I think you are operating on the filling station mentality. Full tank, drive until near empty and then fill 'er up again. This isn't how EV owners do it. Generally, I never charge more than 85% and am fine going with well short of a full charge. Lots of EV owners target even less than that for their daily driving. I only do a full charge when I have a long day of driving ahead. It really is a different way of thinking.
I already hate going to the filling station because it takes time. You only live once so don't waste your time by waiting.
I think you are operating on the filling station mentality. Full tank, drive until near empty and then fill 'er up again. This isn't how EV owners do it. Generally, I never charge more than 85% and am fine going with well short of a full charge. Lots of EV owners target even less than that for their daily driving. I only do a full charge when I have a long day of driving ahead. It really is a different way of thinking.That is not a different way of thinking. That is making do with a system which takes more time no matter how you try to sugar coat it for yourself. Short charge or long charge it doesn't matter because you still need to charge for the distance you drive. I already hate going to the filling station because it takes time. You only live once so don't waste your time by waiting.
Sorry but charging every day is like having to inflate the tyres every day What is not to understand about that?
Also I don't need to go shopping every day and if I need something from a shop I order it online or go by bike. I need a car to go to customers, visit relatives or go on a holiday and I really don't want to have to 'fiddle' with a car for 20 minutes before it works. You probably guessed it: densely populated country so no fixed parking spaces and thus no way to charge at home.
Out of curiosity, how much area do all the rooftops in Europe take up? How much area for the parking lots?
For kicks look at the pricing of Tesla's wall battery. There is no break even point if you add that to the cost of your solar panel setup.
Sorry but charging every day is like having to inflate the tyres every day What is not to understand about that?
Also I don't need to go shopping every day and if I need something from a shop I order it online or go by bike. I need a car to go to customers, visit relatives or go on a holiday and I really don't want to have to 'fiddle' with a car for 20 minutes before it works. You probably guessed it: densely populated country so no fixed parking spaces and thus no way to charge at home.
How many cars can a super charger charge at a given time? If fourteen cars are all lined up to be charge how long does the person in the fourteenth car have to wait to get a charge? And super chargers don’t give you a full charge so even when they get a charge their mileage is limited.
Clearly some misunderstanding going on.
Here's how SCs work. Each site has a set of chargers. Depending on the model, a charger can range from 90 KW to 132 KW. Each charger has a number and can feed 2 cars (lettered A and B). The second car to hook up get's what ever is left over from the first one. The actual charge rate for a car depends on the state of the battery. A fully discharged battery gets almost 100% of the available rate and it starts to drop from there with the largest drop coming from about half charged to full. Not sure what the terminal rate is but I thinnk it's less than 10KW. The second car gets the left overs. However, in practice, no one has a fully discharged battery and no one actually charges to 100%. Typically people charge to the point where they can get to the next SC or their destination. So, even the second car on a charger seldom gets nothing and it's often pretty high. There is quite frequent turn over at SCs. If the occupancy is less than 50%, everyone gets the max charge rate for their battery state. The only time I've seen more than 50% was on a very busy travel day (the evening before thanksgiving, iirc). I've never had to wait for a spot to open up. And, in the places where people have had to wait (mostly in the Bay Area and Southern CA), Tesla has been very proactive in building out more capacity and new SCs in the general area.
I'm not sure what you mean by "don't give you a full charge". If you want, you can get a full charge but that last 1/8 takes about 20 minutes because off the drop off (this is to protect the battery). I've actually done that in one case 3 years ago where I needed a return charge. Though, it's quite unnecessary for the vast number of cases. In fact, my super charger strategy when traveling is to start with an amount of charge such that when I get to the SC, I have about 10% charge left so it will recharge faster. Typically, I only need about 60% to make it to the next SC or destination though the car will tell you when you have enough.
I think you are operating on the filling station mentality. Full tank, drive until near empty and then fill 'er up again. This isn't how EV owners do it. Generally, I never charge more than 85% and am fine going with well short of a full charge. Lots of EV owners target even less than that for their daily driving. I only do a full charge when I have a long day of driving ahead. It really is a different way of thinking.
Sorry but charging every day is like having to inflate the tyres every day What is not to understand about that?
Also I don't need to go shopping every day and if I need something from a shop I order it online or go by bike. I need a car to go to customers, visit relatives or go on a holiday and I really don't want to have to 'fiddle' with a car for 20 minutes before it works. You probably guessed it: densely populated country so no fixed parking spaces and thus no way to charge at home.
Most people plug their mobile phone in each night do they not? What is so different about plugging in the car each night too? I know guys who do this, they don't seem to bothered by the extra 5 seconds before they walk into the house. It is actually something every one of them has raved about how convenient it is, they pull into the driveway at night and plug in the car, they never have to go to a gas station. It sounds absolutely great to me, it's only the fact that I absolutely love my classic Volvo that prevents me from getting an electric myself.
What part of "if you're not one of the millions of people who can plug in to charge in their driveway then this doesn't apply to you" do you not understand? I get it, an electric car probably won't work for you, why are you so fixated on this and refusing to see that for millions of people it can and in fact does work very well? It seems almost obsessive that you are insisting it flat out doesn't work and then listing reasons it doesn't work for *you* and acting as though everyone is in your situation when in fact many millions of people are not.
Sorry but charging every day is like having to inflate the tyres every day What is not to understand about that?
Also I don't need to go shopping every day and if I need something from a shop I order it online or go by bike. I need a car to go to customers, visit relatives or go on a holiday and I really don't want to have to 'fiddle' with a car for 20 minutes before it works. You probably guessed it: densely populated country so no fixed parking spaces and thus no way to charge at home.What part of "if you're not one of the millions of people who can plug in to charge in their driveway then this doesn't apply to you" do you not understand?
QuoteIf many more households have an EV which they let charge overnight the electricity grid would get overloaded.
I read such a quote several times in this thread, and this is BS.
If we switch to EVs this would add between 10% (UK) and 15% (Germany) to the electricity demand.
For 1 million cars it would add ~0,35% and for 45 million cars ~15% in Germany.
In the same time the overall demand is also rising based on growth of population. There is always the need for more electricity, and EVs are just a part of it.
https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis-switch-to-electric-vehicles-would-add-just-10-per-cent-to-uk-power-demand
I read such a quote several times in this thread, and this is BS.
If we switch to EVs this would add between 10% (UK) and 15% (Germany) to the electricity demand.
For 1 million cars it would add ~0,35% and for 45 million cars ~15% in Germany.
In the same time the overall demand is also rising based on growth of population. There is always the need for more electricity, and EVs are just a part of it.
Your number is to high, we charge our car with 3.6kW (4.5 kVA). Usually every third night. Usually for 3-4 hours.
Maybe they could make drive-through charging stations:
Maybe this is a good charging solution for a bus on a circular route, or something like this. You can equip several streets your vehicle fleet uses frequently and you can run them 24/7.
This is a very intersting converstation, it goes to show you how everyones experiance with a plugin electric car is different.
The drive from LA to SF takes an additional 2 hours in a Tesla.
https://forums.tesla.com/forum/forums/fastest-trip-la-sf
And driving a Tesla to Tahoe once you leave the Sacramento area where are the Super Chargers? And just how many of them are in Tahoe?
Lake Tahoe South Shore gets first Tesla Superchargers as region prepares for more electric vehicles
https://www.tahoedailytribune.com/news/local/lake-tahoe-south-shore-gets-first-tesla-supercharger-as-region-prepares-for-more-electric-vehicles/
In the region there are only a handful of public Tesla Superchargers. There is one in Reno with a second in the works, two in Truckee with another on the way, one in Topaz Lake and now one in Stateline. Last year a universal DC Fast Charger was installed in the Heavenly Village Park.
Can you make it from Seattle to Lake Chelan witout having to stop for a charge along the way? Then one in Chelan are there any SC stations? How would you make this trip?
I looked at a Tesla and purcashed a Volt instead. As Teslas are watining in line to get charged. The trip for us to LA is same as for ICE. No 2 hour for usto get a charge.
QuoteIf many more households have an EV which they let charge overnight the electricity grid would get overloaded.I read such a quote several times in this thread, and this is BS.
If we switch to EVs this would add between 10% (UK) and 15% (Germany) to the electricity demand.
If I simply multiply the km driven by cars in the NL (118 trillion) and the required kWh per km (250Wh): 118.5G * 0.250=29GWh) then in the NL it will take an additional 25% (29GWh/120GWh=25%) of elecricity generating capacity to switch to EVs. This means that the capacity of the local distribution grids will need to be almost doubled to deliver that additional 25% if people charge their EVs at home.
And again the same assumption: Over night all cars are replaced by EVs and the grid needs to be doubled.
We are split what the exact numbers are, but whats the point? The grid needs to be developed? Sure! We need more electricity? Sure! We pay the companies for this development? Sure! They will handle this. It's a normal day-to-day process to develop, maintain and upgrade the infrastructure around us.
The amount of EVs will grow over the next decades and also the grid will be delevoped in the same time. The world will continue to turn. Everything will be fine, don't worry!
You are reading things that aren't there. I never said EVs are replaced over night. I'm just looking at the current situation and a hypothetical situation in which cars are replaced by EVs and what needs to be done to achieve that. I never attached a time line to it!
Also updating the distribution grid for heavier loads in small or big steps is going to be more expensive no matter how you twist and turn it.
You are reading things that aren't there. I never said EVs are replaced over night. I'm just looking at the current situation and a hypothetical situation in which cars are replaced by EVs and what needs to be done to achieve that. I never attached a time line to it!
Also updating the distribution grid for heavier loads in small or big steps is going to be more expensive no matter how you twist and turn it.Well, I certainly see the "overloaded grid" arguments using the loads from full deployment of EVs. The system will get upgraded based on demand - happens all the time. Also, peak consumption, at least in North America, is mid-day so there is capacity to spare in the evenings when most EVs would be charged. In fact, a lot of utilities have lower night rates to encourage consumption at off-peak times. I'm not sure how close to over-capacity the grid really is.
You are reading things that aren't there. I never said EVs are replaced over night. I'm just looking at the current situation and a hypothetical situation in which cars are replaced by EVs and what needs to be done to achieve that. I never attached a time line to it!
Also updating the distribution grid for heavier loads in small or big steps is going to be more expensive no matter how you twist and turn it.Well, I certainly see the "overloaded grid" arguments using the loads from full deployment of EVs. The system will get upgraded based on demand - happens all the time. Also, peak consumption, at least in North America, is mid-day so there is capacity to spare in the evenings when most EVs would be charged. In fact, a lot of utilities have lower night rates to encourage consumption at off-peak times. I'm not sure how close to over-capacity the grid really is.Peak consumption during the day is due to the companies being active. During the day usage from residential areas is low anyway because most people are at work. But don't take my word for it: https://www.epa.gov/energy/electricity-customers
I hope it is clear that charging the EVs when people come back home from work is not a good idea because that overlaps with peak demand in residential areas.