Trends hold as long as trends hold.
I have no blind faith in progress. I could easily see mass migration from Africa throwing Europe into an economic slide, while raising European birthrates and steering us into a Malthusian collapse.
But the internet can be easily turned off by the masters of the universe... imagine that!Remember internet was designed for military use with redundancy and decentralised control in mind. I think I still have a modem somewhere...
This is what happens when complex societies begin to collapse. Historically this has always happened eventually - with exhaustion of important resources usually a major causative factor.
A good book on the subject is Joseph Tainter's The Collapse of Complex SocietiesThat is an interesting subject but I don't think that history will repeat itself this time around.
Book printing and more recently internet have created a critical mass in the availability of information and knowledge level of the people in general. Back in the old days people where kept dumb as a means of control.
Resources may become a problem but nowadays it is much easier for people to move to where the resources are.
This is what happens when complex societies begin to collapse. Historically this has always happened eventually - with exhaustion of important resources usually a major causative factor.
A good book on the subject is Joseph Tainter's The Collapse of Complex SocietiesThat is an interesting subject but I don't think that history will repeat itself this time around.
So "this time it's different" huh?.QuoteBook printing and more recently internet have created a critical mass in the availability of information and knowledge level of the people in general. Back in the old days people where kept dumb as a means of control.
Yes, I agree somewhat but that does not solve the problem of resource scarcity.
And while the internet is helpful to keep people informed, on the otherhand it, along with the mass media makes it easier in many ways to keep people in the dark by distracting them with easily digestable and addictive memes. The majority of people, *think* they understand what's going on but they really are kept blind to the underlying forces at work. Propaganda is now more sophisticated and easier to distribute. Goebbels could only dream of having the reach of today's mass media.QuoteResources may become a problem but nowadays it is much easier for people to move to where the resources are.That was true in the past: Collapse of civilizations remained somewhat localized (eg Mayan, Anastazi, etc). People then moved on to where resources were more readily available. As civilization and technology advanced, larger, more far reaching and widespread civilzations became possible (eg Roman, etc) - but even after their collapse there were always other, relatively untouched lands with abundant resources.
But that is no longer true. There are now new lands to exploit. Resources to feed the global machine are extracted worldwide. Fossil fuels are the prime - keystone - resource that has allowed population to grow this far. There is no place for people to move where those will be more abundant. (And no, traveling to Mars will not help in that regard). Other resources, water, topsoil, etc, are also a factor.
In addition, Tainter's distinguishing point is that as societies become increasingly complex, more and more resources are required just to maintain their complexity. That and increasing specialization among societies inhabitants make them less resilient.
What do you mean there re no more resources to exploit? Emigrants are resource which have been, and continue to be exploited.
Rosling has already shown Malthusian is wrong.
It’s education of women, family planning and improved Heath care which results in lower birth rates, and increased average life expectancy. This has been show over and over to be true over the past 100 or more years.
Resources to feed the global machine are extracted worldwide. Fossil fuels are the prime - keystone - resource that has allowed population to grow this far. There is no place for people to move where those will be more abundant. (And no, traveling to Mars will not help in that regard). Other resources, water, topsoil, etc, are also a factor.
In addition, Tainter's distinguishing point is that as societies become increasingly complex, more and more resources are required just to maintain their complexity. That and increasing specialization among societies inhabitants make them less resilient.
In my opinion the most important resource by far is energy.
It would only take PV panels covering a very small fraction of the Earth's land area to provide for all of society's electricity needs.
It would only take PV panels covering a very small fraction of the Earth's land area to provide for all of society's electricity needs.You mean all of society's energy needs, right?
All in all I'm not that worried about the future of mankind or any limits on the amount of people.
It would only take PV panels covering a very small fraction of the Earth's land area to provide for all of society's electricity needs.You mean all of society's energy needs, right?
I meant electricity, but either is true. It would obviously be a bigger percentage if you were trying to meet all energy demands with PV. That would be silly though since wind, hydro, passive solar and biomass (primarily wood) will always have a significant role.
I'm glad I sure won't be here by then, but if the earth ever becomes one big continuous city it will be a shit to live in. And the way things go, all points in that direction.
Quote from: GeorgeOfTheJungleI'm glad I sure won't be here by then, but if the earth ever becomes one big continuous city it will be a shit to live in. And the way things go, all points in that direction.You don't know that. Modern city planners and future planners have real innovative ideas.
No cars, trucks etc in the city. Electric rolling paths for persons, an Underground transportation net for goods. Skyscrapers where the outsides are covered by plants for shade and moisture balance, etc etc.
Perhaps it will become a real pleasure to live in a future modern city, it is as unpredictable as saying in the 19th century that humans will fly in the sky.
Quote from: GeorgeOfTheJungleI'm glad I sure won't be here by then, but if the earth ever becomes one big continuous city it will be a shit to live in. And the way things go, all points in that direction.You don't know that. Modern city planners and future planners have real innovative ideas.
No cars, trucks etc in the city. Electric rolling paths for persons, an Underground transportation net for goods. Skyscrapers where the outsides are covered by plants for shade and moisture balance, etc etc.
Perhaps it will become a real pleasure to live in a future modern city, it is as unpredictable as saying in the 19th century that humans will fly in the sky.
Why do so few homes in England have rooftop solar?
Why do so few homes in England have rooftop solar? I thought England was big on solar like Germany. As I travel around in the city and country side I only see rooftop solar installed on maybe 1 out of 100,000 homes or even less. And so far I have not seen any solar powered signs.
I thought folks posted here saying England was big on solar. Intertingly i’ve Seen several electric charging stations for cars on public streets. Seems to me England could really benefit from electric cars.
A bit surprised they don’t have many more.
Why do so few homes in England have rooftop solar?Have you been long enough to see the weather
Solar panels by themselves are not financially viable so it all depends on government grants
Why do so few homes in England have rooftop solar?Have you been long enough to see the weather
Yes. Are you saying there is nowhere in England is there enough sun for solar panels to be effective yet in Germany where it snows panels are effective? That don’t make no sense.
Got a better more educated answer?
Solar panels by themselves are not financially viable so it all depends on government grantsNonsense. PV is so cheap now, in many locations it provides electricity at a less expensive rate than any other available power. Panels are on the order of $0.50 per watt and total installation costs should be no more than a few dollars/watt - though that doesn't keep many commercial home installers from ripping customers off with higher pricing.