Tariffs

[Cyclotron]

Yes, label people to dismiss them. "They don't agree with me, they have TDS and can be ignored!"

That's true and universally so. Just look at labels "Liberal", "blue haired", "MAGA", "deplorables", "Never Trumpers", "DIMs" and my favorite "NAZIs".

[tszaboo]

But is it really? Do you believe that he thinks you will get paid to take drugs?

No, I think he doesn't have a clue what's coming out of his mouth apart from it sounding good to people who know even less.

Or you just have TDS.

Yes, label people to dismiss them. "They don't agree with me, they have TDS and can be ignored!"

Listen man, so far I heard that
-democracy is going to end
-We are going to have a world war
-Stock market is going to crash
-genocide will happen in the US
because theorange man. And we are 4 years 6 months into it, and none of it happened. I know, any moment now the economy is going to crash, even though it's at ATH. So all the valid criticism boils down now that people don't like his hair and what he is saying.
In the meantime we also find out that half the things they threw at him were fabricated lies.

[TimFox]

Yes, label people to dismiss them. "They don't agree with me, they have TDS and can be ignored!"

That's true and universally so. Just look at labels "Liberal", "blue haired", "MAGA", "deplorables", "Never Trumpers", "DIMs" and my favorite "NAZIs".

I have given up on current sloppy usage for legitimate concepts of "liberal" and "conservative", turning them into insults.
"MAGA" is a self-label, borne proudly by its community.
"Deplorable" was a politically-stupid label applied to a similar community that backfired.
"Never Trumper" is a literal (somewhat obsolete) term for people who oppose Trump strongly.
I haven't seen "blue-haired" recently, nor "little old ladies in tennis shoes".
"Nazi" is an historical term with a curse on it, but reading about German history in the mid-1930s is useful.
However, I am unfamiliar with "DIMs":  is that an insult for "dim bulbs"?

[Cyclotron]

In the meantime we also find out that half the things they threw at him were fabricated lies.

I certainly don't care for Trump but the amount of hate, lies, and attacks are at a scale that is amazing. And even when its been proven wrong it remains.
I was speaking with someone the other day about their view that Trump colluded with Russia. I pointed to the recent news that the left leadership even says that's not true in the recent scuffle around some memos that show the Obama administration was aware of the Clinton's campaign to dig dirt in that area.

The apologies about the comments around Charlottesville but lots of people still people repeat as truth.

[PlainName]

And we are 4 years 6 months into it

holy shit! Is it 2028 already? Doesn't time fly!

[Cyclotron]

Yes, label people to dismiss them. "They don't agree with me, they have TDS and can be ignored!"

That's true and universally so. Just look at labels "Liberal", "blue haired", "MAGA", "deplorables", "Never Trumpers", "DIMs" and my favorite "NAZIs".

I have given up on current sloppy usage for legitimate concepts of "liberal" and "conservative", turning them into insults.
"MAGA" is a self-label, borne proudly by its community.
"Deplorable" was a politically-stupid label applied to a similar community that backfired.
"Never Trumper" is a literal (somewhat obsolete) term for people who oppose Trump strongly.
I haven't seen "blue-haired" recently, nor "little old ladies in tennis shoes".
"Nazi" is an historical term with a curse on it, but reading about German history in the mid-1930s is useful.
However, I am unfamiliar with "DIMs":  is that an insult for "dim bulbs"?

I agree that MAGA was a label proudly bore but it doesn't change that it is used to categorically dismiss the whole so it can be ignored.
Some of the ones I hear are localized. I'm in a lot of places and hear a lot of conversations.  I'm in Vegas right now, Tampa next week, San Antonio the week after, and Chicago the week after that.

The vitriol I hear spewed is amazing. Lots of people down south do not believe I can walk the streets of Chicago and not get shot dead.  People in Chicago believe and have called me a racist simply because of my skin color and from being from the south.

Those labels get pretty extensive. Racist given there's no such thing in science as race.  Race is a sociological construct that is used to divide people into, yup, labels.
There's extensive work in the US to divide people into labels and camps and it works to create anger and drive hate which creates revenue.

[TimFox]

I often ask my relatives in other states if they are referring to the Chicago in which I live, or the one they see on Fox News.

[Cyclotron]

I often ask my relatives in other states if they are referring to the Chicago in which I live, or the one they see on Fox News.

I've got lots of observations about Chicago, I often stay on the North River side or the Magnificent Mile.  We go out to the West Loop a lot.
I have a lot of fun there, enjoy the food, culture, and lots of things. I have visited other areas of the city but only during the day with locals.  And its amazing the duality.  I have come back from Cubs games drunk as snot on the L and walked around lost for an hour to get to my hotel. Never even thought about any danger in those areas. 

Lol, I've even walked down to the Subway that Jussie Smollett got attacked "by maga" racist.  I didn't know it was the one till someone told me later. It was about 11pm and got back to my hotel just fine.

[vk6zgo]

I wonder what the response would have been if the Democrats decided to have a sales tax? Whilst not the same thing i.e. it's applied when goods are sold to the end user and not by companies, it would have a similar effect.

I can't help but notice, whether certain people agree with a policy or not, often depends on how it's framed, rather than the policy in itself or whether it's a good or bad idea in general. Make China pay and bring back American industry, will gain more support from the right and criticism from the left, whilst raise taxes to spend on services will be supported by the left, but be opposed by the right.

Note: I don't support either of the above.

The response to a general sales tax would probably be rather poor no matter who suggested it. In general they strongly dislike taxation - but of course are incredibly vocal about having the tax-funded services they rely on like say, roads, or emergency services. A lot of very critical response to, say, poor funding for military veterans care, but god help you if you want to tax them to pay for it, that money should just, I don't know, be generated out of thin air..

Framing and intent are of course critical. The 'left' are critical of 'make China pay' because it's a fucking lie, not because they're opposed to industry and jobs (so long, of course, as industry is reasonably regulated, not left to pollute and endanger people as it has been historically and will be under the ignorant guidance of certain people, and the jobs actually pay enough for people to live..).

I think many on the left would welcome an increase in tax in order to pay for services.

Yes, of course it's a lie that China will pay. Who would have guessed it? Politicians lie!

One of Mr Trump's "selling points" was that "he wasn't a politician"!

[Cyclotron]

One of Mr Trump's "selling points" was that "he wasn't a politician"!

Actually I believe he portrayed himself as a "Political Outsider" which indeed was true.  At what point you become a politician can be debated. I assume the gate would be that you serve in that role.  So, as a prior president he certainly passed the gate many years ago.

It is my experience that C-Suite people (Trump included) are very "political" just not "public political". Internal company politics can be a horror show.
Lying, half truths, slant, spin, are all similarities between the two.

[wilfred]

Not made in the USA you can't. And you never will, because people like to be paid enough to eat.

Haynes, produces goods in places like Puerto Rico (US) and with US produced cotton.
Surprisingly Amazon has a sale on right now for 6 Haynes T-shirts for 10 dollars.
That's $1.66 US each.

Not 10 for 5 but still not a bad price. I don't know why folks think that manufacturing isn't done in the US.  The shoe factory that sits beside my highschool is still there and still producing shoes. The amount of manufacturing has reduced and that's disproportionately impacted people that have little skills or abilities to find work in other areas.

I like that the US is a manufacturing country and I hope it remains so.

Under $2 a shirt? That shirt was not made in the USA. I did a quick search and you'll find as I did that Haynes does not make shirts in the USA.

"Today there are no Hanes products made in the USA. Hanes factories are located in El Salvador, Thailand, and Vietnam. Hanes is still headquartered in Winston-Salem, North Carolina and has many distribution centers in North Carolina as well."

How prominently would their website display "Made in USA" if they did?

[Monkeh]

I don't know why folks think that manufacturing isn't done in the US.

We don't. We know shirts which cost $2 aren't made in the US.

I looked up some actual US made shirts. The cheapest is about $15. Each.

[Cyclotron]

Not made in the USA you can't. And you never will, because people like to be paid enough to eat.

Haynes, produces goods in places like Puerto Rico (US) and with US produced cotton.
Surprisingly Amazon has a sale on right now for 6 Haynes T-shirts for 10 dollars.
That's $1.66 US each.

Not 10 for 5 but still not a bad price. I don't know why folks think that manufacturing isn't done in the US.  The shoe factory that sits beside my highschool is still there and still producing shoes. The amount of manufacturing has reduced and that's disproportionately impacted people that have little skills or abilities to find work in other areas.

I like that the US is a manufacturing country and I hope it remains so.

Under $2 a shirt? That shirt was not made in the USA. I did a quick search and you'll find as I did that Haynes does not make shirts in the USA.

"Today there are no Hanes products made in the USA. Hanes factories are located in El Salvador, Thailand, and Vietnam. Hanes is still headquartered in Winston-Salem, North Carolina and has many distribution centers in North Carolina as well."

How prominently would their website display "Made in USA" if they did?

I see, it was some years ago that I was in Puerto Rico and now that I see they have closed that facility. Sad, I'm sure the local workers miss that opportunity to support their families.  I do see they still use US Cotton. 

Quickly scanning there appears to be a 6 dollar T-shirt made in the USA.  I'm guessing that implies there's a market here for them.  I just switched brands of tshirts.

[Cyclotron]

I don't know why folks think that manufacturing isn't done in the US.

We don't. We know shirts which cost $2 aren't made in the US.

I looked up some actual US made shirts. The cheapest is about $15. Each.

Look harder, it was litteally the first link
https://www.jonestshirts.com/collections/usa-made-t-shirts-american-bayside-made-in-america

The UK still seems to make stuff?
https://www.thecottonlondon.com/en-us/collections/made-in-england

[Monkeh]

I don't know why folks think that manufacturing isn't done in the US.

We don't. We know shirts which cost $2 aren't made in the US.

I looked up some actual US made shirts. The cheapest is about $15. Each.

Look harder, it was litteally the first link
https://www.jonestshirts.com/collections/usa-made-t-shirts-american-bayside-made-in-america

I didn't say I looked hard or was planning to. And you do realise search results are not consistent, right?

The UK still seems to make stuff?
https://www.thecottonlondon.com/en-us/collections/made-in-england

Did I say we didn't? Did you look at the price?

[Cyclotron]

I see a bizarre pattern these days of political partisans completely ignoring or actively going against planks of their parties. Right now you see conservatives defending tariffs which are a form of taxation while you see folks on the left attacking them. At least I observe this in the US.

Traditionally the left has been far more likely to use tariffs in the US while the right claim for open market was derided. The left has often claimed that the use of tariffs is favor of labor and avoids rewards to corporations that would otherwise take advantage of populations in other countries. Again, this has been my observations of the US.

How do people do that?

[Cyclotron]

I don't know why folks think that manufacturing isn't done in the US.

We don't. We know shirts which cost $2 aren't made in the US.

I looked up some actual US made shirts. The cheapest is about $15. Each.

Look harder, it was litteally the first link
https://www.jonestshirts.com/collections/usa-made-t-shirts-american-bayside-made-in-america

I didn't say I looked hard or was planning to. And you do realise search results are not consistent, right?

The UK still seems to make stuff?
https://www.thecottonlondon.com/en-us/collections/made-in-england

Did I say we didn't? Did you look at the price?

I didn't say you did. I didn't say they are, I didn't say you did. I didn't need to.

[Monkeh]

I didn't say you did. I didn't say they are, I didn't say you did. I didn't need to.

 

[Cyclotron]

I didn't say you did. I didn't say they are, I didn't say you did. I didn't need to.

 

Yes that's exactly what you sounded like.   

[Cyclotron]

Speaking of tariffs and border control, does this mean that BREXIT was where this all began?  The UK taking control over its borders and trade was the majority of the reasoning for BREXIT wasn't it?

Evidently the UK has become a beacon to "Wealthy" Americans. 
https://sterling-law.co.uk/from-trumps-america-to-brexit-britain-why-wealthy-americans-are-moving-across-the-atlantic/

Don't they know about the benefits from Trump for them?

White Flight?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_flight

[themadhippy]

Evidently the UK has become a beacon to "Wealthy" Americans.

Meanwhile on this side of the pond  tabloids and business experts are going on abut the mass exodus of the wealthy from the uk.

[Cyclotron]

Evidently the UK has become a beacon to "Wealthy" Americans.

Meanwhile on this side of the pond  tabloids and business experts are going on abut the mass exodus of the wealthy from the uk.

I'm not sure which side you mean. The US or UK.  The source I posted was Steling-Law in the UK.  Another here from the UK
https://www.fnlondon.com/articles/rich-americans-look-to-london-as-uk-battles-non-dom-exodus-5e4bc261

I wonder if they know that the UK also took action to control their borders and trade?  I wonder if any journalist have looked into this activity as "white flight".

#1776 reply

[Analog Kid]

Speaking of tariffs and boarder control, does this mean that BREXIT was where this all began?  The UK taking control over its boarders and trade was the majority of the reasoning for BREXIT wasn't it?

Just one tiny li'l thing:

• Border = division between two countries
• Boarder = someone who lives in a boarding house

Another very common mistake.

[Cyclotron]

Speaking of tariffs and boarder control, does this mean that BREXIT was where this all began?  The UK taking control over its boarders and trade was the majority of the reasoning for BREXIT wasn't it?

Just one tiny li'l thing:

• Border = division between two countries
• Boarder = someone who lives in a boarding house

Another very common mistake.

Thank you, fixed. I often slip on my spelling with libations.  I'll endevor to do better.

[Analog Kid]

"Endevor"?