it isn't software.
It is unfortunately the case that nearly every SUA event (in any car) can be explained by driver error and distraction. EVs do magnify the risk somewhat since they have quicker torque response than an ICE which may also produce an audible "rev" sound and may also need to shift the gearbox. The problem is that most EVs emulate the conventional automatic gearbox style of low speed driving, where the accelerator pedal switches creep mode on, and the brake is then used to modulate speed. Drivers confuse accelerator and brake, which means the vehicle accelerates. Drivers press what they think is the brake harder, and a positive feedback loop is created. I have had a momentary occasion of this but fortunately I was quick-thinking enough to realise my error and take my foot off the pedal and recalibrate, and nothing was too close to me to hit.
He later retracted some of these statements, and it turned out to be a sign error that meant his conclusion was wrong... along with most of the other things he's written about.
https://www.autosafety.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/01/Note-to-Readers-Regarding-Papers-on-Electric-Vehicles-1.pdf
Yeah, quack quack... -
He later retracted some of these statements, and it turned out to be a sign error that meant his conclusion was wrong... along with most of the other things he's written about.
https://www.autosafety.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/01/Note-to-Readers-Regarding-Papers-on-Electric-Vehicles-1.pdf
Yeah, quack quack...
Thanks, didn't even know that paper was referring to SUA as I didn't read past the diagrams and pedal charts, which AFAIK are still correct and useful info.
You can read the dual pedal sensor position info in real time if you want to test it out (not my photo), as is probably the case for most cars. I'd assume if one sensor reads 100% and one reads 0% its not going to move.
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Lets walk this right back to be fundamentals:
You left off the rest of that quoted paragraph: "...The one systematic exception as on loose gravel where stopping distances increased by an average of 27.2% overall. Additionally, the vehicular stability during testing was almost always superior with the assistance of ABS. For the cases in which instability was observed, ABS was not deemed responsible for its occurrence."
Your claims are not accurate to the vast majority of real world road users:My experience of ABS has not been good. If one wheel traverses an icy patch you effectively lose all braking as hydraulic pressure is reduced until the wheel in contact with the ice ceases to slip. This was my experience with a 20 year old Honda civic with an early version of ABS and things may have changed by now. Does current ABS have the ability to reduce pressure only on the slipping wheel?
ABS is not intended to improve braking distance. It is to improve handling under braking.
I've done one of those training days, and ABS will allow you to swerve while not having ABS may get you stopped faster, you will have run over the cones.
Often these systems are linked with other traction control, with varying sucess. Perhaps that is what you have experienced?
My civic 2009 didn't like one slipping wheel either.
https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/nhtsaabst4finalrpt.pdf "''DOT HS 808 875, NHTSA Light Vehicle Antilock Brake System Research Program Task 4"QuoteThe results of this study indicate that for most stopping maneuvers, made on most test surfaces, ABS-assisted panic stops were shorter than those made with best effort or full pedal applications with the ABS disabled
Despite being on relatively ancient vehicles most with retrofitted (and 3 channel) systems not representative of modern ABS/ESC/traction control.
It also states later: "This study also establishes that antilock brake systems include compromises of stopping distance versus vehicular stability. Most antilock braking systems maintain vehicular stability while braking by minimizing excessive yaw. In a curve, this stability may be created by sacrificing the shortest attainable stopping distance."
Note also that the study doesn't appear to even mention ice or snow, which IMHO are some of the most important situations for ABS to maintain steering control. (The PDF is not searchable, so I can't be sure without carefully reading it in its entirety, which I'm not going to do.)
So yeah, I think Jeroen3's statement that ABS is not intended to decrease stopping distance is correct, and my knowledge of the history of ABS agrees with him: the intent was to prevent loss of steering control. Note however that the study doesn't contradict that statement, either: just because ABS wasn't intended to decrease stopping distance doesn't preclude it also doing so.
Dynamic (sliding) friction is almost always less than static (non-sliding) friction.
ABS was developed to take advantage of that and increase braking force
Ideally, individually for each wheel (hence the massive improvement in controllability)
To be accurate the first mass scale commercial applications of ABS were in aircraft where the only metric was stopping distance:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxaret
Complications:
deep snow and gravel can have a "snowplough" mode where the assumption of letting wheels find their non-sliding grip results in longer stopping distances.
What percentage of drivers and roads is that? a tiny amount. What is the difference between ABS and not in those cases? Some 20-30% or so shorter stopping at the cost of directional control/stability. Can a driver in an actual emergency be cognisant enough to decide if they want to prioritise braking distance or directional control for the unfolding event? Unlikely, they'll just get their default unconscious reaction.
Ice is one of the areas that ABS (modern 4 channel systems) absolutely shines at. Most of the measured data is unavailable publicly (and the various "models" use stupid asymptotes that hide the complexity) but some does escape:
"Adhesion Properties of Studded Tires Study" Journal of Industrial Pollution Control 33(1)(2017)
The "I'm abetter[competitive racing level] driver and can always feel and control the ideal slip ratio so ABS is worse than me" is the problem, as its pretty much implausible other than the specific corner case of deep snow or gravel and wanting straight line stop without needing manoeuvring. Like a historic poster who claimed cars should have more power to weight (acceleration) as it would be safer.... in some vanishingly small corner case, and more dangerous the vast majority of the time.
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Bought a new Hyundai Tucson hybrid in Canada with Advanced Driver Distraction Warning (ADDW) not long ago which is a real pain in the ass. It has a camera on the steering column and if we look away to long it starts beeping then automatically starts braking which is BS. The dealer claimed it could be disabled but I have yet to find where the setting is.
The last update also installed a new feature and whenever the local speed limit is exceeded a big red dot shows up on the speedometer showing where the legal limit is. One has to wonder when they will eventually start sharing all this data with the insurance companies or notify the local police.
I'm with the guy in the video and all this new tech is probably a deal breaker on my next vehicle. I don't need big brother riding shotgun. -
I pointed to the document as an example of how difficult these systems have become these days, not as an example of why EV's (or Tesla's) would be dangerous. I fully agree with the observation that driver error is the main, if not only, reason for accidents like sudden acceleration. Electric drivetrains don't give you much leeway. Response is instantaneous whether you hit the accelerator intended or by accident.
Just FYI, Ronald Belt is a known quack in the industry who insists that every Tesla low speed accident is caused by an as-yet-undisclosed sudden unintended acceleration bug that Tesla hasn't found.Does current ABS have the ability to reduce pressure only on the slipping wheel?
At least in a Tesla this is done on a per-wheel basis. Sounds simple, but isn't, as this means an intricate coordination between acceleration, regeneration and braking. In another thread about one pedal driving someone pointed to a document that explains this a bit: https://www.autosafety.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Tesla-Regen-Brakes-and-Sudden-Acceleration.pdf -
Yeah most unintentional acceleration accidents are caused by the drivers accidentally mixing up the accelerator pedal for the brake pedal.
There have been some actual car faults for it, most famously the Toyota one (they even have a yearly event now where they remind their R&D staff of that accident so that they realize what is at stake). Tesla also had it happen, but it was a problem of the fancy decorative pedal plate sliding off and wedging the pedal down on the Cybertruck (but least their software correctly handled it by ignoring the pedal when the brake is held)
But indeed electric cars make this problem worse. They take off at full power the moment you mash the pedal. In a manual transmission car this mistake is a lot harder to make, while most automatic transmissions are pretty slow to set off from a standstill, additionally hearing the engine revving might give you a clue about what mistake you just made. But some people freeze up in the panic and press the "brake pedal" even harder, if the car takes off like a rocket that panic is going to be even worse.
Not sure if there is any sensible technological solution to this rare but serious driver mistake. Hopefully they don't have the brilliant idea of putting in place legislation for a system that tries to detect this. Then when i floor it at an intersection to get out of the way, the car would give me full throttle for half a second putting me into the intersection, then suddenly stop and telling me i likely mixed up the pedals before i get tboned moments later. -
Yeah most unintentional acceleration accidents are caused by the drivers accidentally mixing up the accelerator pedal for the brake pedal.
There have been some actual car faults for it, most famously the Toyota one (they even have a yearly event now where they remind their R&D staff of that accident so that they realize what is at stake). Tesla also had it happen, but it was a problem of the fancy decorative pedal plate sliding off and wedging the pedal down on the Cybertruck (but least their software correctly handled it by ignoring the pedal when the brake is held)
But indeed electric cars make this problem worse. They take off at full power the moment you mash the pedal. In a manual transmission car this mistake is a lot harder to make, while most automatic transmissions are pretty slow to set off from a standstill, additionally hearing the engine revving might give you a clue about what mistake you just made. But some people freeze up in the panic and press the "brake pedal" even harder, if the car takes off like a rocket that panic is going to be even worse.
Not sure if there is any sensible technological solution to this rare but serious driver mistake. Hopefully they don't have the brilliant idea of putting in place legislation for a system that tries to detect this. Then when i floor it at an intersection to get out of the way, the car would give me full throttle for half a second putting me into the intersection, then suddenly stop and telling me i likely mixed up the pedals before i get tboned moments later.
isn't that already "fixed" by the seven different anti collision, pedestrian avoidance system?
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I pointed to the document as an example of how difficult these systems have become these days, not as an example of why EV's (or Tesla's) would be dangerous. I fully agree with the observation that driver error is the main, if not only, reason for accidents like sudden acceleration. Electric drivetrains don't give you much leeway. Response is instantaneous whether you hit the accelerator intended or by accident.
Just FYI, Ronald Belt is a known quack in the industry who insists that every Tesla low speed accident is caused by an as-yet-undisclosed sudden unintended acceleration bug that Tesla hasn't found.Does current ABS have the ability to reduce pressure only on the slipping wheel?
At least in a Tesla this is done on a per-wheel basis. Sounds simple, but isn't, as this means an intricate coordination between acceleration, regeneration and braking. In another thread about one pedal driving someone pointed to a document that explains this a bit: https://www.autosafety.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Tesla-Regen-Brakes-and-Sudden-Acceleration.pdf
I seem to remember one EV where several had by accident hit the cruise control resume button on the steering wheel
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I always thougth that the motorbike arrangement, having acelerator/brake in "orthogonal" axes (rotation/press) are inherently more secure that the standard mess seen in cars. Now I use much more the cruise control instead of the accel. pedal, except inside the city (provided that the cruise control has a reasonable user interface…)
Anyway, am I the only one thinking that: a) in general, cars have too much unneeded power/torque, and b) this is even worse in EV/HEV? It is of no usage to throw 300+ Nm to the wheels from stop, as it is to achieve 100 km/h in 5s (or 10 s). Limiting maximum speed AND maximum acceleration will make much sense to me. -
I always thougth that the motorbike arrangement, having acelerator/brake in "orthogonal" axes (rotation/press) are inherently more secure that the standard mess seen in cars. Now I use much more the cruise control instead of the accel. pedal, except inside the city (provided that the cruise control has a reasonable user interface…)
Anyway, am I the only one thinking that: a) in general, cars have too much unneeded power/torque, and b) this is even worse in EV/HEV? It is of no usage to throw 300+ Nm to the wheels from stop, as it is to achieve 100 km/h in 5s (or 10 s). Limiting maximum speed AND maximum acceleration will make much sense to me.
yeh, now even "family cars" have performance number sports cars could only dream of 20 years ago
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I always thougth that the motorbike arrangement, having acelerator/brake in "orthogonal" axes (rotation/press) are inherently more secure that the standard mess seen in cars. Now I use much more the cruise control instead of the accel. pedal, except inside the city (provided that the cruise control has a reasonable user interface…)
It has been proposed a few times in the past. To be honest that is quite similar to how I drive in an EV. In my Polestar the regen braking is very strong (100kW+) so you rarely have to press the brake pedal, just lift off the accelerator.Anyway, am I the only one thinking that: a) in general, cars have too much unneeded power/torque, and b) this is even worse in EV/HEV? It is of no usage to throw 300+ Nm to the wheels from stop, as it is to achieve 100 km/h in 5s (or 10 s). Limiting maximum speed AND maximum acceleration will make much sense to me.
Yeah, but counterpoint: it is a lot of fun.
And besides the fun, there can be moments where having more acceleration makes a vehicle safer. For instance, if you emerge out of a junction here, do you prefer a car that can get to the speed limit (70 mph) in ~13 seconds, or one that can do it in ~6 seconds? The quicker you accelerate, the less of a danger you are to other traffic travelling at mainline speed.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/6AeMu2Ew8REwqfkU7 -
Not sure if there is any sensible technological solution to this rare but serious driver mistake. Hopefully they don't have the brilliant idea of putting in place legislation for a system that tries to detect this. Then when i floor it at an intersection to get out of the way, the car would give me full throttle for half a second putting me into the intersection, then suddenly stop and telling me i likely mixed up the pedals before i get tboned moments later.
isn't that already "fixed" by the seven different anti collision, pedestrian avoidance system?
Not sure. I still seen some videos of runaway modern cars.
It might be that the driver is swerving around to avoid obstacles while their foot keeps being plated on the "brake pedal". So the car goes for the evade maneuver rather than brake. Some cars these days do have safety features that intervene with steering when you try to swerve around a obstacle on the highway (as sometimes there is not distance available to stop in time).
I don't have any experience with these systems apart from seeing manufacturers boast about their cars having them. But given how badly they implement some of these aids it does make me worried how well they work in real life. Like for example the car deciding to swerve around the other side from where you are trying to go and pointing you straight into the obstacle as a result. Or what happens if an experienced driver swerves correctly and the system tries to 'help' on top of that and causes an over correction. I might get confused at what is happening if the car suddenly intervened for me. -
Most of the time, collision avoidance features are inhibited if the driver is significantly accelerating. There will be a warning, but no intervention. So I doubt that is what you are seeing. More likely it is the driver swerving or the wheels hitting something that forces the change in direction.
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Yes i meant that the driver is swerving (since that's the natural thing to do when the car is not stopping)
Just that the driver actions likely put the cars safety systems into a different mode, so the car might intentionally avoid automatically braking in that situation (as applying the brake in the wrong enough situation can be just as dangerous) -
Bought a new Hyundai Tucson hybrid in Canada with Advanced Driver Distraction Warning (ADDW) not long ago which is a real pain in the ass. It has a camera on the steering column and if we look away to long it starts beeping then automatically starts braking which is BS. The dealer claimed it could be disabled but I have yet to find where the setting is.
The last update also installed a new feature and whenever the local speed limit is exceeded a big red dot shows up on the speedometer showing where the legal limit is. One has to wonder when they will eventually start sharing all this data with the insurance companies or notify the local police.
I'm with the guy in the video and all this new tech is probably a deal breaker on my next vehicle. I don't need big brother riding shotgun.
I liken these to having a nagging wife on steroids.
And contrary to wife which you can leave at home, this system is always, always with you.