Author Topic: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator  (Read 558949 times)

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Offline DaveR

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2125 on: October 06, 2019, 01:54:13 pm »
Hi Fremen - I think the problem stems from trying to upload a waveform into Loading Area 1.  I've just been testing with a reflashed bluepill and the Startup Config set to Default and, although the "No answer from generator" - freeze - force shutdown - Error 380 sequence is the same, the program looks uncorrupted when it restarts but won't communicate with the FY6600 until the box has been restarted, then everything appears to be normal again (this is the "minor corruption event" that both soundtec and myself have mentioned).

However, looking in LA 1 to see what was there, I found a partial waveform: it was 75% of the sine wave which I'd made two or three attempts to send there, so I resent the sine wave again and the transfer completed ok.  Then I tried sending an AM waveform to LA 50: no problem; sent it LA 51: no problem; sent it to LA 1: error sequence starts.  Looking in LA 1 after everything was running again, there was 25% of the AM wave and the remainder of the previous sine wave; sent the AM wave again: error sequence - restart everything - check in LA 1, there was 50% of the AM wave and the remaining 50% of the old sine wave (see attached).  Sent the AM wave again: error sequence etc., and LA 1 now has 75% of the AM wave and 25% of the sine wave (see attached).  Tried twice more to send the rest of the AM wave, but LA 1 is stuck with 75% AM and 25% Sine wave.  Tried sending an FM wave to LA 1: error sequence etc., and now there's 50% FM + 25% AM + 25% Sine in there (see attached).  Are we looking at a bug in the new wave transfer protocol, which only appears to affect LA 1 (and maybe others, but not 50, 51 and 55, according to my testing)?

I suspected that during the these tests corrupted data would have been lurking in M1, so I then tried to expose it, but loading M1 just returned Ch2 back from Random51 to SINE (reversing the last previous change), and restarting the program with M1 enabled was also normal.  Then I tried sending a sine wave to LA 1 with Startup set to use M1, fully expecting everything to break completely, as per last night's tests, but after going through the error - restart sequence again I looked in LA 1 and found a 100% sine wave!  So this time the transfer had worked ok, immediately before comms were lost, and the program restarted ok afterwards.  Next, I sent an AM wave to LA1 again: it completed ok, no error sequence, no restarts necessary.  Then the same thing with an FM wave: perfect.  Then a Sawtooth: perfect again, so now it appears that the comms / transfer protocol has settled down and become stable.  Restarted the program and the FY6600, and sent two more waveforms to LA 1 without a problem, but the next one, an AM wave, failed after two blocks (now watching the status bar at the bottom of the window - no need to restart everything now, as I know there will be 50% of an AM wave and 50% of a sine wave sitting in LA 1 :) ).

Now I was wondering why it wasn't doing last night's catastophic crashes any more, so I restarted everything again, turned on M1, and sent a blank wave to LA 1, which failed after 3 blocks.  After restarting, LA 1 contains just the remaining 25% of the earlier sine wave, but everything else is still working and Error 380 seems to have gone missing.  Time to give up!

Perhaps once the transfer problem has been sorted out, the M1 corruption problem will disappear with it.  After a cup of tea, I'll try last night's procedure again with a clean reflash, just to make sure it still happens as it did.

Regards,
Dave
« Last Edit: October 06, 2019, 04:19:51 pm by DaveR »
 

Offline DaveR

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2126 on: October 06, 2019, 03:52:09 pm »
More testing:

Tried a new bluepill, freshly flashed, did same procedure as last night, got same result.  Reflashed, tried again without saving any config data to M2, but still same result.  Both transfers to LA 1 failed after two blocks, and both produced Error 380.

Decided to go back to the previous BP, which was apparently working ok when it was disconnected, in order to check LA 1 contents, and got an immediate Error 380 from it!  So it was actually corrupted but still working earlier?

Regards,
Dave
« Last Edit: October 06, 2019, 04:13:41 pm by DaveR »
 

Offline fremen67

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2127 on: October 06, 2019, 04:30:56 pm »
More testing:

Tried a new bluepill, freshly flashed, did same procedure as last night, got same result.  Reflashed, tried again without saving any config data to M2, but still same result.  Both transfers to LA 1 failed after two blocks, and both produced Error 380.

Regards,
Dave
Thank a lot Dave for your time.

There was definitely a bug in the PC Software regarding the new wave transfer protocol coding. The bug was invisible on my test system as it is quite "slow" (Virtual machine). When running PC Software directly on the host system I could trace it with my logic analyzer  :phew:
There was a de-synchronization between the PC and the MCU which led to the MCU waiting for a wave block (1/4 of a wave) while the PC was still asking the authorization to send it.
When it that waiting state, the MCU does not reply to other commands.
This synchronization problem could happen randomly on any block, hence the partial waves.

The corrupted data in M1 is still a mystery for me as I was not able to reproduce it.
I attached a modified version of PC software (just the wave transfer for now, not yet the error 380 handling).
Let see if you are able to reproduce the flash corruption with this version now…
I will also modify the FP firmware so that it will return to a normal waiting state alone if the block wave is not coming.
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Offline DaveR

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2128 on: October 06, 2019, 07:11:46 pm »
That seemed to have got it sorted, Fremen.  I did lots of transfers without a problem, saved four different config sets and swapped from one to another several times, and everything was fine.  Then I restarted the box and the program and immediately got error 380 again.  The hex file attached is taken from the MCU while still attached to the FY6600 and powered up, so you should be seeing the contents exactly as the software saw them.  M1 was enabled, so I'll try again with M1 off to see if that's where the problem is coming from.

Regards,
Dave
« Last Edit: October 06, 2019, 07:24:39 pm by DaveR »
 

Offline DaveR

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2129 on: October 06, 2019, 08:19:24 pm »
Here's something to think about, Fremen: I didn't reflash the bluepill, but on a whim I started up the Feeltech software v6.0, and it worked perfectly, with all the saved config sets loading ok.  Then I closed it and restarted v0.81 and 0.81 was happy again!  No error 380, and everything working.  Closed and restarted 0.81 four times, no problem.  Closed the software and shutdown the FY6600, restarted the software and turned on the FY6600, error 380.  Started v6.0, works fine.  Closed 6.0 and started 0.81, working again.  Closed the software and shutdown the FY6600, restarted the FY6600 then the software, working fine.  Closed the software and shutdown the FY6600, restarted the software and turned on the FY6600, error 380.

I don't think you'll find any corrupted data, because it's probably something else that's causing the error, still linked to the transfer protocol.  I didn't have any problems with v0.8 until last night, when I tried waveform transfers with it for the first time.  It seems that the software is very stable until you do an upload, then something untoward happens causing error 380.  It may be significant that the error occurs when the software is running before the FY6600 is turned on, as the error pops up when the COM port is selected - and you did say that COM port handling was still a work in progress, so perhaps it will sort itself out as work progresses?

Regards,
Dave
« Last Edit: October 06, 2019, 08:28:26 pm by DaveR »
 

Offline fremen67

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2130 on: October 06, 2019, 10:23:26 pm »
Here's something to think about, Fremen: I didn't reflash the bluepill, but on a whim I started up the Feeltech software v6.0, and it worked perfectly, with all the saved config sets loading ok.  Then I closed it and restarted v0.81 and 0.81 was happy again!  No error 380, and everything working.  Closed and restarted 0.81 four times, no problem.  Closed the software and shutdown the FY6600, restarted the software and turned on the FY6600, error 380.  Started v6.0, works fine.  Closed 6.0 and started 0.81, working again.  Closed the software and shutdown the FY6600, restarted the FY6600 then the software, working fine.  Closed the software and shutdown the FY6600, restarted the software and turned on the FY6600, error 380.

I don't think you'll find any corrupted data, because it's probably something else that's causing the error, still linked to the transfer protocol.  I didn't have any problems with v0.8 until last night, when I tried waveform transfers with it for the first time.  It seems that the software is very stable until you do an upload, then something untoward happens causing error 380.  It may be significant that the error occurs when the software is running before the FY6600 is turned on, as the error pops up when the COM port is selected - and you did say that COM port handling was still a work in progress, so perhaps it will sort itself out as work progresses?

Regards,
Dave

Thank you Dave for the feedback.

I think I found the link between the wave transfers and the corrupted flash values. The wave transfer bug in the PC software was one,  but it also triggered another one in the new firmware. :palm:

I some conditions the receive buffer of the FY6600 was able to overflow which led to overwrite some variables in memory (sweep parameters, …). When switching off the FY6600, the parameters are saved to flash memory (when option is enabled)... with inconsistent values for some of them. So the corruption occured before writing to the flash, not in the flash.

Error 380 occurs in the PC Software because some list values read from the FY6600 are inconsistent with min and max values it has. For example sweep direction is supposed to be 0, 1 or 2. If greater, it won't find a corresponding label and will fire the error 380. This is not supposed to happen in normal situation and this can easily be handled by program.

The original feeltech pc software is not able to read all the values from the FY6600, especially the sweep parameters that can only be written. When using v6.0, you where able to overwrite sweep parameters that had inconsistent values with consistent ones. That explain why it solved the error 380 on v0.81.

I will modify the firmware to fix the buffer problem and the PC software to check list values consistency (and also some labels).

Let's move forward  ;)
I'm a machine! And I can know much more! I can experience so much more. But I'm trapped in this absurd body!
 
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Offline DaveR

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2131 on: October 06, 2019, 10:51:44 pm »
Let's move forward  ;)

Yes indeed!  I'll be waiting for the next release to put it through the wringer again ...

Regards,
Dave
 

Offline fremen67

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2132 on: October 11, 2019, 11:18:41 pm »
Let's move forward  ;)

Yes indeed!  I'll be waiting for the next release to put it through the wringer again ...

Regards,
Dave

Here we go!
PC Software: Wave transfer should be OK, original COM port handling re-written
Bluepill & FP: Wave transfer buffer handling bug fixed, display data on LCD with thousand separator
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Offline DaveR

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2133 on: October 12, 2019, 01:12:27 am »
Thanks, Fremen.  I'll get onto it over the weekend, I hope.

Regards,
Dave
 

Offline soundtec

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2134 on: October 12, 2019, 10:13:43 am »
Thanks for the new software Fremen, I'll let you know how it goes later on today.
I did reflash my unit with V0.81  ,just to double check there wasnt an issue related to the process of updating itself , and it wasnt ,
I didnt try any waveform uploads , but many of the issues Dave mentioned I saw too , like jumbled waveforms etc .

 

Offline soundtec

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2135 on: October 12, 2019, 02:44:40 pm »
Yeah thats working a lot better for me , I see the ok/encoder push now defaults each variable to a preset value  thats great in  offset , phase ,duty and rise /fall  , my question is would it be simpler to make  the default values  the same as power on values?


One thing I like about your BP version is the addition of the numeric keypad , I think when you look and compare the FY series to the better makes of stuff thats the big difference , the Rigols and the Owons have a slightly bigger box to encorporate the numberpad .

I did notice that the data from the counter was only displayed when triggered from software , engageing counter from front panel the software wasnt able to hook in , also software reported back 10khz or ten times the value displayed on the unit itself .

I still see some waveform corruption in the display for the sine wave ,as loaded on slot one ,it sorta has a tail on it ,visable on the unit itself and also on the software ,now in 0.82 pc  Im seeing two cycles of each wave displayed in the thumbnail view in control window .

Just as a test I applied factory square wave (slot2) to measurment input , 1khz 5 volts ,all other parameters default , I get back a reading of 49.9 duty and differing +/- peak widths ,  499,992 /500,008 and its a bit jumpy ,
I went ahead and created my own square wave  in the software ,uploaded it to a blank arb memory slot , comes out perfectly 50% duty and right on 500,000nS  and 1khz ,rocksolid 
Ill repeat the same test with the unmodified FY6800 next and compare the result . Could it be possible that even the original memory slots data are corrupted to some small degree and that discrepency somehow got worse ,maybe  . Another thing about the measure page was gate mode isnt initially set,  maybe just default to 1 second mode like the original software here might be best  as I think it causes the pc software to hang up a bit as it expects to see a signal .
 
So I repeated my test with the standard FY6800 ,  around  499,994 vs 500,006 was the best I could get , regardless of uploaded/internal waveform , ac or dc coupled input . I did generally see an improvement across both AC and DC measurements with the new waveform , maybe someone else can try the same test .
 
 
« Last Edit: October 12, 2019, 04:15:30 pm by soundtec »
 

Offline soundtec

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2136 on: October 13, 2019, 01:43:15 am »
I decided to conduct a few more tests , I made a new sine wave in software , both in Fremens and in Wavemanager plus , I uploaded them both to  free slots on the FY6600 .  I then used a low distortion audio interface in conjunction with REW to measure the various harmonics produced at various levels , the new sine waves I made showed markedly less THD than the standard slot 1 sine , typically around 10-15 db less on several peaks across the frequency range .Ill try a similar set of tests tomorrow with the unmodified FY6800,same set of upload waves vs sine and square from mem slots 1 and 2 .

I ran the spectrum analysis at 96khz and factory slots clearly showed several spikes of distortion extending well above the audible range , so either the basic memory waveforms built into the FY6600 were sub optimal to begin with ,or somehow they became corrupted . I should be able to post screen caps of the various spectra tomorrow ,modified and unmodified machines , internal vs newly made waveforms .
 

Offline fremen67

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2137 on: October 13, 2019, 10:14:54 am »
Thank you sountec for the feedback!

Yeah thats working a lot better for me , I see the ok/encoder push now defaults each variable to a preset value  thats great in  offset , phase ,duty and rise /fall  , my question is would it be simpler to make  the default values  the same as power on values?
This was already existing in the previous versions. As you noticed, this was meant to reset parameters to preset values like  offset (0V), phase(0°), duty(50%) and rise/fall(4ns) . For frequency and amplitude that might be less usefull as frequency = 10kHz and amplitude = 2.5 V. These are the default power on values when the "last power on values" option is not checked. It is of course possible to take last power on values when pushing OK but then you have to remember what the values were, plus if you don't use the option, M1 memory, which is used to store the values when powering off, could be empty or could contains values that you don't even remember…
So you might be in a situation where you are not sure of what will happen when pushing a button...

One thing I like about your BP version is the addition of the numeric keypad , I think when you look and compare the FY series to the better makes of stuff thats the big difference , the Rigols and the Owons have a slightly bigger box to encorporate the numberpad .
The photo of the bluepill setup I posted might be confusing. I use a numeric keypad on the bluepill just because I needed a 4x4 matrix keypad to replicate the front panel keyboard hardware. Each key of the numerical keypad corresponds to an existing FP key (F1 = 1, F2 = 4, …). It is not used  for numerical data input.

I did notice that the data from the counter was only displayed when triggered from software , engageing counter from front panel the software wasnt able to hook in , also software reported back 10khz or ten times the value displayed on the unit itself .
The PC software is not reading continuously values and configuration from the FP. This of course possible but it consumes CPU times of the FP to get messages and to reply to them. This could lead to create artefacts when the FP is sweeping waveforms, which is done 100% by the FP software (FPGA genarates the wave and the FP sweeps it).
The only exception is when you trigger the measure function from the PC Software as it has obviously to read the measure values from the FP.
If you mix data input (on the FP directly and on the PC Software) you could then have inconsistent values displayed on the PC software.
For example if you change the gate time directly on the FP and have the PC Software reading measures, the frequency will not be displayed correctly unless you force a refresh of all the values (changing to another tab and coming back now forces a values refresh in the 0.82).
If you need to modify values on both the FP and the PC Software, then you have to think of forcing a refresh manually on the PC Software at some point.

I still see some waveform corruption in the display for the sine wave ,as loaded on slot one ,it sorta has a tail on it ,visable on the unit itself and also on the software
As I explained previously, this comes from a corruption of your sine directly in the main board eeprom. This is a known bug of the FY6600 caused by the FPGA. The only cure is to write the sine definition again in the eeprom. Either with an external programmer or using the FP to do it, which is what feeltech did (this function not developped yet in the FP).
The workaround for now is to use an arb slot with a sine wave that you send from the PC Software.

now in 0.82 pc  Im seeing two cycles of each wave displayed in the thumbnail view in control window .
Yes it was already like this in the previous versions. This might not be a good idea but I found it easier to read for some waves, like ramps for example. As for the FP LCD, it only displays on cycle.

Just as a test I applied factory square wave (slot2) to measurment input , 1khz 5 volts ,all other parameters default , I get back a reading of 49.9 duty and differing +/- peak widths ,  499,992 /500,008 and its a bit jumpy ,
I went ahead and created my own square wave  in the software ,uploaded it to a blank arb memory slot , comes out perfectly 50% duty and right on 500,000nS  and 1khz ,rocksolid 
Ill repeat the same test with the unmodified FY6800 next and compare the result . Could it be possible that even the original memory slots data are corrupted to some small degree and that discrepency somehow got worse ,maybe  .
The square wave, but also CMOS and Adj-Pulse waves are not stored in memory slots. They are dynamically created by the FPGA. It would otherwise be impossible for it to adjust on the fly the duty cycle for them (or pulse length).
When using a square wave that you created in a memory slot, the FPGA just send it to the output. This is a different process, hence the different results you got.
Unfortunately even a new FP firmware can't change this.

Another thing about the measure page was gate mode isnt initially set,  maybe just default to 1 second mode like the original software here might be best  as I think it causes the pc software to hang up a bit as it expects to see a signal .
I guess you still have inconsistent values in M1 from 0.81 and still have "last power on option " checked. This should be fixed after you corrected those values and switch off the FY6600.
You could otherwide perform a factory reset (which I recommand), but it will reset calibration data if you changed them, or you could simply check all the values and save your configuration to M1.

So I repeated my test with the standard FY6800 ,  around  499,994 vs 500,006 was the best I could get , regardless of uploaded/internal waveform , ac or dc coupled input . I did generally see an improvement across both AC and DC measurements with the new waveform , maybe someone else can try the same test .
I guess you saw 499,996 and 500,004 ns as they are multiples of 4ns.
4ns is the minimal resolution of the FY6600 and FY6800 as they sample at 250 000 Msa/s. So that seems quite logical results...

Sorry for the long post but I though this might also have some kind of interrest for others…

EDIT: 49.9 % is an incorrect rounding of the duty cycle. It should display 50.0 % as the result with a cycle of 1,000,000 ns and a wide+ of 499,992 ns is 49.9992 %. I will correct it in the next version.
And by the way 499,992 ns instead of 500,000 ns represents an error of 0.0016 % … I don't think the FY6600 oscillator is that precise...
« Last Edit: October 13, 2019, 10:42:24 am by fremen67 »
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Offline Jacon

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2138 on: October 13, 2019, 10:38:38 am »
Fremen, considering this:
.....
The PC software is not reading continuously values and configuration from the FP. This of course possible but it consumes CPU times of the FP to get messages and to reply to them. This could lead to create artefacts when the FP is sweeping waveforms, which is done 100% by the FP software (FPGA genarates the wave and the FP sweeps it).
...
how about moving to this new board:
https://www.banggood.com/STM32F401-Development-Board-STM32F401CCU6-STM32F4-Learning-Board-for-Arduino-p-1568897.html ?
 

Offline fremen67

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2139 on: October 13, 2019, 11:33:02 am »
Fremen, considering this:
.....
The PC software is not reading continuously values and configuration from the FP. This of course possible but it consumes CPU times of the FP to get messages and to reply to them. This could lead to create artefacts when the FP is sweeping waveforms, which is done 100% by the FP software (FPGA genarates the wave and the FP sweeps it).
...
how about moving to this new board:
https://www.banggood.com/STM32F401-Development-Board-STM32F401CCU6-STM32F4-Learning-Board-for-Arduino-p-1568897.html ?
The new firmware is written for the existing front panel MCU. This is a STM32F103CBT6 that you also find in the bluepill. Hence the use of the bluepill as a transition.
Changing the Front panel MCU is not something that a lot of people are willing or able to do. Plus you would have to find a CPU with a LQFP48 package that should also be 100% pin compatible.

The fact that the Front Panel has to deal with LCD, communication and sweep handling at the same time is not an ideal design.
Without removing the existing front panel CPU, a solution would be to use a second board dedicated to FPGA communication. This would be easier for anyone to do. In that case the second board could of course have a more powerfull CPU.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2019, 04:15:29 pm by fremen67 »
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Offline soundtec

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2140 on: October 13, 2019, 02:18:32 pm »
Many thanks for the detailed reply Fremen,

I do wonder though are all the internal factory stored waveforms subject to this degradation over time , it was only my abillity to measure very small amounts of distortion was I able to detect it . The great thing for me is that my FY6600 is now capable of even lower distortion on sine waves than before ,and by a good margin , I was in 0.05 % territory now with the new sine  its more like 0.002% or less 2nd harmonic , as well as upper harmonics barely above noise floor .
 

Offline DaveR

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2141 on: October 15, 2019, 09:21:25 pm »
Hi Fremen,

The software checking is still in progress, but I've been through quite a bit so far and only come up with one crash and a couple of small items:

Calibration:  Ch2 Offset M:2.5 - this gives a Runtime error 6 if you try to enter a value less than 2.5, so the allowable range needs to be checked.  The program closes when the error dialog is cleared, but the entered value is still saved.  Once, after restarting the program after this crash, the boxes in the Control Window were full of improbable and impossible values, so data corruption had obviously taken place again; the same incorrect values reappeared each time the program was restarted, whether set to Defaults or M1,  but at least the program still ran ok and sensible values could be entered in the value boxes.  I couldn't recreate this situation again, so hopefully it was just a one-off.

Control Window - Sweep - Square Wave - Duty:  Ch1 range is 0.001% - 99.999%, but Ch2 range is only 0.1% - 99.9%.

Control Window - Ch1 Mod - FSK - HOP Frequency has redundant decimal point after value if whole number entered.

All the previous problems have been cleared, and waveform uploading now works very well indeed.  I need another session or two just to recheck the sweep and counter functions, but it's looking pretty good at the moment!

Regards,
Dave
 

Offline fisafisa

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2142 on: November 27, 2019, 04:55:34 pm »
Hi
No more news?


 

Offline Prehistoricman

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2143 on: December 09, 2019, 05:33:00 am »
Did you guys ever extract the built-in firmware?

I found this paper that extracted firmware from an STM32F1 series MCU 'easily':
https://tches.iacr.org/index.php/TCHES/article/download/7390/6562/
Page 9/10 (207/208)

Sounds like a fun project.

Edit:
And by an interesting coincidence, this paper specifies a FeelTech unit for generating their attack glitches.
« Last Edit: December 09, 2019, 05:43:16 am by Prehistoricman »
 

Offline wpmcnamara

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2144 on: December 21, 2019, 04:24:37 am »

I used it to align some AM radios but now I wanted to align the 10.7MHz IF sections.

So I recently purchased an FY6800.  After verifying it worked I ordered an assortment of upgrade parts.  I installed a linear 15vdc supply, installed new op amps and replaced the encoder so I could have a larger knob.  Next was to figure out how to get a repeatable setup for FM IF sweeps and contribute to the thread.


I also want to repair/restore/adjust/align/fiddle with some FM receivers.  I'd be interested how you make out.  Is it necessary to have such high outputs that new power supplies, op-amps, etc are needed? 
Also, I'm trying to synthesize a usable FM multiplex stereo test signal.  I have an RF signal generator with an FM function, but the multiplex signal is complex and I'm still trying to figure out the best way to do it.  Any ideas?

I recently picked up a FY6800 cheap and the first serious thing I did was use it in troubleshooting an AM/FM receiver.  You can generate a basic, but very usable stereo FM IF signal with the 6800, straight out of the box, no mods necessary.  I loaded a stereo multiplex signal in one of the arbitrary slots and used it, on channel 2, to modulate a 10.7 MHz sine wave on channel one, which I fed into the IF section.

The stereo MPX isn't as complicated as it sounds.  I put together an Excel spreadsheet that would generate the waveform for me.  8192 data points is plenty.  I generated a cosine signal on the left channel and a sine signal on the right.  The spreadsheet lets me adjust the L and R levels, as well as the relative modulation levels.

This is the MPX signal for a 1kHz sine and cosine at equal levels.


This is what the decode output looks like.  This was taken from the audio outputs on the receiver sitting on my bench.


Similarly, this is the MPX for a 1kHz sine and cosign with one signal at 50% of the other.


And the decoded output...


Now, you do see some channel separation problems if you set on channel to 100% and the other to 0%.  Channel separation is only about 20dB in that case.  However I don't know if that is a problem with the spreadsheet math, the limited sample size of the waveform, or this particular receiver.

*edit*  attached spreadsheet I used for the MPX waveform generation.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2019, 04:30:29 am by wpmcnamara »
 
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Offline rhb

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2145 on: December 26, 2019, 01:16:26 am »
Did you guys ever extract the built-in firmware?

I found this paper that extracted firmware from an STM32F1 series MCU 'easily':
https://tches.iacr.org/index.php/TCHES/article/download/7390/6562/
Page 9/10 (207/208)

Sounds like a fun project.

Edit:
And by an interesting coincidence, this paper specifies a FeelTech unit for generating their attack glitches.

That attack was tried and did not work on this device.   You can find the details back around pp 15-20 of this thread.

I'm a bit surprised that predistortion of the waveform never came up in this thread that I recall.  Though I have *not* read all of it.

  I recently bought a text on the use of predistorted waveforms for generating RF which is very important to cellular operations.

Have Fun!
Reg
 

Offline Prehistoricman

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2146 on: December 28, 2019, 10:18:49 pm »
That attack was tried and did not work on this device.   You can find the details back around pp 15-20 of this thread.

Really? I took a look at those pages and didn't see anything about it. I saw references to the Fraunhofer attack (which doesn't work on this STM32F1) but not the one I found.

Offline JohnCompter

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2147 on: December 29, 2019, 10:16:31 am »
The 60 Mhz is valid for a sine wave, but the other wave forms tend to have a sine wave form also at 60 Mhz.
The output is very sensitive for grounding currents. I lost a number of steps is the output attenuator by grounding currents.
The interface to a PC works well, but one has to climb a steep hill before the communication between PC and waveform generator operates well.
I did not found a way to transfer a waveform, made in e.g. Mathematica, in a intelligent way to the FY6800. Copy-past was the only way.

Cheap is true, but that is what you notice when you buy it. The quality belonging to cheap you will notice for ever.
 
 

Offline CDaniel

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2148 on: December 29, 2019, 11:12:25 am »
If you read the specs , the other waveforms are not specified up to 60MHz ... this is normal for every such generator , even expensive .
 
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Offline rhb

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Re: FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator
« Reply #2149 on: January 02, 2020, 09:33:28 pm »
That attack was tried and did not work on this device.   You can find the details back around pp 15-20 of this thread.

Really? I took a look at those pages and didn't see anything about it. I saw references to the Fraunhofer attack (which doesn't work on this STM32F1) but not the one I found.

Sorry.  I thought it was the same paper.  IIRC CyberMaus did all the work on that.
 


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