Author Topic: Tariffs  (Read 429205 times)

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Offline MT

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2650 on: October 24, 2025, 03:33:11 pm »
Pretty wild. Ontario CA took out an Ad in the US that misrepresents a speech by Ronald Reagan. That appears to have triggered the president to cancel trade negotiations with Canada.

The optics here are surreal. Is it that common for governments to advertise in another country outside of tourism?  To me, it isn't dissimilar to nation states misinformation campaigns online but they try to hide the source of those.

Did the creators and authors really think that the misrepresentation would be taken well and it would somehow have a positive outcome?

Original speech:
« Last Edit: October 24, 2025, 03:35:48 pm by MT »
 
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Online Cyclotron

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2651 on: October 24, 2025, 03:36:39 pm »
Pretty wild. Ontario CA took out an Ad in the US that misrepresents a speech by Ronald Reagan. That appears to have triggered the president to cancel trade negotiations with Canada.

The optics here are surreal. Is it that common for governments to advertise in another country outside of tourism?  To me, it isn't dissimilar to nation states misinformation campaigns online but they try to hide the source of those.

Did the creators and authors really think that the misrepresentation would be taken well and it would somehow have a positive outcome?

Did you even read the article?, it literally outlines how Reagan was for free trade and against tariffs.

Quote: In the original, Reagan praises the economic benefits of free trade and continues: "Now, that message of free trade is one I conveyed to Canada's leaders a few weeks ago, and it was warmly received there. Indeed, throughout the world there's a growing realisation that the way to prosperity for all nations is rejecting protectionist legislation and promoting fair and free competition."

Do you think the Canadian PM Mark Carney would have a complete melt down and cancel trade negotiations if any U.S. state ran an ad critical of his policy?. Well no, it's psychotic and infantile. I really miss the days when politicians didn't have temper tantrums and acted like adults.

Come on man. I did read it and I was listening when Reagan made the original speech. Reagan was against the tariffs but implemented them and used them as a tool in negotiations with Japan. Please don't mischaracterize it as anything else. If you're coming for me for not reading it, I have to return the favor since you didn't and don't seem to understand what Reagan was saying. Seriously man. He implemented 100% tariffs on Japanese goods in that negotiation process.

I see infantile and psychotic acts from Canadian politicians right here in issuing 75 Million dollars in Ads that any fool would know how it would turn out.
Seeing Infantile and psychotic responses shouldn't be a surprise.
 

Offline Electrodynamic

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2652 on: October 24, 2025, 04:05:13 pm »
Pretty wild. Ontario CA took out an Ad in the US that misrepresents a speech by Ronald Reagan. That appears to have triggered the president to cancel trade negotiations with Canada.

The optics here are surreal. Is it that common for governments to advertise in another country outside of tourism?  To me, it isn't dissimilar to nation states misinformation campaigns online but they try to hide the source of those.

Did the creators and authors really think that the misrepresentation would be taken well and it would somehow have a positive outcome?

Did you even read the article?, it literally outlines how Reagan was for free trade and against tariffs.

Quote: In the original, Reagan praises the economic benefits of free trade and continues: "Now, that message of free trade is one I conveyed to Canada's leaders a few weeks ago, and it was warmly received there. Indeed, throughout the world there's a growing realisation that the way to prosperity for all nations is rejecting protectionist legislation and promoting fair and free competition."

Do you think the Canadian PM Mark Carney would have a complete melt down and cancel trade negotiations if any U.S. state ran an ad critical of his policy?. Well no, it's psychotic and infantile. I really miss the days when politicians didn't have temper tantrums and acted like adults.

Come on man. I did read it and I was listening when Reagan made the original speech. Reagan was against the tariffs but implemented them and used them as a tool in negotiations with Japan. Please don't mischaracterize it as anything else. If you're coming for me for not reading it, I have to return the favor since you didn't and don't seem to understand what Reagan was saying. Seriously man. He implemented 100% tariffs on Japanese goods in that negotiation process.

I see infantile and psychotic acts from Canadian politicians right here in issuing 75 Million dollars in Ads that any fool would know how it would turn out.
Seeing Infantile and psychotic responses shouldn't be a surprise.

No, taking out ads targeting the competition or an injustice is very common and used all the time in business.

Didn't Trump call other leaders stupid, ugly, maybe a 3, having an ugly wife and children, calling their children stupid and so on?. I could bring up the thousands of insults and personal attacks with an AI if you want?.

Oh wait, there is actually a website, https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/01/28/upshot/donald-trump-twitter-insults.html

So let me get this straight, trump can spew insult after insult but anyone critical of him in any way warrants a complete melt down on social media and massive tariffs and/or ceasing government negotiations?. It's wild how your trying to "normalize" this.

 



 

Online Cyclotron

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2653 on: October 24, 2025, 04:13:49 pm »
Pretty wild. Ontario CA took out an Ad in the US that misrepresents a speech by Ronald Reagan. That appears to have triggered the president to cancel trade negotiations with Canada.

The optics here are surreal. Is it that common for governments to advertise in another country outside of tourism?  To me, it isn't dissimilar to nation states misinformation campaigns online but they try to hide the source of those.

Did the creators and authors really think that the misrepresentation would be taken well and it would somehow have a positive outcome?

Did you even read the article?, it literally outlines how Reagan was for free trade and against tariffs.

Quote: In the original, Reagan praises the economic benefits of free trade and continues: "Now, that message of free trade is one I conveyed to Canada's leaders a few weeks ago, and it was warmly received there. Indeed, throughout the world there's a growing realisation that the way to prosperity for all nations is rejecting protectionist legislation and promoting fair and free competition."

Do you think the Canadian PM Mark Carney would have a complete melt down and cancel trade negotiations if any U.S. state ran an ad critical of his policy?. Well no, it's psychotic and infantile. I really miss the days when politicians didn't have temper tantrums and acted like adults.

Come on man. I did read it and I was listening when Reagan made the original speech. Reagan was against the tariffs but implemented them and used them as a tool in negotiations with Japan. Please don't mischaracterize it as anything else. If you're coming for me for not reading it, I have to return the favor since you didn't and don't seem to understand what Reagan was saying. Seriously man. He implemented 100% tariffs on Japanese goods in that negotiation process.

I see infantile and psychotic acts from Canadian politicians right here in issuing 75 Million dollars in Ads that any fool would know how it would turn out.
Seeing Infantile and psychotic responses shouldn't be a surprise.

No, taking out ads targeting the competition or an injustice is very common and used all the time in business.
Note that you said that I'm trying to "normalize" this and right in the same post you say "Business does this all the time" but we both know that countries don't.
Who's normalizing what?

Quote
Didn't Trump call other leaders stupid, ugly, maybe a 3, having an ugly wife and children, calling their children stupid and so on?. I could bring up the thousands of insults and personal attacks with an AI if you want?.

Oh wait, there is actually a website, https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/01/28/upshot/donald-trump-twitter-insults.html
I get it, you're saying that whatever other people do you should be able to sink to the same level and not be called out for it. M-kay.

Quote
So let me get this straight, trump can spew insult after insult but anyone critical of him in any way warrants a complete melt down on social media and massive tariffs and/or ceasing government negotiations?. It's wild how your trying to "normalize" this.

This isn't about anyone being critical of Trump or it shouldn't be. This is totally where a lot of people want the conversation and it will lead nowhere.
This is the stampy foot "But mom, he hit me first" crap that's everywhere.

I have to imagine, if the folks in the Ontario government are super smart, they had to know where it was going and that the intent was to shut down negotiations.
Every post here says that even us regular folks knew this would be the results.

I'm not happy about the response. Are you happy about the 75million spent to create and distribute the Ad that had this response?

And one more thing:
Go Blue Jays! I'm heading back to Toronto and hoping to catch one of the local games.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2025, 04:16:14 pm by Cyclotron »
 

Offline Electrodynamic

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2654 on: October 24, 2025, 04:30:26 pm »
I think much of what were seeing in the U.S. and on tariffs may relate to psychology and normalization.

Desensitization – gradually making someone less sensitive to something shocking or extreme.
Rationalization – trying to justify or explain something irrational or crazy as if it makes sense.
Acceptance of the abnormal – a more general phrasing used in social contexts.

We could ask, is it normal for any leader have a melt down on social media when someone is critical of them?.
AI- "Just because something is “common” doesn’t make it psychologically or socially healthy. A meltdown in response to criticism usually signals poor coping strategies for stress, criticism, or accountability."

Similar to Gaslighting, Gaslighting is a form of psychological manipulation where someone tries to make another person doubt their perception, memory, or reality—essentially saying, “You’re wrong, crazy, or imagining things.”

Of course the obvious question is, if we were a little critical of someone and they had a melt down and stormed out of the room what would we think?... no mystery here.

 

Online Cyclotron

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2655 on: October 24, 2025, 04:58:31 pm »
I think much of what were seeing in the U.S. and on tariffs may relate to psychology and normalization.

Desensitization – gradually making someone less sensitive to something shocking or extreme.
Rationalization – trying to justify or explain something irrational or crazy as if it makes sense.
Acceptance of the abnormal – a more general phrasing used in social contexts.

We could ask, is it normal for any leader have a melt down on social media when someone is critical of them?.
AI- "Just because something is “common” doesn’t make it psychologically or socially healthy. A meltdown in response to criticism usually signals poor coping strategies for stress, criticism, or accountability."

Similar to Gaslighting, Gaslighting is a form of psychological manipulation where someone tries to make another person doubt their perception, memory, or reality—essentially saying, “You’re wrong, crazy, or imagining things.”

Of course the obvious question is, if we were a little critical of someone and they had a melt down and stormed out of the room what would we think?... no mystery here.

What you did above is commonly called "leading the witness."  What constitutes "a meltdown"?  What part of his post about the ads do you consider a "meltdown" and, what does the AI think a meltdown consist of. Do you think that the posts about the Ads from the Ontario leaders are meltdowns?  I generally believe or envision the following for a "meltdown":
A physical and emotional response to being overloaded, not a form of manipulation, and can involve screaming, crying, and lashing out. Loss of control of ones self, and self soothing.

Tantrum might be more realistic but then we have to determine what everyone means by that.

For your obvious question. If you were in a room of people and were being insulted or criticized and you felt it was unfair, would you simply remain calm and quiet?  Would you just sit there and take it? I am not defending the president.

I have stated a number of times that he can act very childish. He loves to troll and use all the trappings of modern social media to his advantage. The two nations involved here are equally responsible for being in the trade negotiations. They both just acted the same.

I don't need AI to help me understand that what both countries did was childish.
 

Offline Electrodynamic

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2656 on: October 24, 2025, 06:17:27 pm »
I think much of what were seeing in the U.S. and on tariffs may relate to psychology and normalization.

Desensitization – gradually making someone less sensitive to something shocking or extreme.
Rationalization – trying to justify or explain something irrational or crazy as if it makes sense.
Acceptance of the abnormal – a more general phrasing used in social contexts.

We could ask, is it normal for any leader have a melt down on social media when someone is critical of them?.
AI- "Just because something is “common” doesn’t make it psychologically or socially healthy. A meltdown in response to criticism usually signals poor coping strategies for stress, criticism, or accountability."

Similar to Gaslighting, Gaslighting is a form of psychological manipulation where someone tries to make another person doubt their perception, memory, or reality—essentially saying, “You’re wrong, crazy, or imagining things.”

Of course the obvious question is, if we were a little critical of someone and they had a melt down and stormed out of the room what would we think?... no mystery here.

What you did above is commonly called "leading the witness."  What constitutes "a meltdown"?  What part of his post about the ads do you consider a "meltdown" and, what does the AI think a meltdown consist of. Do you think that the posts about the Ads from the Ontario leaders are meltdowns?  I generally believe or envision the following for a "meltdown":
A physical and emotional response to being overloaded, not a form of manipulation, and can involve screaming, crying, and lashing out. Loss of control of ones self, and self soothing.

Tantrum might be more realistic but then we have to determine what everyone means by that.

For your obvious question. If you were in a room of people and were being insulted or criticized and you felt it was unfair, would you simply remain calm and quiet?  Would you just sit there and take it? I am not defending the president.

I have stated a number of times that he can act very childish. He loves to troll and use all the trappings of modern social media to his advantage. The two nations involved here are equally responsible for being in the trade negotiations. They both just acted the same.

I don't need AI to help me understand that what both countries did was childish.

A meltdown is defined as a situation where someone experiences a sudden loss of control over their emotions, often resulting in extreme distress or outbursts. Like watching an ad, getting angry/emotional and then cancelling trade negotiations. Letting our emotions dictate our actions rather than reason. Case in point, you don't see other world leaders having a melt down on social media due to a little criticism.

If I was in a room of people and was being insulted or criticized I would laugh my ass off. Once we understand the psychology or reasoning behind the actions or insults it has no real effect. It reflects more on the other person than us imo.

Quote
I have stated a number of times that he can act very childish. He loves to troll and use all the trappings of modern social media to his advantage. The two nations involved here are equally responsible for being in the trade negotiations. They both just acted the same.

Ah, the old were all the same fallacy. Well no we are not the same because our PM does not act like a child ranting on social media and if he did he would soon find himself unemployed. Your trying to normalize psychotic behavior the rest of the world has little tolerance for.
 

Online Cyclotron

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2657 on: October 24, 2025, 07:03:42 pm »
I think much of what were seeing in the U.S. and on tariffs may relate to psychology and normalization.

Desensitization – gradually making someone less sensitive to something shocking or extreme.
Rationalization – trying to justify or explain something irrational or crazy as if it makes sense.
Acceptance of the abnormal – a more general phrasing used in social contexts.

We could ask, is it normal for any leader have a melt down on social media when someone is critical of them?.
AI- "Just because something is “common” doesn’t make it psychologically or socially healthy. A meltdown in response to criticism usually signals poor coping strategies for stress, criticism, or accountability."

Similar to Gaslighting, Gaslighting is a form of psychological manipulation where someone tries to make another person doubt their perception, memory, or reality—essentially saying, “You’re wrong, crazy, or imagining things.”

Of course the obvious question is, if we were a little critical of someone and they had a melt down and stormed out of the room what would we think?... no mystery here.

What you did above is commonly called "leading the witness."  What constitutes "a meltdown"?  What part of his post about the ads do you consider a "meltdown" and, what does the AI think a meltdown consist of. Do you think that the posts about the Ads from the Ontario leaders are meltdowns?  I generally believe or envision the following for a "meltdown":
A physical and emotional response to being overloaded, not a form of manipulation, and can involve screaming, crying, and lashing out. Loss of control of ones self, and self soothing.

Tantrum might be more realistic but then we have to determine what everyone means by that.

For your obvious question. If you were in a room of people and were being insulted or criticized and you felt it was unfair, would you simply remain calm and quiet?  Would you just sit there and take it? I am not defending the president.

I have stated a number of times that he can act very childish. He loves to troll and use all the trappings of modern social media to his advantage. The two nations involved here are equally responsible for being in the trade negotiations. They both just acted the same.

I don't need AI to help me understand that what both countries did was childish.

A meltdown is defined as a situation where someone experiences a sudden loss of control over their emotions, often resulting in extreme distress or outbursts. Like watching an ad, getting angry/emotional and then cancelling trade negotiations. Letting our emotions dictate our actions rather than reason. Case in point, you don't see other world leaders having a melt down on social media due to a little criticism.

If I was in a room of people and was being insulted or criticized I would laugh my ass off. Once we understand the psychology or reasoning behind the actions or insults it has no real effect. It reflects more on the other person than us imo.

Quote
I have stated a number of times that he can act very childish. He loves to troll and use all the trappings of modern social media to his advantage. The two nations involved here are equally responsible for being in the trade negotiations. They both just acted the same.

Ah, the old were all the same fallacy. Well no we are not the same because our PM does not act like a child ranting on social media and if he did he would soon find himself unemployed. Your trying to normalize psychotic behavior the rest of the world has little tolerance for.
You see, I don't think we'll have a reasonable discussion. You didn't address any of the points I made about issues in your statements.
I also think you're feeding your feelings into AI and then plastering the output from it in some form here.

A person is in melt down if they have lost control, crying, screaming, generally non-coherent and will take some time to become functional again. Your definition says that the person gets pissed off and takes an action. That would be more along the lines of a tantrum or fit. He's known to have tantrums and fits for sure. In fact, the president didn't even respond other than to say he "had seen the ads" in the early days of their broadcast. This advertisement campaign started on October 14th so your view that this is a melt down or non-considered reaction is improbable.

Similarly, the Ontario government having a tantrum and taking out 75 million dollars in ads is the same thing.
In fact you claim that because the US president does "X" then it is reasonable that Ontario politicians do do "X" which is precisely the "Bandwagon fallacy".

There is no "were all the same fallacy".  No normal person is going to sit in a room and laugh while being criticized and name called. That as you say, would be psychotic.  I know I wouldn't sit there unless forced to. Why would anyone sit there and take it?

The advertisement is just playing games instead of engaging in productive talks to find amicable solutions. You can say that you're just jumping on the bandwagon but that's what it is and not productive.

« Last Edit: October 24, 2025, 07:44:36 pm by Cyclotron »
 

Offline Electrodynamic

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2658 on: October 24, 2025, 07:50:49 pm »
I think much of what were seeing in the U.S. and on tariffs may relate to psychology and normalization.

Desensitization – gradually making someone less sensitive to something shocking or extreme.
Rationalization – trying to justify or explain something irrational or crazy as if it makes sense.
Acceptance of the abnormal – a more general phrasing used in social contexts.

We could ask, is it normal for any leader have a melt down on social media when someone is critical of them?.
AI- "Just because something is “common” doesn’t make it psychologically or socially healthy. A meltdown in response to criticism usually signals poor coping strategies for stress, criticism, or accountability."

Similar to Gaslighting, Gaslighting is a form of psychological manipulation where someone tries to make another person doubt their perception, memory, or reality—essentially saying, “You’re wrong, crazy, or imagining things.”

Of course the obvious question is, if we were a little critical of someone and they had a melt down and stormed out of the room what would we think?... no mystery here.

What you did above is commonly called "leading the witness."  What constitutes "a meltdown"?  What part of his post about the ads do you consider a "meltdown" and, what does the AI think a meltdown consist of. Do you think that the posts about the Ads from the Ontario leaders are meltdowns?  I generally believe or envision the following for a "meltdown":
A physical and emotional response to being overloaded, not a form of manipulation, and can involve screaming, crying, and lashing out. Loss of control of ones self, and self soothing.

Tantrum might be more realistic but then we have to determine what everyone means by that.

For your obvious question. If you were in a room of people and were being insulted or criticized and you felt it was unfair, would you simply remain calm and quiet?  Would you just sit there and take it? I am not defending the president.

I have stated a number of times that he can act very childish. He loves to troll and use all the trappings of modern social media to his advantage. The two nations involved here are equally responsible for being in the trade negotiations. They both just acted the same.

I don't need AI to help me understand that what both countries did was childish.

A meltdown is defined as a situation where someone experiences a sudden loss of control over their emotions, often resulting in extreme distress or outbursts. Like watching an ad, getting angry/emotional and then cancelling trade negotiations. Letting our emotions dictate our actions rather than reason. Case in point, you don't see other world leaders having a melt down on social media due to a little criticism.

If I was in a room of people and was being insulted or criticized I would laugh my ass off. Once we understand the psychology or reasoning behind the actions or insults it has no real effect. It reflects more on the other person than us imo.

Quote
I have stated a number of times that he can act very childish. He loves to troll and use all the trappings of modern social media to his advantage. The two nations involved here are equally responsible for being in the trade negotiations. They both just acted the same.

Ah, the old were all the same fallacy. Well no we are not the same because our PM does not act like a child ranting on social media and if he did he would soon find himself unemployed. Your trying to normalize psychotic behavior the rest of the world has little tolerance for.
You see, I don't think we'll have a reasonable discussion. You didn't address any of the points I made about issues in your statements.
I also think you're feeding your feelings into AI and then plastering the output from it in some form here.

A person is in melt down if they have lost control, crying, screaming, generally non-coherent and will take some time to become functional again. Your definition says that the person gets pissed off and takes an action. That would be more along the lines of a tantrum or fit. He's known to have tantrums and fits for sure.

Similarly, the Ontario government having a tantrum and taking out 75 million dollars in ads is the same thing.
In fact you claim that because the US president does "X" then it is reasonable that Ontario politicians do do "X" which is precisely the "Bandwagon fallacy".

There is no "were all the same fallacy".  No normal person is going to sit in a room and laugh while being criticized and name called. That as you say, would be psychotic.  I know I wouldn't sit there unless forced to. Why would anyone sit there and take it?

1)I'm not addressing all your questions because your spam posting on 12 different subjects at once.

2)Here in Canada having a melt down tends to mean acting irrationally or childish.

3)First, the government of Ontario is not the government of Canada. Should our PM have a meltdown and nullify a trade agreement just because one governor in one state did or said something?. Well no, that's absurd.

4)I never claimed to be normal or like you. I'm a professional and am okay to watch other people acting irrationally which I interpret as weakness or lack of control over their emotions. If you saw two people screaming at each other would you jump in and start screaming?, well no that's absurd. As adults were expected to act like adults, is that so hard to understand?.

I read an article relating to psychology which explains our differences pretty well. Canadians are very similar in values to Americans 50 years ago. In effect, were more like your parents than you. Do you think your parents would have tolerated a president who constantly lies, is a felon and accused of being involved with a pedophile ring 50 years ago?. We have no tolerance for it either, it's that simple.
 

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2659 on: October 24, 2025, 08:30:37 pm »
Quote
In fact you claim that because the US president does "X" then it is reasonable that Ontario politicians do do "X" which is precisely the "Bandwagon fallacy".

I read it as more "He can hardly complain about this because he does worse." Which is quite different from "that justifies this".
 

Online Cyclotron

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2660 on: October 24, 2025, 09:00:04 pm »
I think much of what were seeing in the U.S. and on tariffs may relate to psychology and normalization.

Desensitization – gradually making someone less sensitive to something shocking or extreme.
Rationalization – trying to justify or explain something irrational or crazy as if it makes sense.
Acceptance of the abnormal – a more general phrasing used in social contexts.

We could ask, is it normal for any leader have a melt down on social media when someone is critical of them?.
AI- "Just because something is “common” doesn’t make it psychologically or socially healthy. A meltdown in response to criticism usually signals poor coping strategies for stress, criticism, or accountability."

Similar to Gaslighting, Gaslighting is a form of psychological manipulation where someone tries to make another person doubt their perception, memory, or reality—essentially saying, “You’re wrong, crazy, or imagining things.”

Of course the obvious question is, if we were a little critical of someone and they had a melt down and stormed out of the room what would we think?... no mystery here.

What you did above is commonly called "leading the witness."  What constitutes "a meltdown"?  What part of his post about the ads do you consider a "meltdown" and, what does the AI think a meltdown consist of. Do you think that the posts about the Ads from the Ontario leaders are meltdowns?  I generally believe or envision the following for a "meltdown":
A physical and emotional response to being overloaded, not a form of manipulation, and can involve screaming, crying, and lashing out. Loss of control of ones self, and self soothing.

Tantrum might be more realistic but then we have to determine what everyone means by that.

For your obvious question. If you were in a room of people and were being insulted or criticized and you felt it was unfair, would you simply remain calm and quiet?  Would you just sit there and take it? I am not defending the president.

I have stated a number of times that he can act very childish. He loves to troll and use all the trappings of modern social media to his advantage. The two nations involved here are equally responsible for being in the trade negotiations. They both just acted the same.

I don't need AI to help me understand that what both countries did was childish.

A meltdown is defined as a situation where someone experiences a sudden loss of control over their emotions, often resulting in extreme distress or outbursts. Like watching an ad, getting angry/emotional and then cancelling trade negotiations. Letting our emotions dictate our actions rather than reason. Case in point, you don't see other world leaders having a melt down on social media due to a little criticism.

If I was in a room of people and was being insulted or criticized I would laugh my ass off. Once we understand the psychology or reasoning behind the actions or insults it has no real effect. It reflects more on the other person than us imo.

Quote
I have stated a number of times that he can act very childish. He loves to troll and use all the trappings of modern social media to his advantage. The two nations involved here are equally responsible for being in the trade negotiations. They both just acted the same.

Ah, the old were all the same fallacy. Well no we are not the same because our PM does not act like a child ranting on social media and if he did he would soon find himself unemployed. Your trying to normalize psychotic behavior the rest of the world has little tolerance for.
You see, I don't think we'll have a reasonable discussion. You didn't address any of the points I made about issues in your statements.
I also think you're feeding your feelings into AI and then plastering the output from it in some form here.

A person is in melt down if they have lost control, crying, screaming, generally non-coherent and will take some time to become functional again. Your definition says that the person gets pissed off and takes an action. That would be more along the lines of a tantrum or fit. He's known to have tantrums and fits for sure.

Similarly, the Ontario government having a tantrum and taking out 75 million dollars in ads is the same thing.
In fact you claim that because the US president does "X" then it is reasonable that Ontario politicians do do "X" which is precisely the "Bandwagon fallacy".

There is no "were all the same fallacy".  No normal person is going to sit in a room and laugh while being criticized and name called. That as you say, would be psychotic.  I know I wouldn't sit there unless forced to. Why would anyone sit there and take it?

1)I'm not addressing all your questions because your spam posting on 12 different subjects at once.

2)Here in Canada having a melt down tends to mean acting irrationally or childish.

3)First, the government of Ontario is not the government of Canada. Should our PM have a meltdown and nullify a trade agreement just because one governor in one state did or said something?. Well no, that's absurd.

4)I never claimed to be normal or like you. I'm a professional and am okay to watch other people acting irrationally which I interpret as weakness or lack of control over their emotions. If you saw two people screaming at each other would you jump in and start screaming?, well no that's absurd. As adults were expected to act like adults, is that so hard to understand?.

I read an article relating to psychology which explains our differences pretty well. Canadians are very similar in values to Americans 50 years ago. In effect, were more like your parents than you. Do you think your parents would have tolerated a president who constantly lies, is a felon and accused of being involved with a pedophile ring 50 years ago?. We have no tolerance for it either, it's that simple.

Thanks for letting about not handling multiple points at the same time. I assume you're implying you're abnormal but somehow how a superior kind of abnormal.

Pro-tip, if you don't want to handle a lot of topics or points about your statements at once, maybe you shouldn't make them.

You don't have search AI for your answers to these. Just take it as your leisure.

1. SPAM is commercial email, I didn't send you any.

2. Your points were refuted but you are allowed to keep your views.

3. I'm here in Canada all the time. I don't find Canadians to be intolerant.

4. The presidents first response to the ads was "meh". Check the facts As the CBC reported,
Quote
At the same event, Ford said he and Carney are on the “same page” when it comes to trade, adding he supports the prime minister “1,000 per cent.”
  The whole thing is childish and even the simple minded could expect that it wouldn't be helpful closing a deal on trade. Why try to negotiate in good faith when they spend 75 million on Ads that they know will be inflammatory?

5. The ads didn't cause any "nullification of a trade agreement".  They caused the planned sessions to be shelved. Don't lie.

8. Careful, your superiority complex is showing.

Why is it so hard for you to understand that the Ads were childish and got the exact results that you expected. Is it that hard?


 

Online Cyclotron

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2661 on: October 24, 2025, 09:04:26 pm »
Quote
In fact you claim that because the US president does "X" then it is reasonable that Ontario politicians do do "X" which is precisely the "Bandwagon fallacy".

I read it as more "He can hardly complain about this because he does worse." Which is quite different from "that justifies this".

In that case it would be the Tu Quoque Fallacy.
 

Online PlainName

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2662 on: October 24, 2025, 09:11:51 pm »
Quote
In fact you claim that because the US president does "X" then it is reasonable that Ontario politicians do do "X" which is precisely the "Bandwagon fallacy".

I read it as more "He can hardly complain about this because he does worse." Which is quite different from "that justifies this".

In that case it would be the Tu Quoque Fallacy.

Is there a fallacy for "I made stuff up that you said, but that's OK because you used a fallacy"?
 

Online Cyclotron

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2663 on: October 24, 2025, 09:21:28 pm »
Quote
In fact you claim that because the US president does "X" then it is reasonable that Ontario politicians do do "X" which is precisely the "Bandwagon fallacy".

I read it as more "He can hardly complain about this because he does worse." Which is quite different from "that justifies this".

In that case it would be the Tu Quoque Fallacy.

Is there a fallacy for "I made stuff up that you said, but that's OK because you used a fallacy"?

I don't know, what did you make up? Unless you're claiming I made something up, then of course, call out what you see as made up.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2025, 09:35:50 pm by Cyclotron »
 

Online PlainName

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2664 on: October 24, 2025, 09:49:17 pm »
Quote
In fact you claim that because the US president does "X" then it is reasonable that Ontario politicians do do "X" which is precisely the "Bandwagon fallacy".

I read it as more "He can hardly complain about this because he does worse." Which is quite different from "that justifies this".

In that case it would be the Tu Quoque Fallacy.

Is there a fallacy for "I made stuff up that you said, but that's OK because you used a fallacy"?

I don't know, what did you make up? Unless you're claiming I made something up, then of course, call out what you see as made up.

Just asking. Presumably, then, you didn't state the alleged claim as fact and the highlight is some kind of 'reading a quote' fallacy.
 

Offline Electrodynamic

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2665 on: October 24, 2025, 09:58:34 pm »
Quote
In fact you claim that because the US president does "X" then it is reasonable that Ontario politicians do do "X" which is precisely the "Bandwagon fallacy".

I read it as more "He can hardly complain about this because he does worse." Which is quite different from "that justifies this".

In that case it would be the Tu Quoque Fallacy.

Hey, look at you go.

I love this website, https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ and the tu quoque is probably the most popular.

Quote
You avoided having to engage with criticism by turning it back on the accuser - you answered criticism with criticism.
Pronounced too-kwo-kweh. Literally translating as 'you too' this fallacy is also known as the appeal to hypocrisy. It is commonly employed as an effective red herring because it takes the heat off someone having to defend their argument, and instead shifts the focus back on to the person making the criticism.

I catch myself in this trap all the time. However we need to be careful or be caught in the fallacy fallacy.

Quote
You presumed that because a claim has been poorly argued, or a fallacy has been made, that the claim itself must be wrong.
It is entirely possible to make a claim that is false yet argue with logical coherency for that claim, just as it is possible to make a claim that is true and justify it with various fallacies and poor arguments.
Example: Recognising that Amanda had committed a fallacy in arguing that we should eat healthy food because a nutritionist said it was popular, Alyse said we should therefore eat bacon double cheeseburgers every day.

 

Online Cyclotron

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2666 on: October 24, 2025, 10:42:11 pm »
Quote
In fact you claim that because the US president does "X" then it is reasonable that Ontario politicians do do "X" which is precisely the "Bandwagon fallacy".

I read it as more "He can hardly complain about this because he does worse." Which is quite different from "that justifies this".

In that case it would be the Tu Quoque Fallacy.

Is there a fallacy for "I made stuff up that you said, but that's OK because you used a fallacy"?

I don't know, what did you make up? Unless you're claiming I made something up, then of course, call out what you see as made up.

Just asking. Presumably, then, you didn't state the alleged claim as fact and the highlight is some kind of 'reading a quote' fallacy.

Passive agressive much?  You do know I wasn't the one that brought up fallacies, right?  Was that your reading fallacy?  :-DD :popcorn:

I didn't quote him, but the claim is there none-the-less. Facts are facts.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2025, 10:51:39 pm by Cyclotron »
 

Online Cyclotron

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2667 on: October 24, 2025, 11:19:38 pm »
Here's a CBC article that refutes the idea that the US administration made decisions abruptly or in some rage quit tactic.
Quote
Donald Trump's initial public reaction to Ontario's anti-tariffs TV ad gave absolutely no indication that it had triggered him so much that he would later kick the legs out from under the negotiating table.

The U.S. president first saw the ad on Monday night, three whole days before he abruptly announced in a social media post that he was terminating trade talks with Canada .

If the reasons are related to the Reagan Foundation claims of misrepresenting Regan (I doubt it) or for some reasons the administration has detailed(likely) the facts remain the facts.
Just more posturing and drama.
 

Offline u666sa

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2668 on: November 28, 2025, 11:45:40 pm »
2706973-0 2706987-1 [ Specified attachment is not available ]

Check this out, bro ordered from Europe, Switzerland.
« Last Edit: November 29, 2025, 12:31:56 am by u666sa »
 

Online Cyclotron

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2669 on: November 29, 2025, 12:05:36 am »
Check this out, bro ordered from Europe, Switzerland.

WOW!

I just imported a turbine blade from Spain and paid nothing for tariffs/duties that I can tell. Maybe it was included in my purchasing price but it wasn't broken out as a line item and the price of the blade and shipping were very reasonable.

Something doesn't seem right on that.  I don't know who you'd call. But didn't US/EU reach a trade deal? Tarrifs should be no more than whatever that percentage is for Europe.


 

Offline Analog Kid

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2670 on: November 29, 2025, 12:10:30 am »
Turbine blade?
What's that for, your backyard nuclear plant?
 

Online Cyclotron

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2671 on: November 29, 2025, 12:10:33 am »
Per this site, Switzerland is 15%.


And per this site, the tariffs for the EU are no more than 15%.

Something broken on that transaction.  Also, you might note there's potential privacy concerns with some of the info in you images.
 

Offline u666sa

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2672 on: November 29, 2025, 12:33:11 am »
I just imported a turbine blade from Spain and paid nothing for tariffs/duties
Via UPS?

Also, this same spinning reel in order above could be ordered from Amazon, eBay, etc.. Is your turbine blade available for order elsewhere in the United States?
 

Online Cyclotron

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2673 on: November 29, 2025, 01:35:36 am »
I just imported a turbine blade from Spain and paid nothing for tariffs/duties
Via UPS?

Also, this same spinning reel in order above could be ordered from Amazon, eBay, etc.. Is your turbine blade available for order elsewhere in the United States?

I am not aware of any currently for sale in the US. New ones are limited to the Military so I don't think anyone would sell it to me in the US anyway.

Mine arrived via USPS and was transferred to them from Spains postal services.
 

Offline tautech

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Re: Tariffs
« Reply #2674 on: November 29, 2025, 02:28:20 am »
The Bull in the China shop is slowly realising the errors of his ways in accelerating the cost of living on his subjects.

For some countries the 15% imposed on imported beef has been dropped to previous tariff levels of 1%.
Others might also live in hope.
Avid Rabid Hobbyist
 


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